Using pins

[Oddball]

Now this might be a stupid question from a newbie but I'll ask anyway.Seems lot's of builders crave for accuracy with their build but then only glue the planks and don't use pins,surely the pins would represent the nails used for planking?

[Baker]

Looks logical.
But,
Planks, wales and beams are attached with : nails, bolts ,treenails
And every era has its own methods 
The hull of a ship from the 16th century is different from a ship at the beginning of the 19th century.

 

If it was that easy 

[allanyed]

Oddball,

No questions are stupid here.  Even the most experienced builders/history seekers here find something new on a continual basis that results in questions that may seem obvious to some, but not to all.   Without a time machine to go back to see how it was done we all ask questions. 

 

Regarding pins, depending on the era, yes, bolts, trennals, and various other "pins" were used and many model builders make and use them, myself included.   But, depending on the model scale, their inclusion can ruin an otherwise great looking planking job.   Over sized trennals  will make the hull or deck look like it has the measles.   Say a hull is planked and "pinned" with 1.5" trennals.  At 1:98 scale, these would be 0.015" diameter.  The smallest hole on a Byrnes draw plate, which is a top quality piece, is 0.016 so can be done, but making nails that small is not easy, even using bamboo.  Plus they will barely be visible.  Where bolts are required, they can be down to 3/4" diameter which is only 0.00765 diameter at scale 1:98.   EDM brass wire can be found to .001 diameter uncoated so pretty close.   Go up to 1:48 and the task is easier, if not extremely tedious, when you consider there many thousands needed on a  hull.  Side, note --- I don't recall the model or builder, but years ago I saw photos posted somewhere of a model that used no glue at all.  Everything was built as was done in the yards back in the day, with trennals and bolts.      

 

Allan

Edited January 19, 2020 by allanyed

[Oddball]

Well thanks for answering especially Allanyed for a comprehensive answer to my question.🙂

[Gerarddm]

In reading Underhill's Volume 1 of Plank On Frame Models, he notes that he ALWAYS pins his work no matter how small that pin or trunnel may be, and does not rely on adhesives solely. 

[Gregory]

1 hour ago, Gerarddm said:

In reading Underhill's Volume 1 of Plank On Frame Models, he notes that he ALWAYS pins his work no matter how small that pin or trunnel may be, and does not rely on adhesives solely. 

Did he provide any illustrations of his method of " pinning " ?

 

Was his purpose visual or for strength, or both ?

Edited January 31, 2020 by Gregory

[Gerarddm]

He provides no illustrations, and the tenor of his comments were than he pinned for strength.

[Bob Cleek]

2 hours ago, Gerarddm said:

He provides no illustrations, and the tenor of his comments were than he pinned for strength.

Archival construction "best practice" is to fasten all pieces with glued pegs. That doesn't mean, however, that the pegs are intended to be visible. Underhill's, and others', recommendation to fasten planking with pegs assumed the model would be painted. The current widely popular style of leaving modeling wood bright is a relatively recent thing based on certain Navy Board or "Admiralty style" models and, in many instances, is carried to extremes in present day models, which isn't to say to poor effect. The use of contrasting colors for trunnels and plugs, and, indeed, out-of-scale ones, is, IMHO, somewhat of an affectation.

[Gerarddm]

Quote

The use of contrasting colors for trunnels and plugs, and, indeed, out-of-scale ones, is, IMHO, somewhat of an affectation.

 

Well, yes, and it looks rather jarring, if not actually unsightly in certain cases. If one assumes that trunnels were 1" to 1.5" in diameter , then some models I have seen photos of have trunnels that, when scaled out, would have been several inches in diameter. 

[wefalck]

It also depends on what one wants to achieve, for instance a realistic, prototype look, or to reproduce certain historic practices (or fashions) of model building.