Norske Love by Mike Reader - Billing Boats - 1/75 scale

[Mike Reader]

Hi new to forum,

as mentioned in my new members thread, I was given a half complete model of Norske Love, put together by a friends father in 1984, the hull and deck was fitted out along with shrouds and rat lines but no further rigging, although the sails were fitted to the spars and supplied loose along with most of the other bits to complete the build. 

  I have spent the last few days repairing a lot of the shrouds (a number of the deadeyes were broken) and colouring the fitted rigging black. I am not sure if the shrouds should be black also, so have left them for now but any advise would be welcome. 

    Looking around the ship more closely I can see a number of issues that I would have done differently but I will have to put up with these as I do not want to replace to much of the existing work as there is more than enough for me to do already.

 I also ordered some black rigging thread as all of the supplied thread is tan coloured. I ordered a small amount 0.50 and 0.75 as was not sure which to use, I think the 0.75 is looking better but again any advise would be welcome.

I have the build manual and the large double sided general drawing 1&2, I have been studying these to try to determine how to fit the standing rigging, there is too much other info on these drawings to see clearly, so was wondering if there was a separate standing rigging drawing that is missing. I have James Lee,s rigging book along with a few other books and have been studying lots of photos ,  so could probably work it out in time, but if there where a standing rigging drawing it would be so much easier.

   I have just completed another much easier project that was started by me about 30 years ago (Artisania Latina - Clara May) which I am happy with, and now feel ready to try to complete this project although I am aware it is not going to be easy. 

[Shotlocker]

Mike,

Welcome to the forum! I don't know what your general drawings 1&2 look like but here is the standing rigging plan for

that ship that I used to have. Assuming it's different from what you have, perhaps it will solve your difficulty.

 

Again, welcome!

Gary

[popeye the sailor]

I've dealt with a number of Billings kits......the one glaring issue with the plans are the termination points.   does the plans include a deck view of the belaying pins?  I've always wanted to build this vessel  

[Shotlocker]

Plan 3 shows the termination points, numbers with arrows:

[Mike Reader]

Thank you Shetlocker that should help a lot, much appreciated. 

Popeye that was going to be my next question, hopefully when I have enlarged plan 3, I can see the details clearer.

[Dziadeczek]

This was my first kit I built many years ago. I too had difficulties with rigging (had only two sheet of plans printed on both sides of paper). Instruction booklet was not much help...

ZuMondfeld helped me a bit, I remember.

After some time upon finishing the model, I noticed that those plastic deadeyes started breaking under tension from shrouds, specifically those tiny eyes on top of each deadeye (?).

I would advice you to replace them all with wooden ones and rig them properly.

Edited March 19, 2021 by Dziadeczek

[Mike Reader]

Hi, 

thanks for all of the help so far, I have a couple more questions about the rigging,

 

1) on the general drawing it shows the crows-feet for each mast going through what I have discovered is called a euphroe tackle fitting, I have not got anything like these and cannot see them on the suppliers lists, do members make there own and how is the line  from these attached to the main  standing rigging.

 

2) do members lash the deck guns (I have a drawing for this) , and if so does it make sense to do this before starting on the main standing rigging.

[Shotlocker]

Mike,

I'm not able to assist you on your first question but concerning the second one, if it were me, I'd definitely rig the cannon before

doing any rigging...lots easier to do without having to work around those pesky lines.

[Snug Harbor Johnny]

Ahoy Mike!    A previous comment about the advisability of replacing plastic pulleys with wood ones is wise indeed.  Apart from looking more realistic (and there are several 'grades' of wood pulleys that can be had), thin sections of plastic - especially old plastic - are prone to failure.  Its not just UV radiation, but age degradation combined with even a little tension.  Case in point:  Builders of the venerable 1:96 Cutty Sark or Thermopylae models by Revell are advised to trim away the tiny belaying pins molded into the plastic pin rails, and drill holes in their place to put in brass (or wood) pins that will stand the 'test of time'.  Other thin parts like the 'dolphin striker' and the 'whiskers' are often replaced by metal wire (not the 'soft' kind of wire, but the springy kind - but you can still bend it as needed).  Ditto for the vertical members of railings.

 

  I'm no expert, as I'm resuming a 1:100 Billings Wasa kit I planked the hull on in the 70s, (build log in progress) but I also did the Revell Cutty & Constitution and a Scientific wood-kit Cutty in that decade (nothing other than the Billings survived).  Half the work (and visual effect) of  ship models is in the rigging - and I'm in the process of 'learning the ropes'.  One helpful book is 'Rigging Period Ship Models' by Lennarth Peterson (in print and available on Amazon).  Now this is for late 18th to mid19th century warships, and the book is essentially 'all illustrations' that are clearly drawn and (taken sequentially) highly instructive and easy to understand.  Your Norske Love happens to be an 18th c. warship.  Many of the principles are applicable to other ships, although there will be differences - like the rigging variations found on many composite Clipper Ships, for example.  So looking at applicable build logs is very helpful, as one can take a screen images to print out as references.  

 

  In my case (building a 17th c. ship ... BTW there was an older Norske Love that was a contemporary of the Wasa) I've found another book (out of print, but copies of the Dover reprint can be had on-line - mine happened to be in new condition) titled 'The Rigging of Ships in the Days of the Spritsail Topmast' by R.C. Anderson.  It has far fewer (and less demonstrative) illustrations and a lot of text (the original was published in 1927), but includes some of the details one would like to see in an older vessel.  I have a book form the 'Anatomy of the Ship' series: 'The Colonial Merchantman Susan Constant 1605' by Brian Lavery as well - to supplement the above mentioned rigging book.  So check around, as there are books featuring other ships - and perhaps there is at least one well-suited to your project.

 

  Ah yes, I found a gem of a book in a second hand bookstore for a mere $8 that covers the entire history of sailing ships - with many great illustrations in many time periods and genres (including 19th c. rigging):  'The Lore of Ships' edited by Sam Svennsson (originally by Tre Trekare printed the 1973) slightly updated when reprinted in 1998.  It is a marvelous tome to pour through.  So the moral might be to visit used book stores in your area ... you never know what you might find, and the books are generally organized by topic.

 

Clear sailing!    Johnny

[Dziadeczek]

"...After some time upon finishing the model, I noticed that those plastic deadeyes started breaking under tension from shrouds, specifically those tiny eyes on top of each deadeye (?).

I would advice you to replace them all with wooden ones and rig them properly..."

 

This is one of the few spare deadeyes from the original kit. Notice the little eye (marked with a red arrow). They want you to attach the chain plates (straps) to this eye, instead of wrapping it around the deadeye. After a while, the strain on the eye breaks it off the deadeye and you'll end up with loosely hanging shroud, which has to be replaced... Hence my recommendation to use wooden deadeyes and have a piece of mind, instead of using these plastic ones.

Also, there are other inaccuracies of the kit - the tops are round, which is a bit archaic for the era the ship was built in. They should rather be rectangular and only rounded up in the forward part, like other ships from the end of XVIII C. Also I have doubts about the stern...

But, overall, the kit makes a nice looking model, especially if you want to bash it a bit...

Edited May 7, 2021 by Dziadeczek

[Dr PR]

Mike,

 

Lees has detailed information in the back about the circumference/diameters of rigging. It is all based upon the mast diameter. However, the rigging dimensions are for the circumference of the ropes. Divide by Pi (3.14159) to get the diameter.

 

I am attaching a spreadsheet I made for my current build, a topsail schooner. This spreadsheet contains most of the formulas for mast/spar/rigging dimensions from Lees and Mondfeld. However, some of the upper masts and yards that are not found on schooners were omitted. You have to enter the  hull dimensions (explained in the drawing) in the appropriate green cells.

 

CAUTION: Although the calculations for each part are valid for any ship, the second set of calculations are for the lower mast dimensions of schooners. Schooner masts were typically only 3/4 as large as square-rigget masts. So you need to pay attention to the part for determining mast dimensions (based upon the ship's beam). Once you know the diameter of your masts  you can plug it into the appropriate green cell and all the calculations will be done automatically.

 

I deliberately did not carry the calculations for mast dimensions through the whole spreadsheet. You have to enter the numbers in several places (green cells). In this way the first set of calculations are for full rigged ships, the second part for schooners, and the final rigging part is for all ships. The spreadsheet also calculates the proper block dimensions to be used with each rope size.

Mast spar and rigging calculations.xlsx

[Blue Ensign]

Hi Mike,

I built Norske Love many years ago, and still have it on display, it is an impressive model, altho’ not up to modern standards in terms of fittings.

 

I too found it odd that the tops are shown as round on a ship of 1765,  (more appropriate to the 17th c) and I replaced mine with the more standard versions of the time. I also replaced all the deadeyes and rigging blocks with Boxwood versions.

 

 

These photo’s that I put up in answer to a question somewhere long ago give you an idea of the use of proper deadeyes and blocks and the modified Tops.

 

Regards,

 

B.E.

[Thunder]

That is a very impressive rig B.E. I love to see the extra effort to include all the sale rig as well even when depicted without sails bent. Even has the bowlines I believe. Looks like more the rig expected in a museum.

[Mike Reader]

    Thank you blue ensign, the pictures you posted are very helpful (and impressive).

     I have been looking at a lot of photos of this model to try to get a better understanding of the rigging (as well as reading a number books), but either a lot of the models viewed have sails fitted which obscure the rigging or in the case of the crows-feet are not fitted at all. Would it be possible to have a couple more photos of your rigging as yours is by far the best I have seen so far. 

   regarding the ship I was given, (as stated he did a good job in 1984 but) unfortunately there are a few  issues regarding accuracy (as well as a small amount of damage over the years) which without deconstructing a lot of his work I am going to have to put up with. My original plan was just to finish it off, but reading and beginning to understand more I will try to do the rest to the best of my ability. 

  Many thanks to all that are replying for there knowledge and assistance.

[Blue Ensign]

Thank you Thunder and Mike.

@ Mike, - rather than clutter your log with photos of my build, I will  put a separate log on here  for folks to use as they will. My build long pre-dated MSW but I do have a short log  that I must have put on some other site, but where I simply can't remember. I hope you will find it of use.

 

Regards,

 

B.E.

[Mike Reader]

Cheers Blue Ensign, I have looked at your build log, and it will be invaluable to me in my attempted to complete my acquired ship. 

[Mike Reader]

    Before adding anything of my own to this ship, I am having to redo some of the work already done. The more I look the more bits I see that I would have done differently (but where do you stop !). 

     I decided to attempt rigging the deck cannons before adding any more standing rigging, but discovered that there is a small sliding block under the muzzle that does not allow any elevation (in fact on a lot of them it is pushing the muzzle downwards, so I am partially dismantling all 20 of them and removing this block with very careful use  of my trusty dremel.

     I suppose this is the joy of taking over a partially built model, it looks great at first glance but when you look deeper and study more books and other members builds you realise it could be better, however I am drawing the line at going too deep.

    In fairness it was assembled in 1984 and a lot of work has gone into the build, and of course there was not the ability to get information like there is now.