Meredith Posted February 18, 2013 #1 Posted February 18, 2013 I am presuming quite a few people have now taken delivery of their Byrnes rope walks. I am still struggling to get mine to look like rope. All the hand made rope walks I have seen - and their finished products look really good. I KNOW it is my use of the machine - but I am just not getting any better at it! I am probably missing something so easy and simple its not funny... So any (step by step) tutorials and tips would be greatly appreciated. Dont presume anything is so obvious it doesnt need to be said - to me at least Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
BANYAN Posted February 18, 2013 #2 Posted February 18, 2013 Hi Meredith, Brian is referring to me - shoot me a PM and I will pass contact details. It will be interesting to discuss this as I have similar issues. cheers Pat Quote If at first you do not suceed, try, and then try again!Current build: HMCSS Victoria (Scratch) Next build: HMAS Vampire (3D printed resin, scratch 1:350) Built: Battle Station (Scratch) and HM Bark Endeavour 1768 (kit 1:64)
jimbyr Posted February 18, 2013 #3 Posted February 18, 2013 (edited) If you're having problems with the machine here are a few things to look at. 1 Make sure all 3 supply spools are wound the same direction and placed on the spindles the right way for the type rope you are making. It makes a difference. 2 Make absolutely sure you have the correct die size for your finished size rope. The hole in the die should be no more than a few thousandths larger than the finished rope. It should be an effort to get all 3 threads through the die when setting up the machine. 3 Make sure you are spinning the head in the correct direction. CCW for left hand rope and CW for right hand. 4 Go slow and keep the rope forming as close to the die as you can. Jim Byrnes Model Machines See the attached drawing for left hand rope set up. Right hand would be opposite. Most if not all store bought thread is wound right handed so you will be making left handed rope to start Rope initial set up.pdf Edited February 18, 2013 by Jim Byrnes Ulises Victoria, mtaylor and GLakie 3 Quote
Meredith Posted February 19, 2013 Author #4 Posted February 19, 2013 Thanks Jim - I will try the loading as per file(I cannot recal if this is the way I had it or not!) - I KNOW this will work well once I get my act together Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
Meredith Posted February 19, 2013 Author #5 Posted February 19, 2013 (edited) I THINK I've got it! I definitely had them all wound the other way. I knew it had to be something so simple! Another few questions - 1. how long do you harden the ropes for? 2. The instructions mention that for different size ropes - you can move the die and guides - closer or further away from the spinning parts. Which way is which (eg smaller ropes closer - larger ropes further away??) I havent actually had an experiment with this bit so far - as of all the allen keys I have and sets - I cant find one to fit I shall look harder - I have quite a few sets of them. I will make some more - let it harden off and try to take some photos...... So Joy of Joys - I think we have rope :) Edited February 19, 2013 by Meredith BANYAN 1 Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
jimbyr Posted February 19, 2013 #6 Posted February 19, 2013 Meredith Great, it's all in the set up. I let the rope harden overnight. Move the post closer to the head for larger ropes if you have to. The die size is also very important. Should be only a few thousandths larger than your finished rope Jim Chuck and GLakie 2 Quote
Meredith Posted February 20, 2013 Author #7 Posted February 20, 2013 I have just made 3 different diameter ropes... the silk one is tiny - I very much doubt I will be able to photograph it (maybe my partner might be more sucessful - I will ask). Of course it will then be suitable to use to make LH ropes too. The other two ropes are cotton - I will work out the finished diameter and TRY and take pics. I never used to have much trouble taking close up phtos of fabrics/individual threads etc - but I am struggling at the minute - not sure what I am doing wrong - its the same camera! Going off to try the thickest thread I have - and see how that looks... I will try and be back with photos today. Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
Ulises Victoria Posted February 20, 2013 #8 Posted February 20, 2013 Hello all. I was also very frustrated today. I made several attempts and did not get anything right. I used several diameters of thread and the result always unraveled. (Left handed rope is that that tightens when you twist it from right to left?) I put the machine to spin CCW. My only doubt is the diameter of the die. It maybe was too loose. Would this cause the rope to unravel. It feels like it would need more torsion to keep it together. Not very happy so far, but I will keep experimenting. Quote There aren't but two options: do it FAST, or do it RIGHT. Current Project Build Log: Soleil Royal in 1/72. Kit by Artesania Latina. Last finished projects: Royal Ship Vasa 1628; French Vessel Royal Louis 1780. 1/90 Scale by Mamoli. 120 Cannons Future projects already in my stash: Panart: San Felipe 1/75; OcCre: Santísima Trinidad 1/90; Wish List: 1/64 Amati Victory, HMS Enterprise in 1/48 by CAF models. So much to build, so little time!
fnkershner Posted February 20, 2013 #9 Posted February 20, 2013 (edited) It took a bit of persuasion, but I convinced my local club to buy one of these babys! As president it will reside with me. (rank does have its privledges). Now I just can't wait for delivery. Just one question - Jim when will I be able to serve my lines using the rope walk? Edited February 20, 2013 by Floyd Kershner Quote Current Builds - 18th Century Longboat, MS Syren Completed Builds - MS Bluenose, Panart BatteStation Cross section, Endevour J Boat Half Hull, Windego Half Hull, R/C T37 Breezing Along, R/C Victoria 32, SolCat 18 On the shelf - Panart San Felipe, Euromodel Ajax, C.Mamoli America, Its a sailor's Life for me!
Meredith Posted February 20, 2013 Author #10 Posted February 20, 2013 Ok I have some photos.... Brian the extraordinaire 1 Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
Ulises Victoria Posted February 20, 2013 #11 Posted February 20, 2013 Meredith!!! You are having way better results than me. The good thing is that now I am convinced that it's me not the machine who is getting bad results. Can you elaborate on what threads sizes you used? Did you try to make one thick line by starting with thin thread and then using that same thread to make a thicker one? I have followed all of Jim's advise and tips above, but I think my mistake is in the size of the die hole I am using. @Jim: What if I drilled my dies wrong? Can I purchase some more? And I am sure I will eventually lose one of those plastic washers. Can I purchase some more too? Quote There aren't but two options: do it FAST, or do it RIGHT. Current Project Build Log: Soleil Royal in 1/72. Kit by Artesania Latina. Last finished projects: Royal Ship Vasa 1628; French Vessel Royal Louis 1780. 1/90 Scale by Mamoli. 120 Cannons Future projects already in my stash: Panart: San Felipe 1/75; OcCre: Santísima Trinidad 1/90; Wish List: 1/64 Amati Victory, HMS Enterprise in 1/48 by CAF models. So much to build, so little time!
Meredith Posted February 20, 2013 Author #12 Posted February 20, 2013 Forgot to add the sizes: druxey 1 Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
Meredith Posted February 20, 2013 Author #13 Posted February 20, 2013 I think this is right... Starting from the left side .39mm rope made from silk 1.0mm rope - cotton Gutterman 12 .92mm - cotton - crochet/perle .93 - 6 strands of silk and 3 strands of cotton 1.87 - 6 strands of size 10 perle cotton 1.56 - 6 strands of size 40 perle cotton .82 - 3 strands of size 40 cotton I can get the exact brands etc - this is just a rough list - I have a whole lot more to try out. Although in person the 3 strands of cotton and 6 strands of silk is very nice. Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
fnkershner Posted February 20, 2013 #14 Posted February 20, 2013 (edited) Meredith - Where did you source your thread. That is beautiful work! Now I just need a model to Rig. Edited February 20, 2013 by Floyd Kershner Quote Current Builds - 18th Century Longboat, MS Syren Completed Builds - MS Bluenose, Panart BatteStation Cross section, Endevour J Boat Half Hull, Windego Half Hull, R/C T37 Breezing Along, R/C Victoria 32, SolCat 18 On the shelf - Panart San Felipe, Euromodel Ajax, C.Mamoli America, Its a sailor's Life for me!
Meredith Posted February 20, 2013 Author #15 Posted February 20, 2013 I am a sewer from way back... threads is my stuff I will take some photos tomorrow (bit late now) of the different types of threads I have tried - and those yet to try. Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
Ulises Victoria Posted February 20, 2013 #16 Posted February 20, 2013 I think this is right... Starting from the left side .39mm rope made from silk 1.0mm rope - cotton Gutterman 12 .92mm - cotton - crochet/perle .93 - 6 strands of silk and 3 strands of cotton 1.87 - 6 strands of size 10 perle cotton 1.56 - 6 strands of size 40 perle cotton .82 - 3 strands of size 40 cotton I can get the exact brands etc - this is just a rough list - I have a whole lot more to try out. Although in person the 3 strands of cotton and 6 strands of silk is very nice. Meredith... what do you mean when you say "6 strands"? Quote There aren't but two options: do it FAST, or do it RIGHT. Current Project Build Log: Soleil Royal in 1/72. Kit by Artesania Latina. Last finished projects: Royal Ship Vasa 1628; French Vessel Royal Louis 1780. 1/90 Scale by Mamoli. 120 Cannons Future projects already in my stash: Panart: San Felipe 1/75; OcCre: Santísima Trinidad 1/90; Wish List: 1/64 Amati Victory, HMS Enterprise in 1/48 by CAF models. So much to build, so little time!
Geoff Matson Posted February 20, 2013 #17 Posted February 20, 2013 I too have Jim Byrnes Ropewalk and have good success on the rope making. I have found the results vary with the quality of thread and the speed at which you turn it. I have not decided on a thread yet and would be interested in which ones seem to have the best results. I am also interested in how you Harden your rope and how to make four strand rope. Thanks for you pictures. Geoff Quote Geoff NRG member #2666Current build : USS Constitution Finished builds: Armed Virginia Sloop (in gallery)
Meredith Posted February 20, 2013 Author #18 Posted February 20, 2013 Instead of just one strand wound on the feeder spools - I used 3 on each spool - 2 strands of silk and one strand of cotton on each spool - x 3 spools. The three strands on each spool acually twist together before they hit the die and then twist with the other spool feeds... So in fact on some types of threads - I have had better sucess with more than one strand on each feeder spool. BANYAN 1 Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
Meredith Posted February 20, 2013 Author #19 Posted February 20, 2013 Geoff - do you find turning it faster or slower the best - so far I have really only turned slow. Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
BANYAN Posted February 20, 2013 #20 Posted February 20, 2013 Hi Meredith, that is terrific. I note though you have only laid up LH rope to date; have you tried RH? Most interesting noting you can work several strands on each spool. I had been planning on experimenting with that, but you have saved me the trouble. Thanks for that great feedback. I am also considering a trial using a core (back fed spool) using a stiffer or larger rope. Just need to get my machine back together before I can progress Thanks for the superb service there Jim, much appreciated. I also would be very interested in any discussion on the best thread to use as I have experimented with Rayon, poly-cotton and silk. THe Rayon was too weak and kept breaking, but if I could get it to work, I think would make very nice rope. The poly-cotton has worked best so far but is far more susceptable to stretching and needs more hardening The linen proved very difficult to use and when Jim looked under a sample under a microscope, he said the thread diameter was variable and looked "awful". That said, it may have just been the brand/type I was trying and may not be true of all silk. cheers Pat Quote If at first you do not suceed, try, and then try again!Current build: HMCSS Victoria (Scratch) Next build: HMAS Vampire (3D printed resin, scratch 1:350) Built: Battle Station (Scratch) and HM Bark Endeavour 1768 (kit 1:64)
Ulises Victoria Posted February 20, 2013 #21 Posted February 20, 2013 Instead of just one strand wound on the feeder spools - I used 3 on each spool - 2 strands of silk and one strand of cotton on each spool - x 3 spools. The three strands on each spool acually twist together before they hit the die and then twist with the other spool feeds... So in fact on some types of threads - I have had better sucess with more than one strand on each feeder spool. Hmmmm I thought of doing that in my very first runs, but somehow I didn't think it would work, so I didn't . Quote There aren't but two options: do it FAST, or do it RIGHT. Current Project Build Log: Soleil Royal in 1/72. Kit by Artesania Latina. Last finished projects: Royal Ship Vasa 1628; French Vessel Royal Louis 1780. 1/90 Scale by Mamoli. 120 Cannons Future projects already in my stash: Panart: San Felipe 1/75; OcCre: Santísima Trinidad 1/90; Wish List: 1/64 Amati Victory, HMS Enterprise in 1/48 by CAF models. So much to build, so little time!
Meredith Posted February 21, 2013 Author #22 Posted February 21, 2013 I am just making some shevles for my partners camera cupboard - as soon as I am done I will photograph the threads I have.... I am more than happy with most of them. Re Rayon - I have about 500 spools of Rayon - and no - it keeps breaking - I tried it as soon as I got the machine. Good silk will give you a stronger/better effect and doesnt break. I have about 5 different types of silk on spools (many others in hanks - but I wont bother with those) - so far no problems with the silk. BANYAN 1 Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
Geoff Matson Posted February 21, 2013 #23 Posted February 21, 2013 Meredith I find I have much more control on the slow speed. I think the key is to keep the twisting part of the rope in front of the die. As long as the twisting part remains there I feel I am at the right speed. It takes a little timming to get a feel for it. Give it a try. Geoff Quote Geoff NRG member #2666Current build : USS Constitution Finished builds: Armed Virginia Sloop (in gallery)
Meredith Posted February 21, 2013 Author #24 Posted February 21, 2013 That about what I have been doing Geoff - so I think I am finally on the right track Ulises Victoria 1 Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
Ulises Victoria Posted February 21, 2013 #25 Posted February 21, 2013 (edited) Same here Meredith. I made another trial today, changing the die for a smaller one and reducing the speed. This is the result and it's very encouraging! (If only the rope was as clear as my fingerprints) Morope, here I come!!! Edited February 21, 2013 by Ulises Victoria Quote There aren't but two options: do it FAST, or do it RIGHT. Current Project Build Log: Soleil Royal in 1/72. Kit by Artesania Latina. Last finished projects: Royal Ship Vasa 1628; French Vessel Royal Louis 1780. 1/90 Scale by Mamoli. 120 Cannons Future projects already in my stash: Panart: San Felipe 1/75; OcCre: Santísima Trinidad 1/90; Wish List: 1/64 Amati Victory, HMS Enterprise in 1/48 by CAF models. So much to build, so little time!
Meredith Posted February 21, 2013 Author #26 Posted February 21, 2013 I knew we would all get there eventually Here are some photos of the threads I have... The crochet threads: They range in size from "5" to "100" (100 being finest) Bit of a mess This Rasant - a corespun polyester cotton - its not too bad as poly goes... Now onto the silks: The Gutterman is nice - thicker than the YSL and Daruma Some Gutterman cotton - 2 sizes - a 12 and a 30 (30 is smaller) King Tut Egyptian cotton - very nice: Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
Meredith Posted February 21, 2013 Author #27 Posted February 21, 2013 Some more cotton ones: Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
Meredith Posted February 21, 2013 Author #28 Posted February 21, 2013 I havent tried them all yet - but if anyone would like a sample made up of anything in particular - let me know and I will try it..... Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
fnkershner Posted February 21, 2013 #29 Posted February 21, 2013 (edited) Meredith are we seeing into another world here? You have an impressive collection! Edited February 21, 2013 by Floyd Kershner Patrick 1 Quote Current Builds - 18th Century Longboat, MS Syren Completed Builds - MS Bluenose, Panart BatteStation Cross section, Endevour J Boat Half Hull, Windego Half Hull, R/C T37 Breezing Along, R/C Victoria 32, SolCat 18 On the shelf - Panart San Felipe, Euromodel Ajax, C.Mamoli America, Its a sailor's Life for me!
Meredith Posted February 21, 2013 Author #30 Posted February 21, 2013 I am not admiting to my "other" or past hobbies and pastimes yet :) Quote Current builds: MS Syren HM Suppy Dos Amigos Completed: Schooner for Port Jackson MS 18th Century Longboat Bounty Launch
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