wyz

I love the progress you're making Matt.  Your Winnie is looking pretty good.
Tom

Welcome aboard tenderfoot.  Chuck gave you great advice about taking your time and asking lots of question.  This group project has quite a number of friendly and competent model builders who will gladly give you help should you stumble.

Tom

No, there will be no quitting with this project.  Thank you, Frank and Ron for your concern and best wishes.  I feel confident all of us will be moving our Winchelsea builds forward soon.

Tom

Thanks H's H.  You can bet the ranch I won't go too fast.  When you have the pain I had you damn sure don't want to hurt yourself again.  The templates will occupy my time for several weeks.

Tom

Well, it's been over a month since I ruptured a disc in my back.  Is it still sore?  Oh yes, but it feels a great deal better than it was.  I told myself I would put down model ship building until my back is better.  While I'm still not where I want to be the prednisone, cyclobenzaprine, rest, and now limited exercise have helped a lot.  I'm now starting to think about how I will move forward with this Winchelsea project.  After my accident I was quite sure that building a solid hull frigate model would be way too much for someone with chronic back problems, and that I should seriously consider building a POB model of the ship.  I did just that, but the more I thought about it the less I liked the idea.  On more than one occasion I came close to placing a sizeable order to Chuck at Syren Ship Model Company, but I could never pull the trigger.  Why?  Down deep inside I knew that nothing short of a solid hull model of Winchelsea would make me happy.  The question was whether I could lighten the model enough that a solid hull build would be viable.  I came to the conclusion it was, but any changes wouldn't be on the hull I started months ago.  After my accident I was angry, frustrated and impetuous enough to trash the hull along with the Mylar lift templates and the plywood hull shaping templates.  Ooops!  My haste to throw out what I perceived to be a hull that would never be completed will absolutely prove to be costly.  I certainly made a lot of work for myself, but with my back still sore I can use the recovery time for those less physical MSB activities.... like making new templates.  It's time-consuming but easy to do.  After looking at the pictures of my first effort I think I've figured out a number of ways to reduce the model's weight.  Today I took a trip down to M.L.Condon in White Plains, New York and purchased quite a few 36"x7"x1" pieces of yellow poplar.  It's certainly enough for building Winchelsea's hull.  Who knows when I will be able to start construction of the model again?  That will depend, to a very large degree, on how the back feels.  Soon I hope.   [putting knuckles to head]  Knock on wood!

It's nice to see you start your Winchelsea model.  I wish you only the best in this project.  Should you run into a problem or just have a modeling technique question Chuck and a number of other experienced model builders are a post away.  Take your time, measure carefully and DON'T RUSH!  We look forward to following your build.

Tom

You did a beautiful job on that deck Mike.  It's really nice!  Your fellow model builders have come to expect this kind of precise workmanship from you.

Tom

Christian, I too wish to rig Winchelsea.  Thank you for the reminder to cut out the positions of the masts in the false keel.  I think I might make the holes for the masts 3-dimensional by building out on each side of the false keel.   That way there isn't any wiggle room in ANY direction.  I want a snug fit.

Tom

Ron, are you saying the mistake was what was supposed to be 1/4" planks were only 7/32"?  I'm not exactly sure what you are talking about.  I'm sorry you are set back to start planking anew, but it sounds like nothing short of that was going to make you happy.  Going forward I have this gut feeling you will be fastidiously accurate with all measurements of model and material.  I've had some setbacks myself this past week.  When my back started getting worse I went to the hospital and found out my problem wasn't a bad lower back muscle strain but a ruptured disk.  It looks like I will need more bed rest and much stronger pain medication.  The seventieth year of my life is not starting out well. 🥴

Tom

I hear you Ron.  You certainly do have priorities other than model ship building.  Cancer, Covid 19 and a disabled wife would be my primary concerns too.  I know you enjoy model building a lot and I just want you to be happy.  My comment about breaking the bank was said with the hope you wouldn't let money alone cloud your judgement in the best way to solve this modeling problem if you really felt it was the bulkheads.   Obviously you know where and how to spend your money.  I apologize if that comment came across as flippant.

Tom

Good luck and best wishes whatever you decide to do.  Would spending money on Chuck's bulkhead set break the bank?  If you can't see where you erred and don't clearly know how to rectify the problem it might be a good time to start anew.  The question is, how far do you want to travel down a road that will probably not take you where you want to go.   Ron, did you cut your bulkheads from Baltic birch plywood or a cheap and softer poplar core plywood?  How did you transfer the shape of the bulkheads from print to wood?  Did you take extreme care in the layout work, cutting them out and sanding them?  If you can honestly say you were very, very careful with the bulkheads you made then I would rip the planking off and try to save this effort.  If you seriously believe the bulkheads are at the heart of the problem I would start anew.  I wonder what our fellow model builders would do if they were in your shoes.  Maybe Chuck can give you meaningful advice.

Tom

One of the beautiful things about my solid hull building method was its stability.  By suspending the hull above the building board the way I did there was absolutely NO MOVEMENT what-so-ever, and because it never moved I could use a very accurate height gauge to check EVERYTHING for accuracy against the plans.  Right now I'm trying to determine how I can have a stable mounting of the hull to the building board that would be repeatable, something similar to what I had before.  Yes, I still want to use that height gauge.  It allowed for incredibly accurate height measurements.  As long as I read the gauge correctly there was no doubt where I made a mistake.  A very stable hull leads to accurate height measurement repeatability, and this solves and helps to prevent problems, especially when you're trying to align something that affects everything else.  I've always found those initial measurements the most important.

Tom

Rip it out Ron!  Way more times than not, those who repair even sizeable mistakes are eventually glad they did so.

Tom

Well JJ,  You certainly have our attention with your efforts to light up the model.  I love what you're doing and can't wait to see how this turns out.  This is something special!

Tom

Yes Richard, Chuck's precut bulkheads are 1/4" plywood, but a softer more easily sanded plywood.  The 1/4"plywood I have is Baltic birch, a very hard and difficult to sand species of birch.  The difference between the two plywoods, when it comes to shaping the bulkheads, is night and day.

Tom

Well Vladimir, yours makes three straight recommendations with no dissents.  Thank you for responding.

Tom

Getting the planking done is always a nice to achieve milestone.

Tom

That's good input JJ, just what I want to hear.  Thanks.

Tom

Thanks Matt.  That's the kind of feedback I'm looking for.

Tom

Thank you, Vladimir and Matt for your concern for my health.  After several days my back is still quite painful, and it takes everything just to stand up.  I can see this is going to take a while to feel better,  Oh well, that's life.  Getting back to ship model building is what I want to do, and I've decided to build Chuck's POB model of Winchelsea.  I really do like the ship and think it would be a wonderful project to work on.

QUESTIONS:

  I have a lot of Baltic birch of all sizes and a brand-new Delta scroll saw.  Is it better to build out of Chuck's laser cut Alaskan yellow cedar or use the Baltic birch which is so much harder and stronger and then plank over with boxwood and pear wood?  Each way has its advantages and disadvantages, so I'd really like to hear what the group has to say.  What's your opinion on this?  I've never used yellow cedar before.  Is it as nice as you thought it would be?  Would you use another wood if you had a do-over?  How long did it take for those who cut out their own station line bulkheads and then give them a preliminary sanding so that they fit?  I ask these questions because, if you say that the laser cut yellow cedar is the way to go, I will make a sizeable $$$ commitment and buy everything Chuck has available to make me current.  If not, I will do a scratch build POB.  You people are far enough into your builds that you've seen what's good and bad.  Give me your honest opinion.

Tom

I appreciate your reply Bruce.   It's rotten to have the rug pulled out from under you like that, bringing this project to a full stop.  However, I am enough of a realist to see that a solid hull Winchelsea that large was biting off more than I could chew.  Who knows?  Maybe hurting my back is a blessing in disguise and that I was always meant to build Winnie POB.  This injury has forced me to look at an issue that I have been avoiding for some time, that a solid hull 1:48 scale frigate is simply too unwieldy heavy for a man of my age and condition to handle and produces an uncontrollable amount of wood dust.  It's sad to say, but youth must be served.

Tom

Thanks, Christian.  I'm an optimist and I feel confident all will be ok with my back.  It will just take some time to heal.   A lot of model builders, for one reason or another, are forced to go back to square one.  It's a HUGE club.  I know I will have lots of fun building a POB model of Winchelsea.  It's just a little different from the way I've been building the last 15 years.  Yes, I'm disappointed, but I'll get over it soon enough.  Lord knows, a POB build won't create the copious amount of wood dust of a solid hull construction.  That I won't miss!

Tom

     A sincere thank-you goes out to Bradley, Marc, Jorge and Ron for your concern about my health.  My back hurts so much I broke out the crutches so that I might at least have some mobility, but most of the time I'm curled up in bed.  I've blown out discs in my lower back before and both times the pain was far worse than what I'm experiencing now.  That gives me some hope, but right now the pain is significant, and I stand bent over and leaning to my right side.

     My solid hull Winnie was almost 40 lbs.  That's really heavy for a healthy guy to pick it up, work on it in your lap and then return it to the building board over and over and over and ....  If I was working on the Tidy Bowl man's dingy I'd say that a solid hull model was still doable, but a really hefty 1:48 scale frigate is just asking for me to injure my back again.  I am happy so many builders found interest in my solid hull construction method, but its simply not viable anymore.  I'm sorry, but I've definitely decided to terminate this and any other solid hull build.  Yes, I spent money on some wood and drawings, but the real expenditure was the time I put into my Winnie.  Even that wasn't all that much.  When my health permits I'm sure I will find great enjoyment building a POB model of Winchelsea and following all of my fellow model builder's logs.  Good things are ahead.  Hopefully this is only a minor speed bump.  Today, while propped up in bed, I cut out all 27 station line hull shapes that I had printed on cart stock several weeks ago.  Once again, thanks for your support and concern.

Tom

Bradley, I love model building too much to stop.  Life can be cyclic.  I built a number of POB models in my youth and then switched to solid hull construction.  Is it time to return to POB?  As for my back, well, the pain certainly gets my undivided attention.  I now walk like a centenarian with gout and plantar fasciitis.

Tom

Every once in a while you get a none-too-subtle reminder you are human, and a fragile one at that.  Last night, while taking two trash can full of poplar scrap from the basement out to the garage, I did something to my lower back.  Instantly I knew I really hurt myself as the pain was intense and that I had difficulty walking, let alone walking erect.  Four ibuprofen barely cut the pain.  I went to bed in the fetal position.  When I woke this morning the pain was less, but not by much.  It was perfectly clear to me that I had really hurt myself and that this wasn't going away in a day or two.  What I also realized was that the solid hull Winchelsea I had started, which weighs a ton, was not a project I was ever going to be able to bring to fruition easily, if at all.   Maybe in my youth a project of that size and weight would have been doable, but not as a 70-year-old with a weak back.  It's asking too much.  That leaves me to make some choices.  Do I walk away from ship model building for good (it's NOT going to happen), choose a much smaller vessel to build with a solid hull (it's unlikely to happen), or build a POB Winchelsea?   While POB is not my favorite build method I'm not totally averse to it.  Lord knows I've built enough POB models in my life.  Truth be said, Chuck has put together a wonderful POB project of a beautiful ship, certainly better than any POB kit I've ever built.  Who knows, maybe I'll like it.  One other thing has been made clear to me is that, no matter what I try, I can't keep the fine wood dust from going all over the house.  Yes, the filter helps, but it's not a solution.  I was still seeing a serious saw dust problem when I was just starting to form the hull with heavy sanding.  You don't have to be a rocket scientist to see where this is going.... dust in every nook and cranny in my condo.  Before I can do anything I need to get my back right.