HMS Triton 1771 by Heinrich der Seefahrer - 1/64 - PoB

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

Hello,

 

one guy more building the Triton - as same in here do scaled in 1/64. As I'm completly unfamiliar with the complexity of a ship's riggimg I decided to build a hull model. As I do not own a lyth I'll use the information from the Gardiner's book "The History of the Frigat" to be free to omit all the 28 guns ad the swielguns, too. 

Yes

I'm a scaredy cat.  

 

 

Tomorrow Im going to print and copy my pile of files in the copyshop.

 

Due to the interst in frigats and my wish to build in a group I decided to take the nice Triton of the Meremaid Class. So I'm going to share my ups, ops and downs with all of you.  

I decided to build her in 1/64 due to the size of my flat, as some others also do.  

 

So I don't expect to get a Museums-able model out of my bonsai workshop on the one hand and on the other hand I hope not to get something I'll have to hide for the public in an open fire place. So I'll try to build something intermedium.

 

Before the very beginning I'd like to have some more literature beside the Gardiner. Is there some thing you would advise me to buy for this build aside the AotS book of Diana I've shot at Ebay and 'm waiting for?   

 

Thanks for your help and friendly intrest.

 

 

Edited October 7, 2017 by Heinrich der Seefahrer

[mtaylor]

It may not help with the build but a good first reference book (and usually inexpensive) is Historic Ship Models by Wolfram zu Mondfeld.  Well illustrated and gives a pretty good overview of the ships and details.  It's not 100% accurate however.

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

Thanks Mark, 

that's something I have got during the last week in a preowned edition. So I'm on the right track I guess. But I'll habe to order an english issiue to get the right termici technici. 

 

Is there any more “fregat-special“ literature I shoud “throw an eye on“?  Let's  abuse a German idiom by translating it word by word... :-D

Edited October 3, 2017 by Heinrich der Seefahrer

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

Update:

 

Due to illness I've to cancel my walk to the copyshop.  

Yes I have a headache, too.

[knightyo]

It's great to see another POB builder on board!  I've already made all kinds of mistakes I can warn you about as you catch up to me.

 

Alan

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

38 minutes ago, knightyo said:

It's great to see another POB builder on board!  I've already made all kinds of mistakes I can warn you about as you catch up to me.

 

Alan

Hy Alan,

I'll try to loose this “Game of Mistakes“. I suppose mine will be newish...

So I can ask you for help.

Here the very first three questions:

 

1.)

What thickness of plywood do you use for the Bulkheads 3/4“ or 1/1“?

 

2.)

Did you make use of the same wood for your bulkheads and filling pices? 

 

3.)

Do I need also this elaborated and complex to build deadwood in the edge between sternpost and keel? (I'm affraid I'll have to face his part because of the planking that certainly need to rest somewhere.)

 

So I'm looking foreward to get the prints tomorrow.

 

 

 

[knightyo]

Hello Heinrich,

 

I'm not at home at the moment, but I "think" the bulkheads are 1/4" thick.  Once you have the plans, you can print out the profile former, and measure the slots. That will show you how thick the bulkheads need to be.  

 

I used standard plywood for the bulkheads, but used basswood (or lime/linder) wood for the filling pieces, since it's so easy to sand, etc.  

 

I would definitely print out the plans and create the deadwood pieces between the sternpost and keel.   The pieces don't need to be pretty. they just need to be complete enough in order to lay planking over the top of. I did this on my version, and inserted basswood filler pieces between the plywood pieces; once everything was sanded smooth, I was left with a nice base for future planking, but most importantly, also had accurate dimensions back there (I hope ).   If I had done this in the bow area as well, I wouldn't have to do the re-work I'm currently undertaking.   

 

Alan

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

Thanks Alan, for your support.

 

Back from the copyshop (where I payed nearly ninetimes the fee for the plans here) I started making myself acquaint with the Triton's plans. 

 

I started with the place where her majesty of the sea will rest - and what I measured really works. I really love it when some first idea works in reality. Astonishindly also the beadth is well. The thickness is also given beside every single bulkhead by the hatchinglines area on the right of the bulkhead's drawing. So itI is resized at copying into an other scale . Really well done draftsmen, very well done!

 

My measurement works on the bulkheads says 7mm - in Gemany a nonstandard thickness for plywood. Due too this I'll buy the 6mm standard pine plywood adding a stripe of 1mm beech-plywood to fill the gape. 

 

But I'm happy that the thikness of the basebord comes exactly to the European 6mm standard. Sometimes luck is most important.

 

Then I looked through the plan and strarted tohe get some ideas and questions.

Edited October 4, 2017 by Heinrich der Seefahrer
Adding a bracket I had written over.

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

Now I'm with a first problem - the centerboard is including the keel, stern and stem. As I see from the PoF threads alls these parts are built seperatly. normaly, so the vein is allways diffrend to the neighbour bits - what makes the interesting look of this very part.

 

0. Cutting along the rabbet?

I think about cutting the centerboard along the inner line of the rabbet. By this  I can add the slimmer rabbitplank easyly between centerboard and stem, keel and stern. But by this I'm forced to build a realwood keel stem and stern.

As all this parts are 6mm breadth I can cut them from a block of ashwood I got as a present. Is this a good idea, as I want to build a partly painted hull model without equipment ? And by this the hullmodel will show the unpainted part of stermmand terns over the CWL?

 

1. Right wood chosen?

Is ashwood a good choice for this scale? As far as I understood only n, 1'=1“ oak should, be used. And by this the oak's vein is to be deminimaliziced, too; isn't it?

 

2. Living with the deadwood:

The after deadwood seems to be a complex fountain of trouble, as Annobium Punctatum shows how to deal with it. And also the frontpart seems to be a tricky beast. Do I have to built this complex parts also in such an elaborated matter when I do not want to clad the underwater part with copper? 

 

3. Formers on bulkheads?

I want to copy Alan's technique to fill the gaps between the bulkheads with softwood to get a smooth surface for the second ash-vaneer planking. Everything is easy he told me as long as Im with nearly parallel hullsides at midship. But when I come to the winding ends of the hull everything gets uneasy if not intrecately. So I've got the risqué idea to use the shape of the frames to interpolate the hull's inside curve. This because the f'cstl part fo the gundeck for example is mainly visible. In particular because of, the omitted guns and the (with out the very first pair at the stem) unexeptional lidfree gunports. Is it possible to combine the bulkheads with the formers? And what former is parellel to what bulkhead?

 

4. Copyright - using a copy wrong?

The pictures of the plan as a detailpart to explain the particular problem ar okay in my way of showing it and the do not tresspas copyright standards? I tryed to camouflage the drawing by canting my smartphone camera. So the picturesvare worthless for everybody.But please tell me if I'm still on a good track.

 

5. Testify the copies scale:

I copied the cross section on transparent paper and figured out that the bulkhead N° Zero and the crosssection fit perfectly...

 ...but I've forgotten to measure the given thickness of the vaneer of the second planking. 

 

Okayokayokay - don't over do it and keep a rest of work for the following day!

 

6. Literature:

Some colleagues here deal with the AotS Diana, others with the Pandora issiue. What ship is closer to the Modified Meremaid Class?

 

Thanks for all the intrest and help.

 

 

Edited October 4, 2017 by Heinrich der Seefahrer
adding pictures

[knightyo]

Hi Heinrich,

 

I feel qualified enough to answer #4.  I think the way you are showing the photos is perfect.  As you say, at that angle, no one would be able to obtain any use from the pictures by printing them out.   It also makes it easier for you to describe your questions.   Pictures are great!

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

Thanks Alan! How did you form your inside of the gundeck in the curved area near stem and stern?

Edited October 7, 2017 by Heinrich der Seefahrer
errata corr.

[knightyo]

Hi Heinrich,

 

This is where I should have been more methodical.  I used a Dremel tool (with the small sanding drum) to sand down the wood blocks.  But, I should have been far more careful during that process, as I removed far too much wood!

 

Alan

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

Hi Alan, 

 

I think you gave an importand advice to me. Well I'll have to work very precise in the inner part, so I think I can use the PoF formers to build the inner hullside and on this I have to add the inner planking. Systematical planning is the keyfeature here so I tried to find some help and I got the AotS book about the HMS Pandora (24 guns vs. 26 on HMS Triton). So I can get some details.

 

I tried too assign the Triton bulkheads to the Pandora cutting profiles.

 

And I compared the details. 

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

An other picturer from the plan may show better what I think about. Tis is a horicontal cut through Pandora in the ports high of the gundeck. I shows clearly that I'll have a plenty more of definited contactpoints for the rest of the inner hill planking. So it would be better than the hand full of points I would have using the inner side of he bulkheads “horns“. So how can I, get this points?

I can try to build the area surrounding the f'c'stl

 

a.)

as “partly PoF“ by copying the PoF plan and figure out what frames are to be choosen and where they were to positionate;

 

b.)

I can take the thickness of the formers as the measurement of the distance of a parallel line to the outside hull, cutting this bow from plywood adding it with a second layer swiftet inboards, adding a slimmer layer swifting inboards repeating his untill the f'sc'stl deck is reached. Copying every layer for the other side makes life easier? Then glueing, sanding it and fitting it on the gundeck after adding thr inner planking easiyly before fixing the hole construction onto the gundeck. 

 

What does the specialist in here do say?

Edited October 6, 2017 by Heinrich der Seefahrer

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

qOne basic question coming from the drawing D3/23 on page 67 and also the art on the dDustcover on AotS Pandora

 

On thethe two MNNplans are once oreports and than none.

 

 

Does Triton have got oars and oarports with lids? 

 

[knightyo]

I've been looking over the drawings and others' logs, and I'm not sure.  It looks like the below builder incorporated them, however.

 

 

 

Alan

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

 

 

Hy Alan, I've figured out that the 1795 Triton has had oarports our 1773 Triton hasn't got oarports. What I thought were the oareports - were in real the bars of the decks by side/cross-section.

 

Now I'm dealing with the centerboard. Some progress will come  in a few days.

 

 

Edited October 14, 2017 by Heinrich der Seefahrer

[knightyo]

Great research!  I've had time to insert additional filler wood in my bow... Hopefully I'll have time to sand the bow to correct dimension today. 

 

Alan

[rdsaplala]

Hello Heinrich,

 

I'm pleased to see another Triton log in 1/64 POB, enjoy your build. Regarding references, I would also suggest getting at least the volumes 1 and 2 of TFFM by David Antscherl. While it is focused on a slightly smaller ship, it contains a wealth of information  as well as reference drawings that would come in handy once you build your hull and fit her out.

[Heinrich der Seefahrer]

Hello friends - everything stood still due to the illness of my wife. So I restart the Coureur first - than in some far away time the HMS Triton will reapear from the shelf to the yard. All the documents are stored in a separarted box.