HMS Fly by Martin W - Amati/Victory Models - 1/64

[Martin W]

Greetings everyone -- Here I am venturing on a new log and a new build.  First off, even before posting any photos, I want to mention that the reason I'm building The Fly is that back in August of 2011 (this was obviously in the Edenic days of MSW 1.0), I noticed an announcement that a kit had been donated to MSW and was available to anyone willing to make a reasonable donation.  The requested donation was significantly less than the market price of the kit.  And, well, I'm the person who made the donation and got the kit.  So here's yet another reason MSW has supported Ship Modelling! 

 

To the build.

 

First photo, The Box:

 

                                               

 

                 This makes it official that I am modelling The Fly 1776. (Note the tidiness of my workspace.)

 

 

As I took out all the pieces, I thought they looked pretty doggone good.  I've been looking at the different sheets of drawings (Tavole?  Excuse my Italian if that isn't the correct plural of Tavola).  They seem pretty clear, though I began to wonder about certain details that I wanted to see.

 

Ok, now I'm getting started:

 

                                   

 

This is the plywood sheet of Bulkheads that I spent last evening cutting and snapping out.  As I was doing so, two questions came to mind.  The first has to do with the Captain's Cabin --  and this question arose largely from reading the logs of other builders of The Fly and Pegasus -- If I did want to have an actual cabin (and I do), and not just an external depiction of one, then I would have to do some refashioning of those aft-most bulkheads.  Something to think about there, and maybe now's the time?

 

Second question:

 

                                     

 

Here you can see The Fly's stem piece alongside a prototype of sorts that I made for my previous build, The Rattlesnake.  The stem for The Fly is walnut, and fits into the keel with all the ease of a work of nature.  But it's a single piece.  The stem I made for the Rattlesnake consists of multiple pieces of boxwood jointed together with scarphs, which strikes me as being more historically accurate.  Now, I am thinking, thinking (and maybe too much) that at least some planking with boxwood would look nice.  On the other hand, I have admired the coppered bottoms of several other builds, and if I went that route the scarphing joints would be covered. 

 

Since I don't have the actual plans of The Fly or any Swan Class Sloop, deciding how to mark and cut the pieces for the stem would entail a good bit of guess work.  And guess work contradicts "historical accuracy."

 

One more factor in this decision:  I looked over Greg Herbert's account of building the stem, and saw that he used a mill.  Well, my work bench is complete, and it's time to mount my mill. 

 

Here's where my decision stands at the moment:  I have the boxwood stock, so I think I'll do some configuring, cutting, and gluing, and see how it looks.  If it's a bust, I can always use the kit supplied piece.

 

Cheers, for now, and please feel free to comment, make suggestions, warnings, etc.

 

Martin

 

 

 

 

[aliluke]

Good to see you at it Martin. I simply scored the stem piece and added a light pencil line to the scoring to mimic the joints - worked for me. Now that I'm coppering only a couple of scored lines remain visible. I think there are many more worthwhile upgrades than rebuilding the stem but it depends on just how far you want to go I guess. If don't have them already the FFM series is a great companion to the model - especially Volume II and IV.

 

I look forward to seeing your progress.

 

Cheers

Alistair

[Blue Ensign]

Hi Martin, good to see you start on Fly.

 

I did the same as Alistair and simply scored the scarph lines into the kit stem, there are a couple of them that show above the copper line.

 

It's not too difficult a job to open up the stern cabin and I think it is well worth doing, the same applies to beneath the Fo'csle deck. One thing I would do differently is to modify the first gunport which should really be a Bridle port, somewhat narrower than in the provided pattern.

 

The fffm books are well worth getting, Vol 11 is particularly useful for the kit basher as it contains a lot of detail on fittings which enhance the basic kit. Vol 1 also has useful information for the kit builder but also covers the early build stages for a pof build. I have all four volumes and I have used them all as references for my build.

 

Cheers,

 

B.E.

[Martin W]

Hi Alistair & BE -- Thanks for checking in, and for the advice; comments from experienced builders (even those with no more experience than I have!) are always welcome.  I think scoring could work, would take a lot less time, and would look good.  The only remaining question is how the walnut would look against boxwood planking; if I kept the walnut stem, I would have to paint it, eh?

 

You're both absolutely right about the FFM books -- I have all 4 and consulted them through my Rattlesnake build.  In fact, I'm afraid I have something of a compulsion about getting my hands on any book I can that might help even a little.  I also got Alan Yedlinsky's book on the Euryalis (not sure of the spelling there -- I tried it 3 different ways and every time it looked off), and it's been a help as well; and Alan himself helped out in making the jig for the steps.

 

So I'm still thinking of at least trying  out a new stem.  I'm in no rush, and I can always use the practice on the scroll saw. 

 

Here's what I've done so far (I'm skipping the parts where I sat and stared, saying "hmmm, hmmm" over and over).

 

                                       

 

Here's the stem laid against the hull, where it fits nicely.   On the paper underneath, I made a tracing of the stem:

 

                                        

 

Hello, what's that?  Ahh, as I studied the diagram I noticed that there was a bit off the top.  Oof!  -- If I do keep the walnut, I'm sure I could glue this piece on pretty securely, so it's no big deal.

 

                                        

Here is how I worked out the joints.  I'm not sure how you other guys scored yours, I'll have to go back and check for comparison.  But this looks kinda close, based on Greg Herbert's build in FFM II.

 

Next -- it's good to hear, BE, that cutting out the space for the cabin isn't that difficulty.  I also see, though, that the entire gundeck area below the Q-deck is also impeded:

 

                                   

 

Both Alistair & BE (on the other site) give detailed accounts of opening the cabin area, and I definitely would like to follow suit -- there must be a parquet floor.  But I would also like to make the gun deck as real as possible, and it doesn't matter in this case to me that no one will see it.  It's part of the build, now isn't it?

 

Beyond that (mostly questions, really), I've been fitting the bulkheads, all of which require filing in order to get into place.  More pictures & discussion when I get them all on.

 

I should mention, though, that the weather here has gotten warmer -- we went from the teens last week to the upper 70s yesterday.  And that means that my fayre true and dear wyfe has been inspired to describe a panoply of new projects for me outside.  Even now, in front of the rose bed there sits a recently acquired pile of paving stones from which I have been instructed to lay a walkway.  Oh my back is hurting even writing about it.  My foot has come down, though:  I still must have modelling time, and that's all there is to it!  I'll leave it to you to imagine the response.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

 

[Blue Ensign]

Hi Martin, the way I got around the Walnut stem to match the boxwood planking was by using a water based varnish to which I added spots of yellow ochre paint until I got a match to the colour of the boxwood proper. I painted it on in thin coats until I got the look I was satisfied with.

 

As for the scarph scoring, I simply penciled the lines on, marked them with a pointy thing and ruler, and defined the lines using an Olfa scriber.

 

Re the 'parquet' flooring in the Great Cabin, the British are really cheapskates when it comes to creature comforts, twas no more than painted sailcloth on the floor. (If you want to get a rolling eyes look from the Guides aboard HMS Victory keep referring to it as Lino.)

 

The French however had far more style fitting their Great cabins with the real thing, at least on the larger ships. The Eighteenth Century British Navy however eschewed anything that smacked of a "Frenchifying" influence, although that didn't stop them adopting the Epaulette to adorn their uniforms, long before the official sanction in 1795.

 

Sorry I digress

 

B.E

[scott larkins]

I'm going to enjoy watching this builid.

[Martin W]

That's a great digression, BE.  I've never been aboard the Victory, but have read about the canvas on the floor.  I guess if I really wanted to approach accuracy, I would paint squares on a piece of canvas and put that in the cabin.  Even on the decidedly Puritanical American ships, though, there were plenty of delightful decorative touches.  That's one of the many things that make eighteenth-century ships fascinating, I think -- they're not quite as far gone with the curlicues as the 17th-century vessels, but still lovely to look at.

 

Thanks for checking in, Scott.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[Martin W]

Hi Folks -- Just a quick update in between other tasks (as in the ones I'm supposedly being paid to perform).

 

First off, here's the frames dry fitted to the keel:

 

                          

 

And the same from above:

 

                           

 

The frames all required a bit of sanding just to get onto the keel, but once on they seemed to fit naturally square (though I might change my mind about that when I actually give it more than an eyeball check).  They also seem symmetrical, which was far from the case with my previous 2 builds

 

With the frames in place, I was able to draw the Bearding Line:

 

                         

 

And my thanks to Blue Ensign for pointing out in his build that the kit's instructions don't say, "Draw the bearding line."  There's every chance for me to think I simply would have forgotten it if I hadn't read that detail.

 

Here are the Bearding Line & Rabbet drawn and awaiting my chisel:

 

                            

 

And then, here they are cut, sanded, and done:

 

                           

 

Ok, as with just about every photo I've ever seen of the Bearding & Rabbet, this one doesn't show diddly, due to the lack of real contrast between cut and uncut wood.  But I assure you they're there.

 

I might also mention that one slight lack in the otherwise good drawings that came with the kit is a sheet of plans showing the lines and frames of the hull, and showing the layout of the decks.  Following the advice of David Antscherl in FFM 1, I spent a bit of time (way too much, really) on the National Maritime Museum website yesterday tracking down the plans of The Fly.  (It took me too long because I kept typing the catalogue number incorrectly.)  The plans in their collection are pretty revealing, and could be enormously helpful in any bashing, even slight bashing, such as opening up the cabin:  a notable detail here is that forward from the Great Cabin are the Coach and State Room.  So to open the Captain's cabin should entail opening another space divided asymmetrically.

 

But, and this is a big but, they cost over twenty quid a sheet, plus another fourteen each for shipping.  There are three separate sheets -- one of the lines and two of decks.  Just to buy two would have run poor me over $120.  It is possible to study the plans online for no charge, however, so I did plenty of that. And then by the end of the day, my appetite was whetted enough that I bought one sheet.  Thus I have proved myself to be very frugal.

 

Still, I would encourage any builder of a Swan Class ship model to check out what the NMM has.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

 

 

[Martin W]

Greetings -- There's been a bit of progress, even though most of my free time has been given over to paving stones.

 

As I mentioned, I wanted to replace the kit-supplied walnut plywood stem with a boxwood version.  In my usual fashion, I vacillated between cutting the individual pieces that would be glued together, cutting out a single piece with the jointing simulated with gouging, or not replacing the stem at all.  Since one reason I enjoy building these ships is that I want to develop some skills in small-scale wood working, I decided I would take the route that involved some cutting and so on, but not too much.

After tracing the original stem onto a piece of white paper that I rubber-cemented onto some boxwood stock, I cut out the new stem on the scroll saw (I used a 28 tpi blade).  Here’s the rough cut new piece in the vise being preddied up with a small file.

 

                  

 

The new stem next to the kit-supplied version for comparison.

 

                  
Hmm, maybe a touch more filing along the inner line there?

 

Here it is smoothed out, with the jointing lines drawn in (if you squint, you’ll see ‘em).  

 

                    

I’ve also drilled the holes.  And. . .

 

                    

I cut along the pencilled lines for the simulated jointing.


The new stem attached to the hull:

                     

 

Here you can see that I cut a rabbet to follow that of the hull: I free-handed a line in pencil, cut it lightly with an exacto, then used a small ( 5/32") skew to cut the actual rabbet.  – You can just see the skew off to the right.

 

                     

 

That bit that broke off is still missing off, primarily because I kept forgetting that it also needed hole drilled into it, so it’ll just have to wait till this evening (it also needs just a skosh or two of fine tuning).


And now to the back.  I spent a few days looking at the early pages of build logs for other Flys and Pegasuses to get a sense of what to cut and how much.  In the end, it’s not at all difficult – at least so far.

Here’s bulkhead #12, which as supplied in the kit would cut across the middle of the Cabin.

                             

I traced the inner lines of #11, and then measure the bottom line from where the deck will theoretically go.

 I might also mention that I cut the thick plywood on the scroll saw with a 15tpi blade.

And now, here’s the false deck, with the bulkheads glued in place, ready to be fitted onto the keel.

 

                         
This step took several trial runs, since the fits are all very snug, and required at least some filing (usually very little).  Once I got everything set on and squared, I committed myself to glue.  

Unlike the previous 2 builds I’ve done, the design on the Amati Fly has the false deck holding the bulkheads into place.  There seems to be little chance of the individual bulkheads slipping out of square, so the actual glue-up goes much faster.

Next, I guess it will be time to cut some balsa fillers.

Cheers,

Martin

 

                              
 

 

[Martin W]

Greetings -- It's been a few weeks since my last posting, but only because I've spent my time in the boatyard (and the backyard) instead of my computer room.

 

After setting all the other bulkheads in place, I trial-fitted the stern extensions, just to get a sense of their purpose, and how they'll look:

 

 

                   

 

I didn't attach them, because they looked pretty precarious.  I actually haven't glued #13 on yet either, just because i want to get as much work done as possible before setting it in permanently.

 

Then began the task of putting in filler blocks.  These I cut with the scroll saw, more or less to shape (mostly less), and glued in:

 

                     

                        These are the fillers at the bow.  You can see they're all still rough hewn.  The space between bulkheads 1 & 2 is so narrow that I don't see the need for filler blocks there.

 

And here's the bow with the blocks sanded down.

 

                      

 

In order to determine the shape of the bow, I traced the outline from the kit's deck plan, and then drew the outline onto the balsa and bulkhead 1.

 

                     

                       You can see the center point that I marked on the tracing, and you can see the bit of the first bulkhead (port) that will need filing down.

 

And here's the bow after filing:

 

                      

 

Now to the back.

 

 

                     

                     The aft bulkheads.  The process of fairing is underway here.  I'm not sure how to judge the amount to file off the bulkheads.  I've mostly just used a piece of planking to see if it lies flat -- like this:

                      

 

And these are the sanding blocks I made up to create as much dust as possible:

 

                      

 

I was advised to put in some blocks to shore up  the bulkheads amidships, which I did -- I thought I had a photo of them, but guess not.  Anyway, on the Rattlesnake I installed balsa filler blocks between all the bulkheads, making for a solid hull to lay the planks on.  That had the benefit of allowing me to forgo a first planking.  For this build, however, I'll be doing the double work.

 

Now on to the deck.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

 

 

 

[Blue Ensign]

Nice bit of infill work with the balsa Martin, so well worth the effort when it comes to planking.

 

If you do intend to open up the Great Cabin those stern extensions No 23 will have to go and be replaced with finer open framed versions to allow the view and light thro' the stern and the Quarter light window.

 

B.E.

[Martin W]

Thanks for checking in, guys, and especially for the advice.  Spyglass, you make a good point.  I hadn't thought of checking how the extensions affect the angle that will happen.  I'll definitely check that, and maybe with a tracing as I did on the bow.

 

BE -- Thanks for the reminder about opening up those extensions.  I've studied the chapters of your log -- the ones that might be called, "Pegasus:  The Early Years" -- and do recall that you cut out chunks of the extensions to turn them into open frames.  Your photos there show them to be plywood, so I take it that you just used the kit's frames and cut out the insides?  -- And it was seeing the mishap that occurred a while later on, that convinced me not to put them on at all just yet.

 

I might also mention that I got the sheet of plans (the frames) of The Fly from NMM -- oh boy!  not only are they very informative, but they're a joy to look at.  Well worth the price, I'd say.  And now I see little reason not to get the deck plan.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[Blue Ensign]

Yes I used the original extensions and cut out the centres and fined them down as far as I thought safe so that they didn't show too much with the view thro' the stern galley windows.

 

With Frame 13 I made a new one out of spare mdf, I didn't want to risk the original in case the modification didn't work. It would have been much easier if I had had the scroll saw at the time.

 

Cheers,

 

B.E.

[Martin W]

Right, BE.  I cut a second number 13 as well, largely following what you did.  I put filler blocks under 13 last night, and they will help considerably in the placing of the new open bulkhead there.  That extension of the hull that holds 13 at an angle from 12 will also need to come out, but I'm going to use it as a space when gluing 13 in.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[Martin W]

After a few weeks spent largely on getting the new operating system installed on my home computer, and then laboriously un-installing numerous spyware programs that seemed to spring like hydra's heads from the new Microsoft program, I can now post with at least some regularity.

First I laid down some planking along the middle of the lower false deck, as I've seen from a few other builds.

 

                                  

                           Here you can see half of the thin ply deck and the planking on the thicker false deck below.

Next I laid out a planking plan on the thin plywood deck, largely by working out the theoretical placement of the frames.  This strategy worked about 80% well, since the frames on the NMM plans don't always quite correspond to what shows up on the kit deck.  But with these "frames" drawn, I'll be able to plot out the Captain's cabin and the Day Room.

 

                                   

 

And, suprise, suprise, I ran into the problem than other Fly/Pegasus builders have met, and that is that silly little bulge down the middle where the 2 halves of the thin plywood meet.

 

                                   

 

I smoothed that out largely with gobs of glue and some smallish blocks of scrap underneath the joints.  I clamped the blocks and joints into a flat condition till the glue dried.

                                   

 

And that's where I should have paused.  Instead, I got antsy.  The kit's instructions say, with all the breeziness in the world, that the next step is attaching the thin plywood gun strips.  Now, I know that other builders have worked on the deck, adding plenty of furniture while everything up there is open.  But I didn't have access to MSW to remind myself, AND I'm waiting on my wood order for the deck planking.  So I worked on those problematic plywood gunport strips.

Following the general procedure, I soaked the strips for 2 or 3 hours, then dry-fit them onto the bulkeads to get the basic form.

                                  

 

I also took considerably care to ensure that they were level relative to one another by setting a small level across the tops.

                                  

 

I mustered the courage – or fool’s courage, I should say – and glued the strips on.  After showing the results to a few modellers more perceptive than I am, I got the response that the strips were noticeably too high, that the gunports would be too far off the deck.  So, out came the alcohol, and off came the strips.

After removing the starboard strip, I did in fact pause (just this once) long enough to decide how far I needed to lower the strips.

                                   

                                    The answer is almost exactly 1/16 inch.  

And that’s where I am for now.  Trying to determine the best way to re-attach the gunport strips at the optimal height, while keeping all the gunports at the appropriate distance from the deck.

Maybe it's time for a beer.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin 




 

 

[aliluke]

I agree with Spyglass. The top of the bulkheads should be your guide. That said I hated this step and got it slightly wrong myself - how wrong is yet to be determined as I work my way through the outer works of the hull...time for a beer indeed.

[Martin W]

Thanks for checking in guys.  I think the real issue was where the gunports ended up in relation to the deck.  When the strip was too high, the gun ports toward the bow were about 2mm higher than those amidship.  By lowering the strip at the stem, the gun ports came more in line.

 

Spyglass, you're absolutely right about the length of the strip.  So far I've only been dryfitting the back halves of the strip to check on how to fair the bulkheads as you suggested previously.  But I don't like the fact that the strip extends well beyond the stern counter extensions.  And that jigsaw joint on my strips is really loose. 

 

But now that I've taken the strips off, I think I'll keep them off for a while and work on the Captain's cabin.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[Martin W]

Thanks for those pointers, Spy.  As a matter of fact, I have been worrying and fiddling with the fairing of the stern bulkheads -- I've set the extensions up to check the angle, and have more or less decided (for now) that everything goes the way I want.  I did end up taking more off the bow bulkheads, because I set the fo'csle deck on and it served as a good guide.

 

It's good to hear that the standing rigging checks out -- that suggests that even though the gunport strip is a pain, it works.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[Martin W]

Hello everybody -- It's been quite a while since I've updated this log.  I ordered some wood, and have been waiting on it, and have held off on just about every thing till it came in.  I did start a few details -- such as the bulkhead to the Captain's cabin, the window seat in the cabin, and some ladders.  But in each case, once I got just a small way in, I decided that my measurements were relying on too much guess work of how the planking would affect the dimensions, and so I held off.  The result is that each of these projects is sort of started and tucked away for now.

 

One detail I did work on though, was the stern carving.  This is pretty ambitious, beyond my capacity; BUT I find carving to be a real hoot, even if I can't do it terribly well.

 

I began by reducing the drawing of the Stern Carving in the NMM plans to 74% to make them pretty close to 1:64 scale.  Then, to get myself to understand how the lines of the figures related to the space in which they appear, I drew a copy of the Carving onto an outline of the boxwood I'd cut out on the scroll saw:

 

                                

 

Once I'd worked out the spatial relations, I copied the copy onto the wood itself.  But before I could get the nerve actually to carve the actual stern piece, I thought I might do a trial run, which would (theoretically) help me to understand how to turn the 2-dimensional lines into a 3-D bas-relief.

 

                               

This is the Queen of the Seas, and, well, in my version she's pretty blocky.  But the aim wasn't perfection yet, just understanding.

 

I next took a deep breath, and started carving the Queen on the boxwood piece that would (I hoped) become the actual carving.  I don't have a picture of the result, but can tell you that this version came to an abrupt halt when I saw that I had effectively decapitated Her Highness, making her royal head float somewhere over her royal port shoulder instead of her royal neck.

 

I've begun Attempt #2, but have only begun.  I'll post photos as I proceed.

 

Meanwhile, my wood order arrived, my obligations at work lightened a wee bit, and I started planking the main deck.  I was happy to get back into making progress in a real way.

 

Here's the holly planking, unsanded:

 

                                 

I've left room for the waterway, and haven't cut out the holes for the masts, etc.

 

Here's a slightly more finished version:

 

                                 

 

                                 

The variation in coloring is due to differences in the levels of individual planks -- I really thought I'd kept them all absolutely level, but, hey, I guess I was wrong.  Looks like I'll be doing more sanding.

 

I'll point out that in this 2nd photo, you can just see the front of the window seat that I set up just to check on the fit.

 

Finally, here's my one Proxxon tool:

 

                             

It makes sanding go a lot faster than ye olde sanding stick. 

 

Comments, suggestions are always welcome!

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[aliluke]

Good luck with the carving Martin. If you can pull it off it will a lot easier to handle than the cast metal kit part.

 

The deck looks great - is it holly?

[Blue Ensign]

Hi Martin, re the gunport strip, I found it useful to also make up a gun to check that they sit squarely in the ports, don't want to find after the event that they are too high or low.

 

I'm impressed with your journey into figure carving I think you have an emerging talent there.

 

I like the holly decking, what are you using for caulking?

 

Cheers,

 

B.E.

[Martin W]

Hi Guys, thanks for checking in, and for the nice words.

 

Alistair -- whether I can pull off the carving remains a real question.  I'm game, though, and enjoy it, even though at times it seems like a waste of wood.

 

BE -- That's excellent advice; I got some cannon from Chuck and the place Alistair has mentioned (and I've forgotten, but they're nice).  I'll be working on a sample gun to do just as you say.  The unplanked deck was again a reason not to put the strips on yet.  For caulking, I just blackened one side of each plank with a #2 pencil lead; I'd used a Sharpie black pen on parts of the Rattlesnake, and found that it tended to run, and couldn't be sanded out.  The pencil might be a touch too subtle, so I'm going to look around for something in between for the hull planking.

 

Spy -- Thanks for the compliment, but let's see if I can keep the figures heads on their necks.  Those little putti flying between the King & Queen have already made me nervous.  At this scale, everything is tiny.

 

Onward!

 

Martin

[Martin W]

Here's a brief update.  With the deck mostly in place, I thought I'd put in the trenails.  I have to say that I do like the contrast between a holly deck and some darker wood for the trenails.  In the past I used walnut, but it tends to split too easily.  The standard bamboo skewers that I can get tend to have a greenish tint that I can't get rid of.  And, well, I've simply never tried the strategy of wood filler.  Long & short:  I cut up a strip of Swiss pear that I had on hand, and gave it a shot.

 

I drilled holes at the joints only, since I agree with the general view that with dark trenails this small model of a deck can get too spotted pretty easily.  I used a #75 bit, and then found I just couldn't get the wood down that small.  So I opened the holes with a #70 bit, which then accepted the wood that I had gotten down to hole #29 on the drawplate.  With the dark wood, I think these are still too big -- another reason to do only the butt joints.  Here you can see the result:

 

                                            

 

You can see that I allowed a spacing of 4 planks between a repetition of trenails on a particular line of planking.  The butts fall on "beams" that I marked following the NMM deck plans; and I also used Antscherl's plan.  I've seen people refer to specific patterns numerically as "13245" or something like that, but I don't know what those numbers designate, so can't tell you what exactly my pattern is.  But the two sides do mirror one another.

 

Next, I made up a list of all the details I need to take care of before returning to the dreaded gunport strips.  It's a pretty formidable list -- ladders, bulkheads, window seat in the cabin, and hatches.  There's been a good discussion about whether the coamings should go on before or after the decking -- and I read that after I had already done the decking.  My decision was made for me.

 

Here's coaming prototype #1, which I only set up to judge for size and dimensions:

 

                                            

 

This is made from boxwood, about 2x5 mm.  This picture doesn't do justice to the gargantuan size of the coaming.  I think I'll try cutting down the boxwood to 2x3, which should look more in scale (I'm using the eyeball measure).

 

--Now, if I can go more than 2 weeks without my computer crashing, I might manage some regular updating.

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

 

 

[aliluke]

Hi Martin

I agree with Spyglass. My coamings are 2 x 3mm boxwood. I think that is the correct size and I did box joints at the corners as you have done. I then slightly round the corners but only down to the lower leg of the joint. I also insert them into the planks rather than sitting them on top of the planks. They can be seen in my log.

[aliluke]

Actually Spyglass the projection of my coamings above the deck is still too high even with the inset. According to the FFM it should be about 2mm at 1:48 and I'm at 2mm at 1:64. 

 

Martin the beauty of insetting, if done accurately, is that you get a very clean line to the coaming and it looks correct. You need to cut the planks back from the false deck cut outs to give the coaming a little ledge to fix to. Up to you of course - I note that B.E lays his on top of the planks rather than insetting them and who can question his results!!!

[Martin W]

Thanks for checking in, folks, and I appreciate both the likes and the advice. 

 

Alistair, I have studied your procedure at almost every step, since your log is nicely detailed.  And I've actually gone back and forth about whether to set the coamings in or lay them on top of the planking.  If I recall, on my previouis build I did the former.  I had originally planned on doing that again for thd Fly.  Then I started thinking about how I would probably need to cut a rabbet along the outside of the coaming frame so it would fit snuggly inside the planking with a bit of overlay.  No big deal, I suppose, since it wouldn't have to be terribly neat and I could do it with an x-acto.  But since I think there also needs to be a rabbet along the inside top to accommodate the grating, I felt a major spell of the lazies come over me.  More study is in order here, which is fine, since I'm still at the prototype stage.

 

There's also this personal detail:  I bought a micro mill that is now sitting in my workshop.  I should be able to knock out rabbets with it in a heartbeat.  But it's tool that requires practice and understanding.  So far, I've practiced, and have NO understanding. I have to admit to being a touch intimidated.

 

Spy -- Thanks for that photo.  I like the nice smooth lines you got on that coaming along with matching the curvature of the deck.  Do I see a slight chamfering along the outer edge as well?  I also have to say I like your deck.

 

But the issue of the height is still a bit foggy for me:  the athwartship pieces are supposed to have a curve, right?  at the peak of the curve they would be what, something like 2.5 mm?  then the sides would be a bit under 2 mm?

 

I'm now going to work out a second prototype, with the rabbet.

 

Till then,

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[aliluke]

Hi Martin

I don't use a rabbet. I just butt the deck planks to the edge of the coaming. I set up the planks first and make the coaming fractionally larger than the set up. I then gently sand the coaming back until I get a really tight fit. I don't use a rabbet or ledges to support the grates either I just make that a super tight fit as well. I also have very little curvature on the coaming such that you couldn't even measure the difference between the high and low point. I know people put much more curvature on them. I'm not sure which is more correct.

[Blue Ensign]

Hi Martin, I used 5mm starting depth for the head ledges and 3mm for the coamings as I recall; it was a conscious decision as I wanted to achieve a visible curve in the gratings without making them too thin on the outer edges which would create problems with them breaking up. The grating sit on a 1mm square ledge glued around the inside of the ledges/coamings; the head ledges were rounded down to meet the coamings and the gratings now in place were carefully sanded down to meet the round in the ledges. I think the head ledges finished up at around 3.5mm at the central point.

 

If you intend to have open hatches it is worthwhile gluing some square stock beneath the deck openings to represent the  hatch framings and give a little depth to the hatches.

 

Cheers,

 

B.E.

[Martin W]

Thanks for the comments, guys, these are all very helpful.  I spent about 3 hours last night just trying to think of how to measure a rabbet and still get the right dimensions for the joints etc.  I decided -- after butchering some nice boxwood -- that the aft hatch will probably sit atop the planking.  Now I've started the ladder way, which be without grating, of course.  My notion is to do all the coaming/ledges, and then do the gratings. 

 

Alistair -- the sanding process you describe sounds absolutely obvious; I'm shaking my head, saying, of course, why didn't I think of that?  Duh!  Did you sand that much before or after putting the grating in?  My little square keeps threatening to collapse whenever I work on it, so I would imagine that the grating would stiffen it.

 

BE -- I've checked out your hatches from the "Early Years" over on the other site.  They're simply gorgeous.  Hearing that you put that 1mm ledge around the inside answers a question I've been meaning to ask you.  Did you make your own grating, or use the kit's?  -- It would seem that the gratings would need to be sort of thick to get the curve you have, eh?

 

Spy -- I hadn't thought at all about actually bending the grating.  Hmm, that's something to consider.

 

Meanwhile -- the Missus mentioned that she couldn't see the lake any more, and I pointed out that it was because the brush had grown up.  After 3 minutes of silence, I slowly understood that she was describing the view but making a hint.  So my afternoon will be spent with a machete. 

 

Cheers,

 

Martin

[aliluke]

Hi Martin

No I don't install the grating first when sanding the coaming to size. I don't have any problem with them breaking up as I find the corner box joint to be very strong. I'm not sure about the curvature thing. I asked Dan about it in his Vulture log and he reckons the curvature should be much greater than the deck camber. To my eye the flatter version with only a slight curvature looks better even if it is historically inaccurate....