chris watton

Definitely not! If anything, I have always tried to make the kits easier (and more fun) to build. For me, it is not a willy waving contest about who is the most skilled at making something from a block a wood - there are plenty of plans and a vast selection of nice woods for people who are into that already. Very nice model, definitely one of Panart's best, and you have certainly done the kit justice. When I worked for Amati, we toyed with the idea of splitting the kits up to try and cut down the cost to the modeller. The problem was that most of the cost is in the hull and fittings. The masts, yards and rigging make up a much smaller cost to the overall kit.

Well, I think I have now had the whole spectrum of suggestions, from CNC'ing all carvings from exotic woods to just supplying a load of wood and a set of drawings and leaving the modeller to it! Both would be financially disastrous, I have no doubt (in the West, at least). As long as I (and others like me) can keep the people in the middle of the spectrum relatively happy, I'll be happy. This so much reminds me of buying my very first wooden kit, a Billings Bounty - this had exactly as you suggest (except for quality wood). Hell, it even had a large block of obechi, this was the ship's boat that you had to carve out yourself! I would like to think we have 'evolved' the kits a little more since then.

I am hoping it will be this year!

I have to admit, I think the larger models like that look just as good without the masts, yards and rig. I wonder if it would be worth doing two versions, with the one just hull only but with special mast holes for the large flag poles, and include those and the flags. I think that would look really nice.

The copies of the original NMM plans have all the decoration included, which is what attracted me to this ship, so I am hoping it will look more or less like those two bottom photographs when finished, but with a white hull below waterline, and either Tanganyika or Pear wood for the second planking - that will compliment the blues and reds perfectly.

I know that in Rif Winfield's book, Leopard is shown as she was in her later career, with gangways around the waist, Bristol has an open waist, so I thought I would just do one (nice looking) pinnace for the ships boat, resting on the spare spars. If I do Leopard at a later date, because that has boat beams, I would do the full compliment of boats. I figure one large decorative pinnace sitting along the waist for Bristol will suit the overall aesthetics of the finished model, as it does for Bellona.

Yes, 1767 class, the second of that class, Bristol. It should be a very nice looking model, and the best part for is the fact that I now get to keep the finished prototype models for myself! I guess I could do another in the future for Leopard, as that is sufficiently different to warrant it, if shown in its later builds.

I do understand the problem of space, but to be honest, there are already countless smaller kits on the market to choose from. I decided from the off to try and stick to 64th scale, as I feel this is the best for such models. I do have a couple of smaller vessels in the pipeline (Have already got all of the plans for the first 6 kits) - but I would like to do another heavy frigate, as the last one I did was the first I ever did. That was two decades ago. I did do a 72nd scale Surprise for Amati a few years' ago, but nothing ever came of it, don't know why.

Portland Class 50 gun two decker is the next kit after Alert I am quite sure that there are no other kits currently on the market for such a vessel. (HMS Bristol)

I know - but I have to make sure that what I choose, for the first few kits at least, have quite broad appeal. This will allow me to then do more developments, one of which is a 70 gun Restoration warship (cannot do that yet as it would take all of my investment money). I would also love to to do a US subject at some point, and if things work out, I most certainly will - but this is very early days, and I am saying all this assuming I sell what I have planned already. I will not be doing another Victory though, so that's a plus!

Cheers Ron. I am quite sure that my Bellona will not look like that. (although for such a small scale, it is a very nice kit) I guess it doesn't matter what I do, there will always be someone who would prefer something else! lol But I do like Bellona, it is a very good looking model, and I did say that I want to design stuff that I would like to build..

Yes, but the problem is that most British 74's all look the same, many with the same dimensions even. Take Bellona, although a different class, has (virtually) the same configuration as the Vanguard, Elephant, Captain and countless others. The differences being mostly superficial. What sets Bellona off from the others is her decoration, both stern and sides (although in reality painted frieze on the sides). Plus I prefer the colour scheme, with varnished sides rather than painted fully. I really liked my first designs for Bellona, and would love to do it again from scratch (as original designs were flawed and were ironed out with the Victory prototype) I know Corel do a Bellona, but this is in a very small scale, isn't it?

The one I was asked to develop was a model of the modern full size replica of Hermione, that is the one I am talking about. I was surprised to find that even the smallest detail in decoration was the same as seen in J. Boudroit plans - like the patterns on the quarterdeck rails, overlooking the waist.

Oh, what would you guys think of a 64th scale model of Bellona, designed in the same style as Victory with all deck detail - although it would not be cheap?

If only - was designed and developed for another company (72nd scale - I think, may have been 64th, cannot remember)

Well, I do have to design and build it first, I will update this thread with progress pics as I go along. ETA - I always like the Mordaunt kit (and their Royal William).

The modern version of Hermione is, I am quite sure built using the La Belle Poule drawings, as both are near identical, even in decoration. I did this a few years ago, it was the Hemione but after much research, I used all of the J. Boudroit plans to develop the model. Never released, as far as I know...

Yes, I was looking at the more expensive machines. However, companies that can 3-D print your STL files are a dime a dozen right now, so prices are competitive. I got the two cannon, anchor and the two winch STL files 3-D printed quite cheap - so cheap that it would take an £8k machine a lifetime to pay for itself. I invested some of that money earmarked for a printer into better quality wood strip instead. ETA - When I looked at the original plans for my next model, my first thought was 'HMS Fly on steroids'!

I have looked very deep into 3-D printers with the aim of purchasing one and learning to draw the 3-D carvings myself. (in fact, one of the deciding factors of selling my car to invest was because I wanted a 3-D printer). However, after much research and visits to various 3-D printer companies, this area is a complete mine field, and the thought of spending many thousands of Pounds (or Dollars, the cheaper ones would be no good at all for fine prototype parts), only to find that the investment isn't all it's cracked up to be, or a newer, much better model may come out put me off. For now, it is better financially to sub contract such work, as, at the moment, there are not enough hours in the day for me already. I must stress that right now, it really is just me doing this, with my wife (who also works full time) helping when she can in searching for reliable suppliers (she will also pack, I hope..). Also, the new designed for the larger kits are meant for everyone, from beginner to expert. This means the development is more complex than standard kits with a lot more parts, which should make it easier for the model maker. I love looking at the finished model, and to that end, I try to design the kit to be as painless as possible in order for me to get there. I want the kits to be fun for the relative beginner, and a good starting point/blank canvas for the more experienced to sink their teeth into. Most of the parts are bespoke to that particular model, and as the subjects I have chosen for the first 6-8 models are quite different in looks and sizes, the fittings will not be interchangeable. For example, even with something as seemingly simple as a 6 pounder cannon barrel and carriage; the larger 2nd kit has 6 of them, but the sizes are larger than those of the Alert's 6 pounders. So, even very similar fittings can vary from kit to kit - I guess if I was more business/money minded, I would just say they are the same (on paper) and use both for the same kits. But that would be wrong, at least to me. I am sure there will be certain fittings available in the long run like cannons, anchors etc. But for now, I have to build up the range. so every new kit will have its own set of cannon, anchors, decoration, capstans, winches etc. Even the hatch combings are now all laser cut to the exact size as the original plans, together with gratings, which are now photo-etched parts so I do not have to compromise of size and shape (many combings and gratings taper fore or aft). At the moment, and for the next 2-3 years at least, I will be concentrating on building up the range of kits I want to see on the market (assuming they sell and I can invest in the next development), so working on the core developments, rather than using my time to sort out many added extras to sell separately, this isn't really at the forefront of my plans. A commercial kit will always have to be a compromise, otherwise they become way too expensive for the vast majority (in our little niche within a niche) to buy - but it's knowing where to compromise that is the trick.

Thanks guys As for the next model I am already working on it, as I need the figurehead and stern decoration sorted, and will feel better when I already have these areas sorted. It is over well over twice the size of Alert, and quite pretty with 50 guns..

From what I understand, all gun ports with lids had the inner sill or lining. I know that Victory shows this on the gun port inner edge sides and top, but interestingly, no step on the bottom (due to the tumblehome, perhaps)?. All gun port openings without lids have a frame that is flush with the hull. Either way, gun ports and lids are a pain on 2 and 3 deckers...

maaaslo, I am currently having a website sorted thanks to a very kind forum member! I can confirm that the deck planking will be Castello Boxwood and the second/outer hull planking will be Pear Wood (But have ordered a similar amount of Cherry Wood, too) All rigging thread is ordered, it is the same thread that I have always used for every prototype model I have rigged, so I do not have any problems with it.

Thank you! I think around May, hopefully I will have got everything sorted by then. The hatch combings are not just wood strip, but laser cut and fit together with simple half lap joins. I prefer laser cutting as you can have the exact scale height - same with gratings in PE, they can have the right size square holes, and the correct outer dimensions with no restrictions

Almost done, just waiting for a couple of parts to complete.. I added the sheets and bowlines to the yards otherwise they would have had hardly anything on them, plus it keeps them more or less in place a little better..

Thank you for your thoughts. I hear what you're saying and I agree! However, I need to get some kits out first. My first priority must be to develop the kits, this is where all of my investment money is going. Once I have a few out, I can then 'fine tune' each kit to include various packages. Right now, let me tell you, it is taking up all of my time just developing the base kit and getting all of the various supplies together. I know some say that if they were developing kits they would include all the bells and whistles from the off, but again, I haven't go an infinite amount of money to spend. For example, I am about to put in an order for various thicknesses of rigging thread that is well over £500, and this is just one small aspect of the kits! I am also waiting for new wood strip samples to arrive. I am waiting for costings for the laser cutting and photo etching, there may well be room to sell some of these separately, but I haven't had time to think about anything other than the kit as a whole. I have almost completed the prototype model, it is mast and bowsprit/yards and is rigged, just waiting for the cast cannon barrels and anchors now. Hell, I haven't even had time to think about a website yet! This little model has been one hell of a learning curve..