Robin Lous Posted August 8, 2016 #1 Posted August 8, 2016 Today I received the two bireme kits and I'm busy packing my tools, so it's time to start my build log. I also received 2 ready made (already stitched) painted sails. they look really neat imho. I'm still waiting for some books on the subject, but I'll get them before we leave for France. I start this build as a vacation project, but I'm of course aware this will take me much longer. It's just a kick off. We rent a small cottage in the Médoc (Bordeaux region). My wife loves to read books and I love to do things with my hands (or I go insane). I used to bring a couple of plastic kits with me on vacation, but the insane amount of paint and tools made me look for something else to build. The Greek bireme seems to be a good choise. I love the subject, it's a good starter kit I think and I don't need that many tools...not as much as I used to drag with me anyway. Above all...no rediculous amount of paint jars, airbrush and compressor! We leave the 19th. I'll use this time to educate myself. Read this forum, read downloaded tutorials and watch youtube videos....and hopefully I won't make too much of a fool of myself when I start building in two weeks time. Looking forward to this! Robin BIGMAC, EJ_L, Red and 10 others 13 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
Torbogdan Posted August 8, 2016 #2 Posted August 8, 2016 I don't you will make a fool of yourself. Take your time and work slowly and it will turn out well. The bireme is my next model so I will follow your blog. In my opinion Dusek makes good models with excellent instructions so I don't think you can do much wrong if you follow the instructions. A small hint is to let the pieces soak in water quite some time. They are fairly thick and need to be thourghly wet to bend and not break. A plank bender can be helpful. Good luck! BIGMAC, cobra1951, Red and 3 others 6 Quote Built ships http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/13384-the-pinta-by-torbogdan-dusek-shipmodels-172/ http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/13673-hanse-kogge-by-torbogdan-dusek-ship-models/page-5#entry458535
cobra1951 Posted August 8, 2016 #3 Posted August 8, 2016 Good luck with your build mtaylor, BIGMAC, PeteB and 2 others 5 Quote Bob Current Build HMB Endeavour - Occre 1:54 Completed Builds Section Deck Between Gun Bays - Panart 1:23 scale....x 2
foxy Posted August 8, 2016 #4 Posted August 8, 2016 Like wise. Should be Interesting to see how they turn out. Frank. WackoWolf, mtaylor and Robin Lous 3 Quote
Robin Lous Posted August 11, 2016 Author #5 Posted August 11, 2016 (edited) Oh dear... Not even started and I already got myself enough stuff to scratch build a Spanish Armada Modelers behavior I guess. Very eager to start building now...one week to go. I'm now spending my time planning my build. Already figured out I won't use the printed deck, I'll plank the deck instead. Will also replace the plywood bow and stern with wood. The side of plywood looks like...uhh...plywood. Okey...one more week! Edited September 19, 2017 by Robin Lous ggrieco, foxy, cobra1951 and 6 others 9 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
ggrieco Posted August 15, 2016 #6 Posted August 15, 2016 Good luck Robin, I look forward to following your build! Robin Lous 1 Quote Glenn ___________________________________ My Gallery 9 inch Dahlgren on Marsilly Carriage<p><p> Heroine Shipwreck Diorama
MESSIS Posted August 15, 2016 #7 Posted August 15, 2016 Why did you orderd two kits? Is it in case you damage any contents as you build the kit or r u going to build two different kits? WackoWolf and Robin Lous 2 Quote
Robin Lous Posted August 15, 2016 Author #8 Posted August 15, 2016 (edited) Thanks for the nice replies guys. On 15-8-2016 at 8:05 AM, MESSIS said: Why did you orderd two kits? Is it in case you damage any contents as you build the kit or r u going to build two different kits? To be honest...I bought two without giving it much thought, because I got a nice discount. With the 2 different sails I got also...I'll build two and I'll alter both, so they will be different. When I like this...and I expect I will, I'll do the same with two triremes. One with masts and sails (journey rigging) and one with the masts left ashore (battle rigging). But that's optimistic future talk, I don't have a clue how long it will take me to finish my first bireme. I now got all my books on the subject sorted out, but it's amazing how little is known about these famous ships. Robin Edited September 19, 2017 by Robin Lous cobra1951, foxy, EJ_L and 3 others 6 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
foxy Posted August 15, 2016 #9 Posted August 15, 2016 The two top books should see you right. That's a fair bit of equipment you have gathered Robin. But know the feeling!!!, Lucky I have an understanding Mem Sihib. My first foray into wood was and is a wonderfull experience. Good luck. Frank. cobra1951, BIGMAC, WackoWolf and 1 other 4 Quote
MESSIS Posted August 15, 2016 #10 Posted August 15, 2016 The hull was oak, the deck was pine mostly. No biremes were found ... Though in the port of Pireus in Athens the garages of the biremes and triremes were found. Also a few metal rams used on ythe biremes to ram the enemy ships can be seen in a few museums in mediteranian sea BIGMAC, cog, WackoWolf and 1 other 4 Quote
MESSIS Posted August 15, 2016 #11 Posted August 15, 2016 Here are some pic BIGMAC and Robin Lous 2 Quote
MESSIS Posted August 15, 2016 #12 Posted August 15, 2016 Here are some pic cog, Nikiforos, WackoWolf and 4 others 7 Quote
Robin Lous Posted August 15, 2016 Author #13 Posted August 15, 2016 (edited) Thanks, I saved about all the bireme and trireme images available on the internet I think (and I have my books) Still somewhat tricky to take the information and images for granted, because there's a lot of guesswork, artistic freedom and copycat behavior out there. But also some properly researched findings, like the marble ship eyes. Also a nice 1st century bc bireme ram found on the Black Sea shore...thanks Tim (harlantk) Research and learning about what I build is a big part of the fun Robin Edited September 19, 2017 by Robin Lous WackoWolf, cog, BIGMAC and 4 others 7 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
MESSIS Posted August 15, 2016 #14 Posted August 15, 2016 Ur bireme model is before 400 or 500 bc... am refering to the ram u just mentioned. WackoWolf 1 Quote
MESSIS Posted August 15, 2016 #15 Posted August 15, 2016 http://www.evaggelosgrypiotis.com/ have a look at this link the engineer was awarded from the Athens Academy for his research. The ships u ll see (more than a few) there they have published as post stamps of the State Postoffice of the Greek Republic Nikiforos and edmay 2 Quote
MESSIS Posted August 15, 2016 #16 Posted August 15, 2016 The Athlit Ram, on display in Israel's National Maritime Museum - from a greek ship 2nd bc foxy, EJ_L, BIGMAC and 2 others 5 Quote
EJ_L Posted August 15, 2016 #17 Posted August 15, 2016 Robin it looks like you have got all your stuff together and are doing some excellent research while you wait to get started. I am looking forward to following along on your build as I have a feeling I am going to learn a lot about biremes which is exciting as I love learning something new. Red, cobra1951, Robin Lous and 3 others 6 Quote "A Smooth Sea NEVER made a Skilled Sailor" - John George Hermanson -E.J. Current Builds - Royal Louis - Mamoli Royal Caroline - Panart Completed - Wood - Le Soleil Royal - Sergal - Build Log & Gallery La Couronne - Corel - Build Log & Gallery Rattlesnake - Model Shipways, HMS Bounty - Constructo Plastic - USS Constitution - Revel (twice), Cutty Sark. Unfinished - Plastic - HMS Victory - Heller, Sea Witch. Member : Nautical Research Guild
Robin Lous Posted August 17, 2016 Author #18 Posted August 17, 2016 (edited) I think I got all I need to start my build, all packed and I did some research and planning. My "mobile shipyard" ready to move from the Hague Netherlands to the vineyards of Bordeaux in France. The first task will be the lower row of seats (both sides of course) for the oarsmen and the lower decks to support them. The kit supplied a 2x2mm beam for this, but that's only 14,4 cm high (1:1 scale), so I'll replace the beam with a 2x3mm beam. I'll scratchbuild a lot to modify the seats. 1x1mm beams to support the seats and foot rests...the foot rests themselves and a side support on each side of the seat. Each seat will go from 1 to 7 parts. An oarsman can't row without a proper foot rest. Specially the top row. There's no deck below the oarsman there. It will be a right mess with their feet dangling, they'll pull themselves off their seats when they use some force to row, so foot rests are a must. from 50 to 350 parts to start with Don't expect this to be a quick build! My next post will be early next week when I actually start building. Off to France! Robin Edit: foot rest: 0,5x1,5x4,0mm Edited September 19, 2017 by Robin Lous EJ_L, Nikiforos, PeteB and 2 others 5 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
Torbogdan Posted August 19, 2016 #19 Posted August 19, 2016 The seat piece, blue, I guess rests on the beam, black part. Are the purple parts, support pieces really necessary to shore up the green part, footrests? Could the foot rests only rest against the black beam? that way you cut down quite a lot of the extra number of scratch built parts. Robin Lous, pythagoras, Nikiforos and 2 others 5 Quote Built ships http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/13384-the-pinta-by-torbogdan-dusek-shipmodels-172/ http://modelshipworld.com/index.php/topic/13673-hanse-kogge-by-torbogdan-dusek-ship-models/page-5#entry458535
Robin Lous Posted August 22, 2016 Author #20 Posted August 22, 2016 (edited) Hi again...in France now (with a horrid wifi connection). Started building Planked the decks instead of using the provided veneer. Cut out and cleaned up all the frame parts. This is just dry fitting, I need to do some other things before this. I cut off the 3mm wide beams (to support the top row seats) and replaced them with 1,5mm basswood. I did this because the original beams looked way too bulky (21,5cm real life is huge) and partly because I want to get rid of the plywood "look". More soon! Robin Edited September 22, 2017 by Robin Lous EJ_L, Timmo, Mirabell61 and 6 others 9 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
EJ_L Posted August 22, 2016 #21 Posted August 22, 2016 Off and running! Great way to spend a vacation! cobra1951, mtaylor and Robin Lous 3 Quote "A Smooth Sea NEVER made a Skilled Sailor" - John George Hermanson -E.J. Current Builds - Royal Louis - Mamoli Royal Caroline - Panart Completed - Wood - Le Soleil Royal - Sergal - Build Log & Gallery La Couronne - Corel - Build Log & Gallery Rattlesnake - Model Shipways, HMS Bounty - Constructo Plastic - USS Constitution - Revel (twice), Cutty Sark. Unfinished - Plastic - HMS Victory - Heller, Sea Witch. Member : Nautical Research Guild
Robin Lous Posted August 24, 2016 Author #22 Posted August 24, 2016 (edited) Before I move on, I did some testing. Drilled 0,5mm and 0,8mm holes in a scrap deck plank and filled them with light and dark wood filler. Still not sure what I like best. The 0,5 plugged holes are barely visible, but best to scale. I'll make up my mind after a few cups of coffee. Same with the wood staining swap I made. The dark colours are more realistic, because the Greek treated the wood with pine tar. The red brown (cherry) is more pleasing to the eye though...pffffff. Tough More soon, Robin Edited September 22, 2017 by Robin Lous AntonyUK, cog, BIGMAC and 8 others 11 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
Robin Lous Posted August 24, 2016 Author #23 Posted August 24, 2016 (edited) Decks done! The finished decks look way too dark on this photo, but it's the shade and crazy light outside atm, 37 degrees Celsius and no cloud in sight. I didn't stain them...just a semi mat coat of varnish...real colour is more like the right side insert. Also finished cutting the rowers seat parts. I think I get those done tomorrow. Robin Edited September 22, 2017 by Robin Lous BIGMAC, WackoWolf, Red and 5 others 8 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
Robin Lous Posted August 25, 2016 Author #24 Posted August 25, 2016 (edited) Today was really too hot to make a significant progress, so I didn't reach my "target for the day". But, I did some work...not enough to show a photo of it though...hopefully tomorrow. I enjoy reading the "The Athenian Trireme" book...for now most interesting for me is the development from earlier ships to the trireme, because that's where my bireme comes into play. Noteworthy...the Greek never used the word "bireme" (a latin Roman word for a ship with 2 oar levels). The Greek name was a pentecontor (50 oars) with two levels. The two levels instead of one didn't change the name of the type. It's a great book (the only decent book on the subject really) and it will help me with my future Dusek trireme (in fact a "trieres"...trireme is also a latin Roman word). I absolutely love building this ship and I think Daniel Dusek did a fantastic job, even though lots is (estimated) guesswork. Not only because it's a good starter kit, but because it's a subject appealing to me. Also nice to be able to change stuff to my own liking and/or interpretation...something you can't do with (set in stone) historical ships. Anyway...sorry I wasn't able to show stuff, but I'm enjoying myself building this! More soon! Robin Edited August 25, 2016 by Robin Lous PeteB, Nikiforos, Red and 4 others 7 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
Robin Lous Posted August 27, 2016 Author #25 Posted August 27, 2016 (edited) Despite the heat...I made some progress. Still busy with the darn seats. It took me a while to get the hang of making them. Plastic is easier! And I changed the bow to one of my own liking. I used ship images on greek vases as an example for this. Only the new bow glued on. All other parts still dryfitting. I'm also sanding the filler blocks (or whatever they're called) atm. I'll replace the stern section also, but that's a bit more complicated. More soon (but I'm moving slowly...steady, but slow ) Robin. Edited September 22, 2017 by Robin Lous cobra1951, Mirabell61, BIGMAC and 8 others 11 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
cobra1951 Posted August 27, 2016 #26 Posted August 27, 2016 Nice little seats, need a lot of commitment to sit and make lots of them Robin Lous, EJ_L and mtaylor 3 Quote Bob Current Build HMB Endeavour - Occre 1:54 Completed Builds Section Deck Between Gun Bays - Panart 1:23 scale....x 2
Mirabell61 Posted August 27, 2016 #27 Posted August 27, 2016 A beautiful build Robin, and a good ocasion to learn about the greek shipbuilding technique bc, thanks for sharing Nils EJ_L, BIGMAC, cobra1951 and 2 others 5 Quote Current builds -Lightship Elbe 1 Completed - Steamship Ergenstrasse ex Laker Corsicana 1918- scale 1:87 scratchbuild - "Zeesboot" heritage wooden fishing small craft around 1870, POB clinker scratch build scale 1:24 - Pilot Schooner # 5 ELBE ex Wanderbird, scale 1:50 scratchbuild - Mississippi Sterwheelsteamer built as christmapresent for grandson modified kit build - Chebec "Eagle of Algier" 1753--scale 1:48-POB-(scratchbuild) "SS Kaiser Wilhelm der Grosse" four stacker passenger liner of 1897, blue ribbond awarded, 1:144 (scratchbuild) "HMS Pegasus" , 16 gun sloop, Swan-Class 1776-1777 scale 1:64 from Amati plan -"Pamir" 4-mast barque, P-liner, 1:96 (scratchbuild) -"Gorch Fock 2" German Navy cadet training 3-mast barque, 1:95 (scratchbuild) "Heinrich Kayser" heritage Merchant Steamship, 1:96 (scratchbuild) original was my grandfathers ship -"Bohuslän" , heritage ,live Swedish museum passenger steamer (Billings kit), 1:50 "Lorbas", river tug, steam driven for RC, fictive design (scratchbuild), scale appr. 1:32 under restoration / restoration finished "Hjejlen" steam paddlewheeler, 1861, Billings Boats rare old kit, scale 1:50
Robin Lous Posted August 27, 2016 Author #28 Posted August 27, 2016 (edited) Thanks guys! It's amazing to read about ancient naval warfare. What strikes me is how advanced the tactics and use of recourses were back then. It's also amazing to read about the sheer size of fleets engaging eachother, The pinnacle of ancient naval battles was of course the battle of Salamis, but many more sizeable battles (mainly Greeks fighting Greeks) followed. Faster ships made up for numbers...and a fast ship was a "dry" (not waterlogged) ship with trained, rested and well fed rowers....a fast ship could be a slow ship the next day...and the other way round. The way commanders used their recourses made the difference between winning or losing. People were pretty clever 2500 years ago! Shipyard by candlelight (photo by Admiral of the fleet). Cheers! Robin Edited September 22, 2017 by Robin Lous cobra1951, zoly99sask, EJ_L and 2 others 5 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
EJ_L Posted August 28, 2016 #29 Posted August 28, 2016 Looking good! Those seats are fantastic and all that time and effort will make your ship look outstanding. mtaylor, Robin Lous and cobra1951 3 Quote "A Smooth Sea NEVER made a Skilled Sailor" - John George Hermanson -E.J. Current Builds - Royal Louis - Mamoli Royal Caroline - Panart Completed - Wood - Le Soleil Royal - Sergal - Build Log & Gallery La Couronne - Corel - Build Log & Gallery Rattlesnake - Model Shipways, HMS Bounty - Constructo Plastic - USS Constitution - Revel (twice), Cutty Sark. Unfinished - Plastic - HMS Victory - Heller, Sea Witch. Member : Nautical Research Guild
Robin Lous Posted August 28, 2016 Author #30 Posted August 28, 2016 (edited) A change of plan! Bireme v2.0 I was thinking about it for a while already, but dryfitting convinced me to do it. The 2 side decks underneath the lower rower seats bothered me, because I think they serve no purpose whatsoever. I doubt these decks excisted (not sure of course). Dry fitting with the decks. Note the visible keel and the void underneath the top deck. My plan...ommit the side decks (triremes didn't had them either btw) and make a centre lower deck instead. To make this work I need to perform some surgery. See above...frame 7 is original...5 and 6 modified. And had to cut off part of the keel to make the deck fit the altered frames. The ruler is where the deck will come. The structure lost some strenght and stiffness because of the surgery I guess, so I'll make some invisible reinforments alongside the keel under the deck to be. More soon, Robin Edited September 29, 2017 by Robin Lous EJ_L, Mirabell61, BIGMAC and 7 others 10 Quote WIP: No ships atm...sorry!🙄 Completed: Greek bireme - Dusek - scale 1:72 Louie da fly: "I think it requires a special kind of insanity to choose a galley to build a model of."
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