CUTTY SARK by keelhauled - Mantua - kit bashed - First wooden ship build

[GLakie]

I'm not really sure if those were served in real life or not Marc. It seems like sails that were used a lot, underwent constant maintenance, so whether or not the bolt-ropes were served would be a question for a more knowledgeable person than I. If I had to guess, I'd say not, because I can't recall ever seeing any running rigging that was served. 

[keelhauled]

Doing research on the bolt ropes.  It's sounding like earrings were wormed, served, and had leather stiched, while the bottoms had the bolts, wormed and served around a ring that sort of looks like Mickey Mouse's head.  Still looking into it.

In the mean time, I've been playing with the sewing machine and serving machine.

 

some examples of different stitching lengths widths and hand sewing mixed with machine

 

 

Edited October 12, 2015 by keelhauled

[NenadM]

Looking good! Please, keep on playing

 

Is that final color of sewing at the edges of sail? Maybe same as sails? And maybe thiner and semi transparent material for sails (satin, silk)

 

Just maybe

 

Maybe I think to much.

Edited October 12, 2015 by Nenad

[keelhauled]

After I had completed coppering the hull, I mounted it to two bronze pedestals.  I can't seem to find photos. 

Over the years, the ends and part of the top changed color.  I thought that maybe the walnut had been dry before I stained and coated it with acrylic.  I stripped the acrylic off and soaked the walnut base in lemon oil then tung oil regularly over months  All surfaces looked the same. I then stained the surface then coated it in acrylic  All surfaces looked the same. Two years passed and then it occurred again.  

 

Here is what I'm talking about

 

 

I posted the issue I was having.  The reply was that sometime woods have issues in the transverse or ends of the boards.  So I stained over the acrylic on the ends, let it dry and coated it with acrylic after 2 year it was still fine.  I read that some where that this technique is used for woods that don't stain evenly.

 

While I was waiting the last two year period, the ship was in a construction cradle and I had time to think over a concern that I had struggled with for several years.  I was always concerned about the stability of the ship using only the two pedestals.  I was worried about the straightness of her keel and of the ship model rolling side to side and breaking her mount, yards, masts, god knows what.  The model had always felt solid in the pedestals and had been in that mount for over five years without issue.  Still I had always been concerned, taken measurements of the keel to the base, never seen any movement.  The hull is very heavy due to all of the filler block and double planking.

 

Then I came across two posts where the models had rolled off the pedestals, With one the damage was fairly severe to the hull.  Both had serious damage.  That was enough for me.  I really liked the pedestals, but wasn't going to risk my model over it.  I saw several examples, new and hundreds of years old, where rods were used at mid-ship to help support the ship and keep it from rolling.  Then I saw an admiralty model where a cradle was used at mid-ship with the pedestals.

I really like the look, so I made my own.

 

I used Brazilian Cherry.  Beautiful, but hard, wood.  I learned that I'm not good manually using a jewer's saw to cut the wood.  After 5 hours to cut the top out and sand it down.  I gave up on the manual saw and ordered the proxxon saw. I mounted the wood jewler's saw blade and the other three cuts took me about 15-20 minutes each!  I really like this saw.

 

 

 

 

Anyway, here's the results.  The cradle is contoured to the haul and just supports the ship while, the pedestals have large screws that are about three inches into her and holds her down.  The cradle will not let her yaw/rotate or roll.  She is locked securely in place.  The cradle also is attached to the base by pins, so It can't move either.  The base has a set of T-nuts on the bottom to secure the base down to a table  or the base of a case using 1/4 inch bolts from underneath.  She should be secure.........I hope.

 

 

 

 

Marc

[keelhauled]

Hi Nenad,

 

Most of the cloth is just for playing.  It was scraps.  The final sails have very nice cloth that is translucent enough that you can see the thickness differences of the hems and reef line when the sun shines behind.  Very much like a real sails.  They are a very thin cotton.

 

In most of the photos that I've seen and historic sails that I've seen in museums,  the bolt rope and the lines that connect it to the sails are tan, while the sail stitching seems to be the same color or close too it as the sails.  Still I may play with lighter colors.

 

thanks

Marc

[hof00]

Hi Marc,

Nice work on the mounting!!

I used a couple of Brass Pedestals with the Keel End shaped to contour to the Hull.

Screws through the plinth, pedestals and about 25mm through the Keel.

 

Haven't read about models rolling off their bases!!

 

God forbid that this happens to mine!!

 

It's been through a few earthquakes a couple of 6+ ones and a 5.8 last night so I must have done something right.

 

Cheers....HOF.

[keelhauled]

Hi HOF, 

 

sounds like you don't have anything to worry about.  My hull is really heavy.  I used balsa fillers and completely filled her below the waterline and she is about an inch thick between the waterline and the lower deck

 

 

Edited October 13, 2015 by keelhauled

[hof00]

Hi Marc,

I have everything to worry about!!

 

New Zealand is and are Shaky Isles!!

You can hear things in the Cutty Cabinet, Glass panels vibrating before you feel it....

 

Yee-Ha!!

 

My other models/construction/cabinets/Etc, I always keep in mind the potential "Threat."

(Earthquake Putty, Etc.)

Construction Benches secure Models and Plinths with "Dogs."

 

Good Fun.

 

Cheers....HOF.

[NenadM]

Interesting method, so I watch very closely to get some idea for my CS, considering that I am close to that stage, and must resolve Her final standing.

My two cents.

 

When you intend to make model with sails, things get more complicated. Sails are famous dust collectors, and we do not want to damage Her cleaning dust from sails / or not ? /

Second problem - Sails react to any kind of wind, including sneezing, coughing, even draft and other kinds of home wind ( from vacuum cleaner), particulary when you open windows to change air in room. They also collect cigarette smoke, and change color, which you can not clean in any way.

Third - Reacting of sails and their even minor moving,  transpose little forces to yards, ropes etc etc, and that do not seems to be healthy for your model during couple of years.

That leads to covering issue ( e.g glass box) and then new actor runs on stage - wooden floor of Her glass prison, and question arises about matching your stand with that floor pedestal. If you make Her stand narrow, it is great posibity that yards overlap width of stand, and having in mind that glass box has to be wider than yards, it wont be good not to have wooden floor under glass box. Somebody can get bright  idea to move glass box counting that model will move also, but this just wouldn`t happened if you do not have box floor, and if model do not move because it is not attached to floor, here is crash and damage. Also, as I remember well, you are planing to make, mount and spread studding sails, and then you will have 3-4 times wider Her profile than your present standing. So, I think you have to rethink this another point of view

I am talking about whole Her look under glass, including all standing parts, including standing fixing to floor

Hope you understand my poor English

A lot to think about. Better now than late

Keep on playing

Edited October 13, 2015 by Nenad

[keelhauled]

Hi guys,

 

I've been working on the bolt ropes... and working...and working...

much labor not much to show.  I'll take some photos this weekend.  I've figured out a method to serve the cringles without driving myself crazy.  

 

I've also been on the road almost half the time.  So, not as much work on the Cutty as I would have liked. However I have gotten more info on the sails and bolt ropes.  

 

I posted the following in another forum on this site where I was asking about the Cutty's sails, but I wanted to share it here as well.  

 

I was traveling in Sydney in October and was able to talk with two sailing masters about bolt ropes, cringles, and serving.

 

I was able to speak to the master of the HMB Endeavor.  I noticed that some of the cringles on the stay sails aboard the HMB Endeavor were wormed and served while others weren't, while still others were wormed, served, and leathered.  Further these were analogous cringles (for example tack cringle on one stay sail vs. tack cringle on another).  So I asked the master why they were different.  She said that it depended upon whether they had an eye (a detail I didn't notice) or how much they would they were used or chance of being chaffed.  She said if the cringle would experience a great deal of wear and abrasion, then a metal eye was used and the bolt rope was wrapped abound the eye and seized without serving.  She said that no serving of the line was needed if the metal eye was used since the eye took all the wear. If the cringle was expected to have less wear, but still substantial then the cringle was served and leathered. If the line had even less wear then it was just served.

 

I was able to also talk with the sailing master of a restored ship that was in Sydney harbor for a few days.  I took the name, but I can't find it right now.  It turned out that he also loved the Cutty Sark and was very knowledgeable about sailing ships of the late 1800's.  He told me essentially the same info that the HMB Endeavor's Master had provided about the cringles.  He added that the earrings of the square sails were often served even if they did have a metal ring since the sails were in contact with the yard arms.  Concerning the bolt ropes, he said that he had also come across historic accounts of the Cutty as well as other ships where the information did not match between sources.  He said that it was because the details of how the sails were set up, such as serving, metal eyes, etc.were up to the Master.  Also the Master may change some of that set up at sea depending on how the sails were wearing.  So if you went aboard the same ship during different times with the same master or a different master, those sail details and even the size of the sails might be different.  He said that he wouldn't sweat those details on a model, any combination of serving, eyes, etc would be acceptable.  I told him of the HMB Edveavor's stay sails not all being set up the same.  He said that it was a perfect example of what he was talking about and showed me examples of the same inconsistencies on his ship.  On his ship the top sails had their lower bolt rope - the foot rope- served.  He said it was because they rub against the stays.  I told him that I have accounts of the Cutty with and without it's foot ropes served.  He said that it probably depended upon which sails and when the observations were made.  If the observations were from the early 20th century when she was a training vessel or when she was being used as the Frederica it was probably because of the same issue as his ship and they wanted to make the sails last longer without having to replace the foot rope (bolt rope) of those sails.  However, she probably didn't have the foot rope served when she was in the tea and wool trade trying to break records.  He said that the bolt rope adds weight to the sail and doesn't allow it to have as rounded a belly for the square sails, so the master would have sucked up having to repair the sails more often for the gain in speed.  He also said it wouldn't have been two unusual to have 2 or 3 suits of sails, light weather sails, a duplicate or heavier set and a foul weather set.  He also showed me where the standing rigging was served to prevent chaffing of the standing rigging from the running rigging or other standing rigging.

 

We were talking about working on the yards.  He said that when he was kid he almost never used the foot ropes that hang down from the yards.  He said that they used to walk out on the top of the yards and then hop down and swing over to the foot ropes when they got to the end of the yard.  He said that you can't do that anymore due to safety concerns and everyone is harnessed onto the yards.  He said that they also used to go between the mast by walking along the stays.  He said that there were usually enough lines that you could grab one to another as you walked across.  

 

I also asked him the royal and sky masts in old paintings and models.  They don't usually have Jacobs ladders or rat lines.   He said that they weren't needed - any sailor could get up those masts just by shinnying up the mast, they could also just go up a shroud.  He said that many professional sailors can still go up that way.  A crew was working on the ship and when they came down, the master told one to go up the back stay to the top for me.  The guy went over to the rail and grabbed the stay (I noticed he didn't have a harness on, but I didn't say anything).  He went up hand-over-hand very quickly to the top and then slid back down the stay.  He also went up the fore castle without using the ladder for me.  I had a question about how hard it was to get up when you're at sea and the steps are stowed away as they were on the Cutty.  He just stepped on the Windlass and grabbed what I think was a jib sheet and when right up onto the deck, then just swung/stepped down.  He was actually much, much, faster getting up and down to the fore castle this way than I was using the steps. Finally the same sailor went back to work going up the ratlines and over the outside to the top without slowing when he hit the futtock shrouds.  The only thing that slightly slowed him down was transferring his safety line and that didn't slow him much.

 

 

When I have seen videos of crews, mainly volunteer crews work a tall ship it was much different than watching this professional sailor.   

 

It is always amazing how helpful and friendly sailors are when you show an interest in their work and have some knowledge about the ship and its working.  These guys were great at filling in some of the gaps!

 

So in the end, it seems like I can detail the sails almost however I like and not be out of line with reality. 

 

 

Marc

[GLakie]

Interesting stuff Marc. Never would have guessed some bolt-ropes were served and others not, but it does make sense. 

[NenadM]

What a story, Marc!

[keelhauled]

So,

I continue to work on sails.  I've sewn on all of the bolt ropes for the close to 30 sails.  Also, I decided to serve the earrings and cringles for all of the stay sails and jibs - and have finished that work.

 

some examples of the serving

 

 

I completed the royals and sky sail with all of the details and then bent and furled them.

, 

 

A detail of the earring

 

from the port

 

Currently, I'm tyring to decide whether I bent them properly.  I've seen them bent two different ways and tried both methods

 

I haven't posted lately because quite frankly you can't tell that I've done any work after 40 hours of sewing.  I just keep sewing the same parts sail after sail.  I think that this it the more efficient way, but you don't have much to look at.  One day all of the sails will amazingly appear ready for bending.

 

I still have all of the earrings to finish.  I'm currently working on these areas:  the fastening of the yard through the eyes.  I also have the rings at the feet - the bolt ropes loop through and must be lashed/served and the yard run through the corner of the sail and ring.

 

-marc

Edited January 18, 2016 by keelhauled

[GLakie]

You're doing amazing work Marc. It almost looks like it's more work furling the sails, than it would be to leave them unfurled, and rigging from there. 

[samson]

Hi   Marc 

YOUR SAILS LOOKS SUPER GOOD LIKE THE REST OF YOUR FINE MODEL.

[keelhauled]

Thanks George and Sampson!

George, you are right about the work for the furled sails.  For me, it adds a good hour or so onto the job for each sail.  Those sails take so much time, it amazes me.  I think that when its done, I'll have easily two to three times the amount of time that it took to build the yards and masts in the sails.

Marc

[GLakie]

Yeah, but all that extra work will be worth it in the end result, and I can't wait to see it. 

[keelhauled]

I posted a question about the furled sails: http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/12588-need-opinions-on-furled-sails/

 

It sounds like the consensus is that there is too much bulk.  Right now they are only 50% of the length.  I'll cut another 25% out.  I'm not going to start from scratch.  I'm going to just literally cut the bottom half off and furl the upper half and stick the corners out the top.  If i really screw this up, I already have a full set of full length that are almost completely finished  for these yards.

 

My plan was to only have the royals and the sky furled with the main and fore courses pulled up in their gear.  The rest of the sails set (excluding stunsuls which I wasn't going to include).

 

Thanks for the feedback guys.  I really appreciate it.

 

I've learned that it's much easier just to set the sails then it is to furl them.  Just in case anyone thinks that they will be saving work by furling their sails!

Edited January 19, 2016 by keelhauled

[keelhauled]

I've been traveling, but I've been building!  I'll post all the updates soon!

Marc

 

[tasmanian]

the furled sails must be 30/100 of the regular size .i read that 40 years ago  so i could be wrong !

[popeye the sailor]

looking forward in seeing your progress Marc  

[keelhauled]

Tasmanian, When I reworked the furled sails they were about 25 percent of the original size, which is slightly less than the size you remembered seeing.  They may still be too bulky, but they are good enough.  thanks for the info!

 

Popeye, thanks for the encouragement.  I'll try to get some post done this weekend.

Edited July 13, 2016 by keelhauled

[hof00]

Ditto "Popeye."

Looking forward to seeing your progress Chap!!

 

Cheers....HOF.

[keelhauled]

Hi everyone.

 

Sorry I haven't posted with updates in quite a long time.  I've been traveling internationally pretty heavy since January - about one to three weeks a month.  At least half of my weekends were taken up with this as well.  But.......I have made progress on the model.

 

So some updates.  

 

I've been working hard on the sails for what seems like years.  All of the sails have their bolt ropes, earrings, foots, and reef lines.  All of the corners of the bolt ropes were served before attaching. All of the staysails except the jibs need their hanks.  All of the courses, top sails, t'gallent, and royal and sky sails have been bent to their yards.  So today, I realized I didn't take photos of any of this. I'll take some photos of the sails as they are and post soon.  Until then, here is my sewing machine.  Apparently I had the mind to take a photo of this and not the progress on the sails.  You can see my sail cloth and sails behind the machine.  (Edit - I  just realized that I didn't address the sail cloth in the background. In addition to the sails that I commissioned, I ended up sewing some replacement sails for the jib, royal, some stay sails and the furled sails. what I found is that they are tedious and a real pain to sew.  took several attempts. So the sewing part of the sails represents work by Radek and myself).

 

 

So while, I was making hanks for the jibs I realized that I never made the mast head preventer clamps.  I took a break from making and sewing hanks.  I think that this detail is important to the character of the Cutty's mast.  I made them from brass.

 

 

 

 

 

 

I guess you can see from the shrouds in the photos.  I never took photos of this step either.  

 

So that brings me to the shrouds.

 

I looked at all of the rigging photos, The comments on Campbell's plans.  ALL of the Shrouds are completely served!!!   Well, I have become very close friends with Chuck's serving machine and have become good at dealing with serving three foot lengths of shrouds.  I have to tell you through, it gets pretty tedious and boring at the same time.  But they look great! .  During this process, I also learned that they need to be hung with weights to straighten them out.  

 

Now here comes my first screw up. while I was working on the serving, I wanted to make the jig for the top deadeyes.  So I made one spacing jig based on the distance between the deadeyes as they should be according to Campbells plans.  I did a test run with unserved lines set up with deadeyes using the spacers.  After the glue dried, I ran the lanyards.  The shrouds ended up stretching over a couple of days under tension. I figured they would, which was the point of the test run, so that I would know how much they would end up stretching.  So I re-made the spacing jig for the top deadeyes ran the test again and the change worked perfectly.  Yeah 

 

So I ran the served shrouds around the mast and seized them according to the books.  I used the new spacer and secured the shrouds around the deadeyes.  the next day I set up the lanyards through the deadeyes and let the mast sit for a few days.  No stretch.  Two weeks, no stretch.  A month later, no stretch!   

 

Now the decision about what to do.  It took hours and hours to serve those shrouds.  start from scratch. or try to save them.  I decided to try to save them.  They had been glued with Elmer's wood glue.  So I was able to unglue the shrouds and remove the deadyes.  The shrouds wanted to stay in a curved shape where the deadeyes had been glued.  I was going to soften the risidual glue, then it hit me that the serving was kept in place by the same glue.  If I wasn't careful, I'd end up removing the serving.  I applied alcohol and rolled the line through my fingers which helped relax the bend in the line.  For the most part this worked ok.  

 

I made a new jig and refastened the deadeyes and setup the lanyards.  This rig sat for several months due to travel, but I also wanted to make sure that there wasn't much stretch if any.  I adjusted the tension the lanyards made sure that the masts were straight in all directions.  

 

I don't think that it turned out too bad.  And since the sails will probably obstruct the entire rig, it probably doesn't matter anyway.

 

 

 

Now on to the ratlines.

 

So here I screw up again!!

I did the calculations and had to decide between a diameter that was much less than what it should be or one that was slightly larger.  I tried both and ended up going with the slightly large diameter (actually it was slightly thinner than the same diameter that Mantua supplied for the ratlines.

 

 

Above IS NOT a photo of the mast with the slightly larger ratlines, but is a photo of the completed t'gallent ratlines - that's right BOTH sides - with line that is TWICE the diameter of the line that I chose and intended to use!!   

 

So..........luckily, I had used diluted carpenters glue.  So, I removed two nights work and replaced it with the correct line.

 

 

 

And the top ratlines

 

 

Here's a photo of the cow hitch used on the lanyards  I attached it as semi close to the way that is shown in campbell's plans

 

 

Thanks

marc

Edited January 15, 2019 by keelhauled

[keelhauled]

Oh, I forgot.  Here is photos of the third attempt at the furled sails.  It is about 25 to 30 percent of the original length.  The bulk has been drastically reduced.

 

Here is what it looked like before:

 

From the front

 

 

And the top

 

 

And trimmed down:

 

From the front

 

 

And the top

 

 

 

By the way, in case you wondered, it is faster to bend a fully set said than a furled one.  Much faster!

 

thanks

marc

Edited July 17, 2016 by keelhauled

[NenadM]

Nice work Marc.I have a question: Why do you decide to furle sails?

 

Maybe I miss something in your log

 

Nenad

Edited July 17, 2016 by Nenad

[keelhauled]

Hi Nenad,

 

years ago when I was at the University I built the Revell model of the Constitution, which is a plastic model about 1:98.  I set all the sails including the stunsails.  The model looks great, but it really blocked most of the details and also created a massive bulk to the look.  So I decided to set the Cutty so that it was easier to see the deck and less bulky looking.  

 

I saw a painting that had a cutter with a sail arrangement that I though would work well.  So I'm setting the Cutty as if she is close to the bowline with strong wind.  The royals and sky sails will be furled.  The main and mizzen courses will raised up into their gear to give an unobstructed view of the deck.  The fore course will be set as will the upper and lower topsails and the t'gallents. Three jibs will be set as will the spanker and probably the t'gallent stay sails (I don't want to block the details of the back of the masts so if I don't have them set I'll remove them).   I will probably furl the lower stay sails so that the deck isn't obstructed.  also there won't be any stunsails set.  I was thinking of only setting one jib, but I think that she would look better with them set.  Also if they were furled, either on the boom or fo'cle they would block all of that detail and look sloppy to anyone without the knowledge of how they should look.

 

The next question is the anchors.  I was thinking of having one anchor being shipped onto the deck with the rail removed and the deck anchor davit lifting the fluke. As I understand it, The bertrum pendant was used to raise the anchor during catting as well as lifting the shaft or ring during shipping the anchor onto deck.  If anyone knows differently, please let me know.  I was going to have the other anchor stowed on the side.  However,  they probably wouldn't have done this during the whether that would require shortening of sail.  Does it matter?   If they had been at sea for any period of time the chains would have been removed from the anchors.  But then to most people looking at the model it will probably look like I forgot the chains.  Also I was going to run the chains around the windlass to the chain pipes.  I think it would look more interesting.  But if the chains were removed from the anchors they would have been stored in the locker and wouldn't be left on deck where they can cause damage and be a danger to the crew.

 

So many decisions.

 

Nenad, are you going to put sails on your Cutty.  If so, which ones?

 

thanks

Marc

[popeye the sailor]

good to see your back at the table Marc.......you've made some great progress here      I did the same with the Revell United States when I built her the first time....I was a lot younger.   sails are a matter of personal taste........I liked the full sail look.  it's a very large model.......and the sails added so much more to her.   how ever you set them,  I'm sure they'll look great      

 

not sure about the anchors........most models I've seen have them stowed at the catheads.   there may have been an extra anchor lashed to the rail along the bulwark.

[keelhauled]

Thanks for the thoughts Popeye.  I'll probably end up just having the anchors on the sides.  As far as the sails, I do have a set of full size sails for the ones that I have furled, Just in case I changed my mind (I'm crazy - all the extra work).  I would just have to switch them out on the yards.

 

thanks!

Marc

[popeye the sailor]

......or....if you wanted to be totally nutz,  simply make new yards and save them for another build.     yes....I know......you had to mention this to someone whose nutz already      

 

however you go my friend.........I will follow along