Jump to content

Roger Pellett

NRG Member
  • Posts

    4,519
  • Joined

  • Last visited

Reputation Activity

  1. Like
    Roger Pellett reacted to SkiBee in Beginner looking for advice on first kit   
    40 years ago I started with a solid hull model and failed to get past step one.  I've built a lot of plastic models but never went back to try a wood model, shaping a hull and the rigging intimidated me.  A couple of years ago I decided to try my hand at wood models and saw an advertisement for Model Expo & Shipways models.  I started with the Model Shipways 3 ship beginners set and they took me step by step and I learned a lot of skills and knowledge for a fair price.  So much I tried my hand at a solid hull again and it's been successful so far.
       I highly recommend the Model Shipways Shipwright 3 Kit Series. By the time you finish the 3rd boat, the Muscongus Bay Lobster Smack, you will have the skills to take on anything.  They might be small and appear to be simple, but that's what you want in the beginning and to learn the basic skills, then try the other models.
  2. Laugh
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from Canute in Golden City by Louie da fly - Scale 1:50 and 1:25 - solid hull - Paddlewheeler   
    I think that this old U S Navy expression must apply to you Steven:
     
    ”If you can’t get your job done during the 24 hour day, work nights!”
     
    Or perhaps days are longer Down Under.
     
    😀😀😀😀
    Roger
  3. Laugh
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from mtaylor in Golden City by Louie da fly - Scale 1:50 and 1:25 - solid hull - Paddlewheeler   
    I think that this old U S Navy expression must apply to you Steven:
     
    ”If you can’t get your job done during the 24 hour day, work nights!”
     
    Or perhaps days are longer Down Under.
     
    😀😀😀😀
    Roger
  4. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from Cathead in Golden City by Louie da fly - Scale 1:50 and 1:25 - solid hull - Paddlewheeler   
    I think that this old U S Navy expression must apply to you Steven:
     
    ”If you can’t get your job done during the 24 hour day, work nights!”
     
    Or perhaps days are longer Down Under.
     
    😀😀😀😀
    Roger
  5. Like
    Roger Pellett reacted to wefalck in SMS WESPE 1876 by wefalck – 1/160 scale - Armored Gunboat of the Imperial German Navy - as first commissioned   
    The Crew
     
    The WESPE-Class had a complement of around 80 crew, of which 3 where officers. This seems to be quite a number for a ship of only 46 m length. Unfortunately, there is no information on the different duties and the distribution of ratings. There are some crew photographs from the 1900 to 1910 era, but they manly show officers and petty-officers and in addition, they come from the short periods during which the boats were commissioned for exercises in groups and may show crew from a whole flotilla.
     
    Gun drill on the WESPE-class around 1900
     
    The intention was to show some gun-drill on the boat, as in the historical photograph above. There are about ten ratings visible and a couple more or so may be hidden behind the gun. There would be probably also a petty-officer in charge. On the bridge there would be two men at the helm and a couple of officers. In total, I estimated that about 15 figures would be needed to present a reasonable picture of activity.
    Below the gun there would some ten men or more manning the cranks with which the gun is trained. In the boiler-room, some further ten crew would be working hard on stoking the fires, trimming coal etc. The same number of crew, would be on the off-watch. The machine would be tended by perhaps three to four engineers and petty officers. I am sure there are other duties, such as maintenance, signalling, plus a certain number on off-watches, but there is no information available on how these ships were ‘run’.

    Officers of SMS HERTHA 1874-1877. Source: https://senckenbergarchiv.de/kolonialesbildarchiv/.
     
    Uniforms
    The 1870s were a time of transition as far as the naval uniforms are concerned. In the early years of the Empire much of the features of the uniforms of the Prussian navy were retained. To a certain degree the uniforms also followed the general fashion in terms of the height of the waste-line, the width of trousers and blouses, the shape of the caps etc. By the early 1880s the uniforms of all ranks were quite consolidated and were changed only in details until the early years of WW1. There is abundant information on these later years and on officers’ and petty-officers’ uniforms, but information on ratings in the early years is quite scarce in the primary and secondary literature. In particular, information on working kits is not very detailed. Normally, a certain ‘kit’ would be ordered for certain duties, but photographs show a certain variety of items worn and how they were worn, for instance some men would have the sleeves rolled up, while others would not.

    Helmsmen on SMS HERTHA 1874-1877. Source: https://senckenbergarchiv.de/kolonialesbildarchiv/.
     
    Photography was still rather new then and it was difficult to take ‘action’-pictures with the cumbersome equipment of the day. When a sailor had his likeness taken in a professional photographic studio, then it was in his Sunday-best parade-uniform and not in workaday fatigues. The same applies actually to all ranks. There are fortunately a couple of photo-albums from training-cruises in the mid-1870s (e.g. of the cruise of SMS HERTHA to the Far East in 1874-1877) which on purpose show the real-life of the crew, as much as was possible with the equipment of the day, thinking of heavy tripods and large-format cameras with wet glass-plates. These photographs are an important source of information on how the uniforms really looked like and how they were worn for different duties, although virtually all situations were ‘posed’.

    Gun drill on SMS HERTHA 1874-1877. Source: https://senckenbergarchiv.de/kolonialesbildarchiv/.
     
    Apart from photographs, there are a number of printed works can be considered as primary sources, as they were published at the time, and just two or three secondary publications, which mostly reproduce the plates from earlier publications:
     
    ANONYM (1872): Uniformierungs-Liste der Königlich Preußischen Armee und der Kaiserlich Deutschen Marine. Zweite bis zu Gegenwart fortgeführte Auflage.-  114 p., Berlin (E.S. Mittler & Sohn).
     
    ANONYM (1887): Die Uniformen der Deutschen Marine in detaillierten Beschreibungen und Farbendarstellungen (Reprint 2007, Melchior Verlag, Wolfenbüttel).- 61 p., 18 Taf., Leipzig (Verlag von Moritz Ruhl).
     
    BURGER, L. (1864): Uniformierung der preußischen Marine, Originalzeichnungen.- Über Land und Meer, Bd. 12, Jg. 6, Nr. 31: 487 u. 489.
     
    HENCKEL, C. (1901): Atlas des Deutschen Reichsheeres und der Kaiserlichen Marine einschließlich kaiserlicher Schutztruppen in Afrika in ihrer Uniformierung und Einteilung.- 32 pl., Dresden (Militär-Kunst-Verlag MARS).
     
    Lintz, G., Raecke, K.-H. (1978): Die königlich preußische Marine.- Z. für Heereskunde, 275: 20-21.
     
    Marineamt [Ed.] (1984?): Die Geschichte der Matrosenuniform.- 79 p., Wilhelmshaven (Marineunterstützungskommando).
     
    NOESKE, R.,  STEFANSKI, C.P. (2011): Die deutschen Marinen 1818–1918. Organisation, Uniformierung, Bewaffung und Ausrüstung.- 2 vols.: 1336 p., 304 pl., Wien (Verlag Militaria).
     
    RUHL, M. [Ed.] (1887): Uniformen der deutschen Marine in detaillirten Beschreibungen und Farbendarstellungen, nebst Mittheilungen über Organisation, Stärke etc., sowie einer Liste sämtlicher Kriegsfahrzeuge und den genauen Abbildungen aller Standarten und Flaggen.- 98 p., 26 pl., Wolfenbüttel (Reprint 2007 by Melchior Historischer Verlag).
     
    RUHL, M. (18936😞 Die Deutsche Marine und die Deutschen Schutztruppen für Ostafrika in ihrer neuesten Uniformierung.- 78 p., 20 pl., (Faksimile Fines Mundi).
     
    RUHL, M. (1892): Uniformen der deutschen Marine.- Starnberg  (reprint 1989).
     
    SCHLAWE, K. (1900): Die deutsche Marine in ihrer gegenwärtigen Uniformierung.- 98 p., (M. Ruhl).
     
    WALDORF-ASTORIA [Hrsg.] (193?): Uniformen der Marine und Schutztruppen.- 14 p., 8 pl., München (Waldorf-Astoria Zigarettenfabrik).
     
    ZIENERT, J. (1970): Unsere Marine-Uniform – Ihre geschichtliche Entstehung seit den ersten Anfängen und ihre zeitgemäße Weiterentwicklung von 1816 bis 1970.- 451 p., Hamburg (Helmut Gerhard Schulz Verlag).

    Gun drill on SMS HERTHA 1874-1877 – note the high heels of the shoes at this time. Source: https://senckenbergarchiv.de/kolonialesbildarchiv/.
     
    Preparing the Figures
    Starting point is a set of unpainted figures by Preiser in 1/160 (N-scale). Compared to HO-scale the selection is much smaller and the sets of unpainted figures are not so easy to find. Individual figures were selected on the basis of their poses, but very few had vaguely useful dresses. Some of the railway officials formed a suitable a basis for the officers and petty-officers.
    Fortunately, the figures are small, some 10 to 11 mm in height, so only a rather summary representation of their attire needs to/can be achieved.
    All figures required quite a bit of carving and sculpting with ‘Green Stuff’. The single-breasted jackets of the railway staff had to be converted into the double-breasted, longer frock-coats of the time. The peak-caps of 1960s officials (many of the figures were originally modelled by Preiser in the early 1960s) looked quite different from those worn by naval officers in the 1870s – German (naval) peak-caps underwent a significant change in appearance between the 1870s and the early post-WWII years. 
    Naval ratings required more substantial carving: jackets had to be cut away and blouses tucked into high-waist trousers had to be carved. Safety helmets were cut away and the characteristic sailor’s cap sculpted with ‘Green Stuff’. Shovels etc. were cut away and hands drilled for more appropriate implements. The sailors also got their traditional large collar.

    The crew-member at various stages of modelling
     
    Unfortunately, I forgot to take a ‘before’ picture, but the one above shows the 15 figures at various stages of the carving and sculpting exercise. Amputations and reassembly à la Dr. Frankenstein are difficult at this small scale and were not attempted with few minor exceptions.
     
    Again, a text-heavy post, but it serves myself as a memo of my deliberations and what I did.
     
    To be continued ....
  6. Like
    Roger Pellett reacted to James H in 1:16 Indian Girl Canoe - Artesanía Latina   
    1:16 Indian Girl Canoe
    Artesania Latina
    Catalogue # 19000
    Available from Artesania Latina for €54,99
     

     
     
    History
    Famous for appearing in numerous American Indian films, the ‘Indian Girl’ canoe was created in 1902 by J.H. Rushton, America's leading canoe builder. The ‘Indian Girl’ came in numerous versions. Introduced in 1902 and always Rushton's best-selling canvas canoe, the Indian Girl was available in lengths from 15' to 18'. Offered in Grade A (two-piece gunwales and pocketed ribs) and Grade B (heavier inwales and thin outside rails and rail caps). 


     
    Rushton died in 1906. His widow and son incorporated the business and remained in operation until 1917. Canoes and boats built between 1906 and 1917 can usually be identified by the presence of a "J.H. Rushton, Inc." brand or tag. Sometime after the Rushton factory closed in 1917, Joseph Leyere, a noted boat builder from Ogdensburg, New York, acquired the Indian Girl moulds and the rights to build them. He marketed these under the "Whistle Wing" trademark of the St. Lawrence Boat Works until sometime in the late 1920s.
    (Abridged from the excellent Wooden Canoe Museum website).
     
    The kit
    This is a new release from Artesania Latina. I'm not entirely sure which of the incarnations of the Indian Girl canoe it represents, but it clearly appears to look like the one in the photo I added above. That's good enough for me. This quite inexpensive kit will create a model which is just over a foot (30cm) in length, at a scale of 1:16. The kit is packaged in one of Artesania's easily recognisable top lid boxes which has some images of the completed model, including detail shots. The nature of this kit means that there aren't oodles of parts sheets within. Instead, there is one small pack of cellophaned parts, and a bundle of strip wood/metal tube etc. No instructions are supplied in the kit as it's expected that you will follow the online build videos. That could be a little contentious for those who want a paper copy and aren't good with using online resources to build a kit.
     



     
    Let's take a look inside the bundle. There are 6 sheets of wooden parts. The first two, seen here, are for building the jig/buck onto which you will plank the canoe shell. Please note the engraved marks on one of the sides of the main jig. these are for transferring the marks to the strip piece which will form the lower keel and determine the position of the inner ribs of the canoe. The formers don't have a centre line engraved on them for some reason, and you will need to add that yourself. The two bulbous parts (J4) are for helping to form the inner ribs before gluing them in place. EB3 are for mounting the nameplate to the plinth.

    Sheet 5 contains all of the internal ribs that you will form around part J4. These are over-length so you can trim them after fitting.  The sheet underneath contains the the largest of the two plinth parts, with the small one on the adjacent sheet. Also seen on the plinth sheet are the bow and stern of the canoe. The bottom sheet contains the thwarts, paddles and the bow/stern turtle decks. 

    While there aren't too many pre-cut parts, but there is a reference sheet included which has them all printed on.

     
    The remainder of the kit materials are in strip form, including some brass tube and rod which will be used for mounting the canoe to its plinth. The lighter material is for planking the canoe and the darker is for internal details as well as keel, seat frames etc.

     
    The hessian fabric is for adding to the seat frames, creating the cushion. The rigging cord is for the canoe tether line and also the handle grips on the paddles. 

     
    As well as the name plate for the plinth, there is also an ID shield for the canoe itself and parts for the tether, plus further parts for running on the outside of the completed keel.

    As there's no manual, you can access the online instructional videos by this link. Please check it out:
     
     
    Conclusion
    While this I a very simple kit, the completed model does look incredibly nice and won't take up much valuable shelf space. It would make a very nice desk ornament too. A very inexpensive and nicely designed little kit which will give the modeller a good number of pleasant hours in the workshop. 



     
     
    RELATED ITEMS
     
    Artesania have sent extra items which relate to this kit release, namely a display case and a set of paints which are also specific. 
     
     
    Methacrylate Showcase for The Indian Girl Canoe Model
    Purchase from Artesania Latina for €59,99

    The case for the canoe model is quite specific in its dimensions, and all parts are carefully packed into a robust bubble bag so the delicate acrylic won't be damaged. 

    Inside the sleeve, all parts are also wrapped in cellophane. 

    There are two parts to the base, creating a recessed lower plinth onto which the clear assembly will sit without need for glue. 

    All panels of acrylic are covered on BOTH sides by a peelable protective cover. Also note that a cleaning cloth is provided too. 

    The online instructions for this case show the sheets being taped together and then thin CA being run down the seams to permanently secure them. This does give me a little anxiety in case the glue leached from the joint and onto the tape which is holding the panels together. And then there is the risk of clouding. I know you can use odourless CA, but I would perhaps opt to use a glue which is specific for Methacrylate, and clamps/tools for making sure you get all angles correct. This is essential to make sure the last part fits. The tape method does mean you test all panels together before CA, but I'll leave that decision to you.


     
    Paint set for Indian Girl Canoe
    Purchase from Artesania Latina for €15,99

     
    This acrylic paint set contains SIX 20ml bottles of paint, filler, varnish, and also stain. The colours are specific to this kit, and include the white as an undercoat. All are water-based. The contents are:
    Off white  Hull green Semi-gloss varnish White primer/filler Water based wood dye Night green
     
    Artesania's site says the paints are also suitable for airbrushing. It gives no details about this, but assume you would need to thin them at least 50% with water or other thinner which aids smooth acrylic flow in an airbrush. 
     
     
    My sincere thanks to Artesania Latina for sending these items to be reviewed on Model Ship World. To buy them, click the links in this article.
     

     
      
  7. Like
    Roger Pellett reacted to HAIIAPHNK in FULMINANT by HAIIAPHNK - French stern castle   
    Geometry is one of the most interesting sciences. In my opinion. Of course, I will not argue that algebra, physics or chemistry have their own beautiful masterpieces. Our world is designed ingeniously and in it different sciences complement each other.
     And when you are engaged in the construction of architectural forms, you can feel yourself a little creator and see how you can solve complex problems with the help of a circular or the simplest measuring devices even without knowing long formulas. When it is not possible to do so, one can still feel the splendor of these tasks. And the fact that they did not succumb at that moment only emphasizes that this is really science and not just random lines on paper.
     

     

     

     
     
     
    I'm interested in this question too. Tell me more about it, please.
  8. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from Ras Ambrioso in Golden City by Louie da fly - Scale 1:50 and 1:25 - solid hull - Paddlewheeler   
    I believe that everything being hand made should also be a selling feature. In this case it’s also cheaper as it  appears that you are donating time and materials.  Printing materials and labor would be out of pocket costs.
     
    I join others in lifting my virtural hat to you!  Building 13 of the same model !
     
    Roger
  9. Like
  10. Like
    Roger Pellett reacted to Louie da fly in Golden City by Louie da fly - Scale 1:50 and 1:25 - solid hull - Paddlewheeler   
    Glen, 'chuffed' means pleased. You can be mildly chuffed or extremely chuffed. I think they were near the top end of the scale. One asked me if it would be possible to get his yacht model repaired, others were very interested in the idea of selling the models to the public - lots of people come here from Melbourne and have a nice trip in the lake in the paddlewheeler. What nicer than to then buy a model of the boat? 
     
    Roger, I agree about the cost factor. The wood is donated - we have far more than we know what to do with, and the machinery to cut it to size. I'm hoping I can figure out a jig to make mass production easier.
     
    Oh, and 13 is just the start!
     
    Steven
  11. Like
    Roger Pellett reacted to Jim Lad in Herzogin Cecilie 1902 by Jim Lad - Four Masted Barque   
    Another small update.
     
    The first image is an overhead view of the very long poop deck - now cleaned of dust, dirt and general grunge. 
     
    The second image is of the forecastle, showing the first tentative steps towards correction of some errors on the model. Part of the railing has been removed on each side of the deck, as these sections were removable and had chain, rather than steel bar railings.
     
    More thinking and study of photos has brought to light another major problem. The original ship had a beautiful teak capping rails all around the poop rather that the pipe rail shown on the model. The Senior Curator would like to have this changed to conform to the original, so - yet another major alteration. My current thinking is that the simplest way around this will be to file down the tops of the stanchions a little to bring them to the height of the bulwarks forward, and then to run the wooden capping around on top of the current steel piping. A lot of work, but I think easier than ripping out all of the railing and starting again. If anyone has any better ideas, I'd love to hear about them as I'm not looking forward to all that additional work.
     
    Another problem is the number holes and gaps in the deck caused by the removal or alteration of items that were no longer on the ship at the time of her last voyage. I need to find some kind of filler to close up all those holes and make them a little less obvious.
     
    This model is turning into a real lesson for anyone thinking of taking on a restoration; the number of problems on deck on this model that have come to light since I started serious cleaning operations is amazing!!
     
    John
     

  12. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from Canute in Golden City by Louie da fly - Scale 1:50 and 1:25 - solid hull - Paddlewheeler   
    I believe that everything being hand made should also be a selling feature. In this case it’s also cheaper as it  appears that you are donating time and materials.  Printing materials and labor would be out of pocket costs.
     
    I join others in lifting my virtural hat to you!  Building 13 of the same model !
     
    Roger
  13. Like
  14. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from KeithAug in Chaconia by Javelin - 1/100 - RADIO - LPG Tanker   
    Piping has a certain logic.  High point vents, low point drains, bypasses around some eqipment and valves, and loops to absorb expansion and contraction in long runs.  There are industry standards for fittings like elbows, tees, flanges, etc.  Long Radius ells are formed to a radius of 1.5 nominal pipe diameters, eg a 4in nominal sized elbow is formed on a 6in radius although the outside diameter of the fitting and pipe that it welds to is 4.5in.  Metric pipe sizes while specified in metric dimensions usually correspond to American pipe sizes.  Pipe bends are usually specified in nominal pipe diameters too;  3 dia, 5dia, etc.  Unlike fittings, which are purchased from a manufacturer, bends would be made at the shipyard or by specialized pipe fabricators (where I worked for most of my career).
     
    Roger
     
     
  15. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from mtaylor in Bragozzo by maurino   
    Thanks Maurino.  I’m enjoying watching you build this model.
     
    Roger
  16. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from mtaylor in Bragozzo by maurino   
    The picture posted below hangs in my living room and was painted, supposedly in Venice, in about 1898 by the relative of a family friend.  He gave it to my parents in 1932 as a wedding present.
     
    I thought that I would post it here to see if you could identify the type of watercraft.  It might be what you are building.
    Roger
  17. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from Cathead in Golden City by Louie da fly - Scale 1:50 and 1:25 - solid hull - Paddlewheeler   
    I believe that everything being hand made should also be a selling feature. In this case it’s also cheaper as it  appears that you are donating time and materials.  Printing materials and labor would be out of pocket costs.
     
    I join others in lifting my virtural hat to you!  Building 13 of the same model !
     
    Roger
  18. Like
  19. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from mtaylor in Brig Eagle 1814 by bdgiantman2 - 1/48   
    Also, check out the articles for other ships in the book.  You may find some useful examples of hull structure for Lake built vessels.  I think tat you will find your local library in tracking down  a copy.  This is one of those books that deserves to held in your hand.
     
    Roger
  20. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from mtaylor in Saint Philippe 1693 by CRI-CRI - scale 1/72 - French warship from Lemineur monograph   
    Haven’t visited for quite a while.  Outstanding work and nice progress.
     
    Roger
  21. Like
  22. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from mikegr in Free CAD program   
    Micha, et all:
     
    Some thoughts from a modeler who doesn’t use CAD.  CAD is not necessary for building ship models.  There are 1000’s of lovely accurate ship models built before CAD.  
     
    The basic scratch ship modeling drafting task is to convert archival information into patterns that define the shape of the hull.  This information comes from a drawing, a half model, or a table of offsets.  For Nineteenth Century vessels and ships built to about 1970 hulls were not designed using simple geometric shapes.  Curves are the result of two different drafting techniques; ships curves, and splines.  Splines work by the rules for deflection of beams; a cubic equation.  Ships curves are standardized drafting tools created using different mathematical functions.  How well a particular CAD program mimics these manual drafting tools well determine the accuracy of the model.  As a Naval Architecture student a long time ago, I watched a visiting Professor from a Major Japanese university test several hull forms modeled from simple trigonometric shapes, sines, cosines, parabolas, etc. in our large towing tank.  They looked nothing like real ships.
     
    All ship hull lines drawings are “faired” at one time or another.  In other words, plotted points often do not line up to allow a fair curve to be passed through.  Manual drafting requires the draftsman to use his judgement to correct this.  CAD requires either manual intervention or a mathematical algorithm.  There is therefore, no definitive example of an old ship’s hull, only different interpretations.
     
    To me CAD is just another ship modeling tool.  If you enjoy working with computers and are willing to spend the $$$ and especially time to learn the program that’s fine.  On the other hand, beautiful models can be built using manual drafting techniques, or purchased plans.
     
    Roger
  23. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from mtaylor in Golden City by Louie da fly - Scale 1:50 and 1:25 - solid hull - Paddlewheeler   
    I believe that everything being hand made should also be a selling feature. In this case it’s also cheaper as it  appears that you are donating time and materials.  Printing materials and labor would be out of pocket costs.
     
    I join others in lifting my virtural hat to you!  Building 13 of the same model !
     
    Roger
  24. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from Canute in RMS Titanic by Massimodels – Minicraft – 1:350 – PLASTIC – Tom's Modelworks   
    I enjoy reading the plastic modeling posts on MSW as you guys are real artists when it comes to subtle painting effects.
     
    I would like to try your scheme on my current project, the Great Lakes freighter Benjamin Noble .  It has a black hull.  
     
    Is the white brush applied? Randomly?  Is the fan in the background serving some paint related purpose?
     
    Any tips would be greatly appreciated.
     
    Roger
  25. Like
    Roger Pellett got a reaction from mtaylor in Chaconia by Javelin - 1/100 - RADIO - LPG Tanker   
    Piping has a certain logic.  High point vents, low point drains, bypasses around some eqipment and valves, and loops to absorb expansion and contraction in long runs.  There are industry standards for fittings like elbows, tees, flanges, etc.  Long Radius ells are formed to a radius of 1.5 nominal pipe diameters, eg a 4in nominal sized elbow is formed on a 6in radius although the outside diameter of the fitting and pipe that it welds to is 4.5in.  Metric pipe sizes while specified in metric dimensions usually correspond to American pipe sizes.  Pipe bends are usually specified in nominal pipe diameters too;  3 dia, 5dia, etc.  Unlike fittings, which are purchased from a manufacturer, bends would be made at the shipyard or by specialized pipe fabricators (where I worked for most of my career).
     
    Roger
     
     
×
×
  • Create New...