Original Rigging for Cutters of 1763: with a Jib boom?

[Gregor]

Many builders of the Sherbourne kit try to improve the small cutter; their most important reference is Peter Goodwin’s book about the cutter Alert of 1777.

But the more I’m thinking about this subject I find that the Alert might be the exception to the rule; and Alert is also is bigger, younger and from a different yard. Especially for the rigging many questions remain unanswered in Goodwin’s book, i.e. a belaying plan is missing.

 

Even more curious: The plan of the Sherbourne of 1763 gives us the following details about masts and spars:

Mainmast to pole head 22 yards 10 inches (diameter 15 3/4 inches)

Topgallant mast 7 3’’ (6 ½’’)

Boom 14 19’’ (10 5/8’’)

Spread yard 11 9’’ (7 1/8’’)

Gallant yard 9 0’’ (4 5/8’’)

Gaff 10’0’’ (7 3/4‘’)

Topsail gaff 2 24’’ (4 5/8’’)

Crossjack yard 12 0’’ (6 ¼’’)

Bowsprit 15 24’’ (14 7/8’’)

Flying jib boom 9 15’’ (6 1/8’’)

N.B. Ringsail driver and studdingsail boom of usual dimensions for cutters.

The mast head (…) be 13’ 6’’ long which length includes in the pole head.

 

I couldn’t find an illustration with these specifications. Most interesting is the Flying jib boom…

Is anybody out there able to draw a simple picture of this rigging? Does anybody know something about a jib boom on cutters (whose bowsprit is supposed to be movable)?

 

A happy New Year to you all,

Gregor

Edited December 31, 2014 by Gregor

[tkay11]

A pity there were no replies as I was looking forward to some thoughts!

 

Tony

[roach101761]

Give us some information on the Sherbourne of 1763.  Where is it from, where did it sail, who commanded, where was it built, why was it built.  This is at the same period that the first revenue  cutters in North America, like Halifax and Sultana were put in service.   I am unfamiliar with Sherbourn so give me some history.

 

Phil

[Gregor]

Phil, you can find historical details of the Sherbourne here: https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/HMS_Sherborne_(1763). She was built in an special effort by the admirality to get as many small crafts as possible in a short time. The cutters of 1763 were built either in royal dockyards or by private contractors - hence the diversity of designs.

It's really the detail of a "flying jib boom" listed in the original plan (but not shown in the drawing) that seems a bit strange. All the contemporary models I know of have a single bowsprit, but no jib boom.

Gregor

Edited March 6, 2015 by Gregor

[tkay11]

Slightly off topic, but I hadn't bothered to read thoroughly the Wikipedia entry before. Interesting that it says the armament was only 6 3-pounders. If I'd known, it would have saved me building 8! I'll now make sure I fit only 8 of the swivel guns now.

 

Tony

[Stockholm tar]

I'm still mystified about the jib boom too as, so far as I know, most just cutters had a straight bowsprit. I also have only have eight swivel guns as well. I left off two of the after ones because I thought it looked too crowded, and could imagine the crews getting in each other's way!

 

Another mystery is the name, and have wondered where that might have come from. Some government or Admiralty official perhaps?

[tkay11]

There's the Dorset town of Sherborne in North Dorset. Has Sir Walter Raleigh's castle, bit far from the sea, though.

 

Tony

[roach101761]

Spent a few minutes looking up Sherbourne.  Did not spend much time but could not locate any box art of the kit here.    Does the Kit rig it with the flying jib boom?   Anyway, 1763 was right when the Seven Years War died down and the Crown was concentrating on raising and protecting the Revenue to Pay for the war.   Thus new building programs in Britain for Cutters and acquisition and conversion of those little Schooner's in North America and those repressive acts of Parliament  which the colonist found so distasteful.   All were small ships. I know it was common to send down the topmasts in those early schooners.  I also have read the same is true for the Flying Jib Boom.  You could take it in.  Perhaps in practice the Flying Jib was a light airs sail on your cutter. 

 

As to rigging it, you have a contemporary North American example in Sultana. 

 

Hope this helps. 

 

Phil

[tkay11]

Wasn't Sultana a two-master with a fixed rather than running bowsprit? Or am I looking at the wrong Sultana?

 

Tony

[Stockholm tar]

There's the Dorset town of Sherborne in North Dorset. Has Sir Walter Raleigh's castle, bit far from the sea, though.

 

Tony,

 

Not sure it's the Dorset town (where I've been a couple of times when I lived in Poole, many years ago). The town has no 'u' in the name, although I guess there may have been different ways of spelling it. 

 

One thought I had was to try to find out the names of any other cutters in her class, to see if there were pointers there.

[Stockholm tar]

Tony,

 

I've just found out there's a Sherbourne (as in the ship's name) in Warwickshire, but it does sound a bit dubious.

[tkay11]

Keep trying, Kester, I'm sure you'll get there! NMM itself says there were numerous variants on the spelling. How about Cher born in ref to the beloved newly born son of the ship builder married to the French wife?

 

I've never been to Poole. Sounds like a nice place.

 

But maybe this is even further from Gregor's topic and I'm watching out for a well-earned telling off from him as we're not really answering his question. Still, having this kind of chat is a darned sight better than watching the telly.

 

Tony

[Jim Lad]

Just had a look at this as I'm intrigued by the thought of a cutter with a 'flying jib boom'.

 

If you have a look on the NMM 'Collections' page the plans of Sherborne that come up are different to the one shown on their 'Art Prints' page linked by Gregor.  The plans on the 'Collections' page are laid out differently and don't have the spar dimensions on them (which is a detail I've never seen on NMM plans before).  Also, the 'Art Prints' page plan doesn't have the museums curator stamp on it that NMM plans normally have.

 

Very odd!!

 

John

[carlosgf]

Hi.

 

Howard Irwing Chapelle in his book 'The search for speed under sail 1700-1855' shows the Mediator sloop (pages 70-73). This ship was built in 1741. It is not exactly a cutter but it is and American cousin. The original plans name a jibboom with its sizes. Chapelle interpret the planes and shows a picture with the sails.

 

http://prints.rmg.co.uk/art/491163/mediator-1745

 

 

The kit Virgina Sloop of model shipways is quite similar.

 

I hope this hepls you.

 

Carlos.

 

[roach101761]

You are looking at the right Sultana. After it was taken into Royal Service, the basic schooner rig was expanded to include topmasts and topsails and a flying jib boom.  I  was originally confused as to why the jib boom was also not included in the inventory of spars for Sherbourne. I have determined the ship was too small to have bowsprit, jib boom and flying Jib boom.  The out board spar is  apparently always the flying jib boom.  The most out board sail would be the flying jib.(i think, someone correct me if I am wrong.  See article by Dana L. McCalip in the Nautical Research Journal on the rigging of Sultana. Even in basic schooner mode he shows the flying jib boom.   See the model shipways kit and the practicum on line at Model Expo written by Chuck Passaro.  

 

Phil 

[tkay11]

Thanks a lot, Phil. Very useful. My ignorance!

 

Tony

[roach101761]

Tony

 

Do not be so quick to agree with me.   I made my last post late last night after a Friday evening of frivolity.  I dug out some more stuff this morning in an attempt to determine why the Jib Boom was left off inventories. See Gregor's inventory above in post #1  I looked at the kit plans for Dallas and Ranger.  In both plans it is listed as a jib boom.   In Howard Chapelle's book,The History of  American Sailing Ships he gives the inventory of the Cutter Massachusetts.(p.186)  It gives only a flying jib Boom just like Sultana.  I am beginning to think Naming Conventions for Spars where different in the past.  Like most things associated with ships, more research seems to be required.  I will keep looking.

 

Phil

[tkay11]

FRIVOLITY!!!!!!!! In THIS forum!!!!!!? What is the (model ship) world coming to?

 

Tony

[bruce d]

1 hour ago, Dubz said:

Any input is appreciated 🙂

Hello Dubz,

I missed all of the early part of your Sherbourne build so excuse me. Have the other Slade designs FERRET and LURCHER been any help to you? There is a good plan of LURCHER in the Dansk archives:

 

Also, another drawing of LURCHER, ref: D3525, is in the Dansk archives but it is not digitised. I believe it is another view of hull/deck details, not sailplan, but have not seen it.

I hope this helps, perhaps just more pieces of the puzzle.

[druxey]

For a start, the figures you you read as '0' are in fact the old script way of writing '8'. It appears sort of sideways on. Hence, not 22 10, but 22 18, etc.  A yard is 3' 0", so 22 18 translates as 67' 6".

 

'Excl'  is, as you say, excluding.

 

I believe that the length of the mast head included the tenon, (but not the tenon at the heel of the mast) but need to check that.

 

One needs to dig a bit to answer the other questions you have.  Normally poles are integral to topmasts in lieu of a topgallant mast, or (as in your illustration) is the extension to the topgallant mast, but not to lower masts. The exception might be a one-piece mast. It is possible that this is what was intended. If that were the case, the mast is a single stick, perhaps the part above the stops being called a topgallant rather than a topmast.

 

Does any of this help?

[Gregory]

2 hours ago, Dubz said:

I don't know as example what a tenon is ...

 

Mortice and Tenon

[druxey]

Nice, but is the drawing of a Danish or English cutter? There were national differences.

[bruce d]

Dubz, maybe you already know this, but in the Dansk archive there is an English cutter named 'SHERBORN'. This would not come up in a search for 'SHERBOURNE'.

Also, I am looking for a description for drawing F207 you posted above, will let you know if I find anything.

[bruce d]

It is D2394, sadly not digitised. See these index entries, it appears all are under the same (D2394) reference:

Hope this helps.

Bruce

 

 

[Chapman]

Hi!

 

The NMM Plan of  the Cutter Pitt mentioned also the Flying Jib Boom. NMM plan Pitt

So there was at least one more cutter with this equipment.

There is another document about the proportion of blocks and ropes of the Sherbourne from the NMM available: J8465

[bruce d]

22 minutes ago, Dubz said:

 

I sent an inquiry to the dansk archives about the plans. I keep you updated´.

Yes please Dirk, I am interested in some other non-digitised items and will be happy to see how you get on before contacting them.

 

[Chapman]

54 minutes ago, Dubz said:

May you provide us the link? I can't find it.

 

 

 

Dirk

Search Sherborn, the document has a new Object ID!

Edited August 30, 2019 by Chapman