Louie da fly Posted September 12, 2021 Share #31 Posted September 12, 2021 Glad to hear it, mate. Have fun with it! Steven thibaultron 1 Quote It's not really a ship model unless you've bled on it. CURRENT BUILDS Golden City - Ballarat paddlewheeler La Lomellina - Theoretical Reconstruction of a Genoese carrack sunk in 1516 FINISHED Venetian merchant Ship from Basilica of San Marco Australian couta boat RMS Titanic HMVS Cerberus 11th century Byzantine dromon Winchelsea Nef - Late 13th century Mediaeval ship Henry Grace a Dieu - Rebuild of 1:200 model I started in 1967 Mistydeefer - restoration of decor model yacht Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
EHood Posted September 13, 2021 Share #32 Posted September 13, 2021 (edited) On 9/11/2021 at 3:32 PM, Louie da fly said: Johnny, I agree about the upper masts on carracks. It took quite a while before the topmast reached a respectable size, and by that time carracks were being superseded by galleons to a large degree. As you are aware, there are a large number of contemporary pictures of ships from the same time period as the Wasa which would help as a guide. I would also recommend Anderson's book for the Wasa's period. It's VERY thorough and VERY detailed, and covers just about every source of information available and every detail of masting and rigging, and even goes into the differences between the ships of different nations. Steven It occurred to me today that my library includes a copy of Brian Lavery's Anatomy of the Ship series volume on the Susan Constant. This ship was built a half-century after Mary Rose, but the mast joins in Lavery's drawings are similar to what's visible in the Anthony Roll drawings of Mary Rose as well as in other contemporary drawings of carracks. Edited September 13, 2021 by EHood mtaylor, spars, Canute and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
bear Posted September 14, 2021 Share #33 Posted September 14, 2021 Ahoy Mates Here's my Mary Rose while it was in progress. Used the Trust books and the AOTS book and others for the 90%scratch build using the Jotika kits bulkheads and keel only from the kit. The Only accurate parts of the ship are the areas that were recovered and documented in the Trust book volumes. All the upper works are conjecture . I made my build with starting with a full main gun deck and up. With most of the deck planking missing so you can look down into the hull to see all the decks and cannons. All the cannons were scratch made . I used Syren Minature rope with Chucks custom made deadeyes he made for me. The rest of the rigging blocks were from Radek at HisModels.CZ . Boxwood and swiss pear was from Jeff Hern. If you would like to see more photos just PM me and I will be happy to send them to you or answer any questions. Thanks Keith Glueck and Pickels rshousha, Mr Pleasant, spars and 2 others 5 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snug Harbor Johnny Posted November 4, 2021 Share #34 Posted November 4, 2021 On 9/11/2021 at 6:32 PM, Louie da fly said: Johnny, I agree about the upper masts on carracks. It took quite a while before the topmast reached a respectable size, and by that time carracks were being superseded by galleons to a large degree. As you are aware, there are a large number of contemporary pictures of ships from the same time period as the Wasa which would help as a guide. I would also recommend Anderson's book for the Wasa's period. It's VERY thorough and VERY detailed, and covers just about every source of information available and every detail of masting and rigging, and even goes into the differences between the ships of different nations. Steven Steven ... I saw on a post not too long ago (yeah, try and find something like that once its been gone a while) that early ships did NOT have foot ropes on the yards (and certainly no jack stays). This was implied for 17th century vessels and earlier. So when did foot ropes begin, and how did crewmen get out and work on the yards without foot ropes? Now my surmise is that on single mast/single sail early ships - like Viking craft and those seen on the Bayeux Tapestry (1066) - the yard was lowered to put on or take off a sail. When ships got larger and a top sail was added (as well as a second mast), one might think that the yards were still lowered via halyards to bend/unbend sail. With the advent of ratlines (still in the 'no foot rope' era), crew could climb the mast to put rigging (bunt lines, clews and the like) through blocks and let the line down to the deck while the yards were down to bend sails. So when such a yard-lowering practice ceased, the question arises (before the advent of foot ropes) ... how did they get out on the yards without falling off? Straddling the yard? Canute, spars and mtaylor 3 Quote Completed builds: Khufu Solar Barge - 1:72 Woody Joe Current project(s): Gorch Fock restoration 1:100, Billing Wasa (bust) - 1:100 Billings, Great Harry (bust) 1:88 ex. Sergal 1:65 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Louie da fly Posted November 5, 2021 Share #35 Posted November 5, 2021 (edited) 7 hours ago, Snug Harbor Johnny said: how did they get out on the yards without falling off? Straddling the yard? Yep. They seem to have been very brave (or foolhardy). But then it's probably the old story, till footropes were invented, nobody felt the lack . . . You may be right about dropping the yard to attach the sail to it, but it seems pretty obvious that to unfurl it once it was up, they climbed up and sat astride the yard. I don't know if they would have done the same to furl the sail - somehow it doesn't seem all that likely. Maybe they dropped the yard, sail and all, to furl it. When footropes came in - certainly not before 1545 - the second painting above is from that date. It would need a search through contemporary pictures of galleons to see if they had them - just did that, and no clear evidence of footropes in use, but this Dutch pic from as late as 1629 (It's not very clear, I'm afraid) still seems to show someone straddling the mainyard. [Edit] According the R.C. Anderson in The Rigging of Ships in the Days of the Spritsail Topmast, "It is impossible to say when they did first appear, but I believe it to be a fact that the first evidence for them is in Bond's The Boatswain's Art" of 1642. Certainly they are not mentioned in the English books of 1620-40, such as Manwayring and Boteler." [/Edit] Steven Edited November 5, 2021 by Louie da fly mtaylor, Canute and Snug Harbor Johnny 2 1 Quote It's not really a ship model unless you've bled on it. CURRENT BUILDS Golden City - Ballarat paddlewheeler La Lomellina - Theoretical Reconstruction of a Genoese carrack sunk in 1516 FINISHED Venetian merchant Ship from Basilica of San Marco Australian couta boat RMS Titanic HMVS Cerberus 11th century Byzantine dromon Winchelsea Nef - Late 13th century Mediaeval ship Henry Grace a Dieu - Rebuild of 1:200 model I started in 1967 Mistydeefer - restoration of decor model yacht Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Snug Harbor Johnny Posted November 5, 2021 Share #36 Posted November 5, 2021 O ... M ... Gosh (concerning the straddling of yards)! There must have been a lot of chafing doing that ... and no Talcum powder. I noticed the pictures showing two-piece yards lashed together in the middle. Seeing images of crewmen standing on yardarms called to mind a 19th c. engraving of most of the crew standing on all the yards of a Navy ship entering port. (There was a term for that - mostly for 'show' and ostensibly to indicate they were not manning the guns.) More recently, the roofers working atop our home walked and carried on unworried about the height and risk of their profession. I guess it is all what one is used to. Canute and mtaylor 2 Quote Completed builds: Khufu Solar Barge - 1:72 Woody Joe Current project(s): Gorch Fock restoration 1:100, Billing Wasa (bust) - 1:100 Billings, Great Harry (bust) 1:88 ex. Sergal 1:65 Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted November 5, 2021 Share #37 Posted November 5, 2021 4 hours ago, Snug Harbor Johnny said: O ... M ... Gosh (concerning the straddling of yards)! There must have been a lot of chafing doing that ... and no Talcum powder. I noticed the pictures showing two-piece yards lashed together in the middle. Not to mention the occasional splinter in a very uncomfortable spot. Canute and spars 2 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
spars Posted November 5, 2021 Author Share #38 Posted November 5, 2021 One of the reasons I was in the army is that I can't walk on water....LoL Canute and mtaylor 2 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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