ClipperFan
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Rob, I applaud your willingness to stretch your understanding of what items did and did not go on a sailing Ship built over 150 years ago. Your cavils look very nice. I hope you won't have much of a challenge installing the last 2 just in front of the rear coach house.- 3,560 replies
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Keith Black, Believe it or not, that inglorious monstrosity is the relocated helmsman's location. Apparently all the added structures for her factory work blocked the helmsman's view entirely. So the Wheelhouse was elevated to the mizzen top. The final insult to a once beautiful, lofty Clipper....
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Rob, In his latest message, copied to you, Mike included this impressive image as additional proof that the mooring bits on Glory's fo'c'sle were double wooden rectangular posts. Even though you had already replaced them, Mike wanted you to see indisputable evidence that you made the right decision. It's from 1922-23 and shows Glory of the Seas near the beach at Fauntelroy, Washington. According to Mike it's one of few scenes taken from above her. This confirms conclusively that you made the right choices, both by raising fo'c'sle height which this image proves and replacing iron mooring bits with double rectangular wooden ones, also clearly visible on her fo'c'sle deck. In addition, her cathead locations are much further back then previous images led us to believe. Your previous measurements showed her first fairlead chock in her splash rail was 9' the second being 6' further back. Visual evidence made it look like the catheads were 4' back from the second fairlead. However, from this beautiful image, the catheads are about 12' back from that second chock. One, I wish this image had been available before I sent my Glory of the Seas plan view to Nautical Research Journal for potential publication; two and three, my large sketch has to be revised yet again, along with the plan view. It just goes to show as more accurate pictures are unearthed, we continue to improve and refine our understanding of her overall appearance. For now, I'm going to send a note to the NRJ editor explaining about this latest discovery and offering to submit revised plans. Meanwhile, it's my considered opinion that, when it comes to specific deck fittings, Mike is the undisputed authority.
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Druxey, From Dictionary of Nautical Terms, cavil: a large cleat for belaying the fore and main tacks, sheets and braces to. (see KEVELS)
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Rob, your model, your choice. I will refer to the Crothers book for his position and will communicate back to Mike. Any further discussion, if something develops, will be in pm, as to not clutter up your board. Fair enough?
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Rob, Mike's latest email asked me why there are no cavils on Glory's main deck bulkheads? I had no decent answer, other than to say "oops!" Then I took a closer look at his main deck plans, which I shared on post #3001. Sure enough, he has depicted 4 cavils, port and starboard. There's a pair in the fore, opposite her fore companion and another pair opposite her stern quarter, just before the rear coach house, opposite her stern quarter hatchway. You can clearly see the stern quarter cavil, as there's nothing to obstruct the view. The fore cavil is almost impossible to make out. However, looking at the call-outs on the plan view, I can make out the 4 cavils. Refer to Clipper Ship Captain Appendix and it's much easier to see. I'm probably going to permanently seal my reputation as "the gadfly" of the Glory of the Seas but (you know there's always a "but") my actions are always done as an act of genuine affection for accomplishing the full authenticity of McKay's final magnificent clipper.
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Rob, I echo Pat's sentiment. It will require access to a Thesaurus in order to source new words to express our awe at your elegant craftsmanship. Just reviewing the meticulous accuracy of your highly detailed Royal yard is stunning. This is even before you add in your brilliantly customized furled and weathered sails. It is indeed a wonder to behold.
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George, Been to Reykjavik, even seen a volcanic isle erupt from the window of a DC-7 back in '65 on our memorable flight to West Germany.
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Arina, TheAuthorsDaughter I personally want to express my most profound gratitude to you, for your interest in Rob Wiederrich's progress on his Glory of the Seas builds and especially your proactive step of arranging for him and your dad to get together. It's no exaggeration to say that it was the turning point in our project. While we would have proceeded apace anyways, I have no doubt the accuracy of our builds would be nowhere near as refined as they are today due to the immeasurable contributions of your dad's historic insights and irreplaceable contemporary photos. If you had told me on June 1st, 2009 a date which was my 24th Anniversary, that one day I would be regularly collaborating with the inspired author on two books about McKay's last Clipper, you could have pinched me because I would have sworn I was just dreaming. I remember that exact day because that's when I first decided to tackle revising Glory's hull to reflect the impressive Samuel Walters' painting which your dad wisely chose to debut on the dust cover of his first book. My wife Peggy and I were spending our first romantic overnight at The Stonington Inn and there were lovely nautical scenes everywhere. Sitting by the crackling fireplace, the mood was just relaxing enough that the idea of correcting the sail plan just felt right. Thirteen years later and here we are. While I haven't heard anything yet from the editor of the Nautical Research Journal, I did my part by submitting a thorough summary of our group's continuing journey in time to meet their deadline. Should that manuscript be published and well received, my intention is to do a follow up article on the masting and rigging of Rob's and hopefully by then Vlad's model. Besides that, Rob and I are in the rudimentary planning stages of setting up a museum display when his vessel is complete. I actually envision quite an elaborate set-up, which I've discussed with Rob. Shoot for the stars, maybe end up on the moon.... The unpublished San Francisco Waterfront manuscript sounds like a fascinating project. I know I would want to read it. Maybe it can be found and published some day. Once again, thanks for your continuing interest in Rob's build group. Best Wishes, Rich
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Rob, As Spock would say "Fascinating!"
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Rob, You need to take out the entire crew and their wives to a nice establishment and treat them all to dinner. It's a well deserved reward! Meanwhile Mike sent us a 1990 Sea Chest article with specific information regarding the fo'c'astle height. Apparently in 1911 a Marine Surveyor was hired to measure the area, to ensure the fit of a new windlass the owners were purchasing. He reported the height as 5 feet 9 inches. That definitely puts it above the original location which would only have been 5 feet even. Now, if the new windlass pillars were intended to abut the supporting beams and not the deck above, then the added height would be 7 inches, making it the height at the fancy rail itself, bringing head room up to 6 feet 6 inches. I agree with you that your overall look for Glory of the Seas now looks far more balanced. Great job!
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Druxey, Ahhy. Them sisters be the three fearful witches they are! For they be sayin' a curse, which witches be cursin' the accursed MacBeth for his deathly accursed greed and the bloody avarice of his accursed wife! Which, this bein' a Shakespearean tragedy and all, of course the curse follows through to their horrific but deserved end.... "Out, damned spot!" "double, double, toil and trouble! Fire burn and cauldron bubble!" I be carried away.... "Fairleads" it is then, matey!
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Druxey, Rob Have we settled on "fairlead" or did Druxey's damn spelczech change it from "farelead?" Nautical inquiring minds want to know. 🙂
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Rob, Just trying to get the nautical lingo correct. Is it "fairleads" or "fareleads?" Because they've been spelled both ways and I just want to get it right.
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Rob Can you correctly identify the metal inserts that accompany the chocks in the splash rail? I read earlier that you referred to those as fairleads. The metal prevents the lines from chafing on the wooden openings. I was referring to your observational skills in identifying and replicating them in your model.
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Rob, Simply beautiful rework. Fairleads you refer to are there on the ship but only if you know where to look for them. Well done!
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Vlad, I hope you don't mind a little assist. Here's your clipper Lightning pics reoriented and lightened a little. The other way was giving me a little neck strain! 😉
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Rob, Vladimir and everybody else, Mike just sent me four more pictures of Frederick Pease Harlow's beautiful models. What these images really drive home for me at least, is the order of magnitude in meticulous accuracy Rob and Vladimir's museum quality Glory of the Seas replicas represent. This is in no means intended to disparage the level of detail or obvious talent displayed by FP Harlow in the loving construction of these impressive models. I have no doubt that, if Mr. Harlow had access to the same remarkable photographic resources as have been supplied to us by Michael Mjelde who has been methodically researching Glory of the Seas since 1957, he would have produced far more faithful models to the actual vessels. If anyone wants to understand the tremendous advancement in our comprehension of McKay's final medium clipper, all they need to do is review the many images of Rob and Vladimir's models in comparison to these models of two ships constructed 80 years ago. Having laser focused specifically on the impressive hull of Glory of the Seas for over a dozen years now, I (as I'm sure Rob and Vlad would immediately agree) can spot such obvious inaccuracies in her somewhat blunt bow, bulbous stern, even her enhanced sheer as to make the Harlow model appear just rudimentary in comparison to their modern counterparts. Ironically, both Rob and I agree that FP Harlow's Glory model is the most faithful replica we've seen to date. This fuels a personal suspicion that his other model of the magnificent clipper Great Admiral is probably very similar in being a more rudimentary replica too. The last two images are of that other significant vessel which, like his Glory model, FP Harlow constructed from a cabin door salvaged from her before she was burned. Here's the description Mike gave me from his latest email: "1940. ship Great Admiral made by F.P. Harlow. The decks are of 3/16 inch planks The decks, houses, boats, spars and masts are made from a stateroom door out of the ship Glory of the Seas/. Anchors are from copper spike." "This indicates that Harlow visited the burn site and recovered at least one copper spike from the wreck but by his having one spike, it seems to indicate that he did. I don't remember, however, being told that he was present for the burning." "I also have half a dozen images of his model of Akbar." (the extreme clipper FP Harlow served on)
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Rob, I never get tired of seeing progress photos on your magnificent model. Even the number of rungs on the newly installed ladders emphasizes how high the new bulkheads actually are. It's almost a shame they have to be there, as they now block most of the lovely molding behind them. I also applaud your thoroughness in replacing all iron bitts with wooden ones. Once again, having input from Michael Mjelde, a man who through his single-minded devotion to researching clipper Glory of the Seas beginning in 1957 has given us unique insights into her historical accuracy. After all, nothing beats first hand accounts of men who actually served on these wondrous vessels. It's yet another reason why I call Glory of the Seas the "Rosetta Stone" of Donald McKay's clippers.
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George, How does $8.37 sound? https://www.abebooks.com/servlet/BookDetailsPL?bi=31077602751&cm_sp=snippet-_-srp1-_-tile1&searchurl=ds%3D10%26kn%3DAmerican%2Bbuilt%2Bclipper%2Bship%26sortby%3D17
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George, More of my spreader 2c contributions. I believe that placing chocks where the lines naturally fall makes the most logical sense. Rob's correct about his description of the proper purpose of the spreaders to alleviate stress, reinforce natural spread and prevent entanglements. That leads me to believe that pushing the lines further out would possibly increase stress beyond natural forces, and potentially weaken the upper masts. Probably the best resources would be either Bill Crothers The American Built Clipper Ship, 1850-1856 and Harold A. Underhill's Masting & Rigging: the Clipper Ship & Ocean Carrier.
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Rob, Your Glory of the Seas now looks like a far more accurate replica of the real vessel herself. The one confusing item was that troubling forward bulkhead. It's hard to underestimate the impact revising it has done to the real sense of this Ship. I congratulate you on your bold decision to remake this area. A particularly satisfying development is the new angled interior forward bulkheads, just hinted at by Mike's plan view. As I said in my email, Mike is glad that you concurred with his position that McKay clippers, from at least as far back as Flying Cloud were all equipped with wooden rectangular bitts. Mike gave additional background about the sailor posing with the port wooden rectangular bitt on Glory's f'o'cstle. His name was Frederick Pease Harlow who sailed on the Clipper Ship Akbar. I found this beautiful China Trade painting of her on-line titled "1869 Clipper Akbar off Hong Kong."
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George, Nice work on your masts. Thanks for sharing your progress photos. As for your spreader check question. I believe they're installed to position the backstays so they don't interfere with each other. If they would spread naturally, there'd be no need for the spreaders themselves.
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Wawona59 Thanks for your expression of appreciation for Rob & Vladimir's Glory of the Seas builds. Thanks for sharing the link too. It seems there's growing appreciation for McKay's last, wonderful clipper ship. Too damn bad his spectacular vessels weren't better understood for their value 100 years ago. What a pity, we might have had at least one of his magnificent ships to behold in person.
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