Roger Pellett

Don't forget that ships do not necessarily sail at their designed water lines. Warships may leave port deeply laden but during their cruise they use up provisions, possibly ammunition, and their fresh water supply is constantly changing. Trim also changes as stores and ammunition are moved about and the Captain may decide to shift armament about, to change the rake of the masts or to deliberately change trim by shifting ballast.
 
Merchant vessels may carry cargos of different densities- such as coal outbound and grain home. Whaling ships would change trim as knocked down barrels were assembled and filled with oil.
 
It is therefore reasonable to assume that different areas of the copper sheathing would look quite different, with the belt above water the typical green verdigris and that submerged brown. The action of water at the bow would differ from that at the stern, affecting the finish of the copper differently but I don't know how.
 
I agree with Frankie that a too literal reproduction of details such as nails does not look realistic. A more impressionistic treatment looks better.
 
A number of years ago builder Rob Napier publishedd an article in then NRJ regarding the colors on the yacht Northern Light. He used paint ovrer the copper sheathing at the waterline to give it a weathered look. I believe that it is number 36. Look it up on their web site.
 
Roger

Roger is correct when he says real mahogany is Honduras mahogany.  It's often called genuine mahogany.  More common these days is African mahogany.  It's darker and a bit inconsistent in how it finishes.  While Honduras mahogany finishes to a deep lustre, African mahogany can look almost dead and getting the right wood can be hit or miss.  Another substitute for mahogany is sapele.  It's in the mahogany family and can finish beautifully.  When freshly cut, it is fairly light in color but once you apply a finish it darkens considerably.  Honduras mahogany and sapele both impart a chatoyance when finished.  It tricks the eye into seeing depth and is fascinating to look at from different angles.
 
I think the problem with mahogany in model building is it is an open pore wood and, when magnified, the pores look abnormally large.  This can be partially resolved with a filler and a good finish but close inspection may still show the large pores.  I did an experiment with French polishing on Honduras mahogany and it turned out gorgeous, though I don't remember how the pores looked up close.  But the nice thing about French polishing is the pores are filled with a slurry of mahogany dust and shellac which is what helps make the finish so beautiful.
 
Keith, your model is coming along beautifully!  It's compelling me to get serious about Endeavour but I have so much else that has to be done.  Your mention of outdoor temperature made me realize that further north of here, winters create a great time to do indoor work.  But here in Florida, winter is the best time to do outdoor work.
 
As always, thank you for sharing your build photos.  Keep 'em coming!

Kieth, A great project beautifully executed! Your deck structures are particularly impressive. For many years I have been thinking of building a 1:32 scale model of a Royal Navy Steam Pinnace. The bright finished cabin aft presents a particular challenge but your deck structures are an inspiration. I have several chunks of Mahogany salvaged from an old chair. It is at least 75 years old, tight grain and deep colored that I have been thinking of using for this purpose despite model building book advice that Mahogany is not a good choice. Your work proves the exception to the rule.
 
Roger

Don't forget that ships do not necessarily sail at their designed water lines. Warships may leave port deeply laden but during their cruise they use up provisions, possibly ammunition, and their fresh water supply is constantly changing. Trim also changes as stores and ammunition are moved about and the Captain may decide to shift armament about, to change the rake of the masts or to deliberately change trim by shifting ballast.
 
Merchant vessels may carry cargos of different densities- such as coal outbound and grain home. Whaling ships would change trim as knocked down barrels were assembled and filled with oil.
 
It is therefore reasonable to assume that different areas of the copper sheathing would look quite different, with the belt above water the typical green verdigris and that submerged brown. The action of water at the bow would differ from that at the stern, affecting the finish of the copper differently but I don't know how.
 
I agree with Frankie that a too literal reproduction of details such as nails does not look realistic. A more impressionistic treatment looks better.
 
A number of years ago builder Rob Napier publishedd an article in then NRJ regarding the colors on the yacht Northern Light. He used paint ovrer the copper sheathing at the waterline to give it a weathered look. I believe that it is number 36. Look it up on their web site.
 
Roger

Just a few more shots of the engine, have added a few things have a few to go.

Hello everybody,
 
I was was starting to feel a little burnt out trying to catch up with model two so I had to take a little break for the Holidays.  I was able to get the tarred roof on and the chimneys completed but, never got a chance to post.  Sorry for leaving many steps out trying to catch up.
 
For the tarred roof I used silk.  I experimented with several adhesives but finally settled on shellac.  One very thin application to penetrate the wood.  Then a second heavier coat to provide a layer to bond to.  I was a little concerned that I would never be able to get the wrinkles out but, after laying the silk on the roof and brushing with shellac, the silk pulled itself to the prepared surface like a magnet.  I was able to apply the entire roof in about 30 minutes.  The shellac dries to an almost glass hard surface and bonds quite well.
 
 
Test piece wood with silk applied.  The silk was originally blue but, somehow changed to dark black the moment the shellac made contact.  I have no idea about the physics of it but it saved me from having to paint the entire surface.

 
Completed tarred roof on the model.

 
Ground glazing installed on the skylights.

 
To make the chimneys as rigid as possible, I used an oak dowel as a core.

 
wooden rings were used as spacers between the top ends of the chimney segments and the dowels.  The lower edge of the segment fit tightly over the segment just below it.

 

 

 

 

 

 
The chimneys required three guy wires each for support.  We had plenty of illustrations but only a couple showed the location of all three.  Information was combined from several illustrations. 
 
The Ouachita

 
Delphine

 
Homer

 
Napoleon

 
Yellow Stone

 
Selma

 
Bands for the guy wires.
[
 
Blackened bands

 
Guy wires in place.

Machined pieces of the pawl rims.

 
Completed pawl rims waiting for their pawls.

OK J,
 
Here are two of my models, US Navy 40 Ft 1900 Standard 40ft Steam Cutter and a US Navy Standard 26 ft Motor Whaleboat. Both models are scratch built to 1:32 scale. The figures are purchased 54mm military figures that I painted.
 
Roger

I disagree that a kit is "just a bundle of wood". A good kit, at least, has had quite a bit of thought put into it by the designer and can save the builder quite a bit of mental energy. Having done both scratch and kit models, I enjoy the mental stimulation of designing and preparing everything myself in a scratchbuild, but also enjoy the relaxation of knowing that someone else has thought through the process for me in a kit. I think that dismissing kits as "just wood" does a disservice to the significant skill, art, and research that goes into kit design.
 
Now, a bad kit like my current build is more trouble than it's really worth. I should have scratchbuilt this one, given the amount of mental and physical work I'm doing to make up for its shortcomings. But not all kits are the same.
 
As for the original question, as I have a very limited disposable income (a few hundred US dollars a year for modelling), I keep things simple. No power tools, basic hand tools, try to re-use anything I can in future work, try to find workarounds for purchases (like making sails out of bond paper left over from Mrs. Cathead's graduate thesis over a decade ago rather than buy fine sailcloth). I would rather my models be enjoyable and cost-effective to build than perfect, and so allow myself a certain amount of leeway in the accuracy/perfection department to achieve the other goals.

I started to receive maritime history books as gifts soon after learning to read and have buying them since I was a young adult. As soon as I bought my first house I set up a small shop in my garage and began to outfit it with tools as projects required. My first table saw was one of the "simple power tools" that used to be advertised in Popular Mechanics for about,$35. Fitted with the right blade it did a great job sawing planking from rough stock. A few years ago I bought a used Delta 10in contractor's saw for $150 from a canoe builder that lives nearby and he threw in a trailer to haul it home. I have a set of Stanley bench chisels that I inherited from my father. They hold a good edge.
 
The point of all this rambling is that I consider a good library and good selection of tools to be the key to good modeling. I find many old, used tools to be much more to my liking than the modern "hi tech" lightweight ones, and some old used hand tools are high quality. As jbshan pointed the Internet is a great place to find reasonably priced used books and quality reprints of old works.
 
With these resources you don't need kits.
 
Roger

Harold Hahn built his models with an 8in table saw, hollow ground Sears blades, a Unimat lathe, and his drawings were hand drawn. Today, using his drawings that include lofted frame shapes, one could build an accurate model without buying an expensive kit. A step up would be to order original drawings from a museum source and do your own lofting. Ships have been lofted by hand for 100's of years. CAD, laser cutting equipment etc is not necessary. Based in the talent shown on this forum used to build model kits, I am amazed modelers shell out big bucks to purchase model kits.
 
Roger

Hello Everyone and thanks for stopping by.
Well I have just a quick update. I Competed building the rudder. I made it from 1/4x1/4" poplar, sanded down to 1/4x1/8" and then glued up. Sorry forgot to take pictures of the in-between. I then shaped it using my belt sander. This weekend I plan on starting on my attempts to make the pintle, and gudgeon for the rudder. This will be my first attempt at making metal parts, wish me luck.

Completed Rudder and Skeg.


Rudder and Skeg Dry Fitted.


 
Until next time!
 
Catch Yall Later,

Harold Hahn built his models with an 8in table saw, hollow ground Sears blades, a Unimat lathe, and his drawings were hand drawn. Today, using his drawings that include lofted frame shapes, one could build an accurate model without buying an expensive kit. A step up would be to order original drawings from a museum source and do your own lofting. Ships have been lofted by hand for 100's of years. CAD, laser cutting equipment etc is not necessary. Based in the talent shown on this forum used to build model kits, I am amazed modelers shell out big bucks to purchase model kits.
 
Roger

I started to receive maritime history books as gifts soon after learning to read and have buying them since I was a young adult. As soon as I bought my first house I set up a small shop in my garage and began to outfit it with tools as projects required. My first table saw was one of the "simple power tools" that used to be advertised in Popular Mechanics for about,$35. Fitted with the right blade it did a great job sawing planking from rough stock. A few years ago I bought a used Delta 10in contractor's saw for $150 from a canoe builder that lives nearby and he threw in a trailer to haul it home. I have a set of Stanley bench chisels that I inherited from my father. They hold a good edge.
 
The point of all this rambling is that I consider a good library and good selection of tools to be the key to good modeling. I find many old, used tools to be much more to my liking than the modern "hi tech" lightweight ones, and some old used hand tools are high quality. As jbshan pointed the Internet is a great place to find reasonably priced used books and quality reprints of old works.
 
With these resources you don't need kits.
 
Roger

Wonderful!
 
Roger

Thank you Bedford.
 
Hello Wintergreen, thanks for visiting my build. Its good to get feedback from a fellow yachtsman.
 
Today was the last day of building for a few days. A 50th wedding anaversary to go to and the brother in law and wife then arriving from Arizona. I think they will find the temperature difference a bit extreme.
 
Returning to the build. In trepidation I decided to take my rather powerful DIY drill to the hull. I needed to mount the portholes - 7 in total - 4 starboard and 3 port, this required the boring of .250 inch dia holes by .250 inch deep.
 
I wanted to get the positioning spot on so I used a card template which I transferred from side to side.
 


 
The holes were drilled slightly undersize and finished off with emery cloth glued to a piece of dowel. The previously made portholes (covered earlier) were glued in place with ca.
 




 
I also finished off mounting the screw. The "A" frame was glued into the hull and the mounting plates pinned in place.
 



 
 
 
 
 

I finished airbrushing the white enamel today and being impatient to see the results I started to peel back the masking. I always find this stage a bit stressful - Will the edges be crisp? and how much bleed will have taken place?
 
Starting with the waterline the masking was removed.
 


 
Generally the result was good with one minor area near the rudder that needed a bit of attention.
 

 
So far so good so I continued to remove the masking from the bulwark area. 
 



 
The bulwark capping rail had proven tricky to mask, particularly at the stern so I wasn't surprised to find paint bleed in this area.
 

 
Fortunately a bit of scraping with a craft knife improved it.
 

 
Generally the result was better than I had feared.
 


 
Meanwhile another coat went on the deck fittings - only one more to go I think.
 


 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 
 

I started to receive maritime history books as gifts soon after learning to read and have buying them since I was a young adult. As soon as I bought my first house I set up a small shop in my garage and began to outfit it with tools as projects required. My first table saw was one of the "simple power tools" that used to be advertised in Popular Mechanics for about,$35. Fitted with the right blade it did a great job sawing planking from rough stock. A few years ago I bought a used Delta 10in contractor's saw for $150 from a canoe builder that lives nearby and he threw in a trailer to haul it home. I have a set of Stanley bench chisels that I inherited from my father. They hold a good edge.
 
The point of all this rambling is that I consider a good library and good selection of tools to be the key to good modeling. I find many old, used tools to be much more to my liking than the modern "hi tech" lightweight ones, and some old used hand tools are high quality. As jbshan pointed the Internet is a great place to find reasonably priced used books and quality reprints of old works.
 
With these resources you don't need kits.
 
Roger

Wonderful!
 
Roger

Harold Hahn built his models with an 8in table saw, hollow ground Sears blades, a Unimat lathe, and his drawings were hand drawn. Today, using his drawings that include lofted frame shapes, one could build an accurate model without buying an expensive kit. A step up would be to order original drawings from a museum source and do your own lofting. Ships have been lofted by hand for 100's of years. CAD, laser cutting equipment etc is not necessary. Based in the talent shown on this forum used to build model kits, I am amazed modelers shell out big bucks to purchase model kits.
 
Roger

The name Mahogany, at least here in the US, is used for several different tropical hardwoods. Some if the stuff is pretty poor, stringy and course grained. I believe that the real stuff is Honduras Mahogany, very difficult to find today. Mahogany salvaged from old furniture is therefore like gold.
 
Roger

Harold Hahn built his models with an 8in table saw, hollow ground Sears blades, a Unimat lathe, and his drawings were hand drawn. Today, using his drawings that include lofted frame shapes, one could build an accurate model without buying an expensive kit. A step up would be to order original drawings from a museum source and do your own lofting. Ships have been lofted by hand for 100's of years. CAD, laser cutting equipment etc is not necessary. Based in the talent shown on this forum used to build model kits, I am amazed modelers shell out big bucks to purchase model kits.
 
Roger

After all that discussion, I never came back and shared how the sails turned out for this longboat. So here are four photos of the completed model; I think it turned out pretty well. Thanks to all who offered advice; hopefully this is useful for future builders who want to try adding sails.

The classic work on early fore and aft rigs, The Fore And Aft Rig in America says that there were two varieties of gaff rigs- a short gaff and a long gaff. The excellent book The Boats of Men-of-War by W. E. May includes a detailed admiralty draught with sail plan of a mid 18th Century Royal Navy longboat and it is a short gaff.
 
I am building a 1: 32 model of this boat of this boat and I intend to rig it in accordance with the drawing. In my opinion, the small gaff sail makes a lot more sense than the long gaff sail shown on the various kit models. With their bluff bows, necessary for providing buoyancy to lift heavy weights, these boats must have difficult to sail off the wind in heavy air. As the boat approached hull speed, it would be pushing a big bow wave and with that big mainsail would develop a strong weather helm. The boat would then "round up" and broach.
 
Modern keel sailboats will knockdown and recover because of their heavy keel but this longboat would flood and capsize. A amaller (short gaff) mainsail than a long gaff one seen on the recent kit models makes more sense to me.
 
Another example of a rigged longboat is the model in the Kregstein Collection. When they got the model it was unrigged, and they rigged it using spars that came with the model. It is a short gaff rig.
 
I think that the mainsail in your drawing should look more like a "shoulder of mutton sail" than the long gaff that you show. The sail should also be loose footed.
 
Roger Pellett

Harold Hahn built his models with an 8in table saw, hollow ground Sears blades, a Unimat lathe, and his drawings were hand drawn. Today, using his drawings that include lofted frame shapes, one could build an accurate model without buying an expensive kit. A step up would be to order original drawings from a museum source and do your own lofting. Ships have been lofted by hand for 100's of years. CAD, laser cutting equipment etc is not necessary. Based in the talent shown on this forum used to build model kits, I am amazed modelers shell out big bucks to purchase model kits.
 
Roger

Harold Hahn built his models with an 8in table saw, hollow ground Sears blades, a Unimat lathe, and his drawings were hand drawn. Today, using his drawings that include lofted frame shapes, one could build an accurate model without buying an expensive kit. A step up would be to order original drawings from a museum source and do your own lofting. Ships have been lofted by hand for 100's of years. CAD, laser cutting equipment etc is not necessary. Based in the talent shown on this forum used to build model kits, I am amazed modelers shell out big bucks to purchase model kits.
 
Roger