HMS Royal William by KeithW - Euromodel - 1/72

BANYAN · February 11, 2015

Quite the adventure you're having with this build Keith. An enjoyable log to follow.

cheers

Pat

Keith_W · February 17, 2015

Hi all, thanks for the likes and commens! Time for an update.

The wales have gone on the ship. The vertical bend was first achieved by soaking the wood for 48 hours, and then clamping it tightly to a jig. Once dried, they have to be used within hours of being removed from the jig, otherwise they will straighten up again!

The lower wale was made from kit supplied walnut, dyed black. Once lightly sanded, the lustre of the walnut shines through the black.It is a marvellous (but totally unintended) effect. The walnut wale was incredibly difficult to get on. As noted by others, Feast Watson stains reject CA glue, even though they are water based! My first effort resulted in the wales falling off time and again until I thoroughly sanded off all the stain from the contact surfaces.

The upper wale was made from pear, which I milled from a block supplied by Hobbymill. Pear is a much nicer wood to work with - it is softer, finer grained, cuts cleanly, and much easier to sand. It was MUCH easier fitting the pear wales than the walnut thanks to its bending properties. My first attempt at finding the line of the upper wale involved tediously reading the plans, but then it was much easier to simply run a compass across the top of the lower wale.

Once done, the metal pieces were test fitted.

This is a close-up of the metal pieces. You can see the difference between the metal pieces at the stern (which I have cleaned of all moulding flash), and the metal pieces at the bow, which I have not yet touched. Note that the total length of the pieces is more than adequate to cover the length of the ship, even will the side strakes taken into account.

Having done all that, I started work on the deck furniture.

I was not happy with the kit supplied capstan, so I turned my own on the lathe. It took me all day to make a capstan. Why?

Because of numerous failures and because i'm still learning how to use my lathe properly! Here are the failures lined up before my final successful attempt on the right.

I also fabricated the ship's stove. Note that I have deviated from the plans suggested by Euromodel. Euromodel suggests that the chimney is square and opens up directly to the sky. This means that any rain or seawater will fall directly into the fire, quenching it. My research suggests that chimneys were angled rearwards, and had a moveable cover - so that's what I made.

The rest of the stove will be hidden below deck, so I did not bother detailing the stove very much. There IS detail from where the stove can potentially be seen - from the back (peeking below the deck), from the top (through the grating), and from the side (through the gunports). But the front of the stove is pretty much left as it is.

The "bricks" that the stove is sitting on is simply painted plastic. I could have done a much better job if I had used masking tape, but I decided that nobody is ever going to see my shoddy paintwork, so I painted the bricks freehand.

Many MSW members like to pose a scale figurine on their model. I thought I would get some practice with my lathe by turning a 1/72 Android figurine out of aluminum stock. Cute fella, isn't he?

I have also made a start on the gun carriages. I first attempted to make these on the milling machine, but after cranking those knobs I became fed up very quickly. It was MUCH faster to make them on the table saw!

That's it for now. Thanks for dropping in.

Edited February 17, 2015 by KeithW

maggsl_01 · February 17, 2015

Hi Keith,

first: a really great build and a impressing Job... esp your attempts on the lathe Show me that I am not alone with all the failures I produce with that machine I think it is quite helpful to see also the mistakes that happen... You can learn more from a mistake than you believe (in my expierence).

Is that guy R2D2 from starwars? Or at least a klone? Very cute to see how the good old past is connected with the days in future... That a living Hobby...

Cheerio

Max

Keith_W · February 17, 2015

Hello Max, thanks for your comment! That little robot is Google's Android mascot ... https://www.android.com/

maggsl_01 · February 17, 2015

Hi Keith...

oh yes... and now I know why I thought of my phone when I saw this guy but didn't understand ... getting older from day to day... and so more memories are present than the presence is...

Cheerio

Max

BANYAN · February 17, 2015

Great effort with the lathe Keith. What cutting tools did you use, the standard bits for metal or did you remove the tool post and use hand held wood cutting tools?

cheers

Pat

Keith_W · February 17, 2015

Hi Pat, I initially used the cutting tools for metal on the wood. Despite a lot of experimenting I could not eliminate chatter and poor finish, with a number of pieces breaking off. I only achieved success when I switched to my Proxxon woodturning chisel set. Till now I still don't understand why the HSS bit that slices aluminum like butter should utterly fail with wood!

The procedure for making the capstan was as follows. Sorry, no pictures ... I was "in the zone" and did not feel like stopping to take pictures.

- machine out a ring from tube aluminum stock using Sherline HSS cutter

- cut out an appropriately sized blank of pear wood using table saw

- mount blank on lathe, swap out the HSS cutter for the Sherline T-rest

- turn the blank until it is cylindrical, check it is the correct diameter and sand it

- swap position of T-rest to make the top cap of the capstan. Carve out a ring and make sure the aluminum ring fits. Cut off the top cap from stock.

- use rotary table on Proxxon MF70 mill to locate and drill 8 holes, then plug holes with brass wire

- in the meantime, turn out the rest of the capstan on the lathe

- transfer the rest of the capstan to the MF70 mill. Using the rotary table and a 1.7mm end mill, machine 8 lines into the top of the capstan for the square holes.

- glue the top cap back on the capstan

- make the whelks and glue them on the capstan

- mount the finished capstan back on the lathe and give it a final sand and polish.

... quite an involved procedure. That's why it took so long.

(edit) oh yes. The biggest discovery of the day was that the four jaw chuck is a massive pain in the rear when it comes to mounting items consistently! If you remove something from the lathe and mount it again later, it will no longer be centered EVEN IF you do what I did - take note of the orientation of the piece AND the exact number of turns to tighten the jaws.

If you want to remove a piece and still have it centered when you mount it back, use the 3 jaw chuck. However - 3 jaws can't hold square stock. So I carved the pear blank into a cylinder using the 4 jaw chuck. I then removed the 4 jaw chuck and mounted the 3 jaw chuck. Flip the pear blank around so that the chuck is gripping the cylinder, then carve the square stock round.

Edited February 18, 2015 by KeithW

rshousha · February 18, 2015

Hi Keith,

Will you be needing a sheet of my gun port hinges . The corrected version should be ready in April.

Regards,

Rick

Keith_W · February 18, 2015

Hi Rick, I will definitely need a set of your gunport hinges! I'm keeping an eye out on your thread to see when your final version is ready.

A quick question - are you able to do one off photo-etch jobs? I can supply the drawings in .PSD (photoshop) format, which I understand can be converted to .DXF (AutoCAD) format. May not be so one-off, I think that other RW builders would be interested as well. I need the decorations done in Photo-etch, try as I might I am unable to think of a way to scratchbuild them.

Edited February 18, 2015 by KeithW

Keith_W · February 20, 2015

Good morning! Time for an update.

The scratchbuilt gun carriages have been completed - along with eye rings, simulated rivets, and quoin. The quoin handles were made from the heads of the smallest belaying pins I could find at my hobby shop (Float-A-Boat). At $2 for a pack of 10, this sure beat trying to turn them myself.

A comparison of the kit supplied gun carriage and the scratchbuilt version with my 1/72 scale Android. You can see that it is exactly the same size and height. I ignored the suggested dimensions in the plans because I located the height of my gunports using the kit supplied carriage. This meant that I had to take the measurements off the kit supplied gun carriage but use a design which I completely copied from Chuck Passaro's practicum on MSW.

You may wonder why there is a red stripe there. The answer - it makes it much easier to paint later. I painted the plank and installed it. That way, you get a nice, sharp line without having to mask. I haven't gotten around to painting the rest yet.

You can also see that I have pre-drilled the holes for the gun rigging ... BEFORE the second planking layer goes on. This was a bit of foresight to prevent accidentally drilling holes from the inside to the outside and ruining the outside finish.

I decided to scratchbuild the decoration that goes above the front bulkhead as well. Two strips of pear were cut with the table saw, then run through the thickness sander until they were 1.8mm thick each. They were then lightly glued together with PVA (generic PVA, NOT Titebond!). The required outline was drawn out in pencil, then they were carved together. After this, it was mounted on my mill to drill 40 holes, spaced 4mm apart (I do not own a drill press). This ensured that they were exact duplicates. They then were soaked in water. This dissolves the PVA and the pieces came apart.

I am not sure if anyone has thought of this idea, I came up with it myself. If so, maybe I can claim to have invented a new technique!

The balustrades were formed with my "bead on a wire" trick described earlier. They were then painted with metal primer (Admiralty paints), then painted gold (Vallejo Old Gold). After 24 hours curing time, they were pushed into the holes drilled earlier and secured with CA.

This is a comparison of the scratchbuilt decoration compared with the part supplied by Euromodel. I think the scratchbuilt version looks miles better!

I started work on the front bulkhead and the "seats of ease". Measurements were taken from the ship, then a ply template was created. I progressively shaved off wood until it fit the front bulkhead exactly. Here you can see two attempts - the first attempt was created before I realized that I had forgotten to take into account the camber of the fo'c'sle deck! Back to the drawing board, had to make another one.

The seats were formed by cutting a 12mm dowel 60/40, and using the thicker piece. The windows for the seats of ease were turned from aluminum stock on my lathe. I am getting quite good at this now, I have to say! The walls of those round windows are 0.3mm thick!

Front bulkhead completed and painted. A quick discussion of the painting of the front bulkhead is in order. Euromodel's plans appear to take after the model of the Royal William in the NMM. When I visited the NMM last year, I took this photo:

As you can see, it is quite plain. However, the Royal William in the USNA collection looks completely different. I am unable to find a better photo than this one:

It is much more elaborate. Victor Yancovitch's Royal William also shows a more elaborately painted front bulkhead:

Having seen these, I came up with my own paint scheme.

A close up of my painting, with a hidden message for my wife on the right pillar - her name and two hearts.

Note the handles and hinges on the doors, as well as the inlay work. The gunport was carved square and a thin red line painted.

For other RW builders: this is how the front bulkhead is located with regards to Frame 8. Note my mistake with terminating the planking early (earlier posts describe how I fixed it, but I didn't fix it enough). No matter, the second planking will be brought to the level of the front bulkhead and nobody will be any wiser.

The front bulkhead dry fitted on the ship.

Hello there!!

CaptainSteve · February 20, 2015

Exquisite work there, Keith !!

Your personal touches make your RW stand out from the crowd.

pirozzi · February 20, 2015

Good morning! Time for an update.

241C2529.JPG

The scratchbuilt gun carriages have been completed - along with eye rings, simulated rivets, and quoin. The quoin handles were made from the heads of the smallest belaying pins I could find at my hobby shop (Float-A-Boat). At $2 for a pack of 10, this sure beat trying to turn them myself.

241C2520.JPG 241C2523.JPG

A comparison of the kit supplied gun carriage and the scratchbuilt version with my 1/72 scale Android. You can see that it is exactly the same size and height. I ignored the suggested dimensions in the plans because I located the height of my gunports using the kit supplied carriage. This meant that I had to take the measurements off the kit supplied gun carriage but use a design which I completely copied from Chuck Passaro's practicum on MSW.

You may wonder why there is a red stripe there. The answer - it makes it much easier to paint later. I painted the plank and installed it. That way, you get a nice, sharp line without having to mask. I haven't gotten around to painting the rest yet.

You can also see that I have pre-drilled the holes for the gun rigging ... BEFORE the second planking layer goes on. This was a bit of foresight to prevent accidentally drilling holes from the inside to the outside and ruining the outside finish.

241C2499.JPG

I decided to scratchbuild the decoration that goes above the front bulkhead as well. Two strips of pear were cut with the table saw, then run through the thickness sander until they were 1.8mm thick each. They were then lightly glued together with PVA (generic PVA, NOT Titebond!). The required outline was drawn out in pencil, then they were carved together. After this, it was mounted on my mill to drill 40 holes, spaced 4mm apart (I do not own a drill press). This ensured that they were exact duplicates. They then were soaked in water. This dissolves the PVA and the pieces came apart.

I am not sure if anyone has thought of this idea, I came up with it myself. If so, maybe I can claim to have invented a new technique!

241C2515.JPG 241C2517.JPG

The balustrades were formed with my "bead on a wire" trick described earlier. They were then painted with metal primer (Admiralty paints), then painted gold (Vallejo Old Gold). After 24 hours curing time, they were pushed into the holes drilled earlier and secured with CA.

This is a comparison of the scratchbuilt decoration compared with the part supplied by Euromodel. I think the scratchbuilt version looks miles better!

241C2514.JPG

I started work on the front bulkhead and the "seats of ease". Measurements were taken from the ship, then a ply template was created. I progressively shaved off wood until it fit the front bulkhead exactly. Here you can see two attempts - the first attempt was created before I realized that I had forgotten to take into account the camber of the fo'c'sle deck! Back to the drawing board, had to make another one.

The seats were formed by cutting a 12mm dowel 60/40, and using the thicker piece. The windows for the seats of ease were turned from aluminum stock on my lathe. I am getting quite good at this now, I have to say! The walls of those round windows are 0.3mm thick!

241C2518.JPG

Front bulkhead completed and painted. A quick discussion of the painting of the front bulkhead is in order. Euromodel's plans appear to take after the model of the Royal William in the NMM. When I visited the NMM last year, I took this photo:

241C2169.jpg

As you can see, it is quite plain. However, the Royal William in the USNA collection looks completely different. I am unable to find a better photo than this one:

2009-10-03 - usna museum - 078 - royal william - 1st rate 100-gun ship of 1719 (bow) - _dsc7467.jpg

It is much more elaborate. Victor Yancovitch's Royal William also shows a more elaborately painted front bulkhead:

P1000591ab.jpg

Having seen these, I came up with my own paint scheme.

241C2519.JPG

A close up of my painting, with a hidden message for my wife on the right pillar - her name and two hearts.

Note the handles and hinges on the doors, as well as the inlay work. The gunport was carved square and a thin red line painted.

241C2524.JPG

For other RW builders: this is how the front bulkhead is located with regards to Frame 8. Note my mistake with terminating the planking early (earlier posts describe how I fixed it, but I didn't fix it enough). No matter, the second planking will be brought to the level of the front bulkhead and nobody will be any wiser.

241C2527.JPG

The front bulkhead dry fitted on the ship.

241C2526.JPG

Hello there!!

Great job Keith. I was also planning to build these parts from scratch. I will follow your lead on this. Thanks.

Vince P.

GuntherMT · February 21, 2015

Gorgeous work Keith. Curiosity though - why did you point out 'not Titebond' as far as glue, is there an issue with Titebond?

Keith_W · February 21, 2015

Thanks for your likes and comments, Steve, Vince, Brian, and Gunther. Steve, I might point out that there is hardly a "crowd" of RW builders, only four of us building from the kit and another 2 scratch builders who are both doing a far better job than I could ever dream of doing.

Gunther, the reason I say not to use Titebond is because it doesn't dissolve so readily in water. There is something about the formulation of Titebond that makes it cure faster, cure stronger, and is more water resistant than normal PVA. All of these are desirable qualities, but not when you want to make a temporary bond!

GuntherMT · February 21, 2015

Ah, that's good stuff to know if I ever want to try a trick like you did there. Thanks!

Greg the peg leg sailor · February 22, 2015

G'day Keith,

I loooove you front bulk head, the balustrades are a piece of art - there's no comparison between yours an the kit. WELL DONE. The front bulk head's painting is great beyond words. (Love the hidden message). I'm sure, the second planking will fix up your earlier"boo boo".

I keep the pixs coming.

Cheers

Greg

Keith_W · February 24, 2015

Thanks Greg, to be honest I am not very happy with it. I can see the brush marks on the front bulkhead, and IMO that's not good enough. I have been thinking of doing it again, but I have been practicing my painting and I can't seem to get good enough such that brush marks are not visible. I may have to live with it.

A few more words about those infernal transom pieces, 54 and 55. I have FINALLY completed them and mounted the lower transom piece on the ship.

If you recall, this was what it last looked like when I showed the piece on MSW. I was pretty happy with it, until I realized a few things.

Firstly, the plans called for the pieces to be bent with a 2mm deflection from the center to the sides. I soaked the pieces in ammonia for 12 hours, then boiled it. No luck. I soaked it again for 48 hours, then boiled it, then mounted it on my vise. Still no luck! I mounted it on an appropriately curved piece, then drove my car over it*. Still nothing!

(* The reason I am so brave with my abuse of this piece is because I know that it is relatively easy to fabricate a new piece from scratch)

In the end, I decided to shim it and then shape it on the disc sanderso that it attained the correct cross section when viewed from the rear. The holes that you can see are mounting holes for dowels, to hold both pieces together to check for alignment and shape. I FINALLY managed to get the correct profile.

The next thing I noticed was this:

(From top to bottom: John Clevely's painting of the Royal George in the NMM; Royal William model in the USNA; Victor Yankovitch's model of the Royal William)

The arrows indicate that the lower transom piece has a distinct concave profile. Note that this is not indicated in Euromodel's plans, nor does Pete's I-I take note of it.

Glad that I realized this before mounting it on the ship, I gave the lower transom piece a distinct concave profile. It looks more graceful now, I think.

Keith_W · February 24, 2015

I thought that MSW'ers might be interested in how I fabricated the replacements for metal pieces 11241 etc from scratch. These metal pieces are meant to be decorative strips on the edges of transom pieces 54 and 55.

I decided to engrave a profile on a 3mm x 2mm styrene strip, using my Proxxon MF70 milling machine. But, how do you hold down a thin, long piece like that on a milling machine?

The answer is to fabricate your own hold-down piece.

On the right is a piece of acrylic. Two holes were drilled on either end. It does not matter that they are not square to the piece. The acrylic piece was then mounted on the machine, using screws in the two holes to mount the piece to the table. Now a 3mm wide and 1mm deep slot was machined into the acrylic piece. A thin piece of acrylic was glued into this slot to act as a fence. Given that the machine itself milled the slot, the fence was guaranteed to be square.

The piece on the left had a thin strip of styrene glued on it. You can see from the first picture that there is a slight gap in the styrene. This is where the milling head goes through. This acts as something like a "fingerboard".

This is the complete setup, complete with hold down step clamp to keep the fingerboard in place. A completed styrene strip with a channel milled in it is also shown.

The setup at work.

And finally, the completed transom piece 55 mounted on the ship, with the decorative pieces attached. Note that I have also fitted the lower mahogany piece 56 as well. I didn't do quite a good job as I would have liked shaping it, but a tiny bit of filler and paint takes care of it. Not that anybody is going to look under the ship and up at the transom piece, but at least I know that it has been neatly closed over!

I have also painted a little decorative motif on the rudder, and follow the black line through from the wales, to the transom, and on to the rudder. I saw it on the USNA RW.

The gunports have been simulated by carving a square outline and painting it red.

Keith_W · February 27, 2015

Here are some gratuitous shots of the model, as she is at the moment.

The second planking has been carried through to the top. Above this level will be painted black ... and I still have plenty of pear strips left. I think I will save them and revert back to kit supplied second planking material, since it will be hidden under the paint.

Other RW builders might notice that ALL the cannon ports (except for the first ones at the bow) are open and can receive cannons! This involved a little bit of engineering to hack away at the bulkheads blocking the cannon openings and finding other ways to reinforce the bulkheads. Because I needed more cannon to fill these open ports, I ordered more from Euromodel. They arrived from Italy in less than a week.

Don't worry, that smiley face will be hidden by a gun port. Yet to clean up the bow area. Will leave final sanding till after I install the treenails. Waiting for my laser marker to arrive before doing so.

Rear bulkhead and stairwell dry fitted, and illumination tested.

View from the front, showing off her lines.

DenPink · February 27, 2015

Hi Keith

Love your work.

I am a bit worried about leaving that tape on, I do hope it comes off OK.

Denis

Edited February 27, 2015 by Denis Pink

GLakie · February 27, 2015

Hi Keith:

Been going over your build of the RW for a while now and think you're doing a great job! I admire your dedication to detail and getting things right before committing. A pure pleasure to watch!

Cheers

Keith_W · February 27, 2015

Thank you Denis and George. Denis, this is the second time I am putting the masking tape on. The first time, I left it on for a few weeks before removing it to install the wales, rudder, etc. There was no problem with removing the tape. This time, I reduced the tack of the tape a little by sticking it on my tablecloth first before applying it to the model. So it should be even safer

Tuffarts · February 27, 2015

Keith,

I know you have taken precautions with the tape but if the model is exposed to warm weather, the tape will be really difficult to remove.

You can dust things with talc before masking to make it easier to remove after long time

Greg the peg leg sailor · February 27, 2015

G'day Keith.

YOUR WORKMANSHIP IS OUTSTANDING! and I'm not confusing you with another person (Private joke) Lol. Glad to hear that Euromodel is so helpful.

Cheers mate

Greg

Keith_W · February 28, 2015

Thank you everyone for your likes and comments.

I have encountered another contradiction in the plans. I suspect that nobody out there can help, given that I am the only RW builder so far to have reached this particular stage of construction.

Right now I am looking at construction of the stern decks and decorations. This involves fitting a side trim (supplied by Euromodel, Parts 53/53A,52/52A, and 51/51A):

Note that the side trim parts are depicted flush with the deck.

However, this did not look right to me. The decks do not follow the transom inclination, which means that the side trim parts would be at a different angle to all the features constructed below it. I looked at the other plans, and sure enough:

Another plan sheet suggests that the side trim parts are angled differently to the deck, and therefore are NOT flush with the deck.

I consulted my usual references to see how others dealt with the problem. Julier does not mention it. As for Pete, on p.34 onwards of his Intepretive Info", he constructs a new deck.

Something tells me that I will need to chop off BOTH the quarterdeck and the poop deck, and construct new decks in order to achieve the correct inclination. Perhaps the quarterdeck only. This then raises all sorts of questions as to how I am going to support a deck which is essentially hanging in thin air, and with a whole bunch of heavy metal decorations to be cantilevered off it later.

It is very difficult to take measurements off decks which are flexible and hanging free in the air! I will have a think about this, measure a little more, and report back. In the meantime, if other RW builders have taken a look at this, please feel free to say something!

Edited February 28, 2015 by KeithW

Keith_W · February 28, 2015

I am building mine in a different order, so in some areas of the build, you are ahead I decided I would look at the most challenging aspect of the build early, so that I don't set any mistakes "in wood" and then encounter an irreversible problem later!

Greg the peg leg sailor · February 28, 2015

G'day Keith

I might be the right person to answer you on your question. I have not done RW model, but someday, I hope to do one. I have been reading all I can, and on Euromodel website I read a log by Peter Coward, and he mentioned this problem. Attached is a diagram he went by. He thought that there are many RW models being made with a twisted stern. It's a good read, and he explained that the balcony should follow the decking as per his diagram.

Hope this helps

Cheers

Greg

Greg the peg leg sailor · February 28, 2015

G'day Keith again

Elsewhere is got a chapter about this. Attached is a screen shot,

Cheers

Greg

Keith_W · February 28, 2015

Thanks Greg, I assure you I have thoroughly combed the I-I on the RW and come across both links that you mention. Your first post refers to a set of plans for scratchbuilding the ship. It is true, the balcony should follow the deck. However, if I did so, it would be at the incorrect angle. The stern is meant to follow the line of the wales (see fig. 27 in your second post). Unfortunately, as Euromodel's own plans indicate, the line of the wales, and the line of the deck, are two different things.

Greg the peg leg sailor · February 28, 2015

G'day Keith

Sorry I can't help you, just showing my ignorance I guess thinking that I could. I know you will do the right thing.

You will be a great help for me and others we when it's our time building the RW.

Cheers

Greg

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HMS Royal William by KeithW - Euromodel - 1/72

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