HM Armed Cutter Sherbourne 1763 by palmerit - Vanguard Models - 1:64 - First Build

[palmerit]

I assume belaying pins are glued in place at this point  

 

Right?

[AJohnson]

2 hours ago, palmerit said:

I assume belaying pins are glued in place at this point  

 

Right?

I do, they will be fiddly to add later. Just make sure they are fully seated so enough pokes out of the underside for you to wrap your rigging around. Something I didn’t do with a few on my Trial build on a couple of them. 
 

Your build is looking very good, like how neat it looks on post #59. 

Edited October 4, 2024 by AJohnson

[palmerit]

Lesson learned, lesson shared:

 

I was building the catheads and since I had removed the char from other parts (like belay pin racks) I just plunged ahead and removed the char from the small parts for the catheads too. I should have waited until get were put together or just not worried about it since I was planning to paint them. The small pieces at the end of the catheads are small and after sanding they now don’t fit snuggly. 

[palmerit]

They look a little better after some wood filler, sanding, and paint. 

[palmerit]

Another lesson learned, lesson shared:

 

Not having done modeling since I was a kid, and not having done anything but the most basic wood working, there are lots of basic things I’m discovering and learning. After making a mistake, I poke around here, YouTube, and other places where I learn how to fix my mistake. I could have avoided the mistake by reading more and taking reams of notes, but sometimes it’s best to live your mistakes. Another good reason for starting with a small, relatively inexpensive model. 
 

So most of my pants (airbrush and brush) are Vallejo. They’ve worked great for everything. 
 

I wrongly assumed that the Vallejo acrylic primer would work on photoetch. Well it doesn’t, unfortunately. You can see it on the eyebolt. I knew you needed to prime PE. But I thought primer was primer. Now I know it’s not. 
 

I’ve ordered a solvent-based primer for priming PE going forward. I bought the Tamiya after watching this fine scale modeler video. 
 

I’m sure this is all well-known to anyone with any modeling experience. It’s new to me. 
 

 

[palmerit]

I’m making the deck pumps and each calls for a 3mm x 25mm dowel. I couldn’t find any precut and did not see them listed separately in the parts list at the end of the instructions. 
 

There is one 3mm x 330mm dowel supplied. From that, I’ll need to make the upper yard (3mm x 129mm) and middle yard (3mm x 170mm). Adding those two up, it’s 299mm, leaving only 31mm left on the 330mm long 3mm dowel. 
 

Am I just confused, missing a part to complete the deck pumps, misreading the instructions, or are the pumps not supposed to be 25mm high, or made from a different width dowel? 

[palmerit]

A great thing about Vanguard's models is that the guy who owns it (Chris Watton) is on here and responds to your messages unbelievably quickly. Thanks Chris. 
 

He suggested these should be 15mm each, not 25mm each, meaning there is enough in the supplied 3mm dowel. I would have done that (or bought a dowel from a hobby shop) but wanted to make sure I wasn’t misreading something. 

Edited October 9, 2024 by palmerit

[palmerit]

Been adding parts to the deck. I just have to do the cannon a bit more pieces and then it’ll be on to the masts. 

 

[Stuka]

Its looking really good! 

[Olli Sukunimisson]

Super! Looks really, really well painted.

[AJohnson]

Very neat, great painting 👍 

[chris watton]

That does look really nice!

 

I shall tell you a secret about the stove chimney - After I received the photo etched sheets for Sherbourne, I realised to my horror that I had forgot to add the chimney to the sheet, too late to change it, as I already ordered the production parts. So I had to design one for 3-d printing instead, but in the end, it worked out fine....

Edited October 13, 2024 by chris watton

[Ronald-V]

Nice clean lines! Really nice  

[palmerit]

A possible suggestion for the pure novices like me:

 

I really haven’t liked worked with CA (super) glue. For my next double planked hull, I’ll probable try using wood glue and clamps, even if it makes the second planking take 4x as long. 
 

But you can’t get around using CA with PE (photoetch). It’s not as much of a challenge (for me) when doing something like glueing in an eyelet or belaying pin: I just dip the end of the piece into a small pearl of glue and then insert it in place.

 

It was using CA on flat PE parts that gave me a headache: such as the tiny Roman numerals on the prow. When poking around on some general modeling YouTube videos on using PE I saw the suggestion of instead using a flat clear acrylic print instead of CA (which I later read in some instructions for another Vanguard model). Being paint, it’s slow to dry. And it stays flat (both physically and in sheen). 
 

I used Tamiya XF-86 Flat Clear to attach the hinges on the companionway. After everything gets a matte varnish, I’m guessing it’ll all be as secure as if I had used CE. 

Edited October 13, 2024 by palmerit

[palmerit]

Another couple of things that have been really helpful is an Optivisor and really fine point paint brushes. 
 

I bought an Optivisor with a 2.75x lens with a Optiloupe auxiliary lens (which gives another 2.5x in one eye). I bought mine from Otto Frei (I buy tons of stuff on Amazon, but I don’t trust resellers). 

I wear my eyeglasses while wearing the Optivisor. And it rotates up so I don’t need to take it on and off. 

 

I buy brushes at a local art supply store. I started with what I thought were really small 1, 0, and 000 brushes. But I’ve since bought a 00000 and a tiny 18/0 for painting while using the Optivisor. 

Edited October 13, 2024 by palmerit

[Knocklouder]

You can use this instead of CA, it dries clear , and washs off with water. I did the copper on my Pegasus as well as the PE for it and the Duchess of Kingston.  It worked really well for me, but this is only my opinion. 

Bob  M.

 

Ps. I forgot to say ,  Hello palmerit

Edited October 13, 2024 by Knocklouder
More info

[palmerit]

Starting the production line to make the cannons. Definitely easier with an airbrush. 

[Nick 843]

On the CA glue thing, you might want to try microbrushes, see the pic in Knocklouder's post above.  I use them a lot with resin models, also PE.  You can position the two pieces against each other, and just a dab with the microbrush lets the CA run along with the capillary action.  There are various sizes of microbrush.

[palmerit]

Worked on the cannon for my Sherbourne. They’re just placed, not glued down (I need to do some touch up painting). 

[EspenT]

Hello @palmerit

This is looking very nice. It looks like I am a few few behind you in the hobby and it is nice to see how others are solving problems.

I especially like that you are using the airbrush. As you, I have aslo built some plastic models and there airbrushing is really the only option. It seems like it is not so common on wooden ships. I have some questions related to the painting that I hope you can answer.

 

- Could you list the Vallejo names/codes that you have used please?

- Did you also airbrush the hull?

- Did you thin the Vallejo paint 50/50 with water or thinner/retarder? Or does wood require a different mix?

 

I am looking forward to see you next updates.

 

EDIT: one more question: How many coats of paint did you spray?

Edited November 4, 2024 by EspenT

[palmerit]

What’s especially nice with the airbrush is that all the engraved (laser etched) details on a Vanguard model pieces stay perfectly sharp. I suppose if you have a deft hand and really thin down the paint you could do the same with a brush. I couldn’t. 

Here are the paints I used (I also used copper for the PE used along the hull) - they were recommended by James H, who builds the Vanguard prototypes. I bought some regular (not airbrush) versions of the same paints for when I need to paint or touch up with a brush (I found the airbrush paints often too thin for a brush).
 

I found https://www.scalehobbyist.com to have a good selection and the best prices (at least in the US). Also https://andyshhq.com. The resellers on Amazon often charge 3-4x as much. I have restocked things like Vallejo thinner from Amazon, taking advantage of the free shipping, but you can find that sold by Amazon instead of a reseller. 
 

Vallejo acrylic primer doesn’t work on PE (unless you treat it or sandpaper it). I bought Tamiya non-acrylic primer to use with PE instead based on recommendations online (it’s in a spray can because I didn’t want to mess with non-acrylic in my airbrush). 
 

The formula I found online is 70% Vallejo Flow Improver, 30% Vallejo Thinner, and 10% Vallejo Retarder. Yeah, I know it doesn’t add up to 100%. The guy online I saw recommend it maybe failed his middle school math classes, but the formula works (if you just translate to a 7:3:1 ratio). I put the mixture in a dropper bottle. A mix of 50% this brew to 50% Vallejo airbrush paint works for me. I run my compressor at about 25psi. If using Vallejo primer, I add more of the mixture relative to paint and increase the pressure to 40psi. 
 

I also use Vallejo Matte Varnish. 
 

I tried to use Vallejo non-airbrush paint with something like a 10:1 ratio and it was a mess and I needed to take the airbrush apart to clean it. Mine is an Iwata and I have the Iwata airbrush cleaning fluid. 
 

After airbrushing, I first clean with warm water, then run through with thinner, then with Iwata cleaner (I’ll just use water and thinner if I’m just changing paints). I’m a novice but that works for me. 

I’ve also done a little bit of plastic modeling and I didn’t see much of a difference. Wood doesn’t need primer like plastic or PE does. 
 

In terms of coats, probably 3-4. I did way more than that on the hull because after painting I saw that the hull needed more filling and sanding. It’s often the case that a coat of paint will really highlight the blemishes. It was probably 10-12 times on the hull because I really couldn’t stand some of the obvious blemishes. It’s not perfect by any means but way better than how it started. 

Edited November 5, 2024 by palmerit

[palmerit]

Oh, and I read not to use water with Vallejo paints. It's some kind of combo of Vallejo product that works best (some just use thinner, a lot recommend some combination of also flow improver and retarder too). Some say water is fine - and it's cheap. But I've seen folks do comparisons and the products work a lot better.

[EspenT]

Thank you so much for the detailed write up. 

[palmerit]

I fed the thick rope anchor line through the grating, which was a bit of a challenge since the holes are about the same thickness as the rope. I created a separate post asking for tricks on how to feed thick rope through a small hole and one recommendation was to use CA glue on the end, let it dry, and the cut the end to a point. I’ll try that next time. I ended up pushing the rope through the hole with the pointing end of a small file. 
 

I glued the hatch (with the anchor ropes) to the deck. I also had glued down the guns. I think all the deck “furniture” is done (one of the guns needs to be glued down again) and the masts and then the rigging are next. 
 

I also assembled the anchors. I wasn’t quite sure how to add the black strips of paper (supplied in the kit) to the anchors. I glued an end to the anchor. I’m planning to let the strip dry and then wrap around the anchor and glue in place. We’ll see how it goes. 

 

NOTE: One pointer for folks doing this model (or any model). When you create your guns, check that all four wheels will lay flush to the deck before the final gluing. There's the part at the back end of each gun that looks like a shim - I read that it was used to raise and lower the barrel. I placed that shim either to far forward or too far backward on some guns (I'd need to play around with the geometry) and so some of the gun barrels would not raise enough to poke out of the gun ports while keeping the four wheels flush to the deck. One of those (many) small consequences I guess you learn to keep an eye out for when building these models.

Edited December 16, 2024 by palmerit

[wool132]

Another thank you for sharing all of your discoveries and mistakes during this build!

They have been quite helpful especially the mistakes and recoveries 🙂. They give me a heads-up on pitfalls dead ahead not only on the Sherbourne but other (Vanguard) models as well.

 

Jonathan

 

[palmerit]

I haven't yet begun the rigging on my Sherbourne, in part because I've been trying to read build logs for tips and recommendations. I'm planning to post some of those here (for my reference, for others to check out). I'll update this post as I find more.

 

Here's one on the NRG Rigging Project build that illustrates shrouds, ratlines, deadeyes: 

 

 

 

[palmerit]

I did finally finish the anchors. The black straps are made from thin strips of thick black paper that you cut from a small supplied sheet. I started by glueing the strips to the bottom of the cross piece a letting them dry (I intended overnight but it was actually for a few days). Then I glued one strip to one side, let that dry for a few minutes, then glued the next strip to to one side and let that dry, and so on. Then I went back to the first strip and glued to the next side and let that dry, and so on. I kept the strips far too long, in part because I wasn’t sure if I should wrap once or twice. I ended up wrapping just once around. I cut the excess when I got all the way around. 

[palmerit]

I think I’ve hit the first point where the instructions leave me a bit befuddled. I’m at the point of shaping the masts and spars, which I think I know how to do. I’m not entirely sure the best way to tie the blocks onto the masts and spars. I see where to tie them on the plans. I’m not sure how - what kind of knot to use etc. If someone can point me to a good tutorial it’s be appreciated. 

[chris watton]

There is this in the manual you have (Page 48):

 

You can apply this method for tying blocks in most instances. It is just a simple knot, but some prefer to go further and simulate a seizing using their preferred methods.

If the block is tied directly to a mast or yard, then add the block to the thread first (rather than after if it’s tied to an eyelet, as shown) and then wrap the thread around the mast or yard and secure it with another knot and apply a little glue to secure it before snipping off the excess. If another block is fitted in the same position on the opposite side, then tie a knot as with the single block, and then, as shown in the above images, add the block as shown above.
 

[palmerit]

I saw that but I wasn’t sure if that worked for all the blocks. Thanks!