Stockholm tar
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Hi Jeff, Good work. Yes, the figurehead is somewhat overheavy and, if truth be told, not exactly correct! I had thoughts of replacing it, which I may do. (I believe the Caldercraft one is 1/72 which is I think close enough in scale.) You're doing a good job on the kit one though.
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A little more to inform, or perhaps confuse, you regarding the new colour scheme. This in depth piece is from the Victory's website and Andrew Baines, her curator and leader of the project: http://www.hms-victory.com/restoration-log/hms-victory-repainted-battle-trafalgar-colours Some food for thought here, I think, especially where he says that the new colour could be seen differently in changing light. Is this, perhaps, what has confused artists in the past? Interesting too regarding the new font for the name on the stern. Mark, I would imagine they are going to include the galleries, when they get to them. Probably that's a bit more tricky!
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Well, I guess it will take some getting used too, after we've known Victory previously with different shades of yellow and yellow ochre, but I imagine we'll get used to it. I'm actually getting to like it! There's always that question in the back of the mind though – how are they certain it's correct? Shame we don't have a time machine. Hmmm. I now have new ideas for my Victory bow section!
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Jeff, Great work on the bowsprit. A few tips for me there! Re. the lashing on the bowsprit. I would have thought it lashed, but don't know for certain. One thing you might do is send an e-mail to the Victory website, or the Royal Naval Museum, I bet they would know.
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Jan, Dafi, I think gun carriage trucks (wheels) were in two halves for strength. When fitted together the grain in one half was opposed to the other, making it stronger. This was actually from a French description so, as with other fittings, different navies were of the same mind. Dafi, Your gun deck diorama is tremendous and a great learning tool.
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Hi Eamonn, Yes, I'm sure you're right. As you know, it's not something you particularly notice when on board – although had I known 27 years ago what I would be doing now... Nils, Thanks, that'll be useful.
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Hi Nils, Good to hear from you. Yes, its nice to be back on SL again, although no pics just yet. Would you have you an idea about the deck camber?
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I'm afraid I've been rather behind with this, due to quite a bit of work at the cottage, but have more time now so I am getting back to it. At the moment I am beginning to draw out the frames and have to work out the angle of curvature for the deck camber. This would obviously be for an early 20th century vessel, SL is 1914, but I would imagine it isn't too different from the 19th century. I imagine the camber would also be consistent along the length of the vessel, or is that not so?
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Jeff, That's absolutely brilliant work on the stove. It almost looks as though it's ready to fire up!
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Hi Jeff, You're doing very well on your bow section, and you have thought of some of the ideas that I have in mind – re, the fire hearth. Incidentally there are plenty of photos of Victory's Brodie stove on line – nothing of course like the poor effort they provide in the kit! One interesting feature is the copper condenser on its top, used I believe to suppy water to the officers and those in the sick bay. I'm going to try and replicate it. Not sure about the guns though. You've done a good job on what is provided, but I might change mine. Waiting for the next update.
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Seaman from the Horst Wessel.
Stockholm tar replied to Stockholm tar's topic in Nautical/Naval History
Bob, I think he's pleased that the US have her now – and still used as a training ship. -
Coincidental with the photograph posted recently in the Amazing Photographs thread, comes this interesting story from an old seaman who sailed on the Horst Wessel (now the Eagle): http://www.bbc.com/news/magazine-33543706
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Jeff, You're doing a great job there, and I like the way you worked the plates. Good point about the plate width too, but a good solution I think. I'll have to remember that, when I eventually get back to mine! Nice to get the photos in order of course, but don't worry about it too much, as I think we can follow.
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Hi Jonny, That's looking very impressive! How about the mooring lines? Bow line, stern line and a couple of springs should do it. Perhaps also a few bollards or rings on the quay to fasten them to.
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Michael, As, Ulises says, the wooden cross piece – known as a stock – was in two halves and the bands were to hold it together. I would think that the earlier 'bands' were of rope, much like the wooldings on the lower masts, and made of iron at a later date. I believe in reality rope bindings were simply fastened with several nails in line, rather than using a knot which wouldn't be very secure. They were probably replaced periodically. Regarding your model, I would say that black paper is preferable, as metal is likely to be over scale. There is also the problem of bending it around the differing angles of the stock, especially the lower tapered side. I imagine paper to be rather easier.
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Hi Jeff, Good to have you back! Sorry to hear of your personal and computer problems. I agree with you about the bands, a nice contrast with the black. Looking forward to seeing more as you progress.
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How to make a flag? (edited by admin)
Stockholm tar replied to michael101's topic in Masting, rigging and sails
Michael, The Bounty, being an English ship, would have followed English flag practice. Ensigns and jacks had a length of line, the tackline, sewn into the side nearest the staff or halliards. The upper end, at the hoist, would have formed an eye directly above the flag, through which a small rounded length of wood, the toggle, was fitted at mid point. This was then threaded through an eyesplice on one end of the halliard, which hoisted the flag. The other end of the tackline extended below the bottom of the flag about 12" or so, and also had an eyeslice in its end. The other end of the halliard was then fastened to it, usually with a sheet bend. With the flag so bent on, it formed a continuous loop with the halliard and could then be hoisted. This method of fastening meant that flags could be bent on or removed quickly, which was important especially with signal flags. Robin, Both ways of hoisting the ensign and jack are correct. The ensign and jack staffs was normally used in harbour. The ensign was usually hoisted from the peak of the gaff at sea, since the staff would get in the way of the operation of the mizzen boom. Similarly with the jack, where the staff would interfere with the heasails. Thus today, the jack is traditionally only hoisted when the ship is in harbour or at anchor. -
Jonny, Very nice – you managed to get a really good finish on that table top! Must have taken hours. Oh, the model, right. That's good too and the guns look top notch. Very good idea to hold off on the Sherbourne until you're on an 'even keel' too, or you might get a bit – !
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Hi Jonny, Yes, I've seen them too, but the stowage never looked that convincing. I found that trying to put them down the centre, either side of the hatch, ended up with them getting in the way of other things, the cannonball racks, the bitts, etc. I didn't think they looked that good on the bulwarks either, hence I ditched them. It will be interesting to see what you come up with! I have never read anywhere how the sweeps were actually stowed. There must be an something somewhere, but I suppose 'different ships, different long splices,' as the saying goes. Re. the boat. So far as I remember, I made two chocks from odd bits of wood, although I don't exactly remember the size – I think they were somewhere in the order of 4mm across, and I think came to the turn of the bilge in length. I know I made sure they fitted the shape of the underneath of the boat where they were to sit, the bow chock naturally being a different shape to the one at the stern. Yes, they fitted across the main hatch.
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Jonny, Good luck with fitting the sweeps. I tried making some, but couldn't fit them in anywhere so left them off. I reckoned they wouldn't have had much use in the windy Channel!
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Hi guys, Not an update on the model unfortunately, but about it! I'm afraid work has come to a halt recently, as you may have noticed, due to me being away on my 'hols' (twice) and other things getting in the way . Anyway this is to say that work on Sherbourne will continue to be delayed again, by several months, as we have just moved out for the summer to our cottage (yesterday) – for even more 'hols' . I'm a glutton for punishment! However all is not lost, as I am sure many of you know that I am building a half model of the Statsraad Lehmkul out here, begun last year. I hope to work on her in between the other jobs that come with a 'holiday', such as lawn mowing, painting, cleaning out guttering, etc . I am up to drawing out the frames from the plans, and transferring them to paper templates to glue to the birch ply board, which miraculously has survived the winter, being layed flat and weighted down with books! So, watch this space... or rather the space in my SL log.
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Hi Jonny, It never rains but it pours, does it? Hope everything goes ok with the M-in-L's birthday – mine celebrated her 90th not long ago and, luckily, I get on with her very well! Anyway, back to the model. Pleased you managed to resite the 'roller' without too much damage. I think you're glad you did. Re the pumps, good call on that. I replaced mine too and made up two new bases, octagonal as you say. I used the original tops and handles, but replaced the plunger rods (actually with two eye brass bolts which looked about right). I also angled them slightly, inwards towards the keel where the water would collect. I send a photo (sorry it's a bit blurry):
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Hi Johnny, I would actually go with option 1, as the jeer bits will be much too close to the mast, as shown in your last photo. I don't know the rake angle, but I placed my 'roller' up against the fore end of the hatch, which leaves a gap of around 6mm. Not so much fun for the wife, I know, but...
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Jonny, To answer you earlier question, the wales basically stiffened the structure of the ship against 'hogging' and 'sagging' (you can look those terms up), and most ships of the period had them irrespective of the planking. Regarding the planking above the wale, I think this was usually carvel at this period, although I'm not certain. I did it this way on my Sherbourne and it makes a nice change to the planking below the wale. You seem to be getting on well!
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... but, strangely, you never find it! Perhaps it should stay that way... Lovely place, Malta, isn't it? We were there a few years ago, and saw the same ceremony. Btw, have you seen the clip on Utube of the Victory firing a broadside – electronically of course. I certainly wouldn't want to have been on the receiving end of that! Anyway, your Sherbourne's looking very good and a very nice job indeed with the treenailing.
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