Storing timber that has been cut and planed

[No Idea]

Hi

 

I hope that this has not been covered before and if it has I apologise.

 

I have seen quite a lot of information regarding the storing of rough cut wood that needs to dry over a period of time, but how do you store you cut and planed wood.  I'm talking about thin planks that are maybe 6mm thick, 150mm wide and 1000mm long?  The reason I ask is because I have a couple of boxwood planks of this size that I have simply put on the top of a flat cupboard directly on top of each other.  I got them down today and they have warped across their width?  Should I have separated them with some battons or something like this?  The room is well ventilated and just like the rest of our home remains quite a constant temperature.  Your thoughts would be very welcome as I was just about to buy quite a lot of timber just like this for my next build.  I need it to stay in good straight condition for a period of time and don't want to waste my hard earned money through a lack of understanding.

 

Mark

[Charles Green]

Warped across their width - it sounds like you are describing cupping.  Stress in a dried, thick plank, too weak to distort it, may take over on thin sections sliced from of it.  The warping of the thin section may occur as it is being cut.   You may be able to flatten your boxwood by steaming the planks, stacking them with with stickers/battons between and on top and bottom and then clamping the assembly.  Let them set, clamped, for a day.     

[Jaager]

Mark,

There have been past discussions.   And I learned about my primary method there.  

One of the frustrations of web style is that it makes source attributions difficult.  Actual names are not often used. Jobs, promotions, grant money, and invitations to speak are not at stake, the harm is slight.  Footnotes are difficult to use.

Pulling bits and pieces together,  It may serve to have some understanding of the physical forces involved and match a storage method to its likely interaction with them.

Seasoned wood is essentially wood that is equilibrium with its environment of water.  The volume and volume to surface area affects the time it takes.    In an environment with controlled temperature and humidity, once at physical equilibrium, shape of wood should stay stable.   You do not address your home's humidity.  The literature of your island suggests that the humidity there fluxes, and is frequently at atmospheric saturation or even above.   There is a constant dynamic at play with stored wood.

Looking at the end grain of a plank  will predict some of the forces affecting the shape a plank will try to take.

Quarter sawn stock has the grain at right angles.  This the more stable conformation.  It is also more expensive. There is higher waste, and more labor involved.

Flat sawn wood is a quick and dirty and the most common method used.  The grain of a tree is a series of ever increasing diameter concentric rings.  The end grain is most often at an angle.  The worst of the effects involving a plank changing shape from the desired rectangle,  is when the center is involved in where a particular plank comes from.  If the end grain is not a series of parallels, if they mirror each other,  there is a tendency to draw the edge towards each other.   Trees taper in overall diameter and they often rotate in a cork screw fashion.   The forces involved with changes  of shape are more when the water content is high. -  Twist and cup are particularly troublesome during the seasoning process.  Kiln drying often can get the water out before the wood can reach the shape that internal forces demand.    Hydraulic pressure can be strong.  The changing water content in a dry plank bring it into play.  It will overcome less than adequate counter forces. Kiln drying or drying under a weighted stack may leave internal stresses that take every opportunity to release. This is a part of the playing field.

Storage of drying wood requires adequate air flow around each plank to get the water vapor away and not support the ever present fungus.   Wood in equilibrium does not need air flow for drying.   I am imagining that a thick stack of closely packed wood, that has been stored where there is no humidity control, will need a little time to equilibrate with the build environment.

POF requires a large supply of wood.   Using a suggestion here  I use cardboard mailing boxes.  2' lengths are convenient for me.

Aviditi Square Mailing Tubes, 3" x 3" x 25", 25 Each per Bundle (M3325),Oyster White
Also  2" x 2" x25"
The contents can be packed.  Laid flat, they stay where placed.  2'  long is a pain to find floor space for.

Mailing tubes, paper towel roll cores,  and egg crate dividers in a big box,  make for easy storage of a size sorted stock.   They work best when stood on end.
Gravity will pull on the top of the planks and bending is a frequent result.  None work well when flat.  The box dumps its contents.  The tubes roll and their cross section is a circle.  Planks are rectangles.  The fit is less than optimal.

I know of no pat solution.  Mostly it is a matter of applying finds to your situation.   Give a thought to what Nature is trying to do to the wood and see if your proposed method offers an adequate counter.

 

About your present stock,  forcing it back to flat is good for stock being feed to a tablesaw.  The product of the saw will possible not warp significantly - depending on size.  The reshaped plank will continue to seek its preferred shape over time.  If you use it on a model, the bond and fittings holding it in place must be stronger than the natural internal forces if things are to stay where you wish them to be.

 

[No Idea]

Hi Charles and Jaager

 

Thanks for your replies they have been quite insightful for me.  Firstly saving the wood that I have seems to be working using the technique as described above.  I'll find out for definite tomorrow but so far things look ok.

 

I've also looked at the end grain and yes it does look like they were cut by flat sawing.  If I look very hard I can also see how the grain was affected the wood too.  

 

I think one of the biggest mistakes that I have been making is stacking all of my wood in one block with no ventilation between them and also different lengths so some are not supported at the ends at all.

 

I like the idea of using boxes too.  This does seem a bit counter intuitive thought as surely the wood gets no ventilation when inside the box?  I have plenty of room to store the wood and the humidity in the room doesn't really change that much. It's a new home with all of the best insulation and triple glazing so the temperature and humidity is quite constant.

 

If you could give me a steer on my understanding of using boxes that would be great

 

Mark

[Jaager]

Right now I am using it to store framing timber stock.  My lumber is well seasoned.  I resaw and then use a thickness sander to get it to final thickness. 

I sticker my lumber supply.  At least the boards that I have had forever are stickered.  Freshly milled lumber, even if kiln dried,  may not be as dry as it could be.

My harvested stock is billets.  It is shorter than 2 feet.  I keep it on shelves, not stickered.  Each layer is oriented 90 degrees to the one above and below.

But, once dry I don't see any need for air circulation, especially after it has been resawn. 

The box has one end secured using duct tape.  I pack as much wood into a box as it will hold.  I write a code for species and thickness on all 4 sides at the

end that opens..  Then lay it flat. 

Oh,  to save work later, I write the decimal thickness (without the dot) on each plank.  It is on both sides at each end.  I use chalk.  I have white and color chalk. White does not

show very well on Maple.  It rubs off easily later.

I try not to use AC, although this year the mid July to early August heat wave was too much for my condo's version of 4/40 air.  It is two floors with a sliding glass door on each.

On the Bay, it is humid.  I use no humidifier in the Winter.  I do not measure it, but I suspect that compared to yours, my range in humidity must resemble a windshield wiper.  

Still, I do not worry about it as far as the condition of the stored wood.  The tight packing stops any cupping.  I work slowly enough that there is equilibrium. 

 

In your place, i would wonder if the Castelo  was still a bit wet when it was purchased. 

[No Idea]

Hi Jaager

 

Thanks very much for the information it really has helped.  I think you are right about the timber being a bit wet but I'm learning as I go.

 

I think when I order my next batch of wood from my supplier I'll pick up the phone and have a good chat with them regarding my needs rather than just ordering online.

 

Thanks again - Mark

[Jaager]

8 hours ago, Jaager said:

I sticker my lumber supply.  At least the boards that I have had forever are stickered.  Freshly milled lumber, even if kiln dried,  may not be as dry as it could be.

Sorry - the middle sentence is not logical.  I omitted a word.  It should read:

At least the boards that I have NOT had forever are stickered.  

[mtaylor]

I don't know if you have them where you are, but many lawn and garden stores carry square vinyl fence post covers that around 4 to 6 inches square.  I've found them ideal for storing wood as they stiff and I can stack them high. I do use the longest ones I can find and cut them half so I have two pieces for storage.

[No Idea]

9 hours ago, mtaylor said:

I don't know if you have them where you are, but many lawn and garden stores carry square vinyl fence post covers that around 4 to 6 inches square.  I've found them ideal for storing wood as they stiff and I can stack them high. I do use the longest ones I can find and cut them half so I have two pieces for storage.

Thanks Mark that's a very good idea and I'm sure that I have seen these at our local hardware superstore.  

[Chuck]

To try and remove the cupping, wet the top of the concave side only thorougly.  Then set it down with the concave side down.  Place some weights on it.  It should remove some of the cupping depending on how severe it is.  You can also iron it.

 

some folks prefer to place the concave side up after wetting.  I dont think it matters and i have done both.  The important thing is adding weight while it dries.  There are many videos online that show the process.  If its a hot sunny day this can be done outside on your driveway or sidewalk.  This works well with plywood also. 
 

Whenever I see some boards cupping in my stacks of boards I try to flip them upside down and place them on the bottom of the stack.  This also works but takes a lot of time.  If you dont catch the cupping early it is very hard to remove it.  Catch it as it starts and flip it over and it will correct itself before setting for good.

 

 

 

 

 

[Carlos Reira]

You can sticker it with popsicle sticks or something like that, but you'll still need to bind it with string, weight it down or something like that. And keep an eye on it. The hydraulic forces in wood are amazingly strong. If they're cupped, the convex side is the higher moisture side, so put two boards concave to concave side and clamp them with spring clamps all around. When they warp the other way, switch the boards, and keep doing this until they're good and equalized. If you need to moisten the concave sides first.