Overworked724 Posted June 24, 2016 Author #31 Posted June 24, 2016 (edited) Excellent. Will also try! On a different note: soaked bulkhead frames in water and put them in my 'bending jig'...nails on a board...and did a right brilliant job preforming them for mounting. But.... Put the damned things in backwards. Would be fine if the bowsprit was intended to come out of the stern. (I am such a bloody idiot sometimes). No pics. Too friggin embarrassing. The only reason I am posting is to keep myself honest and in task. Edited June 24, 2016 by Overworked724 Elijah, GuntherMT and Canute 3 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
Overworked724 Posted June 24, 2016 Author #32 Posted June 24, 2016 On a positive note...I now have an instinctive knowledge of the difference between bow and stern. Canute, Rick01 and Elijah 3 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
Overworked724 Posted June 26, 2016 Author #33 Posted June 26, 2016 Notes from the novice ship yard. 1. Accidentally snapped the nose piece (bow stem) while trying to pre-fit the fake bulk heads. Wonderful stuff, CA glue. 2. Am now re-pre-soaking bulkheads. But during the repair of the bow I decided I would try to put together some bulkhead filler blocks. Pretty obvious that I over sanded the bow filler pieces and have a feeling I can use the help When planking. Did my best. Slow and steady. 1 down, many to go. Elijah and Canute 2 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
Overworked724 Posted June 26, 2016 Author #34 Posted June 26, 2016 Canute and Elijah 2 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
Rick01 Posted June 26, 2016 #35 Posted June 26, 2016 You may find planking easier if you completely fill the bow section with balsa and sand/file to shape. It gives the first layer of planks something solid to grip in that first important curve. Rick Elijah and Canute 2 Quote Completed builds:- HM Cutter Mermaid. HMS Endeavour's Longboat Topsail Schooner Enterprize Arab Dhow Sultan
Overworked724 Posted June 26, 2016 Author #36 Posted June 26, 2016 Thanks, Rick. Now attempting to do just that. Canute and Elijah 2 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
Thunder Posted June 26, 2016 #37 Posted June 26, 2016 Hi, it may be worth checking something before moving on. Have you removed too much material from the bottom of bulkheads 2 and 3? it will be worth putting a piece of the first and second planking at these points to check that they will extend down to the walnut keel. you don't want a bit of the ply false keel showing. Checking now will save a lot of heart ache and work later. They will extend further down at this area due to the angles of the bulkheads but worth a check. Canute and Elijah 2 Quote Current Build(s): H.M.S Diana 1794 - Caldercraft 1:64 Scale Completed Builds: H.M.S. Cruiser 1797 - Caldercraft 1:64 Scale H.M. Naval Cutter Speedy 1828 - Model Shipwright 1:48 Royal Caroline 1749 - Panart 1:47 H.M. Brig Supply 1759 - Caldercraft 1:64 H.M.S. Pickle 1778 - Caldercraft 1:64 H.M.Y. Chatham 1741 - Caldercraft 1:64 H.M.S. Resolution Cutter - Corel 1:50 H.M.S. Racehorse - Sergal 1:47 (Renamed H.M.S. Thunder 1740) first wooden kit build.
Rick01 Posted June 26, 2016 #38 Posted June 26, 2016 Looks as if you've a bit of a curve on the fill you've done. Once you've packed the bow section you need to get a nice smooth sweep from the bow on through to that second bulkhead - takes time and isn't easy but you do need it to get the final planking right. I used a flexible sanding stick to finish that area. This was made by pinching one of my wife's flexible nail buffers and double sided sticky taping fine sand paper to it - made life so much easier. Rick Elijah and Canute 2 Quote Completed builds:- HM Cutter Mermaid. HMS Endeavour's Longboat Topsail Schooner Enterprize Arab Dhow Sultan
Rick01 Posted June 26, 2016 #39 Posted June 26, 2016 (edited) First bulkhead compares with my kit but the second does look like a bit of fill may be called for and three also doesn't look too bad. Rick Edited June 26, 2016 by Rick01 Canute and Elijah 2 Quote Completed builds:- HM Cutter Mermaid. HMS Endeavour's Longboat Topsail Schooner Enterprize Arab Dhow Sultan
Overworked724 Posted July 3, 2016 Author #40 Posted July 3, 2016 Happy 4th. Time marches on. A few hiccups. In trying to pre-bend the bulwarks after soaking, discovered that I put them in the jig backwards...after resoaking and rebending, discovered I had mangled them pretty badly. Yay...made new bulwarks (pretty fair job...get it? FAIR JOB! I laugh at my own jokes. Deal with it) Ok. During the remake of the bulwarks, I made bow and stern bow fillers. I am stopping with 2 on each side for each end. Pretty happy with it. Tried both basswood layering and balsa. Found balsa easier to shape but more difficult to cut (wanted the grain to flow laterally for easier shaping but cutting balsa blocks along the grain can be difficult) Learned a lot about shaping fillers...I found myself 'feeling' more than 'seeing' to note the curvature consistency. Next...bulwarks and whatever comes next. Canute and GuntherMT 2 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
Overworked724 Posted July 3, 2016 Author #41 Posted July 3, 2016 my wife asked me a great question. How will you mount it? Hmmmmmmm Canute 1 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
AntonyUK Posted July 3, 2016 #42 Posted July 3, 2016 Hi Patrick. Like I said you are a man of few words. Plan ahead and make provision for mounting on pillars or similar. Many examples on other builds. I like barrels or something similar. Regards Antony. Canute 1 Quote Best advice ever given to me."If you don't know ..Just ask. Completed Mayflower Completed Fun build Tail boat Tailboat Completed Build Chinese Junk Chinese Pirate Junk Completed scratch built Korean Turtle ship 1/32 Turtle ship Completed Santa Lucia Sicilian Cargo Boat 1/30 scale Santa Lucia On hold. Bounty Occre 1/45 Completed HMS Victory by DeAgostini modelspace. DeAgostini Victory Cross Section Completed H.M.S. Victory X section by Coral. HMS Victory cross section Completed The Black Pearl fun build Black Queen Completed A large scale Victory cross section 1/36 Victory Cross Section
Overworked724 Posted July 3, 2016 Author #43 Posted July 3, 2016 Hi Antony Thanks. I have mounts (brass pedestals with 3/16" bore. The question I have is: If I predrill the holes and install a nut into the center piece (false keel), then I would end up drilling out a gap in the walnut keel attached to the centerpiece. This would make the planking a bit more difficult as I would have basically two 'Gaps' along the keel which my mounts would cover, when it is ready to be mounted. Trying to envision how exactly I prepare the mount without damaging or wreaking the walnut keel. Many lessons as I grind through to the inevitable chore of planking. (Shudder) Canute 1 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
tkay11 Posted July 5, 2016 #44 Posted July 5, 2016 It is really difficult to drill the holes after you have placed the keel on the hull if you want accurate alignment since the nuts have to be placed correctly within the hull -- at least this is what I found when I was doing the same kind of thing. I don't know whether this applies to the mounts you bought, so in your case it may be easier. I had to figure out a jig that would allow me to drill through the keel with a precise vertical alignment. Of course it would have been much easier if I had drilled the holes in the keel before fixing it to the hull -- another one of the reasons why a lot of modellers wait before putting the stem, keel and sternpost on! Tony Quote === First build: Caldercraft HM Cutter Sherbourne 1763 FINISHED 2nd build: Triton cross-section COMPLETED 3rd build: La Chaloupe Armée / 42ft Armed Longboat of 1834 by tkay11 – scale 1:36, plans by M. Delacroix COMPLETED 4th build: Allège d’Arles 1833 (Ancre) POB by tkay11 – scale 1:100, plans by F. Fissore COMPLETED Working on La Jacinthe 1:96 POB (ANCRE publications)
Overworked724 Posted July 8, 2016 Author #45 Posted July 8, 2016 Exactly. Please share the jig design. I am in the exact same situation!! Canute 1 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
tkay11 Posted July 8, 2016 #46 Posted July 8, 2016 Sorry, Patrick, but I don't have any photos and can't remember how I did it. You can see from the first posts on my log that I had put the nuts in before the keel, but that I made a mess of the keel when drilling through. I seem to remember that I turned the hull upside down until the keel was level and held it in place with stuffing underneath as well as on the side whilst I drilled down using a set square as a guide. You can always drop it as an option and just go back to mounting it with the kit stand or another method. Some people just make it look like a shipyard and used beams held up against the side. There's no shame in retreating if you want to retain your sanity! Tony Canute and AntonyUK 2 Quote === First build: Caldercraft HM Cutter Sherbourne 1763 FINISHED 2nd build: Triton cross-section COMPLETED 3rd build: La Chaloupe Armée / 42ft Armed Longboat of 1834 by tkay11 – scale 1:36, plans by M. Delacroix COMPLETED 4th build: Allège d’Arles 1833 (Ancre) POB by tkay11 – scale 1:100, plans by F. Fissore COMPLETED Working on La Jacinthe 1:96 POB (ANCRE publications)
Overworked724 Posted July 10, 2016 Author #47 Posted July 10, 2016 Well...not much progress, but I did finally decide how to get a fairly good approximation of how to get the correct angle for the mount...and I was laughing the whole time. Hey...the hobby is supposed to be fun! Pictures later, but let's just say that I have officially found a use for high school trigonometry. Also...I have a new rule: Never eyeball drilling pilot holes for a ship mount while tipsy. Pat Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
Overworked724 Posted July 10, 2016 Author #48 Posted July 10, 2016 So...here is the rather rough (and totally risky) way I got the angle for the mount so I can mount with a level waterline. - Measured angle per the plans to achieve level water line - Added some 'filler blocks' to ensure there was enough 'meat' around the mounting screws - Prepared a mounting block to mount the ship keel up so that I could use a drill press at the correct angle - Secured ship and drilled pilot holes The time will come when the planking is done and I am ready to mount it for remainder of the work. I really did not see any other way than planning to use wood screws. But with a 3 mm keel, there is not a whole lot there to ensure a stable mount. So I simply planned for a bit of 'off center mistakes' when I drilled the pilot holes...no worry as long as I had some additional wood. Not the most elegant way of getting around not thinking enough ahead, but it will work. The next build I post will have the mounting considerations FIRST BEFORE I DO ANYTHING WITH THE FRAMES! tkay11, GuntherMT and Elijah 3 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
Overworked724 Posted July 17, 2016 Author #49 Posted July 17, 2016 Bulwarks on....and here she is on basic mount with correct angle. Not bad. ZyXuz, tkay11 and Elijah 3 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
Elijah Posted August 15, 2016 #50 Posted August 15, 2016 Nice job Patrick! Will you do a similar assembly for displaying her? Quote -Elijah Current build(s): Continental Gunboat Philadelphia by Model Shipways https://modelshipworld.com/index.php?/topic/15753-continental-gunboat-philadelphia-by-elijah-model-shipways-124-scale/ Completed build(s): Model Shipways Phantom http://modelshipworld.com/index.php?showtopic=12376 Member of: The Nautical Research Guild N.R.M.S.S. (Nautical Research and Model Ship Society)
Overworked724 Posted October 18, 2016 Author #51 Posted October 18, 2016 After many delays and continued visitors....I am finally able to spend some time on the Lady Nelson. I have just discovered that I am not good at planking. Not from the lack of reading, watching practicums and tutorials, etc. I have an ample library.... The problem is, as with all things, practical experience. Seeing a things done and doing a thing are two really different things. In short...I placed the first plank and now I can't go any farther. Soaked plank...check. Attached in place to dry and form, check. Verified fit prior to gluing, check. But now the next plank on both side has to ride up a large 'now existent' gap between the bottom edge of the first plank beneath the bulkhead, and a steep sweep of the bow...unless I force bend the planks, or separate them and make a patchwork 'plank' quilt....I can't get my second plank into position.... Been staring at the model for a week....too frustrated...and yes, I can post a photo....no energy at the moment. Taking a breather. Just wanted to vent. Elijah and tkay11 2 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
tkay11 Posted October 18, 2016 #52 Posted October 18, 2016 I wouldn't be too disheartened at this stage, Patrick. Most of us have had similar experiences and it's likely either to be easy to re-do, or to work around -- especially as this is only the first planking and will be covered up. Photos will help enormously as that will allow others to see where the problem lies and what suggestions or advice to offer. Tony Dutchman, Overworked724 and Elijah 3 Quote === First build: Caldercraft HM Cutter Sherbourne 1763 FINISHED 2nd build: Triton cross-section COMPLETED 3rd build: La Chaloupe Armée / 42ft Armed Longboat of 1834 by tkay11 – scale 1:36, plans by M. Delacroix COMPLETED 4th build: Allège d’Arles 1833 (Ancre) POB by tkay11 – scale 1:100, plans by F. Fissore COMPLETED Working on La Jacinthe 1:96 POB (ANCRE publications)
Matrim Posted October 18, 2016 #53 Posted October 18, 2016 If it is a double plank kit then dont worry about it. All the under layer does is to supply a better 'shape' for the final layer to sit on and you will sand away any bumps. Use it as a 'practice' as to what works and what does not so that when you get to final planking you will then do a much better job. If you have a look at my first layer of planking on my Bounty (steel yourself it is not pretty) and you will see nothing that belongs on a final model... http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/13783-bounty-by-matrim-caldercraft-164/ Elijah, Dutchman and Overworked724 3 Quote ...
Dutchman Posted October 18, 2016 #54 Posted October 18, 2016 (edited) Yes! Don't give up on us/me now! I'm following your progress eagerly, cause this will be my next build (have to finish my Swift 1805 first) and I think I can learn a lot by following your log. So; sail on! (please) edit; photo's will really help us to see what the problem is. So give us a look, please. (If nothing else, we will at least be able to sympathise) Edited October 18, 2016 by Dutchman Quote currently: master korabel Schooner Polotsk finished: the Swift 1805, the Lady Nelson on the shelf: US Brig Syren, Le Renard and the Hermione
Overworked724 Posted October 18, 2016 Author #55 Posted October 18, 2016 Will send pics later...I find it difficult to post pics as I always need to resize and whatnot before this site allows me to post. There are many logs on the Lady Nelson (just FYI - the Amati kit is name Lady Nelson - but is more or less a typical cutter from that age....the real Lady Nelson had two masts!) As this is my first Wooden Ship model - I wasn't expecting things to go smoothly. I was expecting to have been much farther on than I am, though. PLanking is, by far, the most difficult piece of this job. I am terrified to make a mistake...and NO...I cannot take the plank off and do a 'redo'...the glue holds entirely too strong. I think I am using carpenters wood glue, which appears to hold much faster. Elijah and Rick01 2 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
tkay11 Posted October 18, 2016 #56 Posted October 18, 2016 For wood glue, just soak it in isopropyl alchohol (isopropanol). It's easily available at chemists and eBay. I keep a 500ml bottle handy for all the mistakes I make. But you probably don't need to re-do. As has been said, it's just the first planking and sanding and filler does most of the job when mistakes are made. Some people see the first layer of planking as a kind of exercise to get to learn about planking. Tony Elijah 1 Quote === First build: Caldercraft HM Cutter Sherbourne 1763 FINISHED 2nd build: Triton cross-section COMPLETED 3rd build: La Chaloupe Armée / 42ft Armed Longboat of 1834 by tkay11 – scale 1:36, plans by M. Delacroix COMPLETED 4th build: Allège d’Arles 1833 (Ancre) POB by tkay11 – scale 1:100, plans by F. Fissore COMPLETED Working on La Jacinthe 1:96 POB (ANCRE publications)
Rick01 Posted October 19, 2016 #57 Posted October 19, 2016 Don't despair - I'm on to my fourth model and still can't get the planking correct. I've butchered this kit myself turning it into something resembling the real Lady Nelson and would suggest that once you start on the second planking you get a nice timber in .6 x 5 (or 4) rather than the 1 x 4 walnut supplied. I found the supplied timber quite hard to work with whereas the .6 was much easier to soak and bend in the three dimensions needed particularly round the bow and stern area. Rick Dutchman, tkay11 and Elijah 3 Quote Completed builds:- HM Cutter Mermaid. HMS Endeavour's Longboat Topsail Schooner Enterprize Arab Dhow Sultan
Overworked724 Posted October 20, 2016 Author #58 Posted October 20, 2016 Rick Love the idea of the thinner walnut planking. Will take your advice!!! Pat Rick01 and Elijah 2 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
Dutchman Posted October 20, 2016 #59 Posted October 20, 2016 Take it easy. I mean literally easy! One step at a time. If I've learned one thing, it's patience. When planking the hull on the Swift (my first), I often did 2 planks a day (later on some more), sighed, gazed and wondered how the **** I was going to get it done! Then read articles and forum posts again and went on trying. When I had finally finished the first planking. I was proud I had done it after all. But one look at the model made me realize that, in water, it would sink within a second. Then I discoverd woodfiller and the sun started shining through the dark clouds. After filling and sanding I had a smooth, looking good hull for second planking. So life was worth living after all. Just endure, keep on sailing, learn and enjoy. (and don't drink to much rum!) Elijah, Rick01 and tkay11 3 Quote currently: master korabel Schooner Polotsk finished: the Swift 1805, the Lady Nelson on the shelf: US Brig Syren, Le Renard and the Hermione
Overworked724 Posted October 20, 2016 Author #60 Posted October 20, 2016 Well....2 planks a day sounds pretty bloody fast to me...considering I am averaging one plank per month. And....I am a scotch drinker! (Hmmmm.....maybe if I switch to rum.....) Elijah 1 Quote ---------------------------------------------------- “Work like a Captain....Play like a Pirate!” — Every Ship Modeler...everywhere.
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