Modeler12

Hmmm. How about the way the inmates at one of the jails in Maine make sails?
Wood!!! Sails in Jails!!!!
Several years ago I bought a schooner there that had wooden sails.

They still make them and here are some more 
  
and the web site, in case you are interested.
http://www.maine.gov/corrections/industries/boats/large/index.html

She is finally finished.
It only took four years with major interruptions, to be sure.
 
After some minor repair work, adding the boats and making the mahogany base, I hoisted the flags and let her sails fill with our family room air.
             
 
One final touch will be a small brass plaque with the name and date mounted on a piece of the wood hopefully coming from our USS Constitution sailor friend. It will go inside the case in front of the bow.
 

My full model is just about finished and I am looking into an additional compliment:
a cross section of the USS Constitution.
 
I want to build this from scratch and use as much of my abilities and tools as I can muster and try to do a decent job. However, to do research into details are usually not in my bag. But it turns out that I have to . . .

The midsection has been covered by others (likewise with the aft section by one adventurer (help who?)), but I would like to show how the crew lived, slept, ate and filled gun powder bags. So, I decided on the area around the ‘stove’.
As it turned out this area also shows some guns on the spar deck, part of fore-mast rigging, then more guns on the gun deck, hammocks on the deck below, the ‘sail room’ and ‘gun powder room’ on the orlop deck. But the main feature I like to stress is the hull construction in the forward parts. Hence, the frames, beams, knees and other timbers become part of the story.
 
I am using the book by Marquadt  ‘Anatomy of the Ship’ (AOTS) for the main reference. He shows a lot of great pictures of all phases and equipment used on the USS Constitution and I have learned a lot from his information.
In particular, I chose the section between the stairs going down from the deck and forward to just ahead of the fore-mast. Using the same scale as my full model (1:76), that is about six inches, or 38 feet real. Page 51 shows a nice top-view of this.

 
In addition, I am still using the drawings that came with my earlier kit of the full model; and here is where I ran into some problems (let’s just call them discrepancies)::::::
 
1.      I mentioned earlier on a different post that the deck beams seemed a bit out of line. In fact the book shows supports at different decks that are not at all above beams below. They simply sit on top of deck planking. I ‘corrected’ that with my interpretation.
 
2.      The frames making up the ship’s hull do not align with the gun-port holes like they should be. Yes, page 61 of the book has clear pictures of the frames, but those are incorrect (in my opinion). The locations of the gun-port holes do not correspond to the full model drawings I have been using. What is worse is that they do not correspond to the locations shown on other pages in the same book.
 
Starting with these two dilemmas, I decided to take some liberties with the design and align the deck beams in a vertical plane and make the body frames along the lines of what Harold Hahn (bless his sole) did with his models. He took two ‘frame’ parts and laminated them to give a more rigid part to work with. Then he decided to eliminate every other one to make the interior more visible. I had to make some assumptions about the frame thicknesses and settled on what I show on the drawings below. This is still not ‘correct’ because the gun port openings should be between frames. But no matter how I juggle the frame thicknesses, I cannot come up with a way to do this unless I use frames of different thicknesses. So, here is where I am now.


Mind you, I have not cut any material yet at this stage. I am just learning what to do.

Mike, I love to help you with those short pieces of cedar, but I cannot figure out where you live. Kleppe Norway is way up north. Are you sure you don't have north and south mixed up
What is an American doing in a place like that? Do you mind visitors?

The picture you showed, Ray, is indeed impressive but I don't think it represents a carved piece of wood. It is a drawing and to 'shade' carved wood would be redundant. The following is probably more in line with what we are trying to accomplish here. The 'stop cuts' and deep relief carving are very nicely done, in my opinion.

To come back to your original question, does the vise have to be 'big'?
Since you are working on a table, how about a small vise that can be 'portable' and can serve several functions?
 

 
Here is another picture. A bit messy, but you get the idea.

Although Jeff is no longer in the business of supplying wood for us, I hope he is still here and watching us.
Thanks Jeff (again) for those great boards and pieces. You did well by teaching a younger fellow (not Chuck, of course) and the'kid' is doing a nice job as well as you did.
Your instructions are well taken and saved. I use them without fail (well except about the dust problem, but that is my concern)
If anyone knows who the 'kid' is . . . .

Have a look at this thread. The flags are 'real' and can be folded or crinkled to simulate the wind effects.
 

Although Jeff is no longer in the business of supplying wood for us, I hope he is still here and watching us.
Thanks Jeff (again) for those great boards and pieces. You did well by teaching a younger fellow (not Chuck, of course) and the'kid' is doing a nice job as well as you did.
Your instructions are well taken and saved. I use them without fail (well except about the dust problem, but that is my concern)
If anyone knows who the 'kid' is . . . .

Although Jeff is no longer in the business of supplying wood for us, I hope he is still here and watching us.
Thanks Jeff (again) for those great boards and pieces. You did well by teaching a younger fellow (not Chuck, of course) and the'kid' is doing a nice job as well as you did.
Your instructions are well taken and saved. I use them without fail (well except about the dust problem, but that is my concern)
If anyone knows who the 'kid' is . . . .

Frank, when I got mine, I made it a point to learn as much as I could about how to use it. That is easy to say and a bit hard to explain.

The upshot is that a mill is not like your computer. If you do something wrong with a mill it may cause more than 'headaches' . So be sure to know what you are trying to do before turning on the dials. Yet, once you are sure, don't be afraid and follow your plan. Go for it.
 
Here is an example how I mount a tiny piece in the vise. It is outboard, but firmly in place. I can carefully machine a groove, whereas if I mount it in the center of the vise, I have no room to clamp (or run the bit into the vise).
The groove is .060 inch wide and .020 inch deep.
 
First I establish where X, Y and Z are. Then I move the table to the front of Y and index the Z.

Route and see the final piece below.
   
Oh, I forgot to mention, I used a bit that was 0.060 inch in diameter.
 

My current setup is as shown next. I have the vise accurately mounted and try to keep it that way. I use it with bits that take the collets. For flat parts, that can be mounted on the plywood panel, I use the Jacob’s chuck. It is quite accurate and takes drill bits down to around #75.
The plywood panels are easy to make and I have a couple for different edge machining. 
I also made a mounting bracket so I could attach my old rotary tool (a Monkey Wards left over, that works great). Speeds now are from zero up to 10000 rpm (never measured that, I don't care, it works fine).

 
Finally I want to share a little trick. It is the result of a failure to start with. I broke one of my 0.5 mm drills, but saved the broken piece. Later, when making the sheaves in the riding bits shown below, I drilled the holes through with a new bit, but used the broken one to score the grove that connects the holes. This was done by clamping the riding bits in the mill’s vise and slowly feeding the broken bit (at 5000 rpm) across. The picture is not very clear, but it worked.

 
Are there any other ideas floating out there???
 
 
 
 

I realize that not too many modelers have a milling machine, but for those lucky enough to have one, I would venture to say that it is a very versatile and useful tool for scratch builders as well as those who want a bit more accuracy in cutting material.
I am constantly learning to use mine with new ideas for fixtures and techniques. Perhaps we can share some ideas on this thread.
 
 
A couple years ago there was a thread dealing with this subject and I like to revamp that:
http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/4320-milling-work-and-miniature-jig-making/page-2?hl=+milling%20+machine.
 
Let me show you a few things I have done to and with my machine.
When I first got it, I wanted to learn the basics and made this aluminum slitting fixture. It can be used to make slots or even cut planks. Now I don’t use it too much anymore, because it takes a while to set up and takes away space on the table.
 
 
I have a four inch vise that is very accurate. Using the parallels underneath this piece of pear, I was able to machine this log of gun carriages. After the milling I cut slabs that were only 0.050 inch thick.
 
  
When I decided to make my own gratings, I had to make a decision about square or round holes. After some experimenting I gave up making square holes. Now I find it hard to tell if the grating has square or round holes (when viewed a few inches or more away). My point here is that I placed the grating material on a piece of plywood that was clamped to the table and used the mill’s x-y table movements to accurately drill the holes.

Since then I don’t use the metal clamps that you see in the picture above. I made a number of wooden clamps and blocks that do a better and safer job. 

Here is a set up using those clamps. It was part of my cross section work.

 
More on the next post.

 

Mr Mackie, on his web site, shows numerous pictures of the model as well as a few facts about the sailing days. Too bad he does not give the artist who built this beauty any credit. If I have to, I'll go to the museum to find out who it was. I am sure this person must have built lots of other models.

There is a great model of the five masted Preussen in the San Francisco Maritime Museum and I would like to know who built that. I know there is a sign with the model but I forgot to write the name of this marvelous builder. When I contacted the museum it was too late (Friday evening).
 

It is interesting to see the two sides of this 'coin'.
If you have used the proportional dividers for a long time, I can appreciate that you like them for various reasons.
In my case, I have a pair and seldom use them, but so be it.
When Jud mentioned his liking for the decimal system (rather than fractions, I suppose) I agree. But when he talks about using a slide-rule - - - - I have to grin because those are dinosaurs in my college collection. Slide-rules are as accurate as proportional dividers and even more difficult to use and understand (I know Jud, you add or subtract logarithmic values, etc.).
The upshot is: if you like the tool you have, use it. If you want accuracy, calculate.

There is a great model of the five masted Preussen in the San Francisco Maritime Museum and I would like to know who built that. I know there is a sign with the model but I forgot to write the name of this marvelous builder. When I contacted the museum it was too late (Friday evening).
 

When stepping the masts you don't want to permanently glue them in place. Have the blocks on the keel in place to hold the bottom of the mast(s), then cut the openings in the deck and fit the mast(s) to be sure they are at the right angle(s) and then remove the mast(s) for a later installation. There will be lots of other things to do (such as adding deck furniture, rails, deck planking, etc.) and you don't want the mast(s) to interfere with those. The same applies to the bowsprit.
To align the mast(s) you can use a number of methods described in this forum. Search.

When stepping the masts you don't want to permanently glue them in place. Have the blocks on the keel in place to hold the bottom of the mast(s), then cut the openings in the deck and fit the mast(s) to be sure they are at the right angle(s) and then remove the mast(s) for a later installation. There will be lots of other things to do (such as adding deck furniture, rails, deck planking, etc.) and you don't want the mast(s) to interfere with those. The same applies to the bowsprit.
To align the mast(s) you can use a number of methods described in this forum. Search.

Deck Beams.
The first step I took was to align the deck beams. I used the parts on the spar deck to fix the locations. The hatch covers, for example, have a beam on both sides. AOTS shows the cross beams (carlings) and joists which resulted in drawings for each deck. The one for the berth deck is shown below. The beam thicknesses were scaled from the books drawings, but again there were inconsistencies from page to page, so I am not positive about the results.
 
 
Frames.
For the frame shapes I used the cross sections H and O in the book (page 75) and generated others in between from the profiles shown on page 58.
 
 
This resulted in seven shapes for the eleven frame sets. I will ‘estimate’ the shape of the others which are similar to those for F and H. I copied these to scale on heavy paper and cut out the outside of the profile. These will be glued to the wooden laminates and sawn to size.
I intend to use the technique used by Harold Hahn to cut strips of wood and gluing them such that the grain is in the direction of the thin parts but also so the two pieces have the seams in somewhat different directions. I have done this with other frames as shown in the following thread: http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/2191-hms-pelican-by-modeler12-per-harold-hahn%E2%80%99s-plans/
 
Knees.
Special wooden blocks or knees are used where the deck beams meet the frames. Some of them are at an angle, others vertical. They are there to distribute the stresses imposed by the deck above. On page 60 of the book Marquardt shows long rows of the slanted knees but he fails to include the vertical (or hanging) knees. A picture of the gun deck is a bit clearer. Another picture of the berth deck shows very heavy curved knees to support the big guns on the deck above.
 

I made drawings for each of those pieces, so I can cut them out when the time comes. Now it is time to put a list of materials together and order some wood.

Meanwhile I appreciate comments and suggestions about my plans thus far. I could really use pictures of the orlop deck and some of the details there.

One more addition. A splitter.
 
For my .035 inch thick blade, I used a piece of copper wire at .032 inch thickness. Then I drilled two #66 holes in the zero clearance insert as shown below. I had to make minor adjustments with a pair of pliers and now I am ready to add a couple drops of epoxy underneath to keep the wire in place. 
The wire does not wrap around the top of the blade, but even so it worked well.
The hold-down ball bearing will be moved forward when in use, but for the picture I had it sitting well behind the splitter.

Likewise Tom. I also 'used to sail'.
When my wife and I were dating (more than 50 years ago) I had a Junior Folkboat in the SF Bay. We had a lot of fun and some great adventures with it, but my wife did not like to be in charge of the jib. So, we finally got rid of it. Since then I have had a couple small boats and crewed for friends. The avatar you see is when four of us chartered a boat in Phuket, Thailand, and cruised the Adaman Sea for ten days. I was the cook and bottle washer aboard, but did handle the boat from time to time.

Ok, let me explain. Let me do this with an example, the hull planking of my cross section. 
 
If the planks need to be tapered because the space or opening as shown in the picture below changes along the hull lines, it is necessary to use the 'proportional method'. In this case, you measure the two dimensions of the opening and they are 4.85 and 4.00 inch respectively. Let's say the planks you have are 0.121 inch wide. What should the plank width measure at the other end? Obviously smaller if you put the wide end to the left in the picture. 
 
The proportional ratio is 4.00 divided by 4.82. Now multiply that ratio by the 0.121 and you get 0.100 inches, the width of the narrow end.
Now you could have done this with the mechanical divider, but the accuracy becomes questionable because of the big difference in the size of the opening and plank width.
   

Here is another way to use a clamp or hemostats to hold the block while attaching a line around it. The video is primarily intended to show what seizings are all about but it also shows how I hold the block. I have five of these clamps (some with a curved end) and have adjusted the gap by carefully bending one of the handles using a vise. That way I can clamp parts of various thicknesses. Shop around and you can find them at lots of different places for a couple dollars each.
 

Looks like great carving tools.
I also would like the email address and was wondering how payments and shipping are handled.
In particular, I like to see more details of the shape of each tool and if I could order some individually rather than a whole set. 
For 23 of those at $360 total I assume a price of $18 each would not be unreasonable.