ccoyle

I hear what you're saying, Andy, and like I said, I like the railroading/aircraft distinction between the two terms.  But don't expect MSW to issue a policy ruling on the matter anytime soon.  If the more universally accepted understanding of kit-bashing is to become the norm around here, it will have to be via that narrower definition coming into common usage among the members. 
 
Cheers!

I kinda like Andy's definition of kit-bashing vs. super-detailing.  However, around here I think you will find the two terms are used more or less interchangeably.

I hear what you're saying, Andy, and like I said, I like the railroading/aircraft distinction between the two terms.  But don't expect MSW to issue a policy ruling on the matter anytime soon.  If the more universally accepted understanding of kit-bashing is to become the norm around here, it will have to be via that narrower definition coming into common usage among the members. 
 
Cheers!

Today, before I sand and Varnish the Hull, I decided to add some birch ply to the forward Cockpit bulkhead and the rear deck Cockpit station and stained them a cherry red. I started by laying out the ply using the plans, I then cut them out and glued them in, and then stained them Next I cut out the floor and cut out birch ply for the rear deck. And lastly I cut out the seat benches. Next will be to sand and varnish the Hull. Here are the results

I kinda like Andy's definition of kit-bashing vs. super-detailing.  However, around here I think you will find the two terms are used more or less interchangeably.

I hear what you're saying, Andy, and like I said, I like the railroading/aircraft distinction between the two terms.  But don't expect MSW to issue a policy ruling on the matter anytime soon.  If the more universally accepted understanding of kit-bashing is to become the norm around here, it will have to be via that narrower definition coming into common usage among the members. 
 
Cheers!

I kinda like Andy's definition of kit-bashing vs. super-detailing.  However, around here I think you will find the two terms are used more or less interchangeably.

Yes, especially the butapren, which apparently isn't available in America.  I still don't know to this day exactly what sort of glue butapren is, but I do know that it is the glue of choice in the Polish card modelling community, and they include some of the finest practitioners of the art.  I sure would like to know why the stuff is so special.

Steamboats played a significant role west of the Rockies, too.  Many of the rivers that drain into the Pacific were navigable far upstream from their mouths, especially in the days prior to large-scale dam construction.

American western river steamboats represent a unique form of shipbuilding. Designed and built on the American frontier during the core of the 19th century, such boats rapidly evolved to fit the specific needs of the great inland river systems that drained inland North America. In this build I will replicate a typical specimen of this design, the steamboat Bertrand, trying to accurately duplicate the features of these fascinating vessels. I hope you’ll follow along, both to enjoy the construction, and to learn about this obscure but fascinating (to me, at least) part of maritime transportation history. These boats are almost, but not entirely, unlike an ocean-going vessel of the same period, in large part due to the demands of their specific riverine habitat. Below, my updated workbench with Bertrand profile on the wall for inspiration.
 

 
The “western” in western river steamboat refers to the landscape between the Appalachian and Rocky Mountains. Over the course of the 19th century, this area went from the mostly unknown wilderness of Lewis & Clark’s 1804 expedition up the Missouri River, to a land mostly settled and integrated into the United States by the dawn of the 20th century. Most of this landscape centers on the Mississippi River basin, including its major tributaries such as the Ohio and Missouri Rivers. This system drains over 1 million square miles (almost 3 million square km), covering parts of 31 American states and 2 Canadian provinces. Almost all the rivers in the system were navigable in the 19th century for most of their lengths, creating a vast trade and transportation network across the continent’s interior long before railroads appeared on the scene, when roads were all but non-existent (map below from National Park Service).
 

 
The Bertand, built in 1864 and sunk in 1865, was a wholly typical and unremarkable western river steamer, except for its rediscovery beneath a US Wildlife Refuge along the Iowa/Nebraska border in 1968. The boat and its cargo were remarkably well-preserved, due to quick burial beneath river sediment by the quickly changing channel of the Missouri River, and the anoxic environment thus produced. The Bertrand’s mint-condition cargo is now on display at a fascinating museum at the DeSoto National Wildlife Refuge, which also hosts a detailed large-scale model of the craft (shown below). The archeological excavation of the craft resulted in a plethora of information about period steamboat construction. In pairing with the later, but similar, discovery of the sunken steamboat Arabia along the Kansas/Missouri border and subsequent founding of a similar museum in Kansas City, the two wrecks represent a spectacular repository of historical and maritime knowledge and preservation. Below, the gorgeous large-scale model of Bertrand at DeSoto (FWS photo).
 

 
I live and farm near the Missouri River, and have long been fascinated by the history of its steamboats. My first-ever attempt at wooden ship modeling was a scratchbuilt version of the Far West, perhaps the most famous of its class, a sternwheeler which ascended the Missouri and Yellowstone Rivers to extraordinary distances, and carried General Custer’s troops to and from the infamous Battle of Little Big Horn. The Bertrand is a similar craft to the Far West, which was built to ascent the shallow, treacherous river to Montana, while the Arabia was a sidewheeler more typical  of the lower Missouri River below Omaha, Nebraska (and the Ohio and Mississippi). I had initially intended to build the Arabia next, but due to a lack of available plans, and my inability to make it to Kansas City to do research at her eponymous museum, I changed my focus to the Bertrand. Below, my model of the Far West for context:
 

 
I’ve had plans for the Bertrand for several years, having purchased them at the same time as my Far West plans, and consulted them on that project. Now, the goal is a similar boat but at much greater detail: I would like to build the Bertrand frame-by-frame, just as initially constructed in the riverside yards at Wheeling, West Virginia. I have a shelf of texts on western steamboat history and construction, and several more detailed references on the excavation of the Bertrand on order through inter-library loan. I intend to leave one side of the hull unplanked, and possibly the same side of the superstructure, to show full detail throughout. Below, longitudinal internal section of the Bertrand from the plans I'll be using.
 

 
I hope you’ll join me on this (likely) wordy trek through a relatively unknown period of American maritime history and design. Few other steamboats grace this site, so I'd like to fill the gap a little with this project. I’ll try to interweave build details with explanations and demonstrations of why the boat was designed and built the way it was, to give context to this project and help share my love of these steamboats and their (my) home. This project is a significant undertaking for me, a serious step up from my previous Bounty launch kit and various smaller and less-detailed scratchbuilding efforts. I hope to be open to suggestion and advice, and I hope readers will be patient with the slow progress I'll likely make as I juggle this project with the summertime demands on my time, as well as the budget necessary to do this with my uncertain income as a self-employed farmer and writer. Welcome aboard, and unlike most boats of this type, we'll hope this one doesn't sink or blow up on the journey! 
 
UPDATE: Build completed and index available.
I finished this project in January 2016, and compiled an index of the general steps involved, with links to each one. You can review the build index here, in a post at the end of this log.

Hello all.

After completing Bluenose this will be my 2nd build. This time I wanted something with guns. There is a lot of very tempting kits and finally decided to go with Mercury, which attracted me even when I was buying my first kit.

The first impression is that this kit is of very high quality. Instructions are one of the best I have ever See, especially I like separate plan sheets for rigging which will be quite a job to do.

My plans:

-I like natural finish of wood as seen on NMM Greenwich models. This mean that most of the model is going to be unpainted, and I am going to change A LOT of materials provided in kit. For most of the build I am planning to use pear  wood, maple And some walnut. As Ebony I will stain pear wood. Today I received wood from Germany (2nd picture)  .

-There will be no coopering on hull, reason is above.

-Deck planking. Laser engraved plywood deck looks good, but not good enough for me. I will most likely use maple, but have pear For backup. As this is my second build and still don't wont to overcomplicate it I am thinking to use "normal" straight Pattern for planking like on brig Syrene for example, instead of curvature shape.

-Armament. From personal aspect I like the look of guns instead of carronades on deck more. Don't ask me why, just like them  . So I am still in research if there is any possibility that Mercury carried guns before carronades or has sister ship. This can be Seen on HMS Cruizer (guns) vs. HMS Snake (carronade) and Le Cyclope vs. Le Cygne. I have already purchased 6pdr Guns but will wait with that. If anyone could help me with this information I would very appreciate it.
 
-Sails. I am planing to do Mercury with partially set sails

Well, that's it for the moment.

Tony, that's exactly it. You almost have to build with your eyes closed so you can't see what's coming at you next 
 
I'm on a roll at the moment it seems. I decided to make a simple sliding type hatch cover for the wardroom companionway. At 1/96 it doesn't have to be that sophisticated. Needed planking, so I printed out 0.25pt lines 1/16" apart. I'm using Adobe Illustrator for a number of other tasks, so it was easy enough to fire it up and make the pattern. I'll probably add some kind of handle, either bent wire or a simple block type handle from paper. The completed piece was painted and set into place.
 
I also found an old screen in the garage. It turns out that the mesh is the exact size I need for the mullion pattern for the companion way over the captain's cabin. I pulled out a bottle of canopy glue, which I bought for another project, but didn't like the way it worked. For this one and the small glass panes, it worked great – Just squeezed a little out to fill in all the holes in the piece of screen material. Once dried it looked perfect, so I cut down to the exact size I needed and dropped it into place.
 
Lastly, I cleaned up the deck pumps after adding the "iron bands". I decided to give them natural wood looking handles instead of leaving them their printed color, which was red.
 
 
The skylight for the captain's cabin ready to trim and install.

 
 
Everything in place. The deck pumps were quite a challenge and I'm REALLY glad they're done. I will be burning incense and making offerings to the god of thin CA glue tonight. Also visible is the installed skylight and sliding hatch cover forward of that.

 
 
Small accomplishment here was adding the stern timberheads. You probably can't see it so well in the photo, but the rudder is also mounted.

 
 
So, what's next? Good question. I have no idea. Time to look at the kit drawings and get intimidated back into seclusion... But, I'm thinking about cannon barrels (make them from paper or buy or turn them?), deadeyes and chainplates, the taffrail at the stern, and the windlass assembly.
 
Oh, and I noticed that the AOTS book shows two ships boats: A 16' longboat and an 18' cutter. Don't know where these would go, but I also found that the HMS Mercury parts I'm using includes a boat that's just about 16' long. I'll look at the details of that and see if it might be useable. Not knowing where to put it, I would probably mount it as in tow behind the ship. That is, IF I decide to try building it – It seems like a whole project by itself.
 
Clare

Hey, popeye, that's the kit line I was referring to earlier.  I see on the box that the scale is 1/48, whereas Mobbsie states his model is in 1/24.

Hey, popeye, that's the kit line I was referring to earlier.  I see on the box that the scale is 1/48, whereas Mobbsie states his model is in 1/24.

Spritsail Yard
I decided the next job would be to fit and rig the spritsail yard,this has now been completed with photos below. My next job will be to add the fore ,main and mizzen braces, again leaving the gaffs and the the tac sheets for access, also at some point soon I will make up the ships boats,most likely after the braces.










 

Hey, Mobbsie, of what material was the hull of the model originally?  I remember about 10 years ago a bunch of models from a now-defunct English manufacturer were being sold off - can't remember if it was eBay or elsewhere.  The kit line included all kinds of English smallcraft, including a bawley.  The hulls were resin or plastic.

The 1/72 scale Mercury is indeed awesome.  At present, there's no way my current life, budget, and model queue would justify buying it.  Sigh. 

Hi Ken,
 
I ordered direct from GPM. I've order from them maybe 3 times now and it's worked out fine. They seem to have a problem formatting US addresses correctly, but my orders have been arriving okay. Each time, I'd modified the address information I typed in so that the final address looked okay. 
 
The last time I ordered from them, it took a little over a month. That's the longest I can recall. I was about to write off the order, but then it finally showed up. 
 
On the laser cut parts, the one issue I have with them is that I painted some small parts while still on the sheet. I've been using the paint that Shipyard sells, which is an artist's acrylic. It's water based and it seems to weaken the card stock. So, the small parts fell apart a bit too easily and I lost a few. When I do get the parts free, if they are intact, I touch the parts with a dot of thin CA. That wicks into the part and holds it all together pretty well.
 
Here are a couple photos of the new gratings cut, painted and dry fitted into place. You can see the gratings included in the kit laying on the deck as well. I also found that I could slice off the bottom layer of the grating, opening up the laser etched holes completely. 
  Big improvement.
 
 
Clare
 
 

 
 

 
 
 
 

Thanks Slog, Ken and Tony for the kind words and advice.
 
 
Well, today, I thought I'd take the opportunity to mention that several months ago, I acquired Shipyard's HMS Mercury kit, but not the super deluxe 1/72-scale laser cut version that looks EXTREMELY AWESOME in the box, but the regular 1/96-scale paper model kit. I had to check it out as part of my research into the hobby and also because I just couldn't help myself. 
 
In addition, I bought a matching laser cut detail set from GPM. The basic kit includes the laser cut frames, but the detail set includes some very nice features like the gratings, parts for the ship's boats, cleats, blocks and deadeyes, cannon and carronade carriages, and especially nice are the laser cut parts for the stern and quarter galleries. I just couldn't imaging using the printed windows or trying to cut out the frames. 
 
 
Don't worry, I'm not giving up on the Alert and starting the Mercury just now. But this does lead me to some issues I've been having with the Alert. I do periodically pull it out to work on it, but I'm finding that cutting the small parts has been SUPER difficult and it's really slowed me down. I'm doing it, but I'm used to working with wood and being happy with the results. I'm not used to making something that I can't get looking as nice. I've been tempted to cut my losses and go with the 1/72-scale laser cut Alert kit or something. But, then I came up with a nice time saver that may save my project. I looked over the 1/96-scale HMS Mercury detail set and discovered that several items in that set are compatibly with this kit. Maybe that's saying that the kits aren't to precise scale. But, I was going to build the small Alert kit and if I can get laser cut parts that are the same size as those I would otherwise have to cut-out, then I don't care where the scale might be off at this stage.
 
The detail kit for the Mercury cost me about $35 shipped from Poland, and I'm quite willing to sacrifice it for the good of the cause.
 
Turns out that the quarter deck cannon carriages are a perfect match for the Alerts carriages (and the right quantity), the gratings look like I'll be able to cut them to size, some of the cleats are perfect match and there are some others that I think I can trim quite easily. Also, while I've already acquired laser cut blocks and deadeyes of the right size, the Mercury detail set has a ton of these and enough of the smaller ones are the right size to use for the Alert.
 
Anyway, the point here being that if you want to make your life easier with this kit (and probably others too), get one of the detail sets from GPM. It's definitely going to give my project a boost!
 
Clare
 
 
 

 

 

 

 
 

As some of you also experienced with your own logs, some photo links were lost during a software upgrade a while back.  The V108 tutorial lost a can-load of pics, too.  But all is well now - the pictures have been restored.  Model on!

Main deck stanchions
 
One of the unique visual markers of the FRAMs was the widespread use of rather spindly deck stanchions between the main deck and 01 level. USN cruisers and destroyers of the 50’s to 80’s all had a least a few but none as many as the FRAMs. Deck stanchions have pretty much disappeared in more modern ships in an attempt to be more stealthy by eliminating such radar-reflection highpoints.
 
The stanchions are .020 wire per the kit instructions. My only additions are the deck drain pipes and gussets on the after groups.




 
Next up will be detailing the forward 01 level deck.

As some of you also experienced with your own logs, some photo links were lost during a software upgrade a while back.  The V108 tutorial lost a can-load of pics, too.  But all is well now - the pictures have been restored.  Model on!

Chris Watton designed both kits, so both of them will have similar design concepts.  However, Chris being the innovator he is, he has regularly made improvements to his designs with each new issue, and that will be reflected in the Vanguard kit, since it is by far the newer of the two.  I have the Amati/Victory Models Fly kit in progress and can tell you honestly it is a great kit.  But like any kit, it has compromises and can be improved upon by any modeller wishing to do a little extra research and work.  Same is most likely true for Vanguard.  I have also built a Caldercraft kit, and it was a great kit, too.  So, bottom line is both are good kits, but both can be taken up a notch, especially since you say you have experience scratching parts.  The deciding factor may well be how much model do you want to commit to?  One is a frigate, the other is a ship of the line with all that entails.  Either of them will be a long-term project, so I'd go with whichever one set my heart to beating just that much faster.
 
Cheers!

Time for another update.  The deck planking proper has now been started and I must say it seems pretty easy after the hull planking - nice straight pieces of wood to work with for a change!
 
The photos show the present state of play!
 
John
 

 

 

Hi Guys,
 
Another quick update on some progress, I'm a little cheesed off because I have some other pictures on my phone and for some reason I'm unable to access them.
 
They are mainly of the Margin Planks, so I'm afraid there will be a jump from Margin Plank template to half planking.
 
I have had a bit of bother finding a decent Veneer to use an after a couple of orders on line which proved totally useless I found a supplier about 7 miles up the road.
 
Speaking with Grant yesterday, he asked what veneers they were and I was unable to tell him, embarrassing really. I have since done a search on line and they are Cedar and Maple, I quite like the effect and so I hope you guys also like it.
 
Some Pics
 
Starboard side Margin Plank template

 
Stern Margin Plank

 
Bow Piece

 
Starboard Margin Plank

 
Starboard side planking, sorry about the big jump.

 

 
Starting the Port side planks

 

 
Once the planking is completed I will be experimenting with treenail colour and material.
 
So your right up to date now guys, I will post more as progress is made.
 
Be Good
 
mobbsie