Section Deck Between Gunbays by mikiek - FINISHED - Panart - 1:23

[mikiek]

OK - sounds like maybe I should rip a plank to make the 3x3's so they match better.

 

Is there supposed to be caulking between the hull planks?

[cobra1951]

I didn't use any caulking for the hull. I didn't mind the 3mm x 3mm being slightly different in colouring as the cannons hid most of the bottom ones and you don't really see the top one unless you are looking for it

[mikiek]

I have come to realize this afternoon, that the space between frames that make up the sides of the ports is about 33mm. If I screwed that up when I installed them, at least I was consistent.  Had been working under the assumption that they were 30mm apart and that 2 of the 3x15 planks (shortened of course) would make my square. Then the upper sill would close out the port.

 

I've taken a little different approach on the hull planking so far. As I have mentioned previously, the exterior has a 3x15, then part 5B, then a 3x15. On the interior, I laid 1 3x15 first. Then in a trial, I started building up what would be the next plank by adding pieces of strip until the top edge was level with the outer edge. It turned out that I needed a plank 11mm wide, so I ripped one and glued that on top of the first 3x15. So at this point the top edge of the inner and outer planking are the same height.

 

Not sure how I managed it, but I ended up with 2 pieces of scrap 3x15 that fit exactly in between the port frames. So those became the lower sills. Then to bring the upper planking edges up to the sills I laid pieces of a 3x3 strip. So at this point the inside and outside upper plank edge are level.

 

From there I had hoped to lay 2 strakes of 3x15 pieces, then do the upper sills just like the lower. The best laid plans........

 

So now I am left with 2 options. Between the 2 3x15 strakes I can lay another 3x3 strip. That would make port height & width the same. It would also probably look a little goofy as those strips are off color with the bigger planks.  Or I could just leave as is. My ports would not be perfectly square but with all the other stuff around them I don't know that 2.5-3 mm would be noticed. Of course that means my port doors will have to be sized to match, but I have to do that anyway.

 

I'll probably go with option 2 unless anyone can come up with a reason not to.

 

Here's what it looks like up to now (gun is just roughed out and used for positioning):

 

 

 

[cobra1951]

Looks great Mike . Don't forget all the ideas we throw in are just the way we did it, and we all did it differently. Yours is different again but the result is just as good as the rest of us. Don't fall into the trap of over thinking things or you won't progress. Do as you have already done, do what works for you and makes you happy. Your build is looking great

[puckotred]

Looks great. I wish I did it like that...

[mikiek]

I appreciate all the positive feedback. Bob, Mr. Pucko, Paul - Thank You!

 

I am going to go with the 'not quite square' approach to finish out the port area. I laid some plank pieces on the exterior frames - 2 more strakes and then the 3x3 strip - and I just barely noticed the port shape. And I was looking for it.

 

The only thing I wish I had done differently was to use a solid 3x3 strip all the way across instead of pieces. And then inlayed a piece between them to fill out the port sill.

 

Roughing out that gun reminded me that I still need to dig out my scroll saw and cut those laser cut wheels (term used loosely) from the plywood.

[mikiek]

Thought since I had to semi-assemble a cannon I would go ahead and finish it. Need to prime and paint but there are a few pieces that I can't tell the proper color. The horizontal flat piece the quoin sits on and the squares that the axle dowels fit into. I'm guessing red?

[jbshan]

Mike, you could use the Constitution (from your Niagara thread) photos for a painting guide for the gun carriages.  Sometimes they're red, sometimes yellow ochre/buff.

Painted wood work, black iron work, my take.

 

[mikiek]

Had not considered that Joel. Is that about the same 'Dijon Yellow' as the Niagara bulwark?

[cobra1951]

I did my cannon sides red ochre and everything else black

[jbshan]

Had not considered that Joel. Is that about the same 'Dijon Yellow' as the Niagara bulwark?

Roughly, yes.  It's been through the camera, to my computer, through the internet and now your computer and your monitor, but yes.

That's why I try to use a description you can find an example of instead of relying on the picture.  Another way is to use Crayolas, because you can buy a box and use that for a color match.

Edited August 5, 2016 by jbshan

[mikiek]

Roughly, yes.  It's been through the camera, to my computer, through the internet and now your computer and your monitor, but yes.

That's why I try to use a description you can find an example of instead of relying on the picture.  Another way is to use Crayolas, because you can buy a box and use that for a color match.

 

So what is the Crayola color?

[jbshan]

So what is the Crayola color?

I don't have crayolas, Mike, but I bet you can find a grocery store that sells dijon mustard in a glass jar.  :-)

 

Paul, by 1800 not even the Royal Navy was using brass cannon.  It was more expensive, and they had over a century experience to get the bugs out.

Edited August 6, 2016 by jbshan

[mikiek]

Well I'm going to be boring on this choice and go with a sort of red ochre. Was rethinking the natural look (stained) but everything is primed already. This plywood is soooo porous. It's going to take quite a few coats to make it look good.

[mikiek]

Time to resurrect this project!!!  While I am debating with myself over rigging Niagara, I hate losing build time. No rigging here so no excuses. It's been so long I forgot where I was.

 

In our last episode, I was building a gun so that I could get the ports positioned properly. Finished one gun, I think it came out pretty nice although the quion looks a little big.

 

 

 

 

I've also finished the ports and doors. As Bob said, when made per the instructions those doors are quite thick. I went ahead and did them that way. The problem becomes how they fit into the port when they are hinged. I ended up sanding a lot off the bottom of the doors and angled that surface a bit as well. They look a little funky when closed, but I plan to leave them open for display.

 

 

The overall color scheme appears uncertain in the kit. Different pics show different colors for the same items. I needed to paint the supports so I made an executive decision to go with what Tamiya calls Wooden Deck Tan. Here's the first pass, it'll need a second coat.

 

 

 

Ever since the start of this build I've been paranoid about trying to get big fat hands inside and under the support pieces. And now that is coming into play. The instructions seem rather hodge-podge in the order of things - placing some items near the outside and then telling you to do something inside of that.. Instead, I've taken the approach of working from the inside out.

 

So dead center inside is the hanging table and benches. I put those together this evening. Instructions call for 2mm x 8mm walnut planks for this. I couldn't find any in the kit but there were some limewood of that size. I believe those will be used for the upper deck but I used a few for the table and benches. Then stained them a dirty brown.

 

 

I'll need to finish painting the supports before installing them. I made one mistake and glued the support knees in place before drilling a hole in the center knee. The hole is for a pin that is inserted into the back edge of the table and on into the knee. Trying to get a pin vise with bit in there now will be a challenge and the hole will not be square to the knee but no one but me and you will ever know

 

It was really fun getting back to this kit. Working with the wood and solving those type of problems is what I enjoy most in this hobby!

[jbshan]

Port lids should be about twice the thickness of the outer planking, Mike.  Outer layer would match the hull planking, tumblehome, any wale or thicker plank present where the opening crosses, to make the outer surface smooth when the port is closed. 

The inner layer would be set back or held back a bit to make a rebate to fit inside the port lining.  Reference the destructions for your Niagara model.  Oops, your Niagara won't help.  Goodwin, Construction and Fitting will help, if you have it.

Also try this:

http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/7390-gun-port-lids/

The pics show how thin the lids are, also one or two show the lip formed by the port lining.

Edited December 10, 2016 by jbshan

[mikiek]

Haven't heard of the Goodwin book.

 

Wonder why Panart made the lids so thick?

[mikiek]

OK - I'm stumped. I was going to start making the buckets in between other things. There's a wood sheet with a bunch of disks on it - the tops & bottoms. The sheet parts are not numbered, but there is a page in the back of the instructions that shows the sheet with disks numbered. One big problem - the disk numbers called for in the plans do not match the numbers in the instructions.

[piratepete007]

Mike,

That Goodwin text is one of my essential books when referencing. An excellent guide.

 

Pete

[mikiek]

Thanks Pete - always looking to add to the library. I'll take a look at it.

[mikiek]

Onwards thru the fog. Still haven't figured out all the mis-numbering of the bucket disks. Thanks to Paul's log I did see that a bucket bottom has 2 disks. One is solid. The other has a square cutout in the center for the support beam. Both are the same size. I assume that is the same pattern for the upper disks, although I see no need for the solid disk. The upper disk will be painted black and that provides enough cover for the support beam.

 

The first bucket I made is stained rather than painted red. I think I prefer that look.

 

 

Finished a few of the gun tools.

 

 

I've hung the table and glued down the benches. However after seeing the pic, I will have to shorten the loop a little.

 

 

 

Thanks to Joel's notes, I decided to go back and add the lining to the gun ports. I was going to just paint it all red, now I will probably stain it some dirty wood color. I do like the lining - it adds a bit of detail.

 

 

[6ohiocav]

Mike,

 

This is really coming along nicely. Great bucket!  How does it feel to work in a macro world?

[mikiek]

Slow but steady progress on this guy. I've completed most of the gun tools, some of the buckets and the rigging for a gun. There is supposed to be another tool - looks like some sort of tamper. In the instructions it almost looks like it's brass, but I can find no metal parts like it. There are 2 wood parts that could be them, but I would hate to use the pieces and then find out they are supposed to be something else. I'm going to wait until I get further along and see what parts are left.

 

My intention is to take this build to the office when it is complete - a little dangerous I know, but if everything is glued down I'm hoping I'll be OK. It's a little harder to walk out with an entire build that just a cannon.

 

The breech rope looks more like twine so I subbed some rope from Syren - 0.035"  .It's slightly thinner but I think the look makes up for it. May still go back and replace the line in the blocks as well. Yes the block line will be frapped. Planning to glue the guns to the deck in the loading position.

 

A question maybe some of you would know - the hammock rail seems to be at an odd height. It is supposed to be on the upper deck and start at foot level and go up to maybe waist high. In other words the hammock setup is the only thing keeping one from falling overboard.  I thought the hammock rail was usually mounted on the handrail which would be mounted on a bulwark.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[WackoWolf]

Looking very nice. Very sharp detail

[Sirius]

Mike,

 

You're doing a very good job. What is the reference (manufacturer/code) for the red color in the gun carriages?

[mikiek]

Joe - thank you. I'm finding it interesting that each item added really brings more life to the build. I'm looking forward to adding the hanging hammocks. Should really give it it a 'lived in' look.

 

Sirius - I call it Chili Red - as in the food not the pepper.  It's a mix - both colors are Tamiya acrylic.  About 5 parts Flat Red to 1 part Hull Red.

[Sirius]

Thank you Mike. I like your Chili Red color. You can try patenting it

Edited December 19, 2016 by Sirius

[mikiek]

Sirius - we had some good discussions on red paint in my Niagara build log. The kit showed a fire engine red which was much too gaudy for my taste. Also mentioned was the fact of the difficulty getting that bright red pigment. A lot of colors were made locally and included all sorts of items - clay, berries, etc. So I see the Chili Red as more authentic and a lot easier on the eyes.

[mikiek]

Moving right along. There has been some progress and I need to snap some pix for you guys. The problem is there really aren't a lot of milestones with this kit, and that's usually where I take a break, take some pix and talk about it all in a post. With this one, you just keep adding little things to it. And I suppose all of a sudden, Presto, you're done.

 

I did start the upper deck and grate. There is also something that looks like some bitts next to the grate. As I was fitting those it seemed like they are awfully low. I didn't have the cross piece in when I took the pix. Knee-knockers or maybe even shin-bruisers. Seems like they should be taller. Did anyone else get that feeling?

 

Remember this is 1:23 scale

 

 

 

[mikiek]

Good advice Paul. At this stage I have no choice but to go with their "scale" unless I want to start making my own parts. I'm just glad someone else thinks things are a little out of whack.