Mike Y

Finally back on my Le Rochefort after building balsa planes for over a year. I’ve been figuring out where I left off. First thing is to taper the tops of the frames inside. They’re close now but I still have work to do on them. Since I used the Hahn method the bottoms, floors, chocks do not have the complex joints in each half of the frame. The keelson will be another major headache to notch and fit if I decide to notch it at all. I’m going to assemble this hull and when done and able to remove of from the jig take stock of it and decide to either continue or start over completely. 

This is my second POF project. I also did a Blandford section last year. This is quite a project I see already. I’m still at the beginning stages. I’m going to use the Hahn method (attempt it anyway) but just for the frames. I’ll build the hull in the normal shipyard style. Progress so far. Keel bow and stern axial timbers and made and fitted. I’m waiting for my frame wood before I mill out the rising wood and continue. I’m working in the stern timbers now. I’ve been following Mark’s “No Idea’s” build since he started. I don’t expect to get near that quality but in the end I’ll still have a model I can be proud of. 

I had completed making all the Orlop deck gratings (image below). From what I could find they ran along both sides of the hull , full length, and this was called the carpenter's walk. There was also a run along the bow from port to larboard (starboard) and three central gratings.  The topside of all were flush with the top of the beams. The first task was to lightly sand the top of the grating battens to be flush with the grating ledges as mine stood a bit proud. I set my sandpaper down onto the small repurposed pastry marble slab with some double sided tape to keep it secure and had at it (image below).
Installing the gratings was, at first, an overwhelming challenge. The grating ledges were to be set into notches cut into the deck beams and carlings. Aligning these notches properly was impossible, and occasionally splitting the beam corners off unavoidable. To alleviate this, I simply cut (chiselled and scraped) the corner edges off of the beams and carlings that the grating ledges were to rest on, and then I sanded the underside corners of the grating ledges that were to rest on those beams and carlings (image above). Applied a little dab of white PVA glue and plopped them into place. When looking down at it you cannot tell the complete beam corner is gone, plus it will be deep enough below other decks that seeing anything will draw attention away from such a small detail.
In the image above I only have the three central gratings installed.   I did not install the floor, lower futtock or second futtock riders. The second futtock riders pass through the Orlop deck and up to the underside of the Gundeck clamps. In doing so, these run alongside the deck beams and pass through the gratings in those areas. That is why some beams haven't knees in between bracing them. When installing those gratings I notched them out to allow the passage of the riders. I have no intention of adding the riders... they won't be seen or missed.
Once all the gratings are in I will install the Orlop standard knees above the floor beams. Then I move up to the Gundeck.
I am further along than these photos suggest but still will need a couple of nice days to finish them off. Yes, I am back outside working on the ship, so nice weather is a must. Yesterday was rainy, today is a bit cruddy, and the next few are forecasted to be wet!

I usually scrape the joints with a sharp knife, that makes it perfectly flat.
If you leave a little more wood around the piece and create the joint first, it doesn't matter too much if you have to make any corrections. When the joint is done, sand the rest of the piece down to shape.

I continue to complete the bow.      

I did a variety of things over the last week.  I built the jib outhaul block (shown in the painfully enlarged photo below . . . warts and all, haha).  Mike (stuntflyer) has an excellent tutorial for that on his Cheerful build, so I followed that.  I then made a card stock mock up of the starboard side seat.  I used the card stock templates as a pattern to cut out the parts.  As others have said this is a bit finicky.  I have a feeling the second one will be more of a challenge as I try to get it to match the first.
 
I spent some time this week reading ahead in Chuck's monograph chapters to get a list of the last little bits I need to finish the build.  I ordered some Albion Alloys brass tube.  I also messaged Chuck, Mike, and Glenn (glbarlow) with questions about the thread type/size/color they used with Chuck's scale rope for seizing and serving.  Today I went on a region wide road trip to fly fishing shops and fabric stores.  Most of my dark brown rope is Chuck's old style rope, other than the .012" new Ultra for rat lines (so I don't need thread for seizing or serving the brown Ultra rope).  My tan rope is a mix of his old rope and the new Ultra rope.  These tan colors are close enough in shade to mix on the model, but I wanted thread for seizing that matched each shade.  The photos below are color corrected to be as close to accurate as I could possibly get the images.  The Gutermann thread is for most serving and seizing.  The smaller diameter UNI-Thread fly tying thread is for tiny serving and seizing.
 
Here's what I came up with based on what I could find locally.
Using with Syren old brown rope - Gutermann 50wt CA02776 Polyester thread Color 593 - UNI-Thread 72D 8/0W Dark Brown
Using with Syren old tan rope - Gutermann 50wt CA02776 Polyester thread Color 512 - UNI-Thread 72D 8/0W Tan
Using with Syren new Ultra tan rope - Gutermann 50wt CA02776 Polyester thread Color 509 - also UNI-Thread 72D 8/0W Tan
 
Also, as Chuck had answered, the thread he uses for seizing and serving his new Ultra rope is as follows (I researched what actual size/diameter it is in wt and tex).
Ultra Brown rope - Gutermann Mara 150 50wt/20Tex  Color 682 or for smaller uses Mara 220 77wt/13Tex
Ultra Tan rope - Gutermann Mara 150 50wt/20Tex  Color 263 or for smaller uses Mara 220 77wt/13Tex
This is hard to find in the US, so Chuck recommended this place: https://www.williamgee.co.uk/product-tag/mara/
 
Erik
 

To scupper or not to scupper.
 
Most contemporary models do not show the scuppers.   In fact the contemporary model of Speedwell doesnt show the scuppers. I didnt add the scuppers on my Winnie build which was typical.  But I am going to show them on my speedwell.   Nothing fancy.   These arent too crazy to do.   Not like the hawse holes will be.  But you do have to be careful.  You need to carefully measure them inboard and outboard so they look like they line up.  You can actually use the deck planking templates because I have marked the inboard locations for all of the scuppers.
 
When I drill my scuppers I dont even try to drill them all the way through.   That adds unnecessary difficulty.   I drill shallow holes only about 1/16" deep or slightly more.   Inboard, I start with a small pilot hole with a small drill bit.   Then in this case, I used a #47 drill bit afterwards to make them larger.   Finally I used a round file to smooth out the hole’s insides.   I lightly sanded the inboard bulwarks over the scuppers with some 400 grit sandpaper to smooth out any fraying.  This will require some paint touch-up later when they are all done.  The scupper holes were made flush with the deck level or just a hair above.
 
I prefer to use a soft pencil to darken the inside of the holes.  I made sure to cover the entire inside surface of the scuppers including the back of the hole.   Then I touch up the red bulwark paint.  On this model I drilled the scuppers before I added the waterway.  I just wanted to try something new.  It worked out really well for me.  No chipping or fraying of the water way at all.  You can do it whichever way is more comfortable for you.
 
The picture below shows the holes drilled and darkened with the pencil.   They are nice and dark.  I touched up the red paint as well on the bulwarks afterwards.  You can see the waterway strip also prepared in advance and ready to be glued into position.
 

The waterway is a 3/64" x 3/64" strip of cedar.  I sanded one of the four corners of the strip down its entire length.  I used an Emory board or sanding stick.   Basically I made it triangular in profile.  Then I held it in position so I could mark the positions for the scuppers along its length.  I really tried to get these exactly where they should be located.  I used a round mini file to make the half round openings along the length of the waterway where the scuppers were marked out.  Once in position this really looked good.   I used the same soft pencil to darken the round notches I made along the waterway as well.   Below you can see how the scuppers inboard turned out.  I made the waterway in two pieces for the gun deck rather than use one long strip that spanned across the whole length.
 

I also prepared the waterway for the poop deck, port and starboard.   This was easy...no scuppers, LOL.   Just make the strip triangular.  Dont worry about trying to make it concave or anything fancy.   
 
Here is a photo.
 

Finally to the outboard side.  No difference here really.   I used those outboard templates we used way back when....remember those.   If you have to shift the template fore and aft a bit to line them up with the inboard scuppers you made on the opposite side of the deck/hull its no big deal.   But this template will give you a really good start and can be rested atop the wales.
 

 
I drilled with a small drill bit first and again made the holes larger using the #47 bit.   I cleaned them up a bit and darkened them with a soft pencil.  Once again...no need to drill all the way through and hope you meet the same scupper hole you drilled on the inboard side.  Fake it ...till you make it .....I always say.   I drilled part way through once again.   Make sure you really darken them inside the holes nicely and completely.
 

Dont add the waterway on the fcastle deck yet.   I think it best to drill the hawse holes first.   I will be doing that next me thinks.
 

Finishing up Chapter5 with the gunport lids and I thought I would share how I make these.

1. Scotch tape is placed over each of the gunports and then the outline of the port and the position of the plank seams is traced onto it with a pencil.
2. Pieces of the correct width wood to match the planking widths are edge glued together about 1” wide and then the Scotch tape is pulled off the hull and aligned to the wood seams.
3. I roughly sand down to the outline of the outside of the port, and then fine sand while checking the fit until I get a snug fit it the port it is intended for.
4. Add the backing piece to each and paint the insides red.
 

I had to clean up the Dockyard before going on vacation, but thought I would post a couple of pictures of the two models, both in the same scale and of roughly the same timeframe - 1764 for Winchelsea and 1776 for Pegasus.

Winter has not been easy for me in recent years. It is during this period that various problems pile up. And they “knock me out of the saddle”. And this winter was no exception. Therefore, in the winter period of time my shipyard on the table covered with cobwebs and dust. But fortunately with the onset of spring the work there began to come to life. So after a long break I have something new to show. So far it's still small steps. All that I will show are minor changes. But the ice after winter doesn't melt in a minute. I'm happy with this pace. 
That's the introduction. And now after the introduction, you can write something like this:
 
 
Chapter 3 (or 4, or even 5).
in which we learn about the balcony windows, the crooked moldings, and the author is furious. 
 
I finished work on the big screen on the transom of the ship, on which the crest with wings should appear in the future. And now it was necessary to go lower and deal with the decoration of that part of the transom, which is on the second floor of the officers' rooms. Where the balcony is. 
 


I thought this was the easiest part of the whole transom. It would be perfect for “warming up your hands” after a long break.

But it turns out it's not that easy. And the easy ride I was expecting didn't work out. I couldn't figure out the best way to make the shields and screens under the windows and the columns between the windows. I won't list everything, I'll just say that I didn't like some nuances and others. And I had to remodel several times. I will show only one of those variants, which were. 
 

 

 

 
It was also a very ugly design that I had to remove completely. I don't even remember exactly how many attempts there were. 
And now I'll move on to another problem. I need to make moldings for my job. A lot of them. This is the most basic part that is required all the time. They are used to make the edging of shields with fillets. Moldings decorated the joints between the parts. And so on. I made them with the help of a figurative scraper. The technology is so old and familiar that there is no point in describing it. But now when making moldings I faced a problem. Very often they turned out crooked, the pattern of the profile was not even along the rail, it resembled a drunken snake, which in addition still hiccups. 
 

 

 


In the photos, you can even see that the scraper cut into the lath during the movement and chewed off its side wall.

The reason for the defect in the moldings was most likely due to the wood. At least it seems that way to me. I think that the laths I made as blanks were from a board that had too wavy fibers. And that wood grain kept the scraper from going straight. The fibers had different textures, next to the area with soft fibers were places where the wood was harder. So it was easy for the scraper to go sideways and cut the wrong areas.
 
I primarily wanted to show how crooked the pattern is, that it doesn't match the rail. To be honest, I was very surprised when I got the discarded laths for the photo shoot. They had been lying in the garbage can the whole time. I didn't see them after the milling itself. And now it was a big surprise to me to see that the slats themselves had become crooked as well. So this again suggests that the problem is most likely poor quality material. From the same log I carved an English lion. The carving satisfied me. But as a material for thin laths this blank already showed a bad result. What can you do, wood is a living material. From the same billet I made moldings for the transom. And there everything was in order. The remaining laths are still even. But here the result is quite different. Wood is not metal, and not plastic. It has its own character. Although I may be wrong. After all, the laths were lying (exactly wallowed) in the trash. The rest of the trash that was lying on top could have also affected the warping. Maybe there was a different humidity from some wet wipes or something else.
Again, I got distracted.

Of course I started looking for wood with a straighter fiber pattern. But I still had concerns. What if there would be rejects now too? 
And at this point I decided to make a small bed, which can help in working with moldings. 
 
The principle is simple. I used to glue the rail to a piece of plywood and move the scraper by hand. But what if you do the opposite? What happens if the scraper is clamped and the lath moves? I can make walls on both sides of the rail, and then it will move like in a chute and can't run off to the side. A clamped scraper would also ensure that the wood cut would only be where it needs to be. 
I can make one side of the tunnel movable and the width of the channel can be adjusted for any lath size and handle laths with different sizes. So I decided to try this method. Perhaps this method has been around for a long time and I should have just searched a bit for similar designs and made one, taking into account other people's experience. But I have not met such a thing before. So I had to do everything on the basis of my own assumptions. Or maybe the fact that I haven't seen something like this from others suggests that it's not the best way to make moldings. 
I really like it when homemade machines or devices are made qualitatively and beautifully. But more often it happens that you need to make something very quickly and from the material that was lying in the corner. And then homemade devices look like Frankenstein's monster. This little machine became that monster. I just took the first materials I could find. We need to at least figure out if this system will even work. Why waste good material on such an attempt? So I apologize in advance for the fact that the device does not look very beautiful. 
But, you will agree that this is not the most important issue. More interesting and important is another one. Does this method work at all?
In short, yes, it is quite a working option. Although it also has its nuances or disadvantages. What are they?
 

 

 

 
Let me start with the scraper itself. In the process of work it is impossible to immediately set the scraper so, when it makes the last, clean removal of wood. When you hold the scraper with your hands, it gradually descends lower and lower. This is the same principle on this bed. This means that after each layer, the scraper has to be readjusted and lowered. And it is very important that it is lowered without any misalignment. Otherwise it can lead to defects. It takes more time and needs more attention. I would not call it a disadvantage, but rather a feature. But the following nuance definitely fits under the name “minus”. Since for milling it is necessary to push the rail, and it can be very thin, then there is a high probability that the rail can easily break when you push it. And the thinner the cross-sectional size of the rail, the more likely this problem is.

What can we say then? This method is not good? No, I will not categorically reject this milling method. It is possible to achieve a quality result even with very thin laths. All I did was to push the rail very slowly and adjust the scraper so that it removed the chips in very small portions. Plus I also covered the channel where the rail was moving from above. So there was nowhere for it to bend and therefore break. 
A little later, I added another stop to this bed at the back edge. At this end, I could install a scraper that would remove chips from only one edge. This position is convenient when you want to make a shaped edge on a convex part, for example.
 

 
This whole design was a bit of an experiment. I was prepared in advance that the method is not worth attention. And many “pitfalls” were obvious even before the experiments started. But I'm glad I tried it. And I'm happy with the result I got. Yes, I had some discarded parts. A few slats did break before I even got the idea to turn the channel into a tunnel. I won't say that I will reject the classical variant (when the scraper moves) now. Most likely I will use both methods. For the final comparison we need to take the rails that started the whole story. Those that turned out to be crooked by the classical method. And use the same ones, but already in this “depot”. Then it will be quite clear whether this device has such advantages that cannot be obtained by other methods. But I will do this when I have nothing to entertain myself with. For now, my head is already puffing with other tasks and problems.
And at the end, I'll come back to the balcony area. Here's what I've got. 
 

 


Compared to what came before this option I liked it. So I kept it. And after the transom, I decided to turn my attention to the sides as well. Where the side gallery is. And more precisely the upper tier of this gallery, where the dome is made in the form of a false structure.
 

 

 

 

 

 

The story about the rest of the false dome will already be in the next chapter. I already asked for advice in a previous post. So the intrigue about what will happen next will definitely not happen anymore, but I still have to pretend that everything is unknown and covered in fog. Let's see what I got. Did I get anything? Did I succeed in taking the advice.
Intrigue...

1/3 of all frames rough sanded and ready for assembly... there are few that needs to be made again, just to much pressure on the sander caused more removed wood that needed... 
 

Happy modelling..  

Thanks guys....Had a lot of fun and will be back this evening...
 


 
One Note
 
I was contacted while away with an issue about frame 2F.   Its really weird because I cant replicate this.  My laser files for this 3/16" thick top timber shows the correct part for the top timber.   No worries though.  This is an easy fix.  I have not been contacted by any others so it may even be a one off thing.  But if you have the same issue.  Just send me a PM or an email and I will send you a new set of top timbers for 2F right away.  
 
Dont reply here .....send me an email or PM!!!!  Include your name and address info as well.   I will ship immediately.   I will cut a whole bunch when I return and have them ready to ship just in case anybody else has this same issue.
 

Thank you guys...we leave tomorrow.
 
Yes I am headed out to the north and south fork of Long Island.   Gonna check out some maritime stuff including some museums that have small boat collections.  Still researching that block island Cowhorn.  There is supposed to be a nice one in the museum there.  I will be online using my phone though....me always needs some MSW time....lol.
 
Planking has started...today.
 
The facstle is completed.  Nothing to really add except that I followed the planking scheme provided on the plans.   You can see that here.  You guys may of course change it.  I cut these from a 3/64" sheet following the plans rather than use strips.  There is quite a pronounced curve to these and they are small enough so it wasnt a chore.  I basically traced the plan sheet.  Tweaked and sanded to suit.  I used a #4H pencil to simulate the caulking between the planks.
 
Progress below.  One plank at a time.  The outermost planks are the hardest but not terrible.
 



 

Some inner sanding was done for few frames using oscillating sander and paper burr was removed with a small piece of sander paper. Result is very nice and acceptable. This is rough sanding, still leaving some meat close to the line for final sanding..
 



Happy modelling..

Thanks Mike Y,
 
yeah, I was experimenting with few other sanding ways/options but appears that slow and careful way is always a winning combo..
 
Appreciated your comment. 
 
Cheers
 

Your build looks beautiful and with clear quality standard!
Used a disk sander to shape frames, so it was never an issue since the disk always pushes the part down.
The concave parts are sanded on the edge of the disk, slow and careful.
When you got close to a line - then I guess you can smoothen it on a spindle sander. You don’t need to get too close, better leave some ”meat” for the fairing once the frames are in place. 

Your build looks beautiful and with clear quality standard!
Used a disk sander to shape frames, so it was never an issue since the disk always pushes the part down.
The concave parts are sanded on the edge of the disk, slow and careful.
When you got close to a line - then I guess you can smoothen it on a spindle sander. You don’t need to get too close, better leave some ”meat” for the fairing once the frames are in place. 

Your build looks beautiful and with clear quality standard!
Used a disk sander to shape frames, so it was never an issue since the disk always pushes the part down.
The concave parts are sanded on the edge of the disk, slow and careful.
When you got close to a line - then I guess you can smoothen it on a spindle sander. You don’t need to get too close, better leave some ”meat” for the fairing once the frames are in place. 

I've created a suction adapter for the Proxxon DH40.
It can be downloaded from my website and printed out yourself. The diameters have been increased by 0.2 mm so that the tube can be fitted without any problems.
 
https://www.olivers-historic-shipyard.com/

Milling and beveling of frames.

It has been a while since I last posted any update - and to be honest I haven't had a lot of time to devote to modelling in the last few weeks. What time I have had has mostly been spent either reorganising tools and workspaces or taking just a few steps forward and then a few steps backwards with the build!
 
I thought it would be a good idea to get a proper spindle sander setup and as space doesn't allow me to have a dedicated spindle sander I instead purchased some sleeveless sanding drums to use in the drill press. The sleeves are 1 inch, 2 inch 2.5 inch and 3 inch in diameter. I made a little spindle sanding station so that there was a nice flat baseboard on which to place the pieces when they are being sanded - here is the 1 inch drum in the press.

I have made and then subsequently discard two attempts at making the stemson. The stemson is made from 15" stock and in each case I found it difficult to get the join between it and the stem nice and uniform. I am now on my third attempt and rather than using a cut out template from the plans I have this time traced the shape of the inner curve of my stem onto the piece of wood. This has then been cut out on the scroll saw and now needs sanding to ensure a snug fit. I have purchased a cheap A5 lightboard to help me with checking the fit of the joint and hopefully that will help me improve on my earlier less successful attempts!
 
One useful piece of knowledge I have recently acquired is that it isn't a good idea to use tracing paper as a template for any of the pieces. I had traced the shapes of the aft deadwood pieces on tracing paper and then glued then to some 15" stock but when I came to cut them out on the scroll saw I noticed that the act of gluing the tracing paper to the wood had actually resulted in the tracing paper becoming stretched in one dimension. Luckily this meant that my templates were too long rather than too short and so the pieces were still useable, but at least now I know not to do that again! 


I have glued the three aft deadwood pieces together with black tissue paper in the joints. The top curve of the assembled pieces have been sanded to the correct shape but the base and the rear line of the aft deadwood is still a little oversize. I will sand those to size once I have milled in the shape of the stepping line. I also need to drill holes in the base of the aft deadwood so that it can be pinned to the centreline of the keel at some point in the future.

 

This is how this detail looks like on the HMS Victory in Portsmouth.

Hello,
it is done. At least the wheels are ready build. Next to build are the two supporters for the wheels.

Hello,
because today the summer ended we had here the last weeks and it rained again the whole day, I was busy at the yard. 
This is cutter No. 3 and I think now it works. The handles are a little too bulky, but when they are slimmer they would break. The spooks have a Ø of 1,6 mm!


Now are only 17+ spooks left

Preparation for the production of frames.