ronald305

thanks Andre 
      no one from the Model space community hasn't responded to my request for help except Alan but all he told me was his victory had 8 planks in the stern area that is why I came here to this site 
                               Ronald 

thanks Andre 
      no one from the Model space community hasn't responded to my request for help except Alan but all he told me was his victory had 8 planks in the stern area that is why I came here to this site 
                               Ronald 

I  decided to remove 4 of the stern planks on both sides and  will remove  the cardboard shims as well and will start over 
                          Ronald 

Hello there again 
   as you know already from the title I am working on the Model space Victory and have a new problem now when I started planking at the stern  I notice the planking  is not coming out even with the other side as you see from the photos I have no problem removing a plank or two if it comes to that, since   I only added one plank on the left side so far and I even measured the distance from the bend to the edge of the stern which is 40mm from plank # 5, when I add  plank #5  to the right side it should be the same distance right, What should I should do to make them  even before I continue with the rest, I would appreciate any input from anyone who has done the model space Victory  thank you 
                       Ronald 
   

ok thanks Chris 
  each day I learn something new 
                   Ronald 

thanks 
     I am going to copper the hull  may I ask what are planking battens 
                          Ronald 

I explained it the best way I know how but I added photos so everyone can chime in if they wish 
                     Ronald 

here is two photos of the bow where I left off same side different shot if you think it would help 
                          R

Hello there 
     since no one was interested in buying my Latina Cutty Sark would anyone be interested in buying any of my 3 
    model ship kits brand new only 2 was opened for inspection the 3rd has not been opened pictures will come later 
   1) 1/72 scale HMS Victory by Caldercraft asking $6.00 (never opened) 
   2) 1/90 scale Mamoli Royal Louis  was opened for inspection but the kit brand new E-bay has it going the price of a caldercraft Victory I guess because it not in production  but my asking price is $400
   3)  1/90 scale Ocre Santini Trinidad  asking $400 will accept offer but not lower then 360 
   if anyone is interested in either one of these kits please PM me so I may send  you my e-mail address also I only use PAYPAL for all transactions and will pay the shipping for any of the kits (will not use the USPS) FedEx mostly 
 

I understand  and hope  so to  I brought  them thinking I would be able to build them but 
 the Victory from model space is more then enough  for me 

Hello there 
     since no one was interested in buying my Latina Cutty Sark would anyone be interested in buying any of my 3 
    model ship kits brand new only 2 was opened for inspection the 3rd has not been opened pictures will come later 
   1) 1/72 scale HMS Victory by Caldercraft asking $6.00 (never opened) 
   2) 1/90 scale Mamoli Royal Louis  was opened for inspection but the kit brand new E-bay has it going the price of a caldercraft Victory I guess because it not in production  but my asking price is $400
   3)  1/90 scale Ocre Santini Trinidad  asking $400 will accept offer but not lower then 360 
   if anyone is interested in either one of these kits please PM me so I may send  you my e-mail address also I only use PAYPAL for all transactions and will pay the shipping for any of the kits (will not use the USPS) FedEx mostly 
 

HI Gil
   I know the Victory has been finished for some time but would like know how did you figure out the height for the 
  dowels for making the jig in order to hold the victory up side down for planking and plating  the bottom I want to 
 do that for the Victory I'm doing do they have to be a little bit longer so the ship sits on the support base like in the photos 
                               Ronald 

Hello there 
     I was wondering if anyone is working on the model space 1/84 scale Victory if so I would like to know if is critical that the 
 thin brass plate that is .010 thick which come in the carronade kit has to be .010 thick can it be .016" instead reason I'm asking 
 is I messed the tiny brass plate up trying to mark  drill and bend the part  and do want to buy a whole new kit for just for one part and suggestions would  be appreciated thank you 
                                     Ronald 

thanks David 
    Ronald 

Ronald,
 
Ongoing research hasn’t identified the colours of gun carriages and wheels, but what we know is that the black hull is actually a deep slate grey (Victory’s new colours), so grey on the wheels wouldn’t be wrong, the raw paints were often mixed with other paints and oils so it is unlikely any of the colours were a deep black or deep yellow.
 
Gary

Ronald,
 
I would go with your personal choice for aesthetic or historical reasons. The ex-curator of HMS Victory Peter Goodwin examined the carpenters records preceding the Battle of Trafalgar and he identified that there was no red paint used, the colours throughout the ship were black, yellow, white, verdigris and a very small amount of Prussian Blue, all of which would usually be cut with linseed oil. This was published in a 2013 article of The Mariner’s Mirror (journal of the Society for Nautical Reearch).
 
Chances are the carriages were yellow (ochre) with black wheels.
 
Gary

Wonderful photos Joe

Every photo I have from onboard Victory shows natural wood, though certainly varnished to prevent rot.
 
It really makes sense when you think about it. It had to move and you probably didn't want paint preventing it from turning properly with paint getting in the joint with the axle. 

No argument on that one!

looking at photos I would have sworn they were bare wood.
see below

I guess because it was mixed by hand, other than by weight / volume there would be little consistency between successive coats, then all Ochers themselves vary immensely from light to dark, again no batch or quality control in those days 😮 , just the Mk1 eyeball. Then I suppose it depends where they sampled the ‘Salmon Pink’ from, I’m guessing an internal surface (Goodwin says some of the internal upper deck was yellow) as all the external planking will surely have been replaced long ago given all those refits and restorations, and if it was an internal surface was the yellow paint diluted as much as the outside? Too many variables, I guess we have to defer to the experts.
 
Gary

With all these colours logged and a picture painted during the time how come she is now painted in that horrible salmon pink and not yellow   just wondering 
Martyn

Going back to Goodwin's notes these are the paints supplied to Victory:
 
" The overall analysis of paint related issues recorded in the carpenter’s accounts in the Victory in 1805 conclude the following points: 
 
1.    Lime and glue were employed for whitewashing the ship internally along the ship’s sides along the middle and lower gundecks and equally extensively throughout the orlop and within the hold.
2.    Black varnish was applied for yards, tops, cross-trees and quite probably on the topsail and sheet bitts of each mast. 
3.    Linseed oil was mixed with the paint pigments.
4.    Tar was applied for blacking the wales, especially at the ‘bends’, such as the main wale near the ship’s water line.
5.    Black oakum was equally applied. 
 
The document is exceedingly thorough in accounting for all paint colours or pigments used. In this host of information there is a remarkable absence of reference to the red ochre paint that is supposedly synonymous with warships of the period. Red paint applied to the inner faces and edges of gun port lids, gun carriages, gun port sills, lintels and side facings is generally thought to be a predominant (and perhaps iconic) paint feature on the Admiralty Board ship models. Red is also evident in many paintings by recognized marine artists, for example, Brooking, Cleveley, Dodd, Loutherbourg, Luny and Pocock, to name but a few. 
 
These are the relevant stores supplied to Victory at Portsmouth on 31 August 1805: 
 
1.    White – 120 lb
2.    Yellow – 34 lb
3.    Black Varnish – 66 gallons
4.    Glue – 12 lb
5.    Lime – 8 bushels
6.    Whitewash brushes – 6 
 
Then on 2 September 1805: 
 
1.    Yellow – 350 lb
2.    Black – 150 lb
3.    White – 150 lb
4.    Oil. – 47 gallons
5.    White – 66 lb
6.    Black – 13 lb
7.    Yellow – 78 lb
8.    Verdigris (sic) – 5 lb
9.    Prussian Blue – 1 lb 
 
Then on 6 September 1805: 
 
1.    White – 86 lb
2.    Yellow – 234 lb
3.    Oil. – 2 1/2 gallons
4.    Black Varnish – 66 gallons. lb”
 
It may well be that they used the black varnish, which depending on dilution could be greyish and semi translucent, but who knows those gun carriage wheels have been replaced long since!
 
Just to correct my note on the red paint I mentioned above Goodwin also says "No evidence has come to light indicating when the Victory changed her original red-painted inboard works to yellow ochre, but it is considered highly likely that she had red inboard works when she was the flagship of Admiral Sir John Jervis at the battle of St Vincent on 14 February 1797. Although the Victory could have adopted whitewash or yellow ochre at any time between early 1803 and 1805, the change most likely occurred when Thomas Hardy superseded Samuel Sutton".  Certainly Turner's paintings does not show red, just a dark yellow ocher, and Turner went on board the Victory in December 1805 and January 1806 and would have witnessed her colour scheme first hand.
 
Gary

black wheels Gary I am not doubting you but the photos on the real Victory show a grays color  wheels I can go with black if it is correct aesthetically
                           Ronald 
 

yes  I saw the post and it is a good idea if I can find that bit I will try it, but I also drill a few small holes under the main dimensions as well thank you 
                           Ronald