HMS Blandford by hamilton - FINISHED - from Corel HMS Greyhound - 1:100

[hamilton]

Really nice work Hamilton. I can't wait to see further progress.

 

While reading through your log I had to smile at all the comments about Corel's instructions. Did you forget how bad the AL San Fran instructions are? Step 1 - open box. Step 2 - put hull together. Step 3 - make masts & yards and rig together. Step 4 - congratulations, you are done. I really don't know why good kits must be spoiled with poor instructions.

 

Of course you're right!! I had forgotten....It's been a year - long enough for me to bury that particular trauma quite deep - thanks for dredging it up again!! And thanks for the kind words.

hamilton

[hamilton]

NIce fix on a real head-scratcher, Hamilton.  Looks like you bagged it. 

 

Frankie:

I Googled and here's two links.  The second seems to have a more rounded answer.

 

http://www.urbandictionary.com/define.php?term=Softly%2C%20Softly%2C%20Catchee%20Monkey

 

http://nodtonothing.blogspot.com/2007/05/softly-softly-catchee-monkey.html

 

Thanks Mark - for the compliment and the links! 

hamilton

[hamilton]

Alright, then - I thought I'd just give a brief update on the (rather slim) progress on the second planking. I spent a quiet afternoon yesterday touching up the paint on the gunport linings, sweep ports and wales. Not a lot done. 

 

Today I lined off the lower hull and managed to get "Band A" on the starboard side planked - using 1mm x 3mm lime. Eventually, this will be painted white below the waterline and stained at bow & stern where the planking rises above the waterline.

 

Band "A" required 2 dropped planks - not the most sightly, nor perhaps strictly speaking correct. But so far so good. Here are a couple of shots to whet the appetite. I will probably hold off on further updates until the lower planking is completed and finished up...Until then....

hamilton

 

 

 

 

 

[augie]

OK, here we go.  I'll be patient!

[hamilton]

Oh happy day! The hull planking is complete! Feeling good about it - no pictures to show yet - still have the keel, stem & sternpost to plank up and the finishing to do before I update....but the hard part is over....and it's looking.....well, not bad...phew!

hamilton

[Ferit]

We are waiting...

Patience!

Edited May 31, 2013 by shiponthehorizon

[hamilton]

Yikes!! I didn't realise there was demand....don't you have enough to occupy you with your Berlin, Ferit? But I promise I won't leave you waiting for long....I'm waiting to resolve a question around the finishing of the hull and then I will reveal the results....In the meantime, keel planking plus deck planking will keep me occupied....photos soon I promise

hamilton

[hamilton]

Alright - the hull is planked and finished and the deck planking has begun....photos follow, but here is a brief digest of the progress

 

1. Second hull planking - in the last episode, I had lined off the hull and laid the second planking in band "A". I needed 2 dropped planks on both sides in the first and third strakes below the waterline. In band "E" (close to the keel) I ended up needing a great number (4 on each side!) of steelers....Clearly my planking skills need work.....I was less concerned about this on this particular build, however, since the hull is finished below the waterline and the actual structural dimensions of the planking would be hidden - I suppose I could have simply said that the planking went perfectly and without a hitch!

 

2. Keel/stem/sternpost planking - the kit calls for 1mm planking to be used here - no way!! It's much too thick. I used .5mm beech supplied for the deck planking instead. A very straightforward process - I planked the stem semi-vertically from the waterline up, and horizontally the rest of the way. Very straightforward.

 

3. Hull finishing - The top of the stem from the lower wale upwards is painted blue. There is a patch of exposed wood between the lower wale and the waterline at both stem and stern. The lower hull is "tallow", though I painted it Titanium White. Marking the waterline was a pain, since the jig I built (a pencil taped at an appropriate location to a block of basswood) was a little unstable. But eventually I got it. I followed advice given by Randy (lamarvalley) and Nigel (NMBROOK) and applied several coats of poly to the unfinished hull. I then stained the upper portion with Golden Oak, waiting for it to thoroughly dry. I then masked the waterline, sanded below and gave it five good coats, sanding between. A final coat of poly to finish.

 

-- One issue I encountered was with masking. In my impatience to finish the hull, I used scotch tape to mask the waterline. My experience using Scotch has been good - a nice clean line. The issue is that because it is transparent it is really hard to see....As a result when I peeled the tape back there were some jags at the waterline. I quickly went out, bought some Tamiya tape, re-masked at those points that needed correction and  using a scalpul blade (and paint where necessary) made the corrections.

 

4. Deck planking - the f'csl planking was very straightforward. As for the quartedeck - Goodwin clearly shows a nibbed margin plank. At first I attempted to replicate this, but my efforts were both unsuccessful and exceedingly frustrating. In the end, I went with this simpler planking scheme. Goodwin shows no butts on either q-deck or f'csl. The main deck is planked in 60mm lengths in a 4-butt shift. This is shown clearly in his book - I determined the plank length using the deck planking calculator in the MSW database - very handy! I've not yet completed the deck planking, but you can see it in process below.

 

5. The stand - I constructed the stand - the parts took a lot of modification, but eventually I got a good fit. The hull is not permanently mounted yet - I won't do this until a bit later in the build.

 

Anyway, that's it - more regular updates will follow now as I move into the next stage of the build. In the immediate future I will be:

 

-- finishing the deck planking - considering trunneling the deck, but with 3mm plank widths I'm not sure I could take it!! What do you guys think?

 

-- adding the rails - the plank sheer between the gunports on the main deck (which extends fwd and aft); the main cap rail (with similar extensions), the f'csl rail & the quarterdeck rail

 

-- adding the quartergalleries (I'm using the kit-supplied ones, but I may have a stab at making new ones from scratch following the simplest of the suggestions in Goodwin

 

-- building the transom - this is going to be a real challenge for me....but hopefully it will turn out ok.

 

Alright - enough talk! Here are the photos

hamilton

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[realworkingsailor]

You've been busy!

 

Very nicely done

 

Andy

[Blue Ensign]

Good progress Hamilton, she's really starting to look the part now

 

B.E.

[augie]

That's a LOT of progress!  She's coming together very nicely.  At 1:100 I'd only use the 'poke and fill' method for treenails to make them as subtle as possible.  Others might be able to actually draw nails that size but I personally wouldn't go that route.

 

Well done!

[Ferit]

Wow Hamilton!...

A lot of progress...

I should have known... a long silent period then a beautiful job...

[mobbsie]

Looking real good Hamilton, as Sjors would say we want more.  

 

mobbsie

[harlequin]

Hi Hamilton, looking good. I never bothered with the tree nails on my Greyhound ( probably because I would not have made a neat job) You are over the real difficulties with this kit now. I am trying to remember other pitfalls you may encounter. Its funny how you soon forget the angst of a particular model once you have completed it. The boat will take a bit of work if you go with the supplied one, but all ships boats are a bit like that. Just be careful with some of the soft metal fittings like the rudder hinges and the shroud chains, they are very fragile. I used the transom supplied and the windows. May replace the windows to something more realistic but it doesn't look too bad on mine. Also if you use the flags  make sure you soak them in water to remove all the starch from them, that way they hang more naturally.  

[hamilton]

Thanks all for your comments and support!

 

Andy - I hope I can get to the level of precision you've attained in the masting and rigging of your Pegasus (which I believe I mistook for the Fly in an earlier post! - apologies!!)

 

BE - yes, indeed. It's a relief to get over the hump, so to speak, with the planking! 

 

Augie - the scale has already defeated me! At least as far as the trunneling is concerned....I've pretty much decided against it - I think I could probably sort something out, but the idea of so much tedious work is overwhelming to me....I will definitely trunnel the deck on the Syren when I come to it - and the Bellona after that.

 

Ferit - I'm honoured, as usual, by your compliments! Starting on the deck & hull details, I hope to get somewhere close to the cleanliness of your efforts on the Berlin!

 

Mobbsie - thank you for coming by! Your Agamemnon is beautiful - and not to worry, more will come! I'm not sure if I'm sad or grateful that Sjors has not yet discovered my build log! (though I've been spying on his!)

 

Harlequin - thanks! As mentioned, I'm also not going to bother with trunneling the deck....too frustrating, even for someone like me who normally relishes repetitive and tedious work! However, I do see a few complexities coming up in the near-ish future...I'm going to try scratch building a new transom, which I started working on a design for yesterday. This may lead me into a scratch building of the quarter galleries (it's likely that the contrast between the scratch-built transom and the kit supplied quarter galleries will be too garish)....I'm also concerned about the head rails and cheeks, which I'm also planning on scratch building...I've only ever scratch built one ship's head before - the Sultana, my second build...but I really want to take a stab at building it myself - as much for practice when the Bellona hits my table as anything....

 

I was looking at the model this morning and realising that the positioning of the double wale may alter how the cheeks and hawse pieces run....but this is still a bit in the future...in the near term it's the transom and quarter galleries that are occupying my thoughts....

 

In any case - thanks again all for coming by! Much appreciated - hope you're all enjoying the weekend! (though for some it may already be over!)

hamilton

[mtaylor]

Congrats on job well done, Hamilton.  The planking looks super nice. On treenailing... there's been a lot of discussion on this over the years.  Anything smaller than 1:64 seems to be "no".  1:64 is "maybe"... bigger, "yes".  But the issue is also one of "are they actually seen on the real thing?".  I think its' modeler's choice.

[hamilton]

Thanks Mark - this is very reassuring to someone (myself) who tends towards laziness...in some things anyway.

 

If you look closely at the photos on the box, it's clear that the prototype model was trunnelled - but the trunnels themselves look very oversized - not to knock whoever built the prototype, which is a very fine looking model. I can only imagine how difficult it is to obtain realistic and good looking results at so small a scale! And even when they are (as on the prototype) out of scale, I am always impressed at the effort that goes into adding these fine details.

hamilton

[mtaylor]

Let's not call it laziness... I'm doing 1:64 and I'll not be treenailing.  The planks are only 1/8" (about 4mm) wide and that's a tad small for these eyes.  Then on top of it, they should be almost invisible anyway as a plug of the same wood used for decking was used to put in the hole..   Not worth the aggrevation, in my opinion.

[hamilton]

Ok - a small post after a bit of progress followed by another post with a question or two for you all....

 

I've now finished planking the deck, which brings my planking pretty much to a close (except for building up the transom)...Yay!! The next phase - hull, deck and bulwark detailing has begun....

 

My first step was to add the margin planks at the forecastle and quarterdeck, using 1mm x 3mm walnut - pretty basic stuff here....measure, cut, glue.

 

I then added two half-bulkheads beneath the forecastle as outlined in Goodwin's Anatomy of the Ship. I tried these a couple of nights ago using quite thin (1/32") basswood sheet, but the basswood kept splitting and the one unit that I finished looked awful. So then I decided not to make this particular feature.....

 

But (in a rare moment) I decided that it would really detract from the build if I did not include this small element, so I had another go and am quite pleased with the results - i used 1/16" basswood sheeting for the backing, 1mm x 2mm walnut for the frames and 2mm x 2mm walnut for the posts. 

 

Next I added the moldings around the hatch openings using 1mm x 2mm walnut. 

 

I also added the waterways on the main deck using 1/16 x 1/16" basswood filed and sanded into a roughly triangular section and painted red as with the bulwarks. It is very hard to notice on a cursory glance, but I think it turned out quite well....

 

Here are the photos....

hamilton

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

[hamilton]

Now for the question(s)....

 

I'm faced with the prospect of having to scratch build both the transom (which I had expected) and the quarter galleries (which I should have expected)...The metal transom is very badly done altogether and while the quartergalleries are not bad, they do not fit very well and would also clash (I think) with a scratch built transom....

 

So I've looked at the drawings in Goodwin's book, and here is the one that I think I will try to replicate:

 

 

This is the simplest of the several quarter galleries that Goodwin pictures, which is kind of why I chose it....Anyway, I've never done this kind of thing before, and I have several problems with moving from the drawing to a 3-dimensional installation.

 

1. This is the only drawing in the book and it does not show any other perspective....so I can't get a sense of the real shape - I can make a guess based on the drawing, but it may take several attempts to work out the details....

 

2. I'm thinking of carving it out of three solid blocks - one for the "roof" section, one for the window section and one for the lower section, fitting the moldings separately. Does this sound realistic? The decorative element at the bottom....I'm not so sure....I was actually thinking of sawing the bottom off the metal piece supplied with the kit and using that since it is roughly the same shape (though with more decorative elements)....feel free to let me know that this is a bad idea....

 

3. The drawing gives no indication of how it should be finished.....the upper part is in line with the section of the bulwark planking that is painted blue...but I feel like it would be weird to paint it blue....I thought of painting this black, but this might not work either, since the moldings (which are roughly continuous from the moldings on the hull that extend from the cap rail and plank shear) are also black....so maybe I should keep the moldings black and stain the upper and lower part of the quartergalleries? Thoughts? The taff rail will be black, like the other rails....

 

-- As for the window area, I was going to blacken behind where the windows are, use 1mm x 1mm walnut, finished white, for the frames, and use dark walnut for the posts, with possibly some treated brass strips laid over the posts for an extra decorative element....

 

Anyway, any guidance or enlightenment you can provide based on these slender details would be greatly appreciated.....

 

I was going to ask about the transom, too, but maybe I'll leave it with this first before moving on to that next challenge....thanks again to all in advance!

hamilton

[Ferit]

It would be worthy to follow how you would solve the problem. I believe that you would handle it in perfect manner...

Edited June 12, 2013 by ashiponthehorizon

[mtaylor]

Hamilton,

I had a similar issue with my Constellation.  There's about 3 pics showing how I scratched them but no text.  <sigh>  But the Constellation had a round stern so probably not much help except maybe as inspiration for you to do better.

 

Is there a top view anywhere?  Plans, etc.? Other reference work?

 

You might go to the ME site and download the Constitution plans.  As I recall, the galleries are shown and how to make them.

[Blue Ensign]

Hi Hamilton nice work on the decks.

 

Re the Quarter gallery.

 

Drawing D4/2 is quite difficult to picture in 3d, I would imagine it is not quite as angular as it looks, but rather had a slight round to it. The little roof which would be slightly concave would possibly have been tiled in decorative shingles, using overlapping semi circular discs of lead.

 

I’m a little puzzled by the broad timber running from the cill to the rail as the dotted line looks to be the transom line, and I’m struggling to see the relationship between that timber and the gallery.

 

I think you initially need to make up the basic shape and see how it looks on the model, and think about the mouldings and decoration later. Had you considered using sculpey to form the lower finishing, I would imagine it would lend itself to forming those fancy shapes as shown in the drawings.

 

One other thought drawing D4/1 shows a Quarter badge similar to Pegasus, it can be made either flat or canted as Andy (realworking sailor) has done on his build, and there you have how he went about the job.

 

At least with that type you would have a reduced number of glazing bars for the lights. Certainly the flat version can be cut from thin sheet and the window frames made up on the base. Styrene strip could even be used to form the  curves and glazing bars if they are to be painted.

 

Cheers.

 

B.E.

[augie]

Good luck Hamilton.  All I can do is watch

[hamilton]

Thanks all for the comments! And to Mark and BE for the guidance - much appreciated! 

 

Mark - the plans supplied by Corel are horrendous, and there is no perspective drawing at all of the quartergallery - though it seems that they have modelled their metal part on the drawing from Goodwin reproduced above....I took a look at the instruction booklet for the MS Constitution, and the assembly drawing included there for the Conny quarter galleries could serve as a starting point for reproducing the design shown in Goodwin's book - all I would need to do is re-calibrate the dimensions...but this kind of design would work well.

 

BE - I will look at Andy's technique for the Pegasus...From my research it seems that the quarterbadge is more typical of the c.1719 era, while over the period toward the middle of the 18th c. these began to mutate towards the full quarter galleries - at this stage, the 6th rates also went through other modifications that are NOT represented in my build (such as an extended quarterdeck, the ship's wheel moved up onto the quarterdeck, a squared-off beakhead bulkhead, roundhouses at the bow, etc.). I'm tempted to go with the quarterbadge for historical reasons, my only hesitation being the high degree of decorative detail - I don't have Goodwin with me here, but if I'm right, the drawing you're referring to is of a quarter badge that looks very much identical to the one on Pegasus/Fly. My skills are so primitive that I can't imagine the results would be good....there is a drawing in Goodwin of a simpler quarterbadge that might work...

 

I have some sculpy kicking around in my "modelling drawer" so I may have a go at the decorative element at the bottom if I go for the quarter gallery....I might be able to get the look of the semi-circular tiles with some simple carving - how would they have been finished, do you think? Would they just have retained the colour of the lead with no finishing? 

 

Anyway, thanks all once again for the input - it is great to find such encouragement coming from so many distant quarters of the world!

hamilton

[hamilton]

Well I just took a look at Andy's Pegasus log and his method of building up the quarterbadges....I do not feel confident that I could replicate this with the same stunning results, though the quarterbadge illustrated in Goodwin is much simpler....I may have a stab at both the simplified quarterbadge and the quarter gallery depicted above and see which I like best....to be honest this is a new approach to modelling for me, where usually I just throw on whatever's there! It's quite nice and somewhat more relaxing

hamilton

[Blue Ensign]

I look forward to seeing the fruits of your labours Hamilton, whichever design you settle on.

 

Re the tiles: my approach would be to cut them from paper or perhaps adhesive backed foils. The lead may well have been coloured with ochre to give the appearance of gilt, but on the Victory the lead sheeting has been left natural. When I built my Victory model I used exhaust repair tape coloured grey to represent the lead.

 

B.E.

[hamilton]

Great suggestion, re adhesive backed foils - I actually have a long strip of 1/4" copper adhesive that would suit - a bit of paint and it could work well. I may not be able to get to any attempts for a couple of days - we're prepping my workshop our living room/dining room for painting....

hamilton

[realworkingsailor]

BE - I will look at Andy's technique for the Pegasus...From my research it seems that the quarterbadge is more typical of the c.1719 era, while over the period toward the middle of the 18th c. these began to mutate towards the full quarter galleries - at this stage, the 6th rates also went through other modifications that are NOT represented in my build (such as an extended quarterdeck, the ship's wheel moved up onto the quarterdeck, a squared-off beakhead bulkhead, roundhouses at the bow, etc.). I'm tempted to go with the quarterbadge for historical reasons, my only hesitation being the high degree of decorative detail - I don't have Goodwin with me here, but if I'm right, the drawing you're referring to is of a quarter badge that looks very much identical to the one on Pegasus/Fly. My skills are so primitive that I can't imagine the results would be good....there is a drawing in Goodwin of a simpler quarterbadge that might work...

 

 

It's actually not that hard to do.

 

All I did on mine was trace the outline of the quarter badges onto some basswood of an appropriate thickness of basswood and with careful cutting and filing, and sanding, it took me about an hour to make each one.

 

Andy

[hamilton]

Thanks Andy - it seems relatively straightforward - did you use styrene for the molding/window frames? If so where did you get it in such small dimensions? Thanks again!

hamilton