USS Constitution by Modeler12 - FINISHED - Model Shipways

[Modeler12]

When using flags to control fleet evolutions, isn't it standard practice to display the flag signal and execution of the signal is began at the time the flags are pulled down?

jud

Jud, if I am not mistaken, signal flags and what I was referring to are different.

Signal flags do not go to the top of the mast. They would be coming down from the foremast jack, or some other place that is more adaptable to making changes. Help me here, someone.

[popeye2sea]

Jud, you are correct.  The correct procedure for flag signalling is thus:  The originating ship hauls the signal closed up ( fully raised to the yard arm).  The ship receiving the signal answers with the same signal 'at the dip' (about half way up to the yard arm).  If there are ships further along the line those ships also answer at the dip.  The last ship in the line, having answered the hoist at the dip, indicates that the signal is acknowledged and understood by closing up the signal (raised to the yard arm).  The repeating ships in turn back up the line to the originator close up their hoists which tells the originating ship that all ships in the line acknowledge and understand the signal.  The signal to execute the maneuver is when the originating ship hauls down the hoist.

 

Sounds complicated when written out but not so in practice.  And it ensures accurate communication between all ships and coordinated action.

 

 

Jay, signal flags have been placed in a number of places over the centuries.  At one time there was no standardized set of signal flags and the national ensign flown in different positions indicated the signal.  For example, raising the red ensign at the main mast head might mean close with the enemy while the same flag flown from a yard arm might mean Captains report to the flag ship.

 

Today signal flags are flown primarily from halyards on a yardarm, although they can still be flown from the mast in some circumstances.  The signal books dictate the order of precedence for reading hoists.  Just going from memory, flags are read from the yardarms first, outboard to inboard, then from the mast head, then from the triatic stay (a stay which ran from the fore mast to the main mast.

[popeye2sea]

Jay, I think the admirals flag thing was talking about when and where to fly the admirals flag when he comes aboard.

 

Every ship in the Navy flies its distinctive mark (flag) to show that it is in commission and under command.  The commission pennant is the distinctive mark for the ship when the ships captain has command.  It is normally flown from the aftermost mast peak.  Each admiral rank, and each high ranking government official has their own flag.  Since the ship can only fly one distinctive mark at a time, when an admiral comes aboard the commission pennant is lowered and the admirals flag is 'broken out' at the mast peak in place of it.  If a civil official is also embarked the admirals flag is flown from the fore mast on a two masted ship or the starboard yard of a single masted ship.

 

To break a flag means to roll up the flag in a tight roll bound with twine and run it up the mast.  The down haul part of the halyard is looped beneath the twine before attaching it to the bottom of the flag (we use a special snap hook with a sharp edge made just for this purpose now).  As the admiral or dignitary is approaching the ship the side boys are posted at the gangway.  As the admiral approaches the gangway the appropriate number of guns for the salute are fired.  As the admiral ascends the gangway the boatswain pipes the side and the side boys salute.  The pipe ends when the admiral steps aboard, a quick tug on the halyard breaks the twine allowing his flag to fly free, the band strikes up the appropriate ruffles and flourishes, they then play the admirals march, and the admiral has officially embarked.

 

The Navy has a ton of traditions like this.  It was part of my job as a signalman to know all this stuff and coordinate the ceremonies.

[Modeler12]

Great and thanks Henry.

I hope one of the moderators is watching this and perhaps this part can be moved to a more appropriate place.
To me the above comments are neat and this is probably interesting information for a lot of other folks.

BTW there are several other threads talking about flags. Your search on top.

[CaptCraig]

LOL...moving on...The rigging is looking great Jay! It is always a please to see your work.

[Modeler12]

Since this is still my log, I would like to add another 'trial'. It is my first attempt to include some coiled rope on the belaying pins. This is along the bottom of the mizzen mast and along my 'bad side'; the port, where I make my first trial runs.

 

I mentioned making coils before, but now I want to see what I can do with them. They are pre-made, not perfect, but so is life aboard.

I am procrastinating with tackling the main mast shrouds, I know.

[CaptCraig]

Those coils actually look pretty realistic. Looking good!

[Modeler12]

Thanks Graig,

Actually making these coils was another interesting project. I made a video and if you fast forward towards the end you can see how I did them. I am sorry about my shaking hands, but I am not very good in front of a camera.

 

 

Here is part of the collection. My first attempts were horrible, they are the ones towards the left top.

[CaptCraig]

Thanks for sharing this Jay. I enjoy all of your videos, so no need to for apologies!

[ScottRC]

Jay,

 

Thanks for the tutorials.  I started making coils last night instead of what I should be working on, and that is to work up the nerve to rig the jeers and stays on my Connie.

[popeye2sea]

Those coils look great, Jay.  Very realistic.  They would not be perfect on the real ship either.

[Modeler12]

Those coils look great, Jay.  Very realistic.  They would not be perfect on the real ship either.

Coming from a young salt, thank you.

 

Here is a view I don't hope to see again. It is 'pre-main-shrouds'.

The lines from left to right are the two lines of the flag halliard, the royal backstay, the topmast backstay, and the four lines for the topgallant halliard (belayed as shown). I may still make a very small coil for the flag halliard.

 

I'll do the same on the starboard side and then do the shrouds (I think).

[popeye2sea]

Not such a young salt.  I've been retired from the Navy for 9 years now.

[BRiddoch]

Great work on the coils Jay.  Thanks for the video.

 

              Bob R.

[Modeler12]

Thanks Bob.

I am glad the videos are of interest to some of you. But, in a way, I have put them together for my own benefit. I find that by doing this slowly in front of this little camera, I concentrate on doing it right and learn in the process. Then when I edit the clips I find more details I need to improve. In the case of this belaying video I also met some nice folks who could show me how they do it on a small but real ship.

[CaptainSteve]

Jay,

I can only echo MrRiddoch's words.

Your work is going to live on and be of extreme value for others such as myself.

[JSGerson]

Great video. I've added it to my "How To" library of modeling techniques.

[Modeler12]

When earlier I said that the picture would change when the main shrouds are installed, I was not quite right. The view did change when I added the two topmast backstays with the deadeyes, but the shrouds will be somewhat more to the right of the cannon.

The lines to the left coming down (out off focus) are the starboard main royal halliards. I have also added a small 'coil' for the flag halliard.

[Modeler12]

I have added another video to my collection. It has to do with attaching shrouds, deadeyes and lanyards to a ship model. I did this because I wanted some more practice what is coming up with my model.

I also posted this elsewhere.

[Modeler12]

After putting that video together I thought I had the shrouds under control. The nine port main shrouds are grouped in threes. Here is the first set.

 

I had used some bees wax on the lanyards and that really shows as a greyish cast. Also when I pulled them through the deadeyes some of it flaked off like dandruff. I put one of them in the microwave for about 45 seconds, pulled the warm thread between my fingers and that helped to smooth things a little.

 

Close-up pictures also show other so-so situations, but from a distance only I will know (and now you, who read this).

The real USS Constitution has all of the deadeyes painted black. I am not sure if I want to keep the upper ones as is or also paint them.

 

I should add here that later I 'melted' the bees wax by pulling the lanyards through a hot-damp cloth that I had put in the microwave oven for one minute. It not only did a good job with the wax but it also took care of some of the kinks and coiling. (I learned that from making burritos with large tortillas).

Edited January 28, 2014 by Modeler12

[CaptCraig]

Another great video Jay! Thanks again for your lessons! I think these look good close up, so they must look good when viewing the ship overall.

[texxn5]

Hello Jay, I have noticed that you seem to have good experience with blackening brass. It appears that I am going to have to use brass wire for my chainplates on my CW Morgan. The real ones are iron. The kit didn't have enough, and I'm deciding I will have to use the brass wire I have, but I want it of course to be black. Do you have a recomendation or a good proceedure for accomplishing this. I saw your video on using deadeyes but couldn't quite figure out what you used to make them black as well as wondering if it damages the wood deadeyes to saok them in the solution. Would appreciate your input. Also, thanks for your videos as they really help us novices.

[HIPEXEC]

Great job, so far.

[Modeler12]

Hello Jay, I have noticed that you seem to have good experience with blackening brass. It appears that I am going to have to use brass wire for my chainplates on my CW Morgan. The real ones are iron. The kit didn't have enough, and I'm deciding I will have to use the brass wire I have, but I want it of course to be black. Do you have a recomendation or a good proceedure for accomplishing this. I saw your video on using deadeyes but couldn't quite figure out what you used to make them black as well as wondering if it damages the wood deadeyes to saok them in the solution. Would appreciate your input. Also, thanks for your videos as they really help us novices.

I have done a fair amount of blackening of metals including mild steel, brass, copper and the pewter casting material used to make parts like canon barrels. There are several brands of compound on the market, but what I use was left over from my stain-glass work several years ago. For me it has worked nicely. I show a picture of the stuff below and it is still available through Amazon, for example.

If you do a search in the section about 'metal work, etc', you can find several threads on this forum that go into details. Here is one thread http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/1240-another-type-of-blackening-agent-and-some-experiments/?hl=%2Bblackening+%2Bmetals#entry23331

 

Thus far I have treated several wire 'strops' around wooden blocks and I have not had any problems (yet) with soaking the wood in the solution and rinse water. I just make sure the wood is dry before doing much else with it.

Edited January 29, 2014 by Modeler12

[CaptainSteve]

Jay,

A quick question (or two ... ) at this point, if I may.

 

Are you blackening your brass-work to create an aged effect ... ???

... or is it more to match with Connie's over-all black/white colour scheme ??

 

My reason for interrupting is that, for my own build, I am intending her to eventually (one day!!!) be docked with my brother ... who lives not quite 1.5km from the ocean in Mandurah, WA (No, NOT Washington state !!! Down here in Orstraya).  

I'm thinking that the high salt/saline atmosphere will very quickly (1-2 years) patinate(??) naturally.

Edited January 29, 2014 by CaptainSteve

[texxn5]

Thanks Jay, I'm going to attempt some experiments soon, so I'll see what I can find. I have some Blacken-It, but haven't been able to use it yet.

[Modeler12]

Jay,

A quick question (or two ... ) at this point, if I may.

 

Are you blackening your brass-work to create an aged effect ... ???

... or is it more to match with Connie's over-all black/white colour scheme ??

 

My reason for interrupting is that, for my own build, I am intending her to eventually (one day!!!) be docked with my brother ... who lives not quite 1.5km from the ocean in Mandurah, WA (No, NOT Washington state !!! Down here in Orstraya).  

I'm thinking that the high salt/saline atmosphere will very quickly (1-2 years) patinate(??) naturally.

Steve, I am blackening the brass straps to match the real ship in Boston. I also will paint the wooden deadeyes for the same reason. On the port side, thus far, I did not like the alignment of the deadeyes and black paint might hide my mistakes a bit.

I found that the patina works fine for me (as long as I clean the metal first) and it is easier than using paint on these small parts. In the beginning I did paint some using an airbrush, but with the primer first and then two coats of paint was taking a lot longer (not to mention cleaning the gun).

As far as letting Mother Nature do it? I cannot imagine that the brass would turn black in time. But the bottom of the hull might turn green.

Edited January 29, 2014 by Modeler12

[Modeler12]

After adding the shrouds on the port side, I attached the batten at the bottom and then did the futtock staves higher up.

I used pieces of .013 inch thick brass, blackened. To hold them in place and to allow me to adjust the horizontal spacing of the shrouds, I tied each with some thin sewing thread with some CA glue. After each shroud is tied with the thread, I will use my handy end snippers to trim the stave.

The sketch on page 7 of the plans really helps.

Edited January 29, 2014 by Modeler12

[Modeler12]

[Modeler12]

Evening. The futtock shrouds are in place for the port fore mast.

Things are getting 'busy'; something I don't like, but Connie seems to have no problem with all those lines.

She must be a stage girl, a comedian even.

 

Her shrouds on starboard are still bundled together (like a real dance girl) in the upper right hand corner.

Once they come down with futtocks, etc. things will be really jumping in the joint.