hamilton

Thanks Druxey - it's more the actual cutting away that is giving me the nerves.....but the plans and practicum, in addition to Vol 1 of the Swan series have taken a lot of the mystery out of things - I think in this instance it's more that a lack of practical experience at this approach to ship modelling makes it seem really daunting - I've decided to cut a couple of extra top timbers to practice on and get a feel for how to achieve the proper result hamilton

Frame set 1 is now complete and installed. Frame 1-aft was very straightforward - the last such frame for a while....(see photos below) I feel like constructing the first 4 frames, while challenging, is kind of a like a tutorial to get you used to the process - with a couple of little quirks thrown in (like the cast toptimber of frame 1 forward). From here, though, things seem to get much more difficult, with a much more significant and complex cast to frame 2-forward and frame 3-aft and the gunport to manage between these....I spent today making templates for the components of frame set 2 - using 11.5" stock for the toptimbers of the forward frame to accommodate the cast aft. It's a bit of a mystery to me how to achieve the cast....I had thought I could do this using the belt sander, but given the curvature of moulded dimension of the frame, this would be very difficult to get an even result in the cast along the sided dimension.....my feeling is that taking a template of the sided dimension from the disposition of frame drawing and having at it with some sanding blocks will likely be the way to go....I may clamp the part in the bench vice with the sided dimension facing upwards to make the process a little easier, but I am open to any and all suggestions on how to approach this...... In any case - there's other work to do before turning to these cast toptimbers so I'll dig into that before facing this challenge! Bye for now hamilton

Thanks for the response TMJ, but no - I'm talking about chopping the frame down to lay on the gunport sills and what is the best way to approach this. Here's the photo again with the area highlighted..... hamilton

Hi there: I'm working on the Admiralty models HMS Echo cross-sectional model and had a question about how to cut the toptimbers out to frame the gunports. It seems to me there are at least two possible approaches, and I'm hoping to hear from those more experienced than me how best to approach this (understanding that "best" is both subjective and relative).... 1. Complete all frames of the cross-section and then cut the frames off appropriately for the gunports. This method benefits from the strength provided by having all frames in place and with battens added at the top of the toptimbers - though to my mind it seems pretty tricky to cut away the frames even with a small keyhole saw..... 2. Shorten the frames that fall in line with the gunport as they are added to the model, reserving the toptimber pieces for the extensions above the gunports - this seems easier in terms of cutting away the frames, but I wonder if there are difficulties that my lack of experience is hiding from me if I go this route.... I hope the question is clear......Here is the disposition of frame drawing for clarity - the frames in question are 2-aft and 3-forward. Thanks in advance for any help you can provide! hamilton

yes, Druxey - this is easier to see in the photos than on the model - there is a definite roundness to the inside corners that needs correcting...fortunately the files are small enough to get in there...added to the lengthening list!! hamilton

Got back home yesterday and used the east-west jet lag to complete and mount frame 1F in the peace of the early morning - a great time to be out in the workshop with a hot coffee. I dry fit the frame in place and used a small length of 1mm x 4mm walnut from the Bellona build to mark off the height of the sweep port sills in line with the aft deadflat frame. Checking these against the marks transferred from the sheer plan onto the body plan showed that the measures were spot on. I used a couple of triangular needle files to refine the notches and then mounted the frame. I had already attached a batten between the toptimbers of the aft deadflat frame - this was dimensioned according to the wider gap between DA and 1F that accommodates the sweep port, while I used a 2mm thick piece of scrap wood between the floor of DA and the cross-chock/first futtocks of 1F - this helped maintain the slight (approx. 2mm) lean aft of the second futtocks of 1F. The floor/futtocks of frame 1 aft are cut and need a bit of refinement, and I need to make the chocks for them as well, but since I just finished my 1 major home improvement task of the summer (a new fence around our front yard) and since the Admiral has been too pre-occupied with her business lately to invent other tasks for me, I hope to have 1A mounted on the keel by mid-week. It is a simple frame with no cast or shifted timbers and no need to notch out for ports or scuppers, so it will be considerably more straightforward than 1F was. Happy modelling and enjoy the photos! If the first photo makes the frames look like they're sitting a little squiffy, blame this on the unsteady hand of the photographer not the attentiveness of the modeller - though in this case they are the same person... hamilton

A beautiful rendition, John! Your display room is quite a treat to look at, too! hamilton

I finally got frame 1F right, I think - after constructing, deconstructing and reconstructing it 3 times! It has not yet been fixed to the keel, as there is still a bit more work to do - cutting notches for the sweep port sills. To mark these out, I transferred markings for the sills from the sheer plan (which shows their heights) to the frame drawing (which doesn't). This allows me to take an initial location from the plans, which can then be confirmed/corrected by setting up the frame on the keel and using a tick strip to ensure consistency with the notched face of the aft deadflat frame. I have now marked, but not notched out, these elements - the last before instaklling the frame permanently on the keel. I'm out of town and away from the workshop at the moment, so this will have to wait - but the elements of frame 1 aft are now laid out on the building board waiting for me to come home and once that's done I will mount both frames of the set at the same time. Frame 1 aft has the merit of not having any fiddly elements to it - no shifted or cast futtocks and no gunports or sweep ports to account for - so it's just a matter of refining the futtocks and chocks, assembling and mounting it. Here are some photos - enjoy and happy modelling hamilton

Wow - so I guess time has gotten away with me a little here....though with good excuse - was teaching a summer course and this occupied quite a bit of time through May/June and then once that was done, I spent some time on the house and garden - felling and disposing of an old cypress tree and constructing a new fence around our front yard. With these "serious" tasks out of the way, I spent a bit of time continuing with the second layer of lower hull planking on my Bellona, which is progressing quite slowly, since this is a part of ship modelling that I do not really enjoy - perhaps because, though I understand it in principle, and have followed many procedures detailed by some pros both here and elsewhere, my results are never great and the planks seem to want to run in insane ways - I'm beginning to think that this is down to either over-fairing or under-fairing of the bulkhead frames and I can't figure out which...... But anyway, this is a different log, so I should save my planking woes for the Bellona pages....in any case, though I mentioned above that I hoped to finish frame set 1 at the end of May, these frames are still in process. I thought I had completed 1 forward, but then realised that I assembled it with the second futtocks turned the wrong way on the first futtocks. I thought I had corrected this, but it turned out I made exactly the same mistake when I was trying to "correct" it from the first time!! This time, I managed to get it right (at least orientation wise) and have glued up the elements of 1 forward, and am now just waiting for the glue to fully cure before finishing the frame up and installing it on the keel. The second futtock of frame 1F leans back slightly - about 1/32" at scale. To achieve this, I placed the frame on the assembly template with the notched chocks facing downwards. I then ran a small 1/32" thick batten along the line on the body drawing that marks the joint between the futtocks - this propped the joint-end of the futtock up while its top end rested on the drawing. The photos below show what I mean. In the second photo, you'll notice that the chock is standing proud of the frame at its lower end - this will be corrected once the glue is fully cured. I'm going to be heading back east next week to visit my folks, so will once again be away from the bench, but if I can carrve out some more time today and tomorrow I can hopefully finish up 1F at least - the components of frame 1 aft are cut and need a bit more refinement before assembly and it's unlikely I'll be able to get to it before I get back home. In any case, enjoy the photos, basic as they are, and happy modelling hamilton

Well I see it's been a month and a half since I've updated here - blame my distractedness in picking up the Echo cross-section....Now that I've completed the first two frame sets on that build, more or less, and since my work is tapering off for the next several weeks, I will have a lot more time for modelling - between house projects of course (putting in a new fence, doing some tree maintenance and following the Admiral around her constantly growing garden trying to keep up with all the tasks she throws at me).... Today I took a couple of hours and started band "A" of the lower hull planking on the port side - starboard is nearly complete except for a couple of finishing planks at the bow. I don't have photos, unfortunately, but they look pretty much exactly like the ones from the last post, so I'll refer you back there - I'm going to push through the lower hull planking on Bellona over the next week or so before turning back again to Echo. Hope everyone's doing ok out there hamilton

Fancy ones, too, by the looks of it! hamilton

Technically, it will be a "surprise", just not the one people might think... hamilton

I had a colleague once who decided to build a boat in his back yard. Problem was, once it was done he realised there was no room to actually get it out, so he had to rent a crane to lift it over his house and onto the street! Maybe the modeller featured in the image above built a scale crane to help him with those monsters! hamilton

Hello Gaz Great start on the Peregrine. I believe this kit was released at around the same time as the Corel Greyhound and Eagle kits. My experience with the Greyhound was that it was a very challenging model with a great number of flaws in the design. But from what I see here these same problems don't seem to be at issue with the Peregrine! You'll find that there are few kits that have pre-cut rabbets - this is something that you either have to cut in yourself or that is created by narrowing the false keel and attaching separate keel, sternpost and stem parts. Corel's practice seems to be to provide a centre keel piece that includes the keel, so the bearding and rabbet lines must be traced from the plans and the rabbet joint carved out - this can be challenging on the smaller scale kits and especially since the ply used by Corel is not of the best quality - more like pressboard with thin veneers on either side. But you are doing a great job with these elements and it'll be nice to see the model shaping up. hamilton

Thanks Druxey! We'll see how the rest of them go......frame 1 F/A is on the go now and hope to finish on the weekend....been fun so far hamilton

Really nice job on the try works! Looks great! hamilton

Amazing work Yves! hamilton

Thanks very much Jaager - and sorry for being ambiguous earlier. hamilton

Thanks Jaager and David - and sorry Jaager for the ambiguity - I did not have that info on hand - it is the Echo of 1781 - but I suppose that's immaterial now! hamilton

Hi there: Working on Echo cross-section and wondering about the size.arrangement of bolts that would have been used to fasten the square frames to the rising wood/keel. hamilton

A final update - deadflat 1 has now also been raised, after notching it out on the aft face for the sweep port sills. Here are a couple of shots to round out the set....moving on to frame set 1 next....think I will continue to do these in pairs as long as that continues to make sense.... hamilton

So I may have been pre-emptive, but I decided to raise the deadflat frame on the keel today. Doing so took quite a bit of finessing and was definitely aided by the deadflat 1 frame when it came to final positioning. The whole endeavour was slowed by the fact that I broke not one but both of the frames while adding the trunnels, and had to reset the futtocks and in one case re-make one of the chocks - which I did using the method suggested by Greg which worked way better for fit - still a bit of adjusting to do, but not as much as when I was just cutting them from the patterns on the frame drawings.... For mounting, the frame was merely glued to the keel assembly with PVA, which I will let cure for 24 hours before securing the seating with a length of brass rod - this will be invisible under the keelson, so I'm not going to treat it in any way, just use it for structural support. I lined up the frame along the reference lines on the lateral framing squares and clamped these in place. I then clamped the forward square along the centre line (I etched a centre line on the acrylic base and vertical support for certainty)and then clamped the frame to the aft framing square. Once this was done, I inserted some 2mm spacers (scrap basswood) between the two frames and used a length of 2mm basswood for a bracing piece at the top. This is only glued to the aft edge of the deadflat frame but clamped between the 2 frames to secure it. I was quite please not only with the seating of the frame, but with the alignment of the outside edges of these first two frames. I will be adding these horizontal braces to the tops of the frames as I go for structural support and to ensure symmetry and will saw the centre portions flush and sand down the remaining material flush with the frames when I fair the cross-section for planking. The bracing pieces you see further down the frame are not glued and will be removed once the glue is set and I'm ready to install deadflat 1, which I will do after completing frame 1 forward. Any comments, tips or feedback on this process are always appreciated. Thanks and bye for now hamilton

One last update for today. I used the markings on the tape strips attached to the right angle plates to mark out the lines on the front face of the deadflat frame. I then cut a tick strip and marked the lines on it from the profile drawing and checked against the marks on the frame. With a very small adjustment on the starboard side, the markings were nice, even & symmetrical. I then unclamped the frame and extended these marks across the face of the frame using a straight edge, and then extended the lines around the frame, so each line is marked out on all sides. I still need to add trunnels to the futtock joints, which should be interesting - the joints are such a tender spot that I'm not sure how to approach it in terms of supporting the frame so it doesn't break under even the controllable pressure of hand drilling....My current idea is to put the frame in my bench vice so the outside edge of the frame is just above the jaws and going for it from there....I have some cast-off futtocks that i made while practicing my scroll saw work so I might just glue up a couple of those just to see how it feels and how it goes....I guess I'm not in any rush! hamilton

Thanks Alan - yes, this seemed like a much better approach than trying to line up tick strips. It'll be a little tricky as the model progresses, and I may need to modify the framing squares to allow me to continue using this method as I work aft - the framing square that I built from the Admiralty templates is too wide for me to be able to slide the acrylic squares in back of the frame for transferring marks. I'll see if I can puzzle this out over the weekend as I try to get my first frame raised. One thing I will definitely need to do is mark out the station lines as verticals on both the disposition of frame and profile drawings, so I'm sure I'm correctly laying the tape strips. This wasn't necessary for the deadflat frame as there is a little reference for it on the drawing itself, but it will be much better to mark them all out as verticals to ensure the reference lines are correct. In the meantime, I spent a bit of time last night testing the method and seeing if I could set up the deadflat frame with accuracy. Using the vertical measurement jig and some 1/2" masking tape (turned out I didn't have any more 1/4" stuff, which I think would be better), I took measures for the upper & lower deck beams at side, the height of breadth line and the design waterline. I then just peeled this tape off the jig and carefully lined it up with the edges of the square at the bottom and along one side - repeated for the port side square and that was that. The port and starboard squares were lined up with the height of breadth line on the drawing fixed to the building board and then clamped in place. In the photos below, I've set the frame up and clamped the fore and aft framing squares and the lateral squares. I found it useful then to take a tick strip with the lines marked out and used this to test the port & starboard symmetry of the frame and make minor adjustments to its positioning before final clamping. What you see in the final shots below is the frame set up on the building board ready to be marked out for the various lines noted above. The deadflat 1 frame needs also to be marked out for the sweep port notches on its aft face. In fact there are, I think, only 4 frames total that don't need to be notched out for sweep ports, gun ports and/or scuppers. A brief observation - the process of constructing frames has really re-oriented my focus and attention in modelling. The necessity to approach each component with care and thought for its relations is so much more on the surface of things than I've experience in my work on model kits, where I feel like I lag in conscientiousness here and there where the kit manufacturer has done the work for me....Even with my scratch Bluenose there were a couple of "auto-pilot" moments where I was leaning much more on the documentation supplied by MS for their kit, and where I felt I could fudge things without any overall bad effect. Here, there's no fudging things! It has to be right or it's not going to work - it's a lot of pressure, but it feels like there's a lot of learning happening too, which is fun. Here are some photos - I hope to have the first frame raised by the end of the weekend - I just need to mark it out, trunnel the joints, work on the keel notch to ease the fit, and it'll be ready to go......deep breath.... hamilton

A small update - not much time this past week for modelling, unfortunately, but I have a short break from work over the weekend, so hopefully I'll be able to make some progress. Today, I spent a very short time putting together a simple jig for taking vertical measurements - it's just the profile drawing adhered to a piece of 3/4" plywood with a batten clamped along the line marking the bottom of the keel. I made some tick strips out of card, but I think I will take a different approach to transferring these marks - I have a number of right angle plates that I made from 1/8" acrylic some time ago and the taller of these can be used to transfer vertical measures to the model - instead of using tick strips on the drawing, I will use 1/4" masking tape which can then be fixed to the right angle plate itself - perhaps a more stable way of transferring the measures, but we'll see how it goes - I'm going to try to mark and file out the notches for the sweep port sills and lintels this weekend using this method. hamilton