Bluenose by PopJack - Model Shipways - 1:64

[fnkershner]

Are you talking about the fife rail? This is where all the belaying pins will go. Like you I was worried about the stress on these rails when I got to the rigging. I used a wood backing instead of nails but the same result. I did not solder the rings closed.

[PopJack]

Thank you for the reply.

 

I am familiar with the fife rail.  I strengthened mine by gluing some paper to the bottom.  It's reassuring to know that others worry about this as well.  In this model there are extensions to the main rail amidships and toward the bow that also hold belaying pins.  If there is some other name for belaying pins when they are not used in the fife rail, I just need to be educated.

 

Anyway, here is a photo of the forward portion of the ship where you can see these extensions.  I have nails in the drilled holes right now to keep them open when I paint.  After the paint is dry, I will remove the nails and re-drill the holes for a nice fit.  I was concerned that the edge wouldn't hold, hence my "pins" to strengthen the bond.

 

 

Concerning the soldering, I don't really mind doing it (Its kind of fun to play with fire), but the heated brass and solder don't take the darkening solution and I have to paint everything.  This is just annoying.

[popeye the sailor]

thinking ahead is everything........a very nice shot of your deck planking...the nibbing looks very nice    I don't usually solder anything...I try to get my rigging taught,  without a lot of stress.  undo stress can distort masting    your build is looking very good.

[PopJack]

The deck furniture is coming to a close.  I've been working on rings.

 

I had soldered several rings before I asked my question and decided to continue on.  I'm using soldering paste, so its not a big deal.  More difficult is the painting.

 

I've decided to paint the rings and then install them in a manner that allows me to do a bit of touch up (since I'm basically too impatient to allow them to dry for a few days).  So, below you can see freshly painted rings stuck in the tops of yogurt cups (the plastic grips the brass very nicely) and a few installed through some tape that ask as masking.

 

I'm really wishing I had "toned down" the white paint before painting everything, but I'm not willing to redo.  Lesson learned for next model!

 

 

[PopJack]

Just realized I hadn't uploaded the photo of my cabin.  I think the sky light came out pretty good.  I saw some photos of the real ship after it was done and would do it a bit differently if I did it over. 

 

The small dorries are "interesting" to make.  I have kept faith with the idea that only two of them have to turn out really well.  The rest I can stack under the good ones.  Obviously, I have not added rails, or interior framing to any of them yet.

 

 

[bhermann]

I had soldered several rings before I asked my question and decided to continue on.  I'm using soldering paste, so its not a big deal.  More difficult is the painting.

 

I'm really wishing I had "toned down" the white paint before painting everything, but I'm not willing to redo.  Lesson learned for next model!

 

Like you I soldered the eyes.  Now I don't have to worry about them opening up while rigging, just about them ripping out!

 

I agree about toning down the white.  In some places (like the rings on the hatch covers) I changed them to black after seeing them in place.  You are doing some fine work here, in my opinion.

 

Bob

[PopJack]

Been working a bit on Dorries.  They are fun to make, but I have advised my wife if I don't come to bed to check and see if I have superglued myself to the little work bench.

 

First, I made the braces and such, then I bent some narrow wood for the rails.

 

After everything was assembled, I painted the boat a beige.  I'm considering going back and painting the rail a contrasting color.  Don't know.  In any event, in this photo you can see what I plan on doing with the nested boats.  The supports really just make the rail easier to attach.

 

This shows what the boats look like nested.  I'm thinking they are Okay- I'm not sure how much space there should be.  I am assuming the benches came out and laid on the floor to allow closer nesting.

 

As always, suggestions and comments welcome.  And remember, I"m taking the excellent advice of the club member in Knoxville.  He advised I "drink more" when working on the boat!

[PopJack]

Well, I've either finished the dories or gotten tired of them.  I'm finished with all the painting I plan on doing and started making the oars.  Apparently, the oars were stored in the top boat of the nested stack- at two sets per boat, and four boats per stack, that's 2X2X4=16 oars per stack or 32 oars I've got to carve!

 

I've already decided that since this was the early part of the 20th century, it is unrealistic to assume that the oars (or sweeps, if you prefer) were identical.  That's my story and I'm sticking to it.

 

I need some ideas on painting the oars.  Any ideas?  I'm thinking the "handles" black and the "blades natural" or perhaps white.  I'd appreciate input.

 

My first oar.  I'm a proud papa.

 

My first set setting by a stack of boats.

 

Woody the sailor looking things over.  The handles are thick for his hands.  If I get brave, I'll try and sand them down a bit further.

 

 

Oh, one more small point.  I followed the practicum on the benches in the dory, but the placement is incorrect.  They should have cutouts that capture the bracing on the sides to keep them from moving.  They were removable after all and it would have been foolish to mount them any other way.  Not a big thing, but one of those things I wish I had noticed earlier.

Edited February 2, 2014 by PopJack

[PopJack]

I started putting the deck furniture and fittings on today. 

I discovered, after much detailed and secret research into hidden archives, that the bluenose actually had a "step through" fife rail.  Obviously, I had to model such a discovery, to wit:

 

 

I also worked on a paint scheme for the oars.  I haven't found anything I like yet.  BTW, there are a BOATLOAD of oars!  I did a little research today and found that oars used in deep water were held in place by various types of horns or stops, but not circular oar locks.  Circular or ring oar locks were too dangerous in open water.  I also found that some oars were/are protected by leather.  Who knew?   I still am not sure how to paint them, though.

 

 

Anyhow, this is how it looks right now.

 

 

Anyone who has good eyes can see where I repaired the fife rail.  I don't think it will ever look "right" but perhaps I can make it acceptable. 

 

I am thinking about following Jack Tar's example and adding a rack of barrels.  I noticed the ones in the old photo are scuttled on top (if I grabbed the right nautical term).  I'm wondering what was held in them.

Edited February 3, 2014 by PopJack

[PopJack]

The photos in the Nova Scotia archives of the Bluenose show a number of barrels and a storage box which are not part of the build.  Like some others, this bothered me, so I obtained some keg shaped large barrels and created something.  There are two parts left, first, I the barrels in the photo are scuttled, so I will have to add this.  Second, I'm going to have to decide about paint.

 

I suspect these barrels held salt, but I would really appreciate any input on what else might have been in them.

 

 

 

[captainbob]

What about water?  The Bluenose had a fishing crew of 28.  At 1 gallon of water per day,(a minimum) that was 840 gallons per month of fishing.  Where was that stored?

 

Bob

[PopJack]

I don't know really.  Here is a snip of the old photo.

 

Here is a bit closer.   It shows the lids on the barrels and how they were tied down.  I wonder about that young sailor standing so calmly in the photo.

 

 

Here is one more where you can see the lids on the barrels. 

 

 

 

Edited February 8, 2014 by PopJack

[PopJack]

After studying the photos, I decided I didn't have the barrels right.  So I did some rework and came up with this:

 

 

 

On the ship it looks a bit large scale wise.  I'm trying to decide if it adds to the ship or should be 'chucked.' 

 

I also worked on the bow sprint, but ended up with a limp guy (wire).  I cut if off and started over.  In the process I accidently cut the ring I had soldered shut at the cut water, so the new one will not be soldered.  I'm also beginning to regret my decision to paint all of the metal black.  It just doesn't show as much as I'd like for all the work that it is.

 

[dgbot]

Popjack,  what kind of soldering paste are you using?  They make a silver bearing soldering that can be chemically blackened.  Your Bluenose is shaping nicely.

 

David B

[PopJack]

Fusion brazing paste

[dgbot]

I you go to a jewelry supply store they have silver bearing solder flux that will blacken.  I use Sante Fe Jewelry Supply http://www.sfjssantafe.com/  another good site is Contenti Jewelry Supply http://www.contenti.com/  I have used this material in the past and it works pretty good.  Check out both websites I think you will like what you see.

David B

[PopJack]

Thanks for the information.  The advantage of what I have now, of course, is that I have it.  I really don't know the difference between "silver solder" and what I am using.  I have noticed I have to get this stuff really hot to work- sometimes if I'm not careful, I end up melting the brass.

 

Anyway, I had a chance to play with the ship a bit more today.

 

First, I tried re-painting my barrel boxes and I added ropes.  I think it looks better and I will probably leave it on the boat.

 

 

Second I continued rigging the bow sprint.  You will notice how my idea of painting everything black really destroys the detail.  As an aside, the dowell for the bow sprint supplied was poplar- a nice straight grained wood, but green in color.  I thought it looked ugly so I painted it black.  Looking back, I would recommend just buying another dowel and leaving it natural color.  That way the details would look better.

 

 

 

I also shaped the base of the mast so they will fit.

 

 

[dgbot]

Are you using and airbrush or by hand.  As for the the brass it can be chemically blackened. 

David B

[PopJack]

I used an airbrush for painting the hull and major items.  I am painting the hardware with a brush.  I am using a enamel paint which is not water base- semi-gloss.  For the wood, I use a flat acrylic.  I thought this would provide some contrast.

 

I have tried using brass blacken chemicals.   Although I am perfectly fine admitting I don't know what I'm doing, I have very poor success working with brass that has been soldered.  The brass that is brass colored turns quickly (albeit, it takes several short treatments to get a good coat) but the brass that has been heated does not take the color.

 

I have also tried blackener for copper- and it stinks, but works.

 

It may that I am using the wrong kind of solder, I don't know.  I find painting looks just as good to my unsophisticated eye and is a lot quicker and easier.

 

If you have a specific chemical you are using, I'd appreciate know which one.  I can try it on a future project.

[dgbot]

I have had good results from Birchwood Casey's Brass Black.  The secret is to make sure the brass is super clean.  And if you are going to solder use a silver bearing solder or just hard solder.  When properly cleaned you will get a nice color.

David B

[PopJack]

As indicated, I am painting my metal fixtures with a sem-gloss enamel.  This is because #1, I have had very poor luck with chemicals I have tried, and #2 I think that the semigloss with give them a nice look on the finsihed model.

 

Here are a few straps drying before installation.  After they dry it will be easy to touch up.

 

 

Woody examines the foot ropes on the bow sprint.  I suspect he would like to be sure they are VERY secure.

 

[PopJack]

Worked on main mast a bit this afternoon.  I understand that the practicum I bought would produce a nice model, but I have been bitten by the "real detailed real metal" bug.  As such, I started working on the main mast band for the futtock shrouds.

 

First, I used the mast to form the loose metal, then I soldered it up and finally added some elongated rings.  I'm not sure how accurate historically this is.

 

I think once painted it will be great.  The instructions say either white or galvanized.  I'm thiking galvanized or black. 

 

If all else fails, I'm creating a story where the ship's blacksmith had kidney stones the day these were made and an apprentice was pressed into service.

 

 

BTW, Two thoughts,

 

1) I notice this isn't the normal way to make rings.  I hope it works out.

2) Am I supposed to clean my work area before making photos?

Edited February 18, 2014 by PopJack

[russ]

Nice metal work.

 

Russ

[popeye the sailor]

nice progress.........the metal work is really sharp.......and it doesn't look bad painted 

[PopJack]

So, I've been thinking about fairleads on the mast around the spreaders.  The scale is small and I want to make something that looks good, but isn't too far out.

 

I came up with the idea of wrapping  wire around toothpick, then coating it with superglue and letting it dry well.

Then I took a razor saw and cut the toothpick close on both sides, filed it a bit and drilled a hole in it.  This is what I go.

Held up the spreaders, it looks like this. I would paint it before installing it.

 

You may also notice on this last photo that I attached the brace to the forward spreader by drilling a hole in the spreader.  I didn't think I could make anything else look good.

 

Comments or better methods appreciated- Especially what you know about the scale.  I'm a flatlander and have no idea what these things looked like on real wooden ships.

[PopJack]

David B: I did some research on silver solder and silver brazing.  The jewelry stuff you talk about melts at around 430 degrees.  The stuff I have been using melts at over 1200 degrees.  So, when I have used the silver brazing paste, the brass must exceed 1200 degrees and therefore it undergoes changes.  I don't know if they are oxidation related or some other property.  This prevents it from being chemically treated.

 

I have ordered some silver solder to play with and see if I can learn to use it.   At that temperature, the brass doesn't really change much and will probably still blacken fine.   If nothing else, It will be great for soldering shut an eyebolt that needs to be attached to a previously soldered part without loosening the original joint.

 

Thanks for the heads up that lead to this research.

[russ]

I have been using some pre fluxed silver brazing paste for about 10 years now. It melts at about 1100-1200 degrees. I have never had a problem chemically blackening the joints. I always give the joints a good filing afterward. That could have something to do with it. Others use a pickling solution to clean the joints prior to blackening.

 

Your fairleads look good to my eye. That is a good solution. I will have to file that away for future reference.

 

Russ

[dgbot]

I have been using some pre fluxed silver brazing paste for about 10 years now. It melts at about 1100-1200 degrees. I have never had a problem chemically blackening the joints. I always give the joints a good filing afterward. That could have something to do with it. Others use a pickling solution to clean the joints prior to blackening.

 

Your fairleads look good to my eye. That is a good solution. I will have to file that away for future reference.

 

Russ

I have to agree with Russ.  After hard soldering you musy pickle the part to deeply clean to remove flux and imputities like oxidation.  I use a compound called Sparex.  It is used by jewers to clean a part.  Then I blacken it.

David B

[russ]

Keep in mind, I have never used any pickling solution. I just use a 4 inch jeweler's file to scrub the joint bright. Never had a problem getting the joint to blacken.

 

Russ

[PopJack]

Thanks Russ.  I guess I had it figured wrong. 

 

Well, live and learn.  I suppose that I will just have to finish this ship and try again on another one!

 

Would either of you (or anyone else for that matter) know if the low temperature past bond as well or are as strong at the higher temperature brazing paste?

Edited February 22, 2014 by PopJack