moreplovac Posted September 12 Author #61 Posted September 12 Continue with frame building, sanding, etc... after checking the thickness on all frame parts, I discovered some discrepancies on thickness due to bad plan copies and in most time, my mistakes... so some parts I will be able to reuse and some not... so new and old frames lined up... other, missing in this "fish line" are still on the board, waiting for cut.. Happy modelling.. CiscoH, Maxthebuilder, yvesvidal and 3 others 6 Quote
moreplovac Posted September 14 Author #62 Posted September 14 Keel structure needed a bit of a extra work so here is current keel built stage.. Rabbet lines were giving me the hardest time, mistakes like missing correct plan line, too deep chisel cuts, slip over working part making bad scratch marks (not like "Cat scratch fever" Ted Nugget) etc, causing make of two extra stem, apron and forefoot parts... oh well, will have plenty of pear wood for other ship parts and other ship kits are waiting in line.. won't go to waste bin. Continue with wrapping up keel work so I can jump on frames... Happy modelling. Rik Buter, GrandpaPhil, CiscoH and 6 others 9 Quote
No Idea Posted September 15 #63 Posted September 15 Lovely work I used to worry about all of the little scratches and marks but I have found that as the ship progresses they disappear into the detail. When I cut my rabbets I did them too shallow - when I build me next ship I will have an actual plank ready to help me cut to the right depth. Keep the updates coming! mtaylor 1 Quote
moreplovac Posted September 15 Author #64 Posted September 15 Thank you No Idea, I was, I think, too worried with all those small dings and scratches, not that I would not care anymore, but looking into other's logs I start noticing them too often so I am not making a new keel structure... yeah, making an actual plank as a rabbet line depth reference is a very nice idea... Cheers mtaylor and No Idea 2 Quote
moreplovac Posted September 16 Author #65 Posted September 16 And to make my modelling life even more complicated, this is what arrived today, bigger scale: So, current build will definitelly be a learning curve.. Happy modelling.. G. Delacroix, Mike Y, GrandpaPhil and 3 others 6 Quote
moreplovac Posted September 20 Author #66 Posted September 20 In the process of inventory check and making missing parts.. Happy modelling.. mtaylor, Tonphil1960, No Idea and 6 others 9 Quote
moreplovac Posted September 27 Author #67 Posted September 27 Getting inventory off all frame parts... Missing parts are ready to be cut... recycling some old, bad ship parts... mtaylor, GrandpaPhil, KARAVOKIRIS and 2 others 5 Quote
moreplovac Posted September 27 Author #68 Posted September 27 Working now on transom timbers... Testing on a spare wood part, wing transom.. I think I grasped needed steps for wing transom... Now, started to work on lower transom timbers, from #5.. Not sure about you but I always trying to use protective gloves when using scalpels or other cutting tools.. have enough marcs on my tomb from "I can stop it no problem"... And a little bit of mistake... New part on the bench.. I think I have it done right, hopefully... not all cuts are done but the most difficult, at least for me, is completed... Here are various hand tools used for this piece.. Happy modelling.. KARAVOKIRIS, mtaylor, marsalv and 6 others 9 Quote
moreplovac Posted October 1 Author #69 Posted October 1 A bit work on timbers... I don't have board thick enough so 2x5mm glued together to provide a good foundation for wing transom.. and two completed 90% Happy modelling dvm27, marsalv, druxey and 4 others 7 Quote
No Idea Posted October 1 #70 Posted October 1 Sanding those timbers by hand is tricky and they look great. Keep one of your discarded wing transom’s as it will help you build the counter timbers off of the ship 👍 mtaylor and moreplovac 2 Quote
moreplovac Posted October 1 Author #71 Posted October 1 Yeah, I could not find any more efficient way for massaging those timber other than by hand/hand tools... Thanks for the tip, I already have a pile of "spare" parts looking for a new life.. CiscoH and mtaylor 2 Quote
moreplovac Posted October 4 Author #72 Posted October 4 It took me a while but I believe I grasped them all good... with several, I would call them "to-be-used-in-the-near-future" parts, I managed to get 4 transom done.. not completely but most carving was performed and completed..Here are some process pictures, lots of marking, line drawing, pre-sanding, etc but must admit that pear wood is perfect for these parts; yes, I have few broken ends but those are just my mistake not placing transom templates correctly on the wood grain. Once I stabilized that part I was able to carve very nice and sharp objects... For carving I used combo of files-sand paper various sizes, scalpel and carving knife; base sanding was done on Proxxon disk sander and spindle sander with band saw helping cutting parts of the board. And protective gloves as a must when carving is in place.... I think with amount of bandaids I purchased, it makes sense getting a basic carving protective gloves instead... Angle sanding cuts are there to protect wood chipping... This is one of failures which I am using as a test part for fitting.. I had a bit of a hard time understanding the final shape of a part which ended up with few extra parts done. But there will be a new life for them in future steps.. So I have a question; how deep red marked notches (for keelson) should be in these parts? Are they going all the way to the back side (for example on #5) following red marked square, with 90 degrees angle, leaving the notch wider on the top side and narrowing down towards bottom, following the shape of a transom? I see various depth in other people' posts so not sure what shape notches should be taken.. Here is my fitting test part on the plan. If I am seeing it correctly, I have it shaped properly. Feedback is appreciated before I start making cuts.. Happy modelling.. mtaylor, druxey, GrandpaPhil and 4 others 7 Quote
moreplovac Posted October 5 Author #73 Posted October 5 Keep working on timbers, fitting and testing.. I don't have angled wise for my proxxon mill so I had to be a bit creative by using mill for horizontal cuts for keel notches, as much as I can, then with a hand saw cutting a angled line on both ends and finishing up with scalpel removing excess wood. Then filling, testing, filling, testing... etc... So far #2 and #3 were 90% ready. still need to check with a plan to sand them a bit and #4 is made of thicker wood so need a bit of sanding before fitting exercise.. Happy modelling. GrandpaPhil, marsalv, No Idea and 6 others 9 Quote
No Idea Posted October 6 #74 Posted October 6 Nice one 👍 You are literally going through the same learning curve that I did when making these parts. You worked it quicker than me looks great! mtaylor and moreplovac 2 Quote
druxey Posted October 6 #75 Posted October 6 When cutting the bevels, leave them a little full to allow for final fairing. You can always take a little more off, but not put it back on! moreplovac, mtaylor and No Idea 3 Quote Be sure to sign up for an epic Nelson/Trafalgar project if you would like to see it made into a TV series http://trafalgar.tv
moreplovac Posted October 7 Author #76 Posted October 7 On 10/6/2024 at 8:09 AM, No Idea said: Nice one 👍 You are literally going through the same learning curve that I did when making these parts. You worked it quicker than me looks great! Yeah, looks like that.... I learn with every cut, sanding move, etc .... No Idea and mtaylor 2 Quote
moreplovac Posted October 17 Author #77 Posted October 17 I think I finally get this little bugger #4 done; it took me several attempts and I think I have it correct but we will see down the build... So far if I put together all bad parts I made, I might ended up with one good pear wood board . Anyhow, next is work on #1 timber... Happy modelling.. GrandpaPhil, davyboy, Maxthebuilder and 7 others 10 Quote
moreplovac Posted October 20 Author #78 Posted October 20 Today I was working on # 5 transom timber, for the third time... First two attempts were not good in few different reasons. Must say envy people that are done with a part in a first attempt; that is my long term goal when POF are main focus... First i made several copy of several templates that will be used throughout the process... The timber on the top is one of failures, excuse me, actually one of the learning curves.. Two planks were glued together to obtain required thickness, in my situation, 8mm Once it is dried, template were glued on... and cutting was done, following the curve of a top template. The first top template was removed with sanding, so new is glued on. Then bottom was cut and sanded off.. ...... marsalv, KARAVOKIRIS, mtaylor and 5 others 8 Quote
moreplovac Posted October 21 Author #79 Posted October 21 ... Continue work on timber #5... the notches were done with a help of a mini chisel that was used to clean up area in notches, after initial cuts were made on the mill, about half of a mm from the line. Fitting test was also performed few times... The angled area was done by hand, not having an angle wise to assist with milling.. First the mill was used to cut as deep as I can go, then hand saw was used to cut angled cuts and finally the scalpel was used to carve out extra wood.. ... mtaylor and Maxthebuilder 2 Quote
moreplovac Posted October 21 Author #80 Posted October 21 .. most of the work was done using mini chisel and scalpel.. Timber was yet another time refreshed with another template... .. so the rabbet line can be cut, using scalpel... First, marking... Then slowly cutting following marked line.. And few fit tests... and the final result, I think it is for now... hopefully no more modifications will be required on it. Still will not be glued permanently in case I need to adjust a bit... All my templates are glued with this glue: Templates are easy removable after being watered lightly... Happy modelling. marsalv, mtaylor, KARAVOKIRIS and 3 others 6 Quote
CiscoH Posted October 22 #81 Posted October 22 great post explaining your process! No Idea, mtaylor and moreplovac 3 Quote
moreplovac Posted October 26 Author #82 Posted October 26 Today I worked on building board and decided to try a perfect 90 degrees parts... yes, Lego blocks... those darn neighbour' kids are running fast, who would say that for small kids ... just kidding of course... I like using Lego in ship building as much as can just because of its perfect square you can count on and ability to fit it in any weird angle possible.. Anyhow, this is my test and we will see how it goes; the only drawback at this moment is that I cannot find a perfect lego size distance for a keel so need to improvise a bit by adding few wraps of painter's tape to hold the keel nicely and tight. In case, old fashioned pars are here to assist... Then I started to work on frames, just to break a routine.. a glass cutting board are placed on the plan and frame parts are laid down and glued. The ends are sanded a bit using hand sander And first one waiting for final fitting test and send is here.. Happy modelling.. mtaylor, CiscoH, Stavanger and 6 others 8 1 Quote
moreplovac Posted October 31 Author #83 Posted October 31 No pictures today, just comments.... i was continue working on frames and some results were not ending up quite satisfactory, so will play with other way of making frames, basically using a "traditional" or Underhill' method.... will see how that goes... For now I am using a spare wood for testing, saving good wood for later. I have to run planks thru planner anyway since my pear wood came in 6mm thickness which is more that needed for frames.. Happy modelling.. No Idea, Mike Y and mtaylor 3 Quote
No Idea Posted November 1 #84 Posted November 1 Hi What's the issue you are having as I think the pictures of your frames look very good? They follow the plans nicely and the final finished shape is not needed at this stage as that will be sanded once they are all in. I think that translating the plans that you have into an Underhill system may prove difficult. I know of another builder who has tried this on this model and ran into some difficult problems. Your skills are more than enough so maybe just keep at the frames as they are? If you don't have a copy - Adrian Sorrolla's book gives a step by step tutorial on how to assemble the frames on this ship. I followed his instruction pretty much to the letter and it helped me complete them Mark mtaylor and bdgiantman2 2 Quote
moreplovac Posted November 1 Author #85 Posted November 1 Thanks Mark... thanks for your comment, really appreciated...yes, I am following his tutorial and it helps a lot.. Some of my frames are not lining up correctly so the end result after glueing them (like frame #12) is not lining up with plan; Also, need to sand every frame individually since I forgot to run wood board thru planer ending up with frame parts that are thicker than needed... which is not that big of a deal, as I already sanded down half of them... Want to try some other approach of frame building but definitely will not use all my current frames in long winter nights, helping warming up the house 🙂 I am more familiar with making frames as I started and planning to continue building ribs with existing frames, not giving up (too much time and funds will be wasted if I start freshly new) but some of them that are not good, will try replacing with Underhill' method with spare wood from pile... Will try.. and if not working fine will just redo the missing pieces.. Since I really like this ship, somehow is a simple but yet very powerful model, I made an investment and got a larger scale of the same model, so thinking of this build like a learning curve.. And, your build absolutely helping me a lot throughout my adventure.. bdgiantman2, KARAVOKIRIS, yvesvidal and 2 others 5 Quote
No Idea Posted November 1 #86 Posted November 1 Hi Ah I see your problem now but I think it's easily sorted. You have the basis of a frame but it's the building of the parts that seem the issue. I too had this issue and threw all of my first frames away - so I get it. So - The joints and their angles are very important and it took me a while to work this out. Once I started assembling my frames over a frame drawing my efforts became far better. You are so close so don't be put off just keep going. If you do decide to change tack and use Underhill's methods then good luck my friend. I do think that it can be done but Gerard's plans are so precise that I stayed the course. My build is 1/24th which actually shows any defects in accuracy as much greater. If I can help in anyway just let me know Mark mtaylor and bdgiantman2 2 Quote
moreplovac Posted November 2 Author #87 Posted November 2 Thank you Mark, I will keep using existing frames and making sure they line up properly following plan... just a bit of practice... Will also try the other method but already have some questions in my head for that method build... but it might be worth spending hour or two for testing.. Yeah, larger scale = more visible mistakes... Thank you and will certainly use your help offering if needed.. Cheers bdgiantman2, Mike Y and mtaylor 3 Quote
moreplovac Posted November 4 Author #88 Posted November 4 Continue work on timbers... by thinning them with mini table saw to needed thickness.. Few missing/damaged parts are also prepared to be cut.. So far this is what I have and ready to be glued together, following steps from practicum... I don't use template as suggested in the book and fitting them on the keel directly, hopefully it will ending up fine.. Once on keel and with a drop of white glue, while still fresh, checking correct angle... So far... So, I also wanted to test an other method of building frames, using some old poplar board, already planned to correct thickness.. These templates will be glued to the plank.. Orange and blue lines are representing sanding line.. After cutting on a band saw.. Sanded... to the "meeting" point Glueing and drying... Will see what the end result will be, just curious... Happy modelling.. KARAVOKIRIS, Mike Y, Maxthebuilder and 3 others 6 Quote
Mike Y Posted November 4 #89 Posted November 4 Would not trust any joint angles when building a frame, weren't you gluing on top of a frame template (with a glass in between)? To make sure the pieces actually line up, especially on top of the frame? mtaylor 1 Quote Current build: Beavers Prize - POF 1:48 (Hahn style) Side builds: Schooner Polotsk by Master Korabel 18th Century Longboat by MS Finished: 21ft English Pinnace by MS
moreplovac Posted November 5 Author #90 Posted November 5 Yeah, I am doing that for regular frame building but for this "traditional" would not be able to trace the frame from the plan with wood parts that covers the plan. I believe that is why this method might not be to accurate... but this is just a test frame... mtaylor 1 Quote
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