Thistle17

The painting saga continues. After painting the hull 48 hours earlier (per manufacturer directions) I observed a wrinkle pattern on the starboard side about 4 inches long. At the time I assumed it was surface contamination but that is not proving out. I sanded the area down and applied the overcoat of a royal blue color just above the waterline. Much to my dismay it repeated the same wrinkle marking. I searched the internet and now find this is not uncommon. I went ahead and called Rustoleum Customer Service and they indicated it was not contamination (as I had described my process). Rather they claim it is due to the under coat material, the creamy white, had not dried completely. I explained there was over a week between old and new coatings. That did not change his recommendations. Here was the advice I got: 1. Dry sand the area of concern, 2. Wash down the area with a little dish soap in a water solution, 3. Wash area with water only, 4. Dry it thoroughly. 5. Repaint. Not too convinced of this but have no other solution as many on line have also lamented. He also added the best way to use this paint is to apply 2 wet coats in close succession so they paint layers fuse together. An update: I completed Step 1 above and indeed found that the wrinkle did go all the way through the overcoat of white down into the Navajo White coat. So they certainly did have that part correct. I am somewhat hesitant to just plunge ahead and paint without a light prime coat (lessons learned from my youthful days in auto body painting). As I am running out of fair weather I am leaning to follow the manufacturer advice and repaint. My reasoning is that I have now exposed the paint layer that was still uncured so I should have now exposed it to better drying. We will see. Hope this is useful information to others and helps advoid disappointment.

I haven't visited here lately as I had no new info until this afternoon. The release has been approved but the path to get them to send the drawings is a bit circuitous. I am working with the department that prints the drawings and I have to go through a few steps to get them. Maybe more on that later. fnkershner", sorry I do not know your name, I have read your posts and will get back to you when we receive the drawings. Many thanks for the offer. Joe

An update on painting. I changed the base color of the hull to a pure white as the Navajo White just didn't strike me as the right hull color. Took extra precaution and wet sanded the hull 220 then 400. Wiped the hull down with auto body degreaser/cleaner with a lint free cloth and used all my (limited) skill in painting. The results were better than expected as there was little over spray. It is a low humidity day so that helped immensly. Onto the two tone hull color and waterline painting the client liked. This northeast weather is not only welcome it is a gift since I do not have a paint booth.

I have primed and painted one coat of the Rustoleum product for plastics. I wiped the hull down with automotive de-greaser/cleaner and sprayed the primer. After it dried I sanded the surface down with 220 wet paper. I used the de-greaser/cleaner again and applied the paint layer.The good news is that it adheres well and dries to a hard finish. The bad news is that spray cans aren't really a good device to spray any paints. Even though I used what I believe are good application practices I found that the smoothness of the painted hull doesn't muster. I will have to spend some time wet sanding and repeating the process to get close to the results I am expecting. I may even have to rub the final product out and spray an overall clear coat. I have to mask the waterline and the hull body color area for the final hull finish. I am going to use 3M or equivalent automotive masking tape that leaves little to no evidence of ridges at masked area intersections.

You have some pretty definitive advice from the "floor". All good recommendations. I would only add to the comments that most professional sanding machines either have a moving platen or a power feed. Of course the Byrnes sander relies on hand feeding. I have noticed that if I have an unsteady feed rate that I can get slight gouging in the material. So I would only add that a constant feed rate is important.

After altogether too much time and effort I have nearly completed the machining, attachment and refining of the bulkwarks to the model. My lament of course is if I had had the original kit supplied bulkwarks this would have been a non event. I guess I needed to vent. The actual bulkwark mounting was a lesson in humility and frustration. I read somewhere that the kit version probably had some adhesive backed tape to help mount them. Anything I could think of just didn't seem right so I attached them with the supplied screws countersunk and filled (and filled and filled again - I used auto body Nitro Stan glazing compound which has a tendency to shrink). To further secure them to the hull I applied the inboard section with DAP Inst Cure. The bow section fit was tricky and required not only Easy Sand filler but also spot glazing. The inboard port and starboard, at the bow, sections of the bulkwarks were sanded with a thin scraper with sand paper both sides to get a crisp fit at this junction. To facilitate this the forward most mounting screws were backed off just enough to allow the scrapper/sandpaper sanding. Once mounted it was obvious there was a void where the bulwarks met the molded rabbet of the hull. I simulated the kit molding by applying doll house furniture chair rail(180 thousands). That disguised the void quite well I believe. One last note. When I tried using the small Tamiya spray cans it became obvious that coverage and cost were going to be a problem. In a hardware store search I came across the Rustoleum Plastic primer and spray paints. I am about to go that route for hull finish.

Always a treat to see your work results Rusty! Joe

I always hesitate disparaging any business especially the "cottage industry" that supports us. I too have had an experience with Crown but not nearly as bad as yours. Of late I have been dealing with Wood Project Source. Roman has been very supportive to me and has delivered timely and quality materials.

Well I finally decided to order the Sherline 5400A with the DRO assembly. I chose the DRO unit over the CNC ready system for a very specific and probably dumb (to some) reason. My background is electronic machine control engineering. Given over 35 years in that business I did not want to get caught up in the "gee whiz" of the machine control. I just want to build ship models!!!! I know I would get caught up in the "programming" and its associated fascination. So the compromise is the DRO version. After using an earlier, non DRO, version of this mill to machine bulkwark scuppers in the Atlantis model, I decided my machine skills needed some help in machining accuracy. I also ordered the 10,000 rpm pulley system to facilitate wood machining. I will have more to say when it arrives.

Ger one of our members commutes from Syracuse. I am sure he would be happy to cart you in some Saturday AM (2nd Saturday of each month 9 to 12). He is a fine fine modeler and very personable. Joe

Walter welcome to this amazing and engaging forum. I am curious as to your location as we have a modeling group here in the Rochester NY area. We are a small group with both nearby and distance members. We have members from Buffalo and Syracuse and even a distance member in Lisbon Portugal! Please visit our web site www.modelshipwrightguildwny.org for more about us. We surely would like to have you visit us if that is feasible. Regards Joe (Model Shipwright Guild Facilitator)

I have started early stages of painting the hull and bulwark area. I was advised that Tamiya spray should work just fine with ABS plastic. I am told it does not need to be primed. Having no experience with Tamiya paints (spray) and/or ABS I am at the mercy of others at the moment. Anyone out there that can confirm or refute that advice I surely like to hear back. Joe

The second last step to completing the bulkwarks prior to assembly was to enable the fastening system on the model. Six, 2.2 X 6.5 mm flat head screws were provided for each side. Once again using the Sherline mill, 6 clearance holes were drilled and then counter sunk with a larger drill bit to enable "fill in" so as not to show after painting. The mill proved invaluable in this seemingly simple operation as it enabled accurate depth and alignment control of the machining process.

The masts (and booms) arrived yesterday via Ages of Sail from Krick in Germany. These folk were so good about following through with my request. It is heartening to know some people still care about customer support!

I had another though,t although I have never used it. I just received a sheet of Alaskan Yellow Cedar. It is beautiful with little to no grain and seems to be another candidate for carving. I would imagine it can be purchased in billets. You might query Wood Project Source (Roman) as to availability. Joe

I have used sugar pine and it is a delight to work with if you can find it. Try the west coast lumber suppliers for musical instruments. If you can afford it mahogany carves beautifully as well and is quite stable. It too was used by pattern makers. Joe

This has been an incredibly busy summer so working on this model has been almost impossible. However yesterday I managed to sneak in some time and decided to work the bulwarks for this huge model. I am driven by the fact that it has to be painted soon and I do not have a spray booth. Given the size and extent of painting required it has to be done out of doors. The bulwarks need to be applied to the hull pre- painting. The work shown is related to the scuppers. There are 5 each side. I tried hand fashioning but almost knew before I started I wasn't going to be satisfied with the uniformity of each to its neighbor. Luckily one of our club members loaned me his Sherline vertical mill. This machine has made it a breeze. Mounted in the table vise is a block of pine rabbeted to accept the stepped bulwarks. The block elevates the bulwark and enables use of the miniature "quick grip" clamps to clear the mill table. Using a 1/8" router bit I am able to carefully mill the scupper slots to a high degree of uniformity. The bulwarks where the machining is taking place is maple and machining produces a clean cutout in-spite of the slower speed of the mill drive. Prudence dictates multiple passes to cut through the material. I am sold on a vertical mill and plan to acquire one soon. Just an aside. This mill is a Model 4000 and does not behave well at slow speed. I believe the brushes are worn and the commutator is dirty. Given its vintage the motor must be disassembled as the brushes are internal. Newer models have brushes external. I will be fixing this for the club member as a thank you for his loan.

Heard some good news yesterday. Krick came through and shipped masts to Ages of Sail and they will in turn provide them to me. Krick could not ship them directly as European post services do not permit packages of that length in their systems. The masts are 1400 mm long. I can't thank these folks enough for being so supportive!!

An inquiry for the drawing request was made within the past few day's to our Navy contact. Hopefully we will hear sooner than later. Joe Update as of 8/12/17: The request for drawings was finally signed off and I am to understand that the request has gone to the David Taylor Model Basin (old name) for fulfillment.

Many thanks for both heads up. It is more and more obvious that I need to do more homework. Secondly the tip to call Sherline never occured to me. I woll do that. Joe

OK guys I keep saying I have made up my mind on the Sherline Mil,l 5400 with DRO. But what keeps popping up on my radar is the CNC ready version of this mill. My background was as an electrical engineer so I have never let go of the "technology" interest. Does anyone out there employ a CNC version in thier model work? Is this version overkill? I am assuming one can use the CNC ready version as a manual machine. Is that true? Joe

I don't have this book yet but by the accolades herein it is surely one for my library. I had the good fortune to spend some time with Rob when he lived in North Chatham MA. It was in the 1980's and when I would vacation there I would visit his shop. He was an incredible modeler even then and of course remains so. What I found, possibly even more remarkable, was his incredibly detailed documentation of his works. To say they complimented his projects wouldn't do them justice. To me they were in themselves works of art. At the time they were hand drawn and printed. I can't imagine his published books to be anything less than that! Joe

Welcome to this august, friendly and supportive group. You are in for a journey of enjoyment and accomplishment and you won't travel alone as the folk who support this forum are there to help and advise as you have already seen. Joe

Tom I am not coming up with KeithAug's log. Can you give me a more direct pointer? Joe

Jud just this past Friday I was on the phone asking for an update on the Navy drawings. Not surprisingly the answer, as you guessed, was it will take time to get the drawings released to us. We are hopeful that this happens before the summer is over but we are on the "wag end of this puppy". Standby. In regard to your latest post it must have been just crazy nuts there! The guys were just amazing in getting the job done! Joe