US Brig Syren 1803 by Overworked724 – Model Shipways – Scale 1:64

[CPDDET]

😁

[Overworked724]

1 hour ago, CPDDET said:

😁

Oh my GOD!!!  You started my Pg 6 with an emoticon!!!  🤣

[Overworked724]

"Bringing in the Sheaves"...continued.

 

So I cut out the holes for the single and double sheaves.  After cutting the sheave holes, I reset the piece on it's side in the mini vise on my x-y table at the proper angle to drill the hole for the axle (is that the proper term) which will be 0.50mm brass wire.  For each section of wood, I could make 4 blocks comfortably, so made eight (8) singles and four (4) doubles.  I like to think I made this many to pick the 'best of the lot', but it's really because I know me and I screw up a lot!

 

After getting the sections predrilled, I did a brief sanding using 400 grit sandpaper.  I cut some strips that would slide into the sheave holes, and connected them (back to back) in my mini-vice.  Then I just slid them into the sheave and I could do a touch up sand on both sides of the hole’s interior.  (I'm not looking for perfect...I'm looking for decent!)

Afterwards, I cut my little sheaves from the mini-Skulpy noodle, and lined them up with the axle holes.  You'll notice the Skulpy sheave in the pic below has a hole in it.  I just ran my pin vise with a little drill bit down the center (again - I'm just eye balling here but it worked.)

I got the wire set in the block with CA by touching one side of the wire with CA and slowly pulling the other end through until the wire seized in the wood.  Then I trimmed off both sides and sanded with my 220 girt sanding stick (my most useful tool!).  Now the strips with the sheaves can be put away until I'm ready to cut the individual blocks to place on the ship.  

The blocks have enough room on front/back to sand down if required.  Not sure if they are accurate, but this is the best I can do with them...and I prefer these over drilling holes and simulating the sheaves by carving.  I don't trust my expertise enough in carving to do that...

 

Moving on....

 

 

 

 

[Overworked724]

Didn't think of this until now....but this little side trip into making the sheave blocks is identical to how I would make the sheaves for the catheads.  The block height for the double sheaves in the stern bulkhead is roughly the same as the cathead width...awesome.  One less thing.  

 

And what's funny is that I just imagined a simple jig to make reproducible cross sections with exact thickness...will try on the catheads!!

 

Moving on...

[CPDDET]

Beautiful work Patrick. Thanks for the tutorial!

Dave

[niwotwill]

Patrick your fixed blocks with the sheaves came out really nice. kudos for a job well done. I never thought of using sculpey for my sheaves instead of turning them from wood.

 

Many Congrats

Will 

[Overworked724]

10 hours ago, niwotwill said:

Patrick your fixed blocks with the sheaves came out really nice. kudos for a job well done. I never thought of using sculpey for my sheaves instead of turning them from wood.

Thanks, Will!  Very much appreciated!!  Like you, I get ideas from other build logs and read yours as well.  Many different ways to simulate the sheaves. I liked your approach to making the sheaves.  Since I don’t have a mill or mini-lathe, I needed to go a bit out of the box...which is the fun part of our gentle hobby.  
 

But...Making them is one thing...getting them on the ship is another. Seems Jesse’s build log was the right approach. Have the sheave blocks made and make the openings for them as you plank up the exterior bulkheads.  🤔

 

I’ll make the block openings before I put in the shear strake. So I’m now working on that approach while I continue to noodle over planking. 
 

Planking is going slow...but here are a couple of boring pics. 😊

Moving on...!

[Overworked724]

Took a stab at trying to install one of my earlier sheave blocks. I used the earlier faux deck made of basswood and added some filler blocks to simulate the thickness of the bulkhead. 

In the end, after making a horrible mess, I was able to get the block into my fake bulkhead. It’s ok...but It’s not as clean as I’d like.  I wish I’d have made clean openings to instal the blocks while building up the exterior bulkheads. 😣Sanding sticks and pin vise with drill bit...

 

I’ll be sweating bullets when trying to make these slots. 🙄

OK...

[CPDDET]

I have faith in you Patrick, sweat away!

 

Dave

[WalrusGuy]

Looks perfect!! Next time I'll try making sheaves as well (back then I had no idea what they were lolll)

[CPDDET]

I wonder if making the block the same width as the plank might have made fitting it in a bit easier?

 

But then I'm not familiar with your build or the proper scale. So I could be way off base here.

 

 

[Overworked724]

8 minutes ago, CPDDET said:

I wonder if making the block the same width as the plank might have made fitting it in a bit easier?

HI Dave.  The single blocks I made exactly one plank width.  The double blocks are by necessity a bit wider, but those should be slightly easier to cut as the stern area has no bulkhead behind that are of planking.  

 

I'll do my best!

[CPDDET]

As I said, perhaps I don't know what I'm talking about.🤐 

Carry on, Pat. Don't mind me.

[Justin P.]

Looks really great.   I might have lost my mind trying to work out those tiny sheaves - perhaps I will when I get there.   Definitely understand how work gets in the way, I had a great productive few months and now Im all bogged down myself with "emergent issues." Though, your description is a bit more gracious that mine might be...

 

[niwotwill]

Patrick your fixed blocks look great and as to installing them I found it easier to cut the double that the single blocks and you can see on the plans that the double is larger than 1 plank width. I found it best to install my blocks prior to the internal bulwark planking. With the blocks in place I could trim the planks to fit as needed. Just a note about fixed blocks: These blocks were designed and installed with the need to replace worn/broken blocks while at sea, so they should be somewhat loosely fitted. (don't remember where I read about replacing fixed blocks at sea but I think it was in one of Ed Tosti's logs)

 

Stay Well

Will 

[Overworked724]

I did plan to make the holes after sanding down the inner bulwarks and prior to installing the inner bulkhead planking.  The problem I referred to is in the technique needed to make straight edges to the holes, and making the holes themselves...without marring the hull overmuch.  

 

We shall see!! 

 

Moving on... 

[Overworked724]

Ugh. I really stink at planking.  😑

[CPDDET]

I find that hard to believe. Perhaps frustrated, but no worse than that.

 

Breathe Pat, breathe.

[Overworked724]

10 minutes ago, CPDDET said:

I find that hard to believe. Perhaps frustrated, but no worse than that.

Well, Dave...I'd say as a beginner, I'm probably right where I should be as my efforts are barely passable as far as I can tell.  I see a crap ton of wood filler in my future!  I had some initial thoughts of trying to get the hull planking done in a way that might allow me the option of leaving the hull natural and forgo the copper plating.  But I don't think that will be possible.  I'm doing ok...nothing horribly bad, but it's going a bit rough...the stern especially...

 

I have learned a couple of things first hand that I will not forget for my next model:

1. Basswood strips are absolute crap.  The basswood strips that came in my kit are bad even for basswood...knots everywhere, dry as a bone, and grainy as all get out.  After I get the hull planked, I'm not using basswood again.

2. If I ever do another plank on bulkhead I will be using filler blocks between every bulkhead frame.  I can see the imperfect depressions between the frames where I don't have fillers...and planking the bow and the stern area without full surface area makes the planking that much harder to put on.  So filler blocks it is...live and learn

3. Spiling or trimming planks is a mystery to me.  I need to technique to make uniformly trimmed planks.  Have no clue how other people do it...I'm using a razor blade and a ruler!  (I'm equipment challenged)

 

Ok....off to bed.  Pics to follow a bit later!

 

Moving on...to dreamland.

 

[niwotwill]

Patrick you are not alone with the planking problems we've all been there and done that and I still have the same feelings each time I plank another boat. Search the msw logs and find ones the appeal to you and see what they've done. There are many tutorials on the subject and you'll find them on the msw logs and web searches. Chuck Passaro has written about lining off the frames and planking from there, I used that system on my Syren and was very happy with the results. Chuck also has videos of how he planked the group project HMS Winchelsea Google "youtube Chuck Passaro" and you will see all for videos about 30 minutes total.

 

Hope this helps

Stay Well and Safe

Will  

[Overworked724]

Hi Will. Thank you. Yes, I’ve read many many blogs and watched several vids. I am attempting to use the method lining off the frames. As with all things, seeing is one thing, doing and developing the skill set is another. 😏
 

Again, my problem is understanding the technique needed to consistently thin down a plank. 
 

it’s funny you mention the Winchelsea. That’s probably going to be my next build...which could be a few years out at the rate I’m going. 🤔

Thanks for the helpful feedback on Chuck’s YouTube vids. I’ll check them out!

 

[CPDDET]

I couldn't agree more on the basswood issue. Just not the best wood for the best results.

 

My plan is to slog through my Bluenose using what I have, doing my best and learning as I go. But my next build will be a larger scale, simpler ship which I will attempt to scratch build. 

 

I've already purchased the half hull planking tutorial and think I need to back up and relearn how to walk before trying to run. 

 

Right now I know more about brain surgery than wood, so a huge learning curve there also.

 

And tools is something else I need to think seriously about if I plan to commit to this hobby.

 

It's great to have this forum as a sounding board.

[niwotwill]

Just catching up with your log and see you've taken some time off, just a supportive note your work is great and your great work will follow though with the planking. Keep in mind that sometimes it is best to remove an unacceptable piece and start a new piece. Don't be disappointed it will come together and be great. Keep it up.

 

Stay safe and well

Will 

[Overworked724]

No worries.  I’m still slowly pecking away at planking and other side projects for my model. Now that it’s Thursday, I should be able to get some progress over the weekend. 
 

On a side note, I think I might have a way to make the holes for the Shreveport blocks. We shall see....

[Overworked724]

Planking continues. I’m doing my best, but it’s some rough going. Transom is especially difficult. The bend below the counter, and trying to accurately trim the planks is beyond me. Doing my best though. 
 

Have a feeling my planking job once done is going to look like a patchwork quilt!

 

I see a lot of wood filler in my future. 
 

Moving on....!

[WalrusGuy]

6 hours ago, Overworked724 said:

Transom is especially difficult

I also struggled with this. I tried using clamps at first (which did work initially) then had to move on to just using my hands and patiently waiting. I also found a neat trick of using superglue at the end with wood glue for the rest of the plank. The superglue acted like an internal clamp since it stuck super quick. Hope this helps!! 

 

Btw your planking work is very neat! 

[Overworked724]

4 hours ago, WalrusGuy said:

I also struggled with this. I tried using clamps at first (which did work initially) then had to move on to just using my hands and patiently waiting. I also found a neat trick of using superglue at the end with wood glue for the rest of the plank. The superglue acted like an internal clamp since it stuck super quick. Hope this helps!! 

 

Btw your planking work is very neat! 

You just described the method I’m using. 🤣

[Overworked724]

Well...I was not expecting perfection. I’m using this planking project to identify my weaknesses and build some skills. However, my frustration is boiling over. I won’t post pics because it’s too embarrassing...

 

I realize my biggest problem is trying to cleanly taper a 1/8” plank. I just don’t know how others do it. Another problem is the basswood strips. I realize now many of them are wider/narrower than they should be...which makes the job even harder. The quality of the basswood strips is poor and the edges are extremely rough. However, I’m glad I’m using the basswood because I don’t feel like I could do a respectable job using nicer wood. 
 

I’ve tried lining the hull, but the lines are defunct after I lay a plank because I can’t get the plank to lay clean against the edge of the adjacent plank. Plus the taper (I am using a razor blade and straight edge - poor method) is not a straight clean edge...which makes it impossible. 
 

How do others taper their planks?
 

Finally...I can see why having a seamless hull is the recommended way forward. The gaps between the frames only give you the adjacent planks to adhere to...and so you are completely limited by the frame edge for surface area. Makes setting stealers more troublesome, and you need to bend the strips across individual small sections instead of having a clean continuous surface area. Next time it’s filler blocks all the way. 

I also think my fairing was not spot on...as I have the irritating clinker built effect continuing along the front of the hull.  I really tried to fair her up as tightly as I could.
 

Not certain what to do at this point, so I’m taking a break for the weekend. I’ll work on something else.   I’m sure I can finish the planking, one way or another...but it won’t be planking...it will be ‘dry walling’ since I’ll just be covering the hull with wood to fill and copper over. Was really hoping I could do a better job. 
 

 

Moving on...kind of....

 

[CPDDET]

Sorry to hear about your frustrations. But I can easily relate.

 

Sometimes I find it better to just walk away from my build rather than trying to push through the problem.

 

My mind continues to ponder on the problem even away from the shipyard, and sometimes I will come up with an out of the box solution.

 

I know this doesn't answer your question, but I wanted to at least offer some moral support.

 

As for tapering hull planks, and deck planks for that matter, here is what I did. Probably not the best solution but it worked for me.

 

First I took a board of the same thickness and length of the planking boards but 3 to 4 inches wide. 

 

Then I took a metal ruler (12-16 inch) and glued a sandpaper strip to the backside.

 

I then drew the taper on the plank, butted it up against the larger board and placed the ruler along the line I drew. The ruler overlapped both the plank and the larger board. I found the sandpaper on the backside of the ruler trapped and held the plank firmly enough to allow me to taper it with a knife.

 

Perhaps there is a way to also get sandpaper below the plank as well and "sandwich" it in to hold it firmly.

 

I think this may work better if the larger board is very slightly thinner (1/64) than the plank. Too much difference may cause the knife to run at an angle.

 

I took the dive and invested my tax return in a Byrne's saw. I would hope this will solve any future problems with tapering.

 

D

[smotyka]

I also wanted to second the idea of using sandpaper such as adhesive backed 80 grit to the back side of a ruler as stated by CPDDET.  As a woodworker I do this with rules, straight edges etc. to insure that my marking don't slide all over the place. 

 

For me, it's the discipline of cutting where the blade doesn't wander.  I used a 4 inch scraper that uses disposable razor sharp knives for a straight down cut.  Again, thanks for sharing your pitfalls as I'm about to restart my ship modelling endeavors.  I stopped years ago because of getting so far into a model, seeing something I don't like and then pitching it.  

 

Observing yourself, you will figure out something innovative - I'm sure of it!