Jaager
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Jaager got a reaction from mtaylor in Types of Scarphs
From empirical observation, the time and effort involved in fabricating this more expensive join was limited to those parts that were for lateral enforcement and/or vertical load carrying. The strength parts and not the coverage parts. I am thinking wales, clamps, riders (?), beams, spirketting (?). If the strake carried a load, it may have required a scarph instead of a simple butt.
When I first read the title I thought you were aiming at a wider time period coverage. The original meaning described two timbers meeting side to side. The meeting of the first futtock with the floor and second futtock, for example. The description being necessary because in earlier time, these timbers floated between each other. When the framing method changed and made this definition all but moot, the mating of butt ends in the same strake took over the word, it seems.
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Jaager got a reaction from mtaylor in Converting scales
Roger,
OK.
Not knowing what the practicum involves, I was thinking about the actual wood pieces.
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Jaager got a reaction from mtaylor in Converting scales
I would do it 64/76 = 0.84 but for what you want, it is the way that I would approach it. Remember that this is 3D so it is l x 0.84 and w x 0.84 and d x 0.84.
With a digital caliper, it should be no problem doing measurements. It sure beats vernier or going blind using a 1/64" graduated ruler.
Now, the trick is getting stock to match.
Hello Jim Byrnes and if you do that, it is hello dark side (scratch).
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Jaager got a reaction from mtaylor in 74 Gun | Ship of the Line - 3rd Rate | Blender
I do not know if this has been addressed, but I verified with AotS Bellona, the quarter galleries are incorrect.
The sides do not extend to shield the sides of the balcony. It is not a motel balcony where the rooms need visual isolation.
Perhaps some 16th c. and 17th c. had a square ended balcony. When seen from above, it was likely an arc by the 18th c.
And no roof either.
The quarter galleries were mostly the senior officer crappers. I seems that way to be anyway.
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Jaager reacted to allanyed in Types of Scarphs
Jaager,
Wales with anchor stock or similar planking are not really all that difficult at our scales. The fun would be for the clamps on the UD and GD on this model as they are specified as tabled and scarphed hook and butt. THAT is not a fun prospect. I decided to forego the tabling on this model as these will be pretty much closed in and never be seen. Maybe on the next project.
Allan
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Jaager got a reaction from mtaylor in Types of Scarphs
The government shipyards would have been their own world, but with a contract I was thinking private yard. In this situation, I considered that perhaps every component may not have been covered. As time progressed, I suspect that the list grew longer as some less than ethical private builders worked to contract instead of using artful assembly. If I were of a mind to replicate the internal components that are hidden by decking, gratings, and planking, going that far in role playing, I would try to follow artful practice in my shipyard.
..... Expletive!! I guess this means I talked myself into using the elaborate joinery for the main wale used in later era RN ships. Another reason to stay with countries with better timber supplies.
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Jaager got a reaction from Roger Pellett in Converting scales
Roger,
OK.
Not knowing what the practicum involves, I was thinking about the actual wood pieces.
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Jaager got a reaction from Kurtis in 74 Gun | Ship of the Line - 3rd Rate | Blender
I do not know if this has been addressed, but I verified with AotS Bellona, the quarter galleries are incorrect.
The sides do not extend to shield the sides of the balcony. It is not a motel balcony where the rooms need visual isolation.
Perhaps some 16th c. and 17th c. had a square ended balcony. When seen from above, it was likely an arc by the 18th c.
And no roof either.
The quarter galleries were mostly the senior officer crappers. I seems that way to be anyway.
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Jaager reacted to allanyed in Types of Scarphs
Thanks guys, much appreciated.
Jaager, the contracts are relatively detailed in their description of the frames so no issues there. I was only in a quandary regarding the various strakes, specifically the footwaling and GD clamp. The GD is in pieces as it has a clamp and riser. I looked again at the FC and as it is only 25 feet long, a single piece would likely be appropriate.
Just as an FYI, there are 6 strakes of 15" wide footwaling at the wrongheads, with two that are 6" thick lying on the chocking of the floor head and middle futtock, then one 5" on each side, then one 4" on each side. Perhaps the center strakes would be scarphed as they are to reinforce the area of the joints of the frame.
The devil is indeed in the details at times.
Allan
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Jaager got a reaction from bruce d in Types of Scarphs
From empirical observation, the time and effort involved in fabricating this more expensive join was limited to those parts that were for lateral enforcement and/or vertical load carrying. The strength parts and not the coverage parts. I am thinking wales, clamps, riders (?), beams, spirketting (?). If the strake carried a load, it may have required a scarph instead of a simple butt.
When I first read the title I thought you were aiming at a wider time period coverage. The original meaning described two timbers meeting side to side. The meeting of the first futtock with the floor and second futtock, for example. The description being necessary because in earlier time, these timbers floated between each other. When the framing method changed and made this definition all but moot, the mating of butt ends in the same strake took over the word, it seems.
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Jaager got a reaction from Canute in Frigate vs. Sloop
Sloop is an ambiguous type designation. The vessel in Antscherl's book is the 18th century version.
There is a merchant /civilian vessel type.
In the 19th century - for the USN : Sloop-of-War - the class and distinctions within it 1st class, 2nd class, 3rd class based on size and number of guns.
They were also termed corvettes - there may have been a size distinction to which were called corvette. Corvettes were also a creature of the 18th century.
The defining characteristic was that they carried their guns on one deck. In general, the number of guns was 16-20. As the 19th century progressed, some or most had a spar deck. A sort of roof over the gun deck that made it easier to manage the rigging. No guns and not much of a bulwark.
A frigate carries guns on two levels (decks). There may only be 2-4 guns on the quarterdeck, but that makes it a frigate.
As the 19th century progressed, some frigates had their 2nd level guns removed, the upper bulwarks cut down, and perhaps the beams replaced using less substantial ones - to become razee corvette.
The RN changed the sparring on some of their brigs - Cruzier's were a subject for this. The main and fore masts were made less lofty and a full mizzen mast was added. For some reason they were called brig sloops. Though born brigs, they were now ship rigged and the same size as Sloop-of-War.
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Jaager got a reaction from Gregory in Frigate vs. Sloop
Sloop is an ambiguous type designation. The vessel in Antscherl's book is the 18th century version.
There is a merchant /civilian vessel type.
In the 19th century - for the USN : Sloop-of-War - the class and distinctions within it 1st class, 2nd class, 3rd class based on size and number of guns.
They were also termed corvettes - there may have been a size distinction to which were called corvette. Corvettes were also a creature of the 18th century.
The defining characteristic was that they carried their guns on one deck. In general, the number of guns was 16-20. As the 19th century progressed, some or most had a spar deck. A sort of roof over the gun deck that made it easier to manage the rigging. No guns and not much of a bulwark.
A frigate carries guns on two levels (decks). There may only be 2-4 guns on the quarterdeck, but that makes it a frigate.
As the 19th century progressed, some frigates had their 2nd level guns removed, the upper bulwarks cut down, and perhaps the beams replaced using less substantial ones - to become razee corvette.
The RN changed the sparring on some of their brigs - Cruzier's were a subject for this. The main and fore masts were made less lofty and a full mizzen mast was added. For some reason they were called brig sloops. Though born brigs, they were now ship rigged and the same size as Sloop-of-War.
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Jaager got a reaction from mtaylor in Do you love Ancre Monographs and building models from them?
This is a great idea.
Search " Commerce " and tag these too. All Gerard Delacroix inventory is now ANCRE. Even if this particular vessel seems to have defeated all attempts so far.
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Jaager got a reaction from tkay11 in Do you love Ancre Monographs and building models from them?
This is a great idea.
Search " Commerce " and tag these too. All Gerard Delacroix inventory is now ANCRE. Even if this particular vessel seems to have defeated all attempts so far.
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Jaager got a reaction from Chuck in Do you love Ancre Monographs and building models from them?
This is a great idea.
Search " Commerce " and tag these too. All Gerard Delacroix inventory is now ANCRE. Even if this particular vessel seems to have defeated all attempts so far.
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Jaager got a reaction from druxey in Le Mercure by Planet_Jupiter - from ANCRE plans
It is an excellent job that you have done in laying your deck.
The darker raised strakes have an open grain that is similar to that of some Rock Elm that I have come across. It may want filling of the pores. I am not sure of the best way to do it though.
The blond species looks great. Adding trunnels is a modeler's convention that I enjoy. On a real ship they would not be all that obvious. They were often covered with plugs of the same wood as the decking, with matching grain.
The end grain of any species will usually be darker. If your trunnels were cored from the same blonde species, they would show. Using Pear, the contrast that comes from its end grain may be a more stark contrast than you really want. Just a thought before you step off that cliff.
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Jaager got a reaction from Gregory in Castello Boxwood Price?
Mark,
A thought that came up when I read what Richard said about the inventory focus at Cooks: what they sell is a minor fraction, and a premium one at that, of their supplier sawmills' product.
If they have to buy the lot to get their premium stock, perhaps they have a backroom with the boring stuff we want. Or maybe they can tell you who they buy from and you can learn for us, where all the boring stuff goes? Who sells it?
As I read it, Madrone at Cooks is a species where they have to buy the lot. It is most likely from that mill that I contacted and their stock has experienced the special session in a kiln. They (the main mill) make a point of saying that if Madrone is not special kiln dried, and air dried instead, the result is mostly twisted toothpicks i.e. cupped, twisted, warped, and severely checked. If I have this correct, when you look, think of it as red colored boxwood.
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Jaager got a reaction from RichardG in Castello Boxwood Price?
Mark,
A thought that came up when I read what Richard said about the inventory focus at Cooks: what they sell is a minor fraction, and a premium one at that, of their supplier sawmills' product.
If they have to buy the lot to get their premium stock, perhaps they have a backroom with the boring stuff we want. Or maybe they can tell you who they buy from and you can learn for us, where all the boring stuff goes? Who sells it?
As I read it, Madrone at Cooks is a species where they have to buy the lot. It is most likely from that mill that I contacted and their stock has experienced the special session in a kiln. They (the main mill) make a point of saying that if Madrone is not special kiln dried, and air dried instead, the result is mostly twisted toothpicks i.e. cupped, twisted, warped, and severely checked. If I have this correct, when you look, think of it as red colored boxwood.
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Jaager got a reaction from mtaylor in Castello Boxwood Price?
Mark,
A thought that came up when I read what Richard said about the inventory focus at Cooks: what they sell is a minor fraction, and a premium one at that, of their supplier sawmills' product.
If they have to buy the lot to get their premium stock, perhaps they have a backroom with the boring stuff we want. Or maybe they can tell you who they buy from and you can learn for us, where all the boring stuff goes? Who sells it?
As I read it, Madrone at Cooks is a species where they have to buy the lot. It is most likely from that mill that I contacted and their stock has experienced the special session in a kiln. They (the main mill) make a point of saying that if Madrone is not special kiln dried, and air dried instead, the result is mostly twisted toothpicks i.e. cupped, twisted, warped, and severely checked. If I have this correct, when you look, think of it as red colored boxwood.
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Jaager got a reaction from mtaylor in Sanding planking first layer
I did not want to know this, what with all the super fine grit abrasive media out there. A final sanding of layer one with 100-120 grit with provide the tooth required for PVA to hold the two layers of wood together. For a bonding surface, glass-like is not good.
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Jaager got a reaction from Chuck Seiler in Thin bullwarks
What I see: this is a POB build. The molds are 3 layer plywood.
Your dimensions are for the mold extensions that are inside bulwarks that are fully planked outside and inside? Just this between two layers support is 5/32" at the waterway and 4/32" at the rail?
Aside from making the already weak plywood even more fragile, it is not good practice to propagate and error and shave down the other supports.
The simple solution is to scab (PVA glue with careful clamping) a piece of 1/16" veneer on the inside to repair your overzealous sanding.
Woodcraft has 1/16" veneer packs. The two species that will be of use for other places on a ship model that will be seen are Black Cherry and Hard Maple.
A #11 shape knife blade and a steel straight edge should do what cutting needs doing.
A piece sawn from scrap Pine would do, as would any appropriate bit of wood from your scrap bin, or layered up curls from a full size hand plane on Pine. By asking this, I am guessing that you are where most all of us were when we started. Not many tools, no scrap bin.
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Jaager got a reaction from bruce d in Castello Boxwood Price?
Mark,
A thought that came up when I read what Richard said about the inventory focus at Cooks: what they sell is a minor fraction, and a premium one at that, of their supplier sawmills' product.
If they have to buy the lot to get their premium stock, perhaps they have a backroom with the boring stuff we want. Or maybe they can tell you who they buy from and you can learn for us, where all the boring stuff goes? Who sells it?
As I read it, Madrone at Cooks is a species where they have to buy the lot. It is most likely from that mill that I contacted and their stock has experienced the special session in a kiln. They (the main mill) make a point of saying that if Madrone is not special kiln dried, and air dried instead, the result is mostly twisted toothpicks i.e. cupped, twisted, warped, and severely checked. If I have this correct, when you look, think of it as red colored boxwood.
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Jaager got a reaction from mtaylor in Castello Boxwood Price?
Mark,
Placing myself in your shoes for moment, but with my bias, what I see at Cook Woods:
Castello from what I seek, their stock looks sort of the opposite - too busy - and the price!!! My back of the envelope calculations tell me that I would need 8" x 2" x 60" to frame a hull the size of La Belle Poule.
Pear too busy and too expensive.
Holly the cutoffs box looks promising. @ 1/64 a 6" piece is 32' long -- if there is enough of the longer to make it worth getting, excellent for hull planking and can be dyed - black = a safe and user friendly Ebony substitute - icky yellow - the bottom treated planking -- blue - topside the deck if toned down from white.
Ceylon Satinwood take a look at the grain and cost, but think spars - Probably good for planking but the cost?
Yellowheart the same - I have some really yellow stock, but their photos have theirs a bit more toned down it should work for most any part of a ship. again cost?
Madrone When they say "a better Swiss Pear than Swiss Pear", my ears perk up. It is locally sourced for you. You can actually massage each board, look for color and straight grain, see if it is straight, tight, hard, no pores. If their advertising is actually correct, you have the potential for a golden ticket.
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Jaager got a reaction from thibaultron in Converting a Backyard Shed into a Model Workshop
I trust that you mean this is jest. Being 3 litres negative water balance in Piedmont Carolina in Summer-like temp sort of makes it difficult to maintain the necessary internal balance and not start to denature some temperature sensitive enzymes and receptors. I think beyond a certain age, our internal thirst safety drive can get to be below the strength of signal necessary to gain our attention.
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Jaager got a reaction from mtaylor in Thin bullwarks
What I see: this is a POB build. The molds are 3 layer plywood.
Your dimensions are for the mold extensions that are inside bulwarks that are fully planked outside and inside? Just this between two layers support is 5/32" at the waterway and 4/32" at the rail?
Aside from making the already weak plywood even more fragile, it is not good practice to propagate and error and shave down the other supports.
The simple solution is to scab (PVA glue with careful clamping) a piece of 1/16" veneer on the inside to repair your overzealous sanding.
Woodcraft has 1/16" veneer packs. The two species that will be of use for other places on a ship model that will be seen are Black Cherry and Hard Maple.
A #11 shape knife blade and a steel straight edge should do what cutting needs doing.
A piece sawn from scrap Pine would do, as would any appropriate bit of wood from your scrap bin, or layered up curls from a full size hand plane on Pine. By asking this, I am guessing that you are where most all of us were when we started. Not many tools, no scrap bin.
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