AON Posted November 25, 2015 #1 Posted November 25, 2015 Can someone tell me the proper name for any extra partial top timber frame? I was into a rhythm drawing my frames and suddenly noticed something was wrong. After about 20 minutes I suddenly saw it tuck in between two frames above a gun port. (see the attached image below) Of course I had some choice names for it at the time, but now that I've had time to... reflect... I probably should be calling it something else. Thanks in advance for your help with this. Alan mtaylor and Canute 2 Quote Alan O'Neill "only dead fish go with the flow" Ongoing Build (31 Dec 2013) - HMS BELLEROPHON (1786), POF scratch build, scale 1:64, 74 gun 3rd rate Man of War, Arrogant Class Member of the Model Shipwrights of Niagara, Niagara Region, Ontario, Canada (2016), and the Nautical Research Guild (since 2014) Associate member of the Nautical Research and Model Ship Society (2021) Offshore member of The Society of Model Shipwrights (2021)
AON Posted November 26, 2015 Author #2 Posted November 26, 2015 Seems I may be resorting to my original nautical vernacular (spoken like a true sailor) as this unnamed timber had caused me considerable emotional grief. Or possible I'll just refer to it as Waldo (as in where's Waldo) ;^) mtaylor and Canute 2 Quote Alan O'Neill "only dead fish go with the flow" Ongoing Build (31 Dec 2013) - HMS BELLEROPHON (1786), POF scratch build, scale 1:64, 74 gun 3rd rate Man of War, Arrogant Class Member of the Model Shipwrights of Niagara, Niagara Region, Ontario, Canada (2016), and the Nautical Research Guild (since 2014) Associate member of the Nautical Research and Model Ship Society (2021) Offshore member of The Society of Model Shipwrights (2021)
Jaager Posted November 27, 2015 #3 Posted November 27, 2015 (edited) My guess is: filler top . In any case, what you show is a nightmare. Tapered timbers - shifted timbers. re-enforces my preference for planking everything from the main wale on up. In which case, it is easier and makes for a more stable hull to fill the spaces above the main wale with timbers. Edited November 27, 2015 by Jaager Canute and mtaylor 2 Quote NRG member 50 years Current: NMS HMS Ajax 1767 - 74-gun 3rd rate - 1:192 POF exploration - works but too intense -no margin for error HMS Centurion 1732 - 60-gun 4th rate - POF Navall Timber framing HMS Beagle 1831 refiit 10-gun brig with a small mizzen - POF Navall (ish) Timber framing The U.S. Ex. Ex. 1838-1842 Flying Fish 1838 pilot schooner - POF framed - ready for stern timbers Porpose II 1836 brigantine/brig - POF framed - ready for hawse and stern timbers Vincennes 1825 Sloop-of-War - POF timbers assembled, need shaping Peacock 1828 Sloop-of -War - POF timbers ready for assembly Sea Gull 1838 pilot schooner - POF timbers ready for assembly Relief 1835 packet hull USN ship - POF timbers ready for assembly Other Portsmouth 1843 Sloop-of-War - POF timbers ready for assembly Le Commerce de Marseilles 1788 118 cannons - POF framed La Renommee 1744 Frigate - POF framed - ready for hawse and stern timbers
AON Posted November 27, 2015 Author #4 Posted November 27, 2015 (edited) Thank you for the very good suggestion Jagger! It was suggested this would take some research to find out. I'm guessing it was not that common. I have a small library that I will look through once more... and of course there is the inter-web which I will delve into further but I have a feeling you may be correct as it may have just been a "toptimber filler piece" as opposed to that sneaky little so and so. For the present mine will be referred to affectionately as Waldo. Regarding your comment on the choice of build... there are moments I feel I may have bitten off more than I can chew but I have nothing but time and I can be very patient but certainly never quit. I am hoping it will be more fun than it seems. It will definitely be a worthy challenge.... and ah loves a challenge! Alan Edited November 27, 2015 by AON Canute and mtaylor 2 Quote Alan O'Neill "only dead fish go with the flow" Ongoing Build (31 Dec 2013) - HMS BELLEROPHON (1786), POF scratch build, scale 1:64, 74 gun 3rd rate Man of War, Arrogant Class Member of the Model Shipwrights of Niagara, Niagara Region, Ontario, Canada (2016), and the Nautical Research Guild (since 2014) Associate member of the Nautical Research and Model Ship Society (2021) Offshore member of The Society of Model Shipwrights (2021)
robcg Posted November 27, 2015 #5 Posted November 27, 2015 Peter Goodwin (Sailing Man of War, 1987, pg.15,16) and C.N. Longridge (Anatomy of Nelson's Ships, 1981, pg.19) both call them "lengthening pieces". DH Roberts' translation of Blaise Ollivier's Remarks on the Navies of the English and the Dutch (1992, pg.65) calls them "fifth futtocks", but this is a translation of Ollivier's best guess on the subject. Generally, I believe they're also occasionally called "filling pieces". This seems to be the case whether they're above a port sill, as in your example, or attached to an unbroken bend. mtaylor, Canute and shiloh 3 Quote
mtaylor Posted November 27, 2015 #6 Posted November 27, 2015 (edited) "Waldo" works for me, Alan. The name sort of grows on you. Edited November 27, 2015 by mtaylor AON and Canute 2 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned)
druxey Posted November 27, 2015 #7 Posted November 27, 2015 Usually 'Waldos' are attached to the top timber beside them with a long scarph. I've not seen an independent one such as your illustration shows. Very interesting! Canute 1 Quote Be sure to sign up for an epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series http://trafalgar.tv
trippwj Posted November 27, 2015 #8 Posted November 27, 2015 I have a vague recollection of Rees mentioning and showing Waldo (though he called it something else) in his Cyclopaedia. Alas, I am packing ti move and my hard copy is somewhere in a box. Canute and mtaylor 2 Quote WayneNeither should a ship rely on one small anchor, nor should life rest on a single hope.Epictetus
AON Posted November 27, 2015 Author #9 Posted November 27, 2015 I have Rees and hadn't found it but will look again, I also have the PDF of the Cyclopaedia and will hunt through it tonight. Thank you Wayne (it may be hard to let go of Waldo) Canute, druxey, trippwj and 1 other 4 Quote Alan O'Neill "only dead fish go with the flow" Ongoing Build (31 Dec 2013) - HMS BELLEROPHON (1786), POF scratch build, scale 1:64, 74 gun 3rd rate Man of War, Arrogant Class Member of the Model Shipwrights of Niagara, Niagara Region, Ontario, Canada (2016), and the Nautical Research Guild (since 2014) Associate member of the Nautical Research and Model Ship Society (2021) Offshore member of The Society of Model Shipwrights (2021)
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