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Copyright


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14 replies to this topic

#1
Kishmul

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A coming project is a 74 gun ship as described by Jean Boudriot. Whilst the books are essential, they are insufficient to create a model. The next resource are the plans by La Charpente. Even armed with these there is much lofting to be done, many hours of work in CAD. Both the books and the plans (bought from Ancre) will be within copyright, but what of the drawings I produce? As examples, the plans show the station frames but not the others, nor are the transom timbers detailed, nor the beams. As it is my intention to cut as much wood as possible on a CNC machine I have a lot of CAD to do.

It seems a waste that the work I do to create these files will just take up memory on my PC, I am well aware that I will not make a fortune by selling them but I could save a fellow modeller hundreds of hours of work for want of the price of a memory stick, postage, a little beer money and a donation to NRG.

There will be errors in my drawings I do not doubt, but sharing them on this forum will both expose and correct them.

Any thoughts of experience?

 

Ken


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#2
ofencer29350

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if u just draw cad on  your pc never mind;

but if u send or sell them the copyright must be.


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Of the bank I look at an ocean of pleasure, or the tumult attracts you, this global movement will be your tipcart!

 

 

 

current build:   royal caroline

 

buid finished:  la recouvrancehttp://modelshipworl...?hl=recouvrance


#3
Dupree Allen

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Based on US Law

Related Laws Contained in Title 17 of the United States Code

In short.... If it aint yours it's copyrighted and you must obtain permission or release to publish, amend or offer for profit.


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Dupree

 

"A slow steady hand conquers a fast shaky mind" - me

 

 

HMS Triton 1:32 Cross Section


#4
Cap'n'Bob

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In patent law you can build a copy of a patented item and use it or give it away as long as you do not get paid for it.  I suspect it is the same for a copyright but I'm not sure.  Like Dupree said, " or offer for profit ".

 

Years ago when writing school papers we were allowed to copy any information from any source as long as we gave credit to the source.  And this was not considered copyright infringement.  Isn't it the same today?

 

Bob


Edited by Cap'n'Bob, 11 January 2017 - 06:51 PM.

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Every build is a learning experience.

 

Current build:  Two Edwardian launches

 

Completed builds:  US Coast Guard Pequot   Friendship-sloop,  Schooner Lettie-G.-Howard,   Spray,   Grand-Banks-dory

                                                a gaff rigged yawl,  HOGA (YT-146),  Int'l Dragon Class II

 

In the Gallary:   Catboat,   International-Dragon-Class,   Spray


#5
Jack12477

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Ken, you could try directing your question to the US Copyright Office for clarificantion  their website is https://www.copyright.gov/help/

 

I think what you are planning to do, if I understand you correctly, is allowed under the US Copyright Fair Use Law but check with them for clarification.


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Jack
 
"No one is as smart as all of us"
---------------------------------------------

Current build: MS Willie L Bennett
Completed build log(s): MS 18th Century Longboat , AL Marie Jeanne
Gallery: AL Swift , AL Armed Virginia Sloop, AL Santisima Trinidad Captain's Launch , 18th Century Longboat , AL Marie Jeanne
In dry-dock: AL 1798 US Constellation,  MS Picket Boat,  Dumas Donzi Z65 Tournament Fisherman (R/C)

Other: 1912 Hudson River Ice Yacht Manhasset - RESTORATION - Scale = Full Size, Relief Carving for Model Ships


#6
Kishmul

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Thanks folks for your comments. I am in the UK, and have discussed this with some legal folk. It seems to be a minefield.


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#7
mtaylor

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Ken, 

 

Ping Chuck.  He's pretty into copyright and since we're US based, I believe US rules apply.   He can give you more info.


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Mark

"The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me


Current Build:

Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0

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#8
Jack12477

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Caution Ken,  since MSW is hosted in the US not UK it's the US Copyright Law that governs what can be placed on this site.  And, yes, it is a minefield.


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Jack
 
"No one is as smart as all of us"
---------------------------------------------

Current build: MS Willie L Bennett
Completed build log(s): MS 18th Century Longboat , AL Marie Jeanne
Gallery: AL Swift , AL Armed Virginia Sloop, AL Santisima Trinidad Captain's Launch , 18th Century Longboat , AL Marie Jeanne
In dry-dock: AL 1798 US Constellation,  MS Picket Boat,  Dumas Donzi Z65 Tournament Fisherman (R/C)

Other: 1912 Hudson River Ice Yacht Manhasset - RESTORATION - Scale = Full Size, Relief Carving for Model Ships


#9
Kurt Van Dahm

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Ken:

 

For a discussion on Copyright, the following link will take you to a much discussed topic - http://modelshipworl...e/?hl=copyright

 

The official policy regarding Copyright on this site is posted on the last page of the link above. 

 

You are perfectly able to do anything on your own for your model w/o worry about copyright - it's only when posting the drawings or selling the drawings that you run the risk of violating the law (or our rules here).  The link above should clear this up for you.  Building the model and posting on MSW is encouraged. 

 

You mention selling copies later - that would certainly depend on your work not infringing the copyright of others - but also follow the rules here on MSW about selling.  It is entirely feasible for you to do up CAD plans and sell them w/o violating copyright - depending on how you go about the project, what you add to the work, etc.  There is all sorts of information regarding copyright on the internet.   My suggestion would be for you to do some research into copyright and then decide on how you proceed with your project.

 

If you have any specific questions you can send me a PM.

 

Kurt


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#10
Chuck

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Its really  a VERY simple answer.  Dont Use the Ancre plans at all. Dont use the Ancre drawings at all .  You can learn a great deal from those books as a reference and source of inspiration but rather than replicate them and adding more to them....simply pick a 74 gun ship other than those from a plan by La Charpente....get the original drafts of a similar 74 and draft your model plans from them, using the knowledge you have gleaned from the Ancre books and other sources while avoiding any copying/duplication at all.  Thus you will have created an original Kishmul set of plans that are entirely your own.

 

Otherwise you would be really walking a thin line ....If you have the knowledge and skill to fill in the blanks that are missing from someone elses efforts....then certainly you would also have the chops to not use someone elses efforts as a starting point, and instead...simply flush out a whole new project from A thru Z ......rather than take A thru M from someone else and then supplement with your own N thru Z.    

 

Chuck


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Chuck Passaro - MSW Admin 

 

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#11
Kishmul

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Thank you all for your replies. This fits with the legal advice I have had in the UK. The lawyer I contacted is an expert in intellectual property rights, though not in international law. I will not infringe the rules of the forum (knowingly, for unknowingly, I hope for a warning). As it happens, one publisher has offered to put my efforts up for sale having covered (at their own expense or liability) all copyright matters. But my income would be measured in pennies. It is interesting that in another use of my workshop I build trinket/keepsake  boxes from designs in a number  of books. The designers make their income from book sales, I am free to copy their designs as I have bought the book.  If you have bought the plans from Ancre that is as far as you can go, the rest is up to you. I will take you further and charge you for that. I will not breach forum rules, nor publish anything until this is sorted.


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#12
ofencer29350

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or perhaps take  the inquiries from hubert berti' family ....

in our french forum we automatically post the picture's sources .


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Of the bank I look at an ocean of pleasure, or the tumult attracts you, this global movement will be your tipcart!

 

 

 

current build:   royal caroline

 

buid finished:  la recouvrancehttp://modelshipworl...?hl=recouvrance


#13
Kurt Van Dahm

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ofencer -

 

We have established a policy acceptable here - please don't muddy the waters with what is done elsewhere.  Please read the policy and posts that were linked in my earlier post.

Kurt

 
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Kurt Van Dahm

Director - Chairman

NAUTICAL RESEARCH GUILD

www.thenrg.org


CLUBS
Nautical Research & Model Ship Society of Chicago
Midwest Model Shipwrights
North Shore Deadeyes

Butch O'Hare - IPMS

#14
Kishmul

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I have no intention to violate forum policy, nor to suggest that I will do so elsewhere and promote same here. Full stop.

IMHO, there is an issue for discussion and advisement. Perhaps not. If so, Admin are welcome to delete this topic.


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#15
ofencer29350

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ofencer -

 

We have established a policy acceptable here - please don't muddy the waters with what is done elsewhere.  Please read the policy and posts that were linked in my earlier post.

Kurt

 

 

i have read this and i'm ok with the policy

it was just a suggestion to puchase his work  on an other support .

i'm not so stupid to think that all the forum have her own policy...

so like kissmul said full stop for this log


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Of the bank I look at an ocean of pleasure, or the tumult attracts you, this global movement will be your tipcart!

 

 

 

current build:   royal caroline

 

buid finished:  la recouvrancehttp://modelshipworl...?hl=recouvrance





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