HM Cutter Sherbourne by Stuka - Vanguard Models - 1:64

[Stuka]

Thanks again Craig for the answers 😁. I just remembered I do own a measuring tape from my sewing kit so I think its good for the job of measuring the bulkheads. 
 

2 hours ago, Craigie65 said:

As for tools, I use a travel iron for edge bending. I have read others suggest a mini heat gun, but we had an unused travel iron and requisitioned it for modelling purposes 😉

I do own a hair dryer but I just dont have a good setup to clamp down planks and edge bend them like Chuck does. So I will see how im going to tackle that but I will think a little on what kind tool to get. I am dragged towards the electric bender since I have heard lots of good about those as long as its used carefully. But getting a traveling iron is not out of the question though.

Edited September 15 by Stuka

[Stuka]

Hello again, I have been abit busy aswell as trying to read up on how to plank well.  Even though some of the tips are great its still hard to grasp but im getting there one step at a time. Im figuring out a good way transfer tick marks to the bulkheads but since I have no good tool like a divider or compass im left with a paper strip which might not be that accurate. Anyway Im currently figuring out how exactly to taper planks and at what angle etc,  Are you supposed to taper planks on the lower side or the upper side?  

I also tested my new plank bender on some other planks to get the hang of it today and the results are promising. But all in all I am a little slow and want to take things carefully and when I know 100% what needs to be done. Therefore I have been these past weeks just gathering information, looking at good tools and even book suggestions for planking model ships 

[Craigie65]

Hey Stuka,

paper or thin card is good enough for transferring tick marks.

taper your planks on the upper side.  The angle of cut is dictated by the measurements you transferred to your plank.

[AJohnson]

Hi Stuka,

 

Craig is right, a simple bit of card is fine for transferring tick marks. I’m not holding my efforts up as “expert” advice, I did describe my planking efforts on my Cutter Trial log from post number #34 using tick marks etc.  There are also many more better examples and tutorials on MSW, you don’t need to spend money on fancy tools or books, a flat board, some clamps, a travel iron, rule and good knife is about it. Good luck, keep us posted.  👍

Edited September 26 by AJohnson

[Stuka]

Thanks for some clarification, Though I did see on example modelers central that the tapering Will be done on the lower edge of the plank. I also saw the same being said on MSW. Im not trying to say one is wrong but for a beginner like me I dont understand frankly what side is correct to taper.  I might just need to follow your advice and see the results in reality to grasp it all.

 

Though if I taper it on the upper edge there is an even larger gap between the plank and the bulwark pattern. I Suppose that this is where edge bending comes into play then.

 

Again thanks for the advice im eternally grateful for it

[Craigie65]

Hi Stuka,

Usually at the bow a plank will curve up away from the keel without edge bending. 

Step 31 shows that and hence why I cut from the top, i.e. planking from the top down to the keel.  The edge bend is down towards the keel, you can see it in the picture in the top left of page 13.

 

See page 16 in this planking guide Here, as to why I have always cut from the top.  

 

Andrew’s post #34 has a couple of pics of the tapering and bending of what I believe is the first plank on the port side, pictures 12 and 13. @AJohnson can correct me but it looks as if the cut is to the top of the plank.

 

Perhaps you could post a couple of photos of the problem?

good luck and keep posting!

 

Edited September 26 by Craigie65

[Stuka]

Hello Craig. 

I looked through your link and its helping to some extent. For page 13 I can see that the stern and bow planks are pointing upwards meaning the center was edge bent down. And whilst looking through I see it being mentioned for word that the tapering is always taken from the upper edge of the plank so thats that settled then. 

 

 

Here above you can see I have a test tapered plank that is tapered to around 2.5 mm at the bow and the taper line goes from the bow to around where the 3rd or 4th bulkhead Is.  As you can see here above there is a gap now I did myself try and bend the plank in a way It would be if it was edge bent toward the keel like a U shape. Then the tapering looks pretty okay and could use some slight trimming to get rid of the small gaps.  

 

Finally Im figuring out where to stop placing tick marks on the bow/keel area. Is it where the bow meets bulkhead 1 or later?. Now I will redo my tick marks with a thinner pen and also more accurate. 

( Hopefully im not bothering to much asking this much questions)

[Craigie65]

Hi Stuka,

Don’t worry about asking questions. That is the beauty of this forum!

 

I would have the apex of the bend at the “?”

 

As for the stop, use part 56 and draw a line along the inside of this part onto the stem. You want to be a mm or so in side that line with your first planking.  You can just see the pencil line on the front of this model.

Also shown is my rig for edge bending, the plank is the first for the starboard side. This boat had a taper from around frame 7.

 

[Stuka]

12 hours ago, Craigie65 said:

I would have the apex of the bend at the “?”

 

 You mean the highest point of the edgebend?

[Craigie65]

Yes, that is right.

 

It is always a bit trail and error to find the right spot , for me atleast!

[Dan Poirier]

I'm just a few planks in on this model, and struggling.

 

I needed to bend the bow ends of my planks down like hockey sticks to get them to lie flat there, and they wouldn't bend that much, so my first couple planks are sticking up from the bulkheads along one edge. On the fourth plank I just cut the bottom edge straight, ending the plank in a long thin point short of the stem, so that the next planks wouldn't have to bend nearly so much. I'll see today how well that works.

 

 

One thing I did figure out. It's a lot easier to make bends near the eventual end of the plank if I leave some excess attached until after I've done the bending.

Edited September 27 by Dan Poirier
Add photo.

[Stuka]

On 9/27/2024 at 2:32 PM, Dan Poirier said:

One thing I did figure out. It's a lot easier to make bends near the eventual end of the plank if I leave some excess attached until after I've done the bending.

 
I noticed that too, Though I can get around that easily since im using an electric plank bender.  What tools are you using Dan for the planking?

Also slight update I got my first plank down yesterday and it looks very good,  I edge bent it with a travel iron and then I bent the inward curve with the electric bender.  Hopefully I can get some more planks down and then show a picture

[Dan Poirier]

I'm also using an electric plank bender, but when making hockey-stick style bends, I use rubber-tipped clamps to hold the plank in place while I apply the heat, and I need a little extra room so I don't melt the clamp tips.

[Stuka]

Its not much, And its slow progress but it looks good so far I think. Though I might have miscalculated the area around the stern. because I made it so that 12 planks would fit on the very last bulkhead but after looking at the pictures I see the planks going down on the stern until they meet the keel. I think im in the deep here, and maybe I should only taper in the bow area ?

[Craigie65]

Hi Stuka,

As you say the planks will run down to the keel at the rear. look at step 32 and you can see that.  Now it also looks as if there is some tapering to the first few planks in that picture.  I would keep going and adjust as you go.   You can run the planks to the stern but you will need top feather them down so that they are no thicker then the sternpost, otherwise your second planking will be above the sternpost facing. Look at the bottom left picture on page 18 of the manual, you can see that that is what has been done.

You may find it easier to stop the planks a little before the stern post and feather them in as I did with this hull. 

 

Ignore the clamps they are holding the stem, keel and sternpost facings for the second planking while the glue dries!

 

 

[Stuka]

Hi Craig 
Thank you for the guidance I looked at the images and I can see the planks thinning out along the sternpost until they just stop. I guess this is what you mean by top feathering that they just gradually become thinner and thinner until the planks stop?  Also Is it a good idea to perhaps taper less on the planks by the stern as I have more area around the sternpost to plank than what I mistankenly accounted for?

But since the planks have to run around the bulkhead 17 down to the sternpost. I might not be able to have full width planks here right now. Therefore I might go for tapering just 1/4 of the planks around the stern while continuing normally on the bow hopefully that will yield a nice result. Any opinion is welcome thanks!

Edited September 30 by Stuka

[Craigie65]

Morning Stuka,

Feather - sorry I keep forgetting English is not your first language - yes that is right thinning down as you say to blend into the stern post.

 

The manual has the first 4 or 5 planks tapered at the rear, then they look to be full width for the rest.  I would follow that.

 

 

[Stuka]

Thanks Craig. Yea many of these english terms are a first time encounter for me. But I will follow your advice with tapering the first set of 4-5 planks on each side. Should the gap get to big around the stern I will throw in a stealer to even the area for edge bending.

[Craigie65]

Yes it does look as if you will need a stealer.  I can see 2 on the model in the manual, although one is pretty small. You might get away with just one.

Edited October 2 by Craigie65

[Stuka]

Another problem I encountered yesterday was that at bulkhead 2-3 I might have bevelled to much so the planks make contact to far in. Meaning that a gap will appear between the upper plank. I looked at some threads and I think im going to attempt to use a small piece of wood to even out the bulkheads more so my planks run flush.

 

This is a rollercoaster build

[Stuka]

So in looking at my error the fault might actually not be cause of over sanded bulkheads. But more so to me not properly beveling the planks so they start to twist inward. On one side I managed to carefully knife through the glue and realign the plank somewhat. Time will tell if this side worked . On the other side I didnt manage to get it off so I instead took some wood bits of tapering leftovers and put two of those pieces on there. Hopfully to rest the plank halfwidht on it to create a twist without any gaps in my planks. 

Hopefully this trial and error will get me somewhere with a planked hull someday hopefully. 

[Stuka]

Hello 

Just a quick update, Im currently cracking on with the planking and its going okay. Im going to back on my statement about the reason for the gaps in my planks.  I think actually I oversanded bulkhead 1-2 and didnt even out the rest of the bulkheads to match thats why I had a huge gap over those two. But I tried to fix this by gluing on some wood pieces and it helped to some extent. I will have to learn from this and hopefully not repeat it in the future.  

Anyway got 4 planks down aswell as the garboard ones so soon halfway as for the tapering. Before I tapered from bulkhead 5 to the stem but I tried with  the latest plank to taper it from the 4th bulkhead and no taper in the stern. My tapering skills are very novice so not the best. However I still have gaps  between my planks on the bow which Im going to sand down and use wood filler to hopefully rid of those gaps. Afterall this area is to be covered in a 2nd layer aswell as a white paint so im optimistic...for now 😆 

[Stuka]

Hello 

So first planking ever done looks okay I think. Some gaps here and there though mostly by the bow are cause of the oversanded bulkheads 1-2. However I did the first couple of planks very tapered by the bow and some tapering around the stern. But as I kept going I thought that unless I wanted to use alot of stealers in the stern I should start to attempt to use as much full plank width there as I can. So thats what I did and I stopped tapering the stern area as I kept going. Only tapering if the plank would curve to much in a to tight space (Like where the last bulkhead meets the stern). I eyeballed the tapering alot over here and im not sure it was the right decision but I ended up with only 1 stealer on the stern. 

As for the bow I tapered pretty much all the planks there to some extent. Only  tapered the top planks from bulkhead 5 however as I progressed down I started only doing it from the 4th or 3rd bulkhead. 

In the end I used 2 stealers per side, one by the bow and one by the stern.  The bow one I had to do due to the last slot being only around 2.5mm wide. But I think the result from using the stealers was pretty good so Im happy with it. Also when doing the Garboard plank to get the right curvature I just clamped it together with the prow piece and drew a line that way I got a good curve on the plank and it matched nicely.  

Now I used pliers for driving in the brass nails but the pliers I had though small where not good enough. They were to wide so just a tiny bit of the nail was outside of the plier. Therefore when driving it in I had to take several new grips which often resulted in a kinked nail.  And the needle nose plier I have even though it was small enough had the problem of having a ribbed grip. That meant that I often found my nails just going freely between the ribbed area. Going through some hardware stores in my town in search of a new plier with a smooth grip I came across this one.  Very very tiny grip and I could drive in the nails in one go from all angles so this little tool helped alot. 

Other techniques I used was edge bending with a traveling iron like Chuck Passaro which worked like a charm. And after that I would set the inwards bending with the electric bending iron.  Alot of tools but they made all this easier for me as a novice.

All in all I am happy with the first planking though alot of things could have been done different, like sanding the bulkheads better, better tapering and better bevelling of the planks. I am a person that usually learns things the hard way so to speak so hopefully I learned something from this for future endevours.    

[Craigie65]

Hey Robin,

That is great progress!

Sanding and filling will get you a good base for the second planking.  The pear planks are slightly thinner and I found these a bit easier to work with.  As you say most of it will be under a coat of paint but still good practice!

It is a great feeling to finish the hull and start kiting her out.

 

For the nails have you thought about a pin pusher?  Vanguard sells this one. 

Edited October 9 by Craigie65

[Stuka]

Thanks Craig for the encouragement 🙂 feels very relieving to be over the first plank layer as it took me a long time to get this finished. As you are saying my plan now is to use woodfiller and start sanding the hull to get it smooth. And Im trying to be patient cause I want to start adding the other parts and paint her.  

 

1 hour ago, Craigie65 said:

For the nails have you thought about a pin pusher?  Vanguard sells this one. 

I did actually buy that one but because I saw so many people use pliers and once I tried using the pliers it just stuck with me. But next planking Ill try to use the pin pusher to see if its easier/ more convenient. Afterall I spent money on it so hopefully will get some use of it. 

[Craigie65]

Robin,

I would not use pins for the second planking if at all possible.  You don’t want pin holes to fill!  Sorry should have said earlier.

Some use thick CA for the second planking, but I find it too unforgiving!  I use Titebond PVA and a bit of patience👨🏼‍🦳

[Stuka]

Oh dont worry Craig haha, I wasnt going to use pins for the 2nd planking I already have scrolled through here and read the manual to know that only glue is used. Now Im wondering how to clamp down these planks if im going to use PVA glue,  Cause CA glue settles way to fast and is unforgiving

[Stuka]

So I spent around 1.5 Hour sanding and it feels very smooth now all around so I think this good enough. Hopefully my 2nd plank layer will sit flush against each other now . or should I sand off more wood filler? 

Edited October 9 by Stuka

[Craigie65]

Hi Robin,

I think you have a bit more sanding to do, fun eh?

Run your finger down the hull, if it feels a bump, catch or a depression you need to fix it, otherwise the second planking will show every imperfection.

[Stuka]

Hello Craig 

I ended up sanding the hull for a little bit more and I drew my fingers across to planks to feel for bumps or sudden deppressions and I didnt find any so fingers crossed now