Le Soleil Royal by EJ_L - FINISHED - Sergal - Scale 1:77 - 1669 Version

[md1400cs]

Hey EJ - missed those updates for some reason but clicked In  - Nice

 

[Hubac's Historian]

Stay strong and stay thirsty, my friend!

[Hubac's Historian]

I'm having a little Powers myself, right about now.

[Hubac's Historian]

I was just looking at the comparison photos of SR to Couronne - JeezUS!  That is a huge model!

[popeye the sailor]

keep pouring.......two more fingers ought to do it     you got a tall task ahead of you.....surely there is a second planking on the horizon.    once you get it where you want it,  a little filler should set the stage     I recall a couple of my 'sanding parties'...........out in the garage with a twelve pack    I tried one time to get my younger son involved........he didn't take the bait  

 

I look forward in seeing what you come up with   

[CédricL]

Good evening EJL,

 

I just finish to read your log. That's an impressive work !

 

Just two informations, the first is that they were no entry on the hull for the ship. It was a common british practice, not a french one (except maybe for some earlier vessels not built in France).

The second is that you absolutely need R.C. Anderson's book for the rigging of the ship. As the kit's instructions are (as usual it seems) far from being correct.

 

There is also an interesting work made about the running rigging of the ship here:

http://www.jans-sajt.se/contents/Navigation/Modelling/Belayings_Collection.htm

 

Good luck with the sanding of the hull.

 

Have a nice day

 

[EJ_L]

Cedric,

 Welcome and thanks for both the kind words as well as the link. Always good to have another resource for rigging. I do have Anderson's book, in fact I have two different printings of it, a newer 1994 printing as well as one from 1955 that I absolutely love as the drawings are a bit larger and on fold out sheets. I have referenced his work extensively on my Couronne build and I expect to do the same for this one.

 

As for the build itself, I have had a successful weekend of sanding, wood filler, sanding, wood filler, sanding, wood filler, sanding, wood filler, sanding, wood filler, sanding, wood filler..... okay, so maybe not that bad but it sure feels that way! Actually, I am thinking that the end is in sight. Should be able to tell for certain after dinner tonight when I get back at it. Been applying sealer to a book shelf that I built for my kitchen to hold all my cook books which has given me a nice break from sanding. I also had a fun trip to the hobby store for a couple tools and some more wood for the gun port frames and other framing that I will need to build. And to make the weekend even better, I received a nice email from the good people at Crown Timberyard letting me know my order has shipped and should be here early this week. That will be all the wood for the 2nd planking layer and the wales plus some other misc. wood for all those unforeseen items that come up. This week should see some interesting progress made!

[ca.shipwright]

E J,

Looking real good. I use a Black and Decker Mouse for rough sanding of the convex areas of the hull and a Riobi profile sander kit for the concave areas. This Riobi kit has about 10 interchangeable  profile ends. These really take the drudgery out of sanding all that wood filler we so liberally apply. Finish sanding by hand, of course- up to 320 grit.

 

Keep going. I don't know anyone who builds as fast as you do.

 

Regards

[EJ_L]

I don't know if I actually build fast or if I am just fortunate to have a lot of time I can dedicate to building. Just to get to this point I around 230 hours and La Couronne to date is around 860. While the compliment is appreciated, in fact I need to slow down. I tend to get impatient and want to keep going and I have sacrificed details and a cleaner look on some things that I wish I had not. It is one of my faults I am constantly working on improving with every build.

 

I do use a power sander for rough sanding to knock down the really bad planks and the clinker effect. Still, most is done by hand and all the wood filler sanding is done by hand. I have to be able to feel the curves on the hull as well as the low and high spots as I sand. Now I get to start squaring up the gun ports and installing their framework. Once I get all of those done, I will give the hull another sanding. I like to do this as it helps to make the port framing match up to the hull shape as well as just giving the hull another go over before the second planking goes on. I also like to use a rough grit to lightly hit all the places where I applied wood filler to provide grooves for the glue to bond to. 

 

 

[CédricL]

Good evening EJL,

 

I don't know if you know the existence of the manuscrit of "l'Anonyme du Havre de Grace" ?

If not, you maybe could download it from Gallica:

http://gallica.bnf.fr/ark:/12148/btv1b8626226w?rk=21459;2

 

There are, on pages 25 - 26 the dimensions for the outer planking of the ship and those of the wales. Also are the dimensions of the gunports (wich are not correct on Sergal, particularely for the upper row)

Sorry, it's in old French, but it's worth the effort to translate it. (or you can ask to some french-speaking native...)

 

Have a nice day.

 

[EJ_L]

S.R.'s planking arrived today making for a nice couple days of acquiring new stuff for the build. The mahogany and walnut strips are from Crown Timberyard, the bass wood is just from Hobby Lobby but works great for sub structure work. I also picked up a pair of those pliers for making wire loops for eyebolts. Looked like they might be a good investment after seeing them used on some other logs here. I realized when I bought them that I own a very nice collection of jewelry making tools and supplies for having never made a piece of jewelry.... 

 

Well, I guess I better get to building as I no longer have any excuses!

[popeye the sailor]

I do the same........square stock from Hobby Lobby,  strip stock from Billing's     sanding went well........look'in good  

[EJ_L]

Had to take some time to reorganize the lumber rack this evening. It had been needing it and with the new wood I finally decided to take the time and clean it up. Found some pieces I thought I was out of and now I have a better idea of what I have.

 

 

Then it was back to work on gun port framing. Slowly advancing down the hull. Focusing on them has also allowed me to see areas that will need a little more fill and sanding work before the 2nd planking. It is like looking for a lost item. Stop looking for it and it appears! Same with dips and uneven planks. Stop looking for them and there they are. Not a problem as I was expecting to have to do another sanding anyway. I am just marking the spots I want to fix as I see them and will get to it when done with the framing.

 

The top row of ports I am still not certain how I am going to do them. At the moment the have been cut out to receive the metal fittings that came with the kit. These contain the port frame and the ornate casing. The more I look at them the more I think they will be replaced by something I create. This of course means I will have to resize the ports but at this stage that is not a big deal to do. I will sleep on it as I have a couple more days before I reach those ports anyway. 

 

[BLACK VIKING]

I am following with interest on this one as I have the full kit from Deag which I have just started planking with the first layer hoping to post a build log in the next few days 

[EJ_L]

Let me know when you do as I would love to follow along with another builder. I have found that it is always nice to have someone else working on the same ship to bounce ideas back and forth. It is hard to find that on these large builds though as not as many people tackle them. Good luck on yours as you start planking.

[BLACK VIKING]

Thanks EJ hopefully will post pictures at the weekend. I love these ships of the 17c . It's good to bounce ideas of some one who is building the same ship 

 

BV aka Martyn 

[Elijah]

Looking good E.J! What is that thing that you are using for wood storage?

[EJ_L]

Elijah thank you!

That wood rack is a modified craft storage cabinet I bought from Michaels. I added the black parts cabinet and the hooks as I need them. For the wood bins, the original cabinet came with the dividers in the top section. To allow for long strips of wood, I drilled out the bottoms of the back 2 rows and moved the top drawer to the middle slot. This gave me the depth I need for long strips. The middle row I left alone for shorter pieces and the first 2 rows I covered with a piece of wood to make a ledge for my glues. I use a lot of their craft cabinets for my shipyard. Sometimes I can use as is, other times I can modify them to fit my purposes better.

 

Here is the link to Michaels website and the actual cabinet.

 

I've included the original pictures as well as my modifications.

 

 

 

[EJ_L]

Been hard at work but I feel like it has mostly just been chasing my tail. I finished framing all the starboard gun ports Friday night but something had been bothering me. I got up, left the room and played with the dogs for a while and when I came back in I realized that the bottom two rows of gun ports were shorter than the top row. Width was great but they were all squatting. I measured them and they are in fact shorter. I could not figure out how that happened as I have measured them time and time again what happened?!?! and why were the top ports all the correct size? Then I realized what I did. I did not oversize the height on those port opening for the framing. Still don't know how I missed that but I caught it. So now I get to go back through and re-frame the ports in order to make them all the correct size.

 

On the bright side, while I still have rework to do on the port side gun ports, I should just be able to transfer over the dimensions from the starboard side and rework them once instead of the 4 times I have reworked them on this side..... I wish I could say that simply pulling the dimensions off the prints would work, and the would normally but, with the interior modeling I am doing there is no way to make the kit plan layout align with the actual decks.

 

So, here I go. Already fixed a few in this picture and got in a couple more since it was taken. The repair work is going fairly fast so hopefully in a few days I will have some forward progress to show. Then I get to fix wood filler and finish sanding the hull and repeat on the other side.

[popeye the sailor]

she's look'in good E.J.    just a small oversight........you need to do more sanding anyway,  now that you added the casings.   ....and yes,  you are making good progress on her  

[ca.shipwright]

E J

Looking good so far, sand and sand again.

Take a look at my posts under STORY STICKs. This may give you some added help.

 

Regards

[EJ_L]

Thanks for that Michael! That is almost too simple, I don't think I ever would have thought to do that! Yet another reason I love this site as often we get tunnel vision that having another persons perspective adds a great solution that we would never have seen. Well, I have now achieved my daily goal and learned something new.

[EJ_L]

Progress continues on the gun port framing. 3 hours of build time tonight have left me with 3 ports left to go on the starboard side. Should have them done tomorrow and then more filler and sanding. There are lots of imperfections but the filler and the sanding should be light at this point so no big stress there. I will have pictures later this week when there is something to actually see.

 

To all my S.R. scholars, I am in need of guidance. On the stern at the aft gun ports, does the transom remain flat and the just the balcony supports curve or does the transom follow the curve of the balcony supports. I have seen it both ways and am wondering if anyone knows how this should look. Below are pictures of the area in question. On the drawing the transom appears to be flat and just the supports curve. On the model, and I have seen this on a few of them, the transom itself takes on the same curve as the supports. I am quickly approaching a point where I need to make the decision on how to frame and plank this area so any input would be greatly appreciated.

On this model it shows the transom curving with the balcony supports.

[Hubac's Historian]

Hi EJ,

 

I think you are referring to the "round-up" of the stern. Most commercial models of square-tuck sterned models present the transom as being flat, but this was not the case in actual practice.  There is, as you note, an upward camber of the transom wale (beneath the chase ports) that follows the arc of the stern counter, as well as the galleries above it.  However, there should also be a corresponding outward arc of the transom, from the ship sides toward the sternpost.  This arc in two planes (upward and outward) carries up and past the stern counter into the fashion pieces.  All of the Tanneron models display this characteristic (see stern pics of L'Agreable and Le Brilliant on the first page of my build log), and many good pictures of the Vasa's transom and upper stern display this feature to good advantage.

 

On one of the arsenal sites I found this proposed framing for SR's stern:

Below the stern counter, this plan correctly shows the framing for the round-up of the transom, however, it seems to show the upper framing of the fashion pieces as being flat, which is incorrect.  The dual arc of the transom timber, above the stern post, is what provides a footing and gives shape to the coved supports to the fashion timbers.  Round-up should be continued into the upper stern, but here it is not.

 

The other interesting feature of this framing diagram - for those who are interested in developing plans for a scratch-build of SR - is that it shows the correct profile of a pre-1673 stern, where the widest point of the stern is at the middle deck level, as opposed to the lower deck level on the Tanneron model of SR (which is actually a model of the second SR, ex Foudroyant of 1693).

 

My only other contention about this framing for the first SR (1669-1692), is that the framing of the stern counter should close-in this lowest stern balcony, which shouldn't be a balcony at all.  Otherwise, I quite like the shape of the plan and will tweak it for a future scratch-build.  I think the cyma curve line of the tafferal is very well drawn, here.

[Hubac's Historian]

On a closer look, it seems that I may have been wrong about this framing diagram; it does seem to show a diminishing taper (upwards) of the round-up into the fashion pieces.

[Hubac's Historian]

I'm curious EJ about this model of SR that you are showing.  It seems to have applied the plastic, Heller stern balconies and quarter galleries (painted "walnut" brown to match the planking) to a wooden model. Or, perhaps someone veneer planked over the plastic kit?  Anyway, it's interesting.  Do you have other pictures of this model?

[EJ_L]

Marc,

 

Thank you for that. I was fairly certain that the round up is the way to go but the drawings I had either do not show it at all or make it appear to be flat. Flat did not see right but I could not tell and I have learned not to just assume that all ships were built similar no matter how much sense something makes. I will model it that way!

 

AS to the model in the photo, I do have some more pictures of it. I can post them later on when I get home. THey are mostly of the stern as I collected them when I was looking at different versions of the stern configurations.

[Sjors]

Hi EJ,

 

Nice job on the sanding.

A lot of work nut now you've got a good surface for the next planking.

And a nice cabinet.

We are doing it with plumber pipes ( if that's correct)

 

Sjors

[EJ_L]

Sjors, I use piping for a lot of storage. Wood strips, dowels and model railroad track all have their tubes out in the garage. That is originally what I was using for my ship wood as well until I got this cabinet.

 

I meant to post this a couple days ago but I did finish up the starboard side gun ports and more sanding. She is starting to look good on that side now. The port side is also well underway and I am hoping to have the ports finished up in a couple more days and then more sanding on that side. Once both sides are where I like them I will build out the stern and the 2nd planking will start. If I can manage it at work, I am hoping to get a 4 day weekend this weekend and should be able to get in some long build days. 

[Hubac's Historian]

The re-work really adds up, EJ, but it is well worth the effort.  You will always rest easy knowing you did what was necessary.  Can't wait to see the finish planking begin!