Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack by Dee_Dee - FINISHED - Midwest Products – 1:24 – Kit Bashed - Small

[petehay]

I would also like to hear David's comments regarding gesso. I used it as a primer on the balsa hull of my Sakonnet Daysailer and ended up with a finish as white and smooth as the styrene plastic of a Revell model kit. This worked on the Daysailer as it looks like a fiberglass hull but it was not what I was after.

Pete

[petehay]

Thanks all for the replies regarding my book question. One of the members of the model shipwrights group that I just joined is bringing his copy to the next meeting for me to look at.

[hexnut]

Great work on the rudder, Dee Dee, that looks really good. 

 

Keith, I think part of the problem is that I had the rudder turned a bit when I took that shot, although I think I did end up with a larger lower radius at the aft end.  (Midwest just gives you a blank to glue to the edge of the keel, so all working parts need to be scratched.)  The biggest problem I have with my rudder assy. is that the attachment point is way too low, Dee Dee gets much closer to Chappelle on that one.

 

BTW, I think we are all using American Small Sailing Craft as a source because it's what we can get ahold of, does anyone know of other info sources?  They supposedly have the MB sloop "Ranger" at the Penobscot Maritime Museum-- Has anyone seen it?  Is this a picture of it?  Whatever this boat is, it's pretty interesting with the staight stem, no cutwater and the shroudstays.  I got it from here: http://byyb.org/gaffrig/200501/article%20craig%20milner.htm

[themadchemist]

That also may be causing the trick my eyes are seeing, the lower mounting of the rudder in your build. I love seeing the differing way this build can be approached, It helps me decide so when I get to building my kit. I also like the way DeeDee rudder shaft/spindle is mounted below and above which to me looks more real, due to the strenghtening. Although I dont really know if any of that will show once its all closed up. but then thats the great and sad part of this hobby, All the inner detail, that no one ever see's, except log readers. But the builders know.

[Dee_Dee]

Bob, I’ve seen this photo and read about Ranger.  Since you are the closest, I think you need to take a ‘road trip’ to the Penobscot Maritime Museum.  If needed, Keith & I will write you a ‘note’.      

 

FWIW, before I saw Bob’s photo of his rudder (page one) my plan for attaching the tiller to the rudder was beyond wacky!  Bob’s picture bought me back to reality. 

 

As for the rudder post – I think it could go either way.  I’m thinking it depends on how the rudder is secured to keep it from ‘floating up’ and off the keel mount.  Another reason why a road trip is in order!     

 

~~~

 

The first planking is done. 

 

I soaked the planks by wrapping them in a few paper towels, dousing them in water and into the microwave for a minute.  When done, they were wrapped in tin foil and a thick towel for five minutes.  This worked great, except on one piece I used ‘heavy duty’ paper towels and that left an ‘impression’ on the wood.  Ooops!  

 

I'm happy with the snug fit of the cockpit floor and the hull.    

Per the blueprint, the cockpit floor is 18” below the deck and the benches are maybe 9” high.  Next time, I’ll drop the height of the cockpit floor.  

 

 

I could have done a better job with beveling the top plank – there are a couple of thin spots and pin holes. If I was not doing a second planking, I would definitely take these off and start over again.  

 

 

Since the second planking will be walnut, the rudder will look sort of ‘weird’, so I am remaking the rudder and tiller.  I was playing around with this rudder assembly and decided the new tiller will be closer to print.  The original tiller does not ‘clear the deck’ and would reduce the maneuverability of the boat.  The blank is made, but will wait until the second planking is done before shaping it. 

 

Next up is gluing and carving the bow blocks.  After that, the fun begins with the planking! 

 

Thanks for stopping by - Any comments suggestions are welcome. 

 

Dee Dee

 

(Edited 5/27/2013 to add back pictures)

(Edited 11/26/2014 to add back pictures)

 

.

Edited November 27, 2014 by Dee_Dee

[capnharv2]

Dee Dee,

 

It's looking really good!

 

Regarding Ranger, I understand that the Muscongus Bay Lobster Smacks went thru some evolution until they finally morphed into the Friendship Sloop. I believe that Ranger was one of the earlier versions, and the Chapelle model was a later version.

 

Unstayed masts are not unusual on boats of this era and size. They're designed to bend and spill wind when overpowered. It's alarming, at first, to watch the mast bend 5 feet or so at the top. After a while you begin to understand the the unstayed bendy mast is a safety valve when in gusty conditions.

 

I find it a little sad that, as opposed to Friendship Sloops, Muscongus Bay Lobster Smacks are poorly documented (in general). I don't know if the Penobscot Maritime Museum has a much information, but it's certainly a boat that deserves more visibility.

 

Thanks,

 

Harvey

[themadchemist]

Note to self.

1) drop and widen cockpit floor

2) open live wells to give cabin room, for bunks.

3) write Bob a note, for research at the Penobscot Maritime Museum.

 

Its a shame the tiller wasn't tall enough to clear the deck. So what woods do you have planned for the benches and cabin? Walnut ought to be nice looking for the hull. I love Marios Mahogany and basswood striped roof on the cabin and seating. So many options. Thanks for the updates Dee Dee, I'm watching with a notepad handy, ready to borrow all your great ideas. I'll be sure and reference you in the bibliography.

[themadchemist]

Personally I see alot of the lobster smacks design in the kit Waynes building, the Emma C Berry. Emma seems to be a bigger sister of the smaller smack.

http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/888-emma-c-berry-by-trippwj-model-shipways-scale-132/

[capnharv2]

The Emma Berry was a Noank smack, built for fishing in Long Island Sound.

 

These types of work boats have a lot of similarities, but they have distinct features for the area the were designed for-and that area was not always a very large area. If you look at the Emma Berry  vs. The Estella A (a Friendship Sloop also at Mystic) vs. the Hudson River Sloop Clearwater, they all have similar features, but are different for the waters they were designed for.

 

Hope that doesn't muddy the waters too much

 

Harvey

[themadchemist]

Muddy Waters! Now that's GREAT BLUES

 

Edited April 3, 2013 by themadchemist

[capnharv2]

What is this? Pink Elephants on parade?

[themadchemist]

Well how do you enjoy the Blues without a Rum and coke. Oh no, are you seeing pink elephants too

 

You actually made things very clear, thats one of the things I find so remarkable is the Historiosity of ships. How the science of ship building developed over time. For the largest part it was with sails or oars, but thats greatly overlooked these days. The similaritities between the Emma and Muscongus are remarkable but they are 2 completely different ships/boats/smacks.

 

and sadly.. with the Lyme meds no rum and no coke. but I drink a gallon of H2O a day. Wow, just thinking, that would be 32 rations for one of Blighs Bounty Launch crew. nearly 11 days worth YIKES. 

[popeye the sailor]

great bit of progress Dee Dee.......big thumbs up!

[Dee_Dee]

So this is the place where I dive into the ‘dark side’ of modeling….

 

I was not going to post again until both sides were planked, but I just finished the starboard side and it turned out OK!

 

I started with a full plank at the top and a full plank at the bottom – I think that’s called the gardboard plank.  Did some measuring and decided to use nine 1/4" x 1/32” planks for a total of 11 planks.  Next I marked off the hull at the bulkheads using the ‘fan’ and started to plank away!

 

As for why am I using walnut for planking – I had a momentary lapse of sanity, but I’m better now and the doctor said I should be off the meds in a month or two…  ..  

I was at the local hobby shop, when I spied a stash of walnut that appeared to be orphaned, so I purchased a stash and bought it home with me.  I had no idea where I was going to use this, until I started this build.  Next time, walnut will be great for deck fittings, but I’ll use a different wood for the planking.

 

After I did a few planks, I figured out that the first planking can be done with strips.  I’ll make a drawing and add it later the small changes needed. This would eliminate the bow blocks, the cutwater can be added later, giving a much cleaner bow.  The walnut frequently splintered resulting in some ‘gaps.’  But these were filled in using the 1/64” strips.  Next I scraped and sanded the hull and wiped it down with a damp cloth.  While still damp, I burnished the hull with a hardwood block.  There’s a couple of glue marks that I’ll need to remove.  Also, there are a few gaps that I will pack with thread and watered down glue.   

 

The transom was veneered in 1/64” walnut strips.  When the port side is done, I’ll veneer the keel and cutwater with more of the 1/64” walnut strips.      

 

Also, Midwest keels are made from basswood and the keel is going to get nicked / deformed during the build.  So before I started this build, I glued a 1/64” strip of walnut to the edge of the keel and cutwater to keep its shape. I highly recommend!

 

The first two planks

 

 

The transom veneered with 1/64” strips

 

What I learned:

Yes it is possible to do the first planking with strips.  I need to make a drawing so I remember how to do it next time. 

Be careful when planking over the balsa first layer – balsa WILL bend very easily! 

Walnut is nice – but I’ll keep it to deck furniture.   

Not sure if I should have veneered the keel before planking, so, on the port side I’ll veneer the keel first and find out! 

Since this boat does not have shrouds, I could have added a rub rail below the top plank.    

 

Well, that's it for now.  Thanks again for stopping by.  Suggestions are always welcome. 

 

Dee Dee

 

(Edited on 5/27/2013 to add photos back)

(Edited on 11/26/2014 to add photos back)

(Edited on 4/09/15 to add photos back for the third time)

Edited April 9, 2015 by Dee_Dee

[popeye the sailor]

yea,  walnut is hard to work with.......but a light stain and a sealer,  you should come out with a nice looking hull.   mahogany is another one that is a bit tough to work with.   I use what is called Annegre.....I get it from Billing's.  it's light in color,  but as I mentioned,  go as dark as you want with the stain and give it the sealer...looks really good.  your doing a great job with it......keep it up!

[themadchemist]

Nice job with the walnut. Planking looks good. I just love the swoop in the tail of this boat its so dang sleek. Can't wait to see the other side.

I wonder how that walnut would tung oil. It usually darkens quite a bit and brings out the grain.

 

My Swift came with walnut second planking and I'm saving it and will be using cherry for the lower hull and I think ramin for the outer bulwarks,

 

So are you going to continue with the walnut up top. The live wells look walnut. Walnut cabin roof and cockpit seating would look good against the light upper decking.Any way you go its gonna be a beauty.

[capnharv2]

I'm with Keith. The walnut looks great. A little shine and she'll be stunning!

 

Harvey

[petehay]

I'm thinking of planking my build of the Smack by going over the balsa with 1/4" strips cut from Revell 1/64" birch ply that is available at Micheals. Has anyone used this material? I will be painting over it so the finish isn't an issue but I do want the planking to be obvious. 

Pete

Edited April 23, 2013 by petehay

[capnharv2]

Peter,

 

I see some problems using plywood for planking. First off, it doesn't like to bend and twist. Second, sealing the edges can be a problem (I know you're going to paint, but those open edges will suck up a lot of paint. Third, I don't know what the adhesive is in the plywood, but it could dissolve by using the wrong chemicals.

 

That said, there are quite a few full size plywood boats out there. The row and sail boats from Arch Davis come to mind. Sam Devlin (in Olympia, WA) has also made many outstanding plywood boats. So it can be done. It's just that, at the scales we build to, the working issues with plywood (other than for keels and bulkheads) seem to get magnified.

 

A different solution might be to plank over the balsa with basswood strips or cover the balsa with gesso and scribe the plank lines into that.

 

Anyway, I hope that helps.

 

Thanks,

 

Harvey

[petehay]

Harvey,

Don't know if it's really plywood or veneer. It would have to have some pretty thin layers being just 1/64" overall. Being so readiliy available I was wondering if anybody has ever worked with it. I cut a couple of 3/32" planks from it and it didn't seem too bad.

Would like to find 1/64" basswood but my only luck so far was "scale lumber" at the model RR store. This was pretty expensive (but I do plan to use it to plank the deck).

I have tried gesso over balsa in the past and ended up with too smooth a finish for my taste. I am trying to somehow keep the semblance of wood grained planks with weathered paint for the hull. 

Pete

[popeye the sailor]

I've done basswood over balsa on my lobster boat....it worked out quite well.

[petehay]

Popeye,

How thick were the basswood planks? (And what scale is your model?)

[popeye the sailor]

the planks were about 1.5mm.......not sure about scale size,  but it's 3/4" to 1'

[hexnut]

Great progress, Dee Dee, the planking is looking really good!

[Dee_Dee]

Planking the port side is done and it turned out much better.  I took extra time to make sure the top edge of each plank was beveled to get a tight fit.  Then each plank was glued in two inch segments (bulkhead to bulkhead.)  It was a slow process, but the results were well worth it. 

 

I pushed my luck using just 11 planks.  At the widest point I had just 1/8” fudge factor.  On the starboard side I had to fill in numerous ‘gaps’, but on the port side I only had to use two on the last plank added.  ‘Next Time’  I’ll add one more plank for a total of 12 planks / side. 

 

I veneered the keel with 1/64” x 1/8” walnut 

  (Looking for this photo....)

 

‘Next Time’ the cutwater will be added after I’m done planking.  The first planking will land on a false flat bulkhead and the second planking will land on the keel.  This will give a clean line for the cutwater.  (I’ll add a drawing.)        

 

Close up of starboard bow

 

Close up of port bow

 

A photo with the fish well hatches

 

What I learned:

While walnut is a difficult wood to work with, if I take my time, it is possible to get good results. 

I need to do more planning with the number of strips needed to plank a side – don’t cut it so close

How to prepare the bow / keel for planking

I just received ‘Next Time’, so I will be doing some planning, adjusting the print and make the false flat bulkhead.  Also, it will have a real, working centerboard.

 

Well, that's it for now.  Thanks again for stopping by.  Suggestions are always welcome. 

 

Dee Dee

 

(Edited 11/26/2014 to add back photos....)

(Edited 4/09/15 to add back photos)

Edited April 9, 2015 by Dee_Dee

[themadchemist]

Nice Work Dee Dee.

That Walnut is hard to work with but it has some beautiful streaky grain texture. I love those 2 blackish streaked planks on the port side.

 

I had a similar planking dilemma on the Swift build. 12 planks was fine but pushing it a bit in the midsection. I also widened the last plank in that area by under 1mm. I just love planking, I find it relaxing.

[Old Sea Dog]

Great work.

[capnharv2]

Really nice!

 

Harvey

[captainbob]

Dee Dee,

 

The planking and deck, both looking good.

 

Bob

[Dee_Dee]

Next Update

 

The MBLS has been a fun build and I have enjoyed reading and researching the history of working boats.   

Now that I am close to finishing the hull some of the ‘oops’ are starting to show up.  I’ll split this into a few posts.   

 

(Mother Nature is about to put on one of her “Light Show”, so I might lose power in between posts.)

 

07 05 2016  Looking for these photos.......

 

 

 

F2 Bulkhead

Next time, I’ll line the top of this bulkhead with walnut to keep it from becoming deformed.  The starboard side ended up being significantly shorter.  Also, I should have done more work on the hatch door before gluing it to the keel and then complete most of it after adding the deck.  The hatch rails need more work.   

 

Fish Well Hatches

I like these fish well hatches, but the obvious is they are way too big.  Next time I’ll stay with the original size and make them flush fitted.  The blue thread is to prevent losing them!

 

(Edited 11/26/2014 to add back photos....)

Edited July 5, 2016 by Dee_Dee