Real knots verses what is practical for scale ships

[Srenner]

Hi it might have been a topic before but do model ship builders bother to tie, splice scale ropes in the same manner as maireners did on real ships? Plenty of books on how to make eyes in rope by splicing, the types of knots to use at different parts of the rig and on deck.

 

Verses creating eyes by gluing rope together or using a thread and winding around?

 

 I'm interested what is the practical approach or the most used approach by modellers?

[BANYAN]

Hi.  Where possible I try to use genuine knots and seizings, or at least simulated versions of them (the simulated versions may miss a couple of steps in tying the real knot).  For example I try use a form of the 'common' whipping, reef knots on ratlines, figure of 8s on cleats, pins etc, proper coils for rope ends, etc etc.  However, based on the scale you are using, it is sometimes impossible to do this, so I use a knot/finish, that when finished, looks a little the same as the typical real life knot.  This is possible as generally there is not a lot of tension on model ship lines that require the benefits of using the real knot.  For my purposes I have found you do not have to use many types of knots.

 

cheers

 

Pat

[barkeater]

One of the problems you have to consider is the thickness of the knot itself. You want a low profile to better approximate the real thing. You also want to avoid pulling on the line as you tie. This can be a real problem when you are dealing with a ship which has a lot of rigging. You also want something simple and easy for those tight spots. I tie three overhand knots with thin thread of the appropriate color and place them against one another as if I was rapping the line to simulate the seizing. You can adjust this knot for tension if needed as you counterbalance with its opposite line if it is a starboard/port configuration or standing rigging on the center line. I then make sure it is tight and hit the knot with a tiny amount of thinned pva (wood glue) to lock it in. The glue can't be seen once it dries. 

Richard

[Srenner]

Thanks... if the scale rope is slicker and not hairy the knots can really compact down verses the true scale rope..  so your saying you try and tie it so it looks good.. it doesn't need to be tight tight as the glue holds it...

[barkeater]

I do try to get it tight. Do 1 knot, check the tension and then add the second and if still happy the third. An overhand knot can be undone fairly easily if you need to adjust.  You want the knot as tight as you can when you finish up and then lock the knot in with the glue. I do 1/48 scale.

Richard

[rwiederrich]

19 hours ago, Srenner said:

Hi it might have been a topic before but do model ship builders bother to tie, splice scale ropes in the same manner as maireners did on real ships? Plenty of books on how to make eyes in rope by splicing, the types of knots to use at different parts of the rig and on deck.

 

Verses creating eyes by gluing rope together or using a thread and winding around?

 

 I'm interested what is the practical approach or the most used approach by modellers?

Kind of a loaded question.  If you are a purist and tend to make models for purist to view.....and your scale is large enough to warrant it, you try your best to replicate actual knots.  However, modelers are *Modeling*..so they are not burdened with this issue.  A good secure knot will do with scales under 1/72.  I typically paint all my knots to replicate preservation any way...so it never is an issue.

 

Lastly....I don't want to take what will most likely take years to complete and add any more years to it....just to make a point.  The most discriminating viewer should have learned patience and overlook your choice and the rest,....Well,......they,  didn't even know it was a subject.

 

Rob

 

 

[popeye2sea]

I am one of those crazy few who try and make each rope fastening the way it really is.  I tie everything from whippings and seizings to doubled wall and crown knots for my tacks and matthew walker knots for my laniards.  I do all the appropriate bends and hitches and splices where needed. I even do rose lashings.

 

But beware, all the above takes a special kind of crazy to do at scale😉

 

Regards,

[Dave_E]

8 minutes ago, popeye2sea said:

I am one of those crazy few who try and make each rope fastening the way it really is.  I tie everything from whippings and seizings to doubled wall and crown knots for my tacks and matthew walker knots for my laniards.  I do all the appropriate bends and hitches and splices where needed. I even do rose lashings.

 

But beware, all the above takes a special kind of crazy to do at scale😉

 

Regards,

What scale are you building when you do this real marlin spike?

[rwiederrich]

8 hours ago, popeye2sea said:

I am one of those crazy few who try and make each rope fastening the way it really is.  I tie everything from whippings and seizings to doubled wall and crown knots for my tacks and matthew walker knots for my laniards.  I do all the appropriate bends and hitches and splices where needed. I even do rose lashings.

 

But beware, all the above takes a special kind of crazy to do at scale😉

 

Regards,

A self proclaimed example.  What scale are you performing this magic in?  And I don't want to hear 1/128.😁

 

Rob

[popeye2sea]

1:100

[BANYAN]

I love your sort of 'crazy' popeye2sea.

 

cheers

 

Pat

[popeye2sea]

On 7/21/2022 at 2:11 PM, rwiederrich said:

 

Lastly....I don't want to take what will most likely take years to complete and add any more years to it....just to make a point.  The most discriminating viewer should have learned patience and overlook your choice and the rest,....Well,......they,  didn't even know it was a subject.

 

Rob

 

 

Fair enough.  But in my case I am not so much trying to make a point, rather I am proving to myself that I can accomplish the goal of doing it the real way.

Besides, as far as adding years to the build goes, when you already have 40 years and counting on a build, what's a few more?  😲

 

Regards,