HMS Victory by mfrazier - Sergal 782 - 1:78 scale

[Old Collingwood]

6 hours ago, mfrazier said:

Yes, I  do. I thought about trying that. Thanks for the tip.

 

Mark Frazier

No problem Mark.

 

OC.

[Old Collingwood]

Looking good Mark.

 

OC.

[mfrazier]

1 hour ago, Old Collingwood said:

Looking good Mark.

 

OC.

Thank you OC. I will have about 20 hours in building the bow grating, but if it works, it will be better. 

 

Mark  Frazier 

[mfrazier]

I  am filling in the lower section of grate for the bow. It has taken 8 hours to put these few pieces in.  They are sooooo tiny and they are difficult to fit. It looks like I  am almost half way. I sure hope all this effort works out. When this is done, I  will paint it flat black and see how it looks. The front piece that is tilted up at the end will probably get a panel on it like the photo, because I  don't have anymore grating this small. It looks a little rough right now, but after sanding and painting,  I  think it will look good. 

 

Mark Frazier 

Edited April 18, 2020 by mfrazier
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[mfrazier]

  Basically the bow grates are done. I have left the front piece empty until I  see if I  can find grating for it. If not, I  will make a panel for it. I'm not going to order grating in the mail because it will cost several times the price of the grate for shipping and the hobby shops are closed.

I have one coat of flat black paint on it. It will get several more coats dry brushed. Dry brushing is more work but adds color without losing any detail. It just takes many coats this way.

 

I set it on the hull to check fit and see how it looks. I like it a lot. Much better than the kit. When I  get to the point in my build , I  will make new framing for the bow to hold this deck.

 

Mark Frazier 

 

[mfrazier]

1 hour ago, Y.T. said:

Hi Mark, what I meant is this: This means gratings are following curved side channels.

Also I do not want to sound intrusive but all my experience tells me I should not pre-build anything before I am sure it fits. Mamoli kit is a tough kit and it thought me - nothing matches with anything, Beware! Measure 10 times and cut just once.

I  know what you mean. I think I  will be OK because I  made this grate deck the same size as the kit supplied one. This will allow me to use all the decorative molding from the kit which I want to use because it is not bad. It may need a little embellishment. The kit was designed for the deck to be flat which was incorrect as the front angles up some. I made sure the side moldings will still fit and cover the sides of the grate deck. I will build the supports to fit this deck as I do not like the ones in the kit.

 

Mark Frazier 

[mfrazier]

50 minutes ago, Y.T. said:

Hi Mark, what means "dry brushed"?

Dry brushed is painting with an almost dry brush. You dip your brush in the paint ,scrape most back off on the container edge, then dab it on a cloth so it is just damp without a lot of paint. You brush the part and this only deposits a small bit of paint at a time, (takes a lot of brushing) so it must be done several times to get any finish. This will color a part without gobbing a heavy layer of paint that  hides fine details. I do this on something that has small detail I don't want to lose with a heavy layer of paint. Grates such as these on this model have small holes with square corners and sharp edges and lines. Paint tends to clog the small holes and round the tiny corners.  I want the fine details to show. The acrylic paint is thick so I thin it to a water consistency to help keep detail.

 

Mark Frazier 

[Old Collingwood]

15 minutes ago, mfrazier said:

Dry brushed is painting with an almost dry brush. You dip your brush in the paint ,scrape most back off on the container edge, then dab it on a cloth so it is just damp without a lot of paint. You brush the part and this only deposits a small bit of paint at a time, (takes a lot of brushing) so it must be done several times to get any finish. This will color a part without gobbing a heavy layer of paint that  hides fine details. I do this on something that has small detail I don't want to lose with a heavy layer of paint. Grates such as these on this model have small holes with square corners and sharp edges and lines. Paint tends to clog the small holes and round the tiny corners.  I want the fine details to show. The acrylic paint is thick so I thin it to a water consistency to help keep detail.

 

Mark Frazier 

Like I do on my plane builds in the forum - its a great way of showing raised detail also.

 

Still loving what you are creating Mark.

 

OC.

[mfrazier]

Thank you, OC.

 

Mark

[mfrazier]

The planking is slow going. I can only do 2 to 4 planks in a day as the glue has to cure after installing each plank. And I am edge gluing each plank. I now have to line off the hull before going any farther as I  need to start tapering planks.

 

Mark  Frazier 

[Old Collingwood]

13 minutes ago, mfrazier said:

The planking is slow going. I can only do 2 to 4 planks in a day as the glue has to cure after installing each plank. And I am edge gluing each plank. I now have to line off the hull before going any farther as I  need to start tapering planks.

 

Mark  Frazier 

Thats good progress Mark  - nice tidy work.

 

OC.

[mfrazier]

I saw a procedure for lining off the hull, SOMEPLACE , I  don't know if it was here or somewhere else but I can't find it now. I think I  remember most of it but I wouldike to be sure. Does anyone know where I  can find it?

 

Mark Frazier 

[Old Collingwood]

Found a couple of links Mark  -

 

http://www.shipmodelsocietyofnewjersey.org/resources/Downloads_page/Lining Off your hull for planking.pdf

 

https://www.syrenshipmodelcompany.com/resources/PartTwo.pdf

 

And from our very own  -

 

OC.

[mfrazier]

Thank you so much OC. I found just what I  needed from you links. You have been a big help to me through my first build and this one. Thank you.

 

The folks on this forum are very helpful. It is nice to have this resource. 

 

Mark Frazier 

[Old Collingwood]

19 minutes ago, mfrazier said:

Thank you so much OC. I found just what I  needed from you links. You have been a big help to me through my first build and this one. Thank you.

 

The folks on this forum are very helpful. It is nice to have this resource. 

 

Mark Frazier 

No problem at all Mark  - truly glad to help.👍

 

OC.

[mfrazier]

I have planked below the gun ports and stopped for an issue. I knew this problem was coming .... and now it is here. This is the poor planning on Mantua's part with this kit. The gun ports are interfered with by the bulkheads. I would have thought they would consider this in the design. 

There is marks on the gun port template to line up with a bulkhead. The ports look good in this location .... BUT.... several of the gun ports are badly obstructed by bulkheads, about 6 total.

This was my reason for marking the bulkheads  on the outside of the planking.

My first thought was to shift a few of the gun ports,  but this makes everything look odd. I can't shift the pattern far enough to move them all as it will look very wrong. The worst one has a bulkhead in the center of a gun port opening. This is a problem and will have to be sorted out before proceeding. I am open to suggestions.  My first thought is to cut the gun port openings and then cut the bulkhead back. This will have to be done through the small gun port opening on most of them. I may be able to shift a couple but I  am doubtful as it will throw the spacing off too much and look weird. I shall think on this for a while to explore all options before cutting anything.

 

Mark Frazier

 

[mfrazier]

I marked the ports according to the pattern.  I cannot move some of these the amount needed. I colored in the bulkhead interference. 

 

I will mark the other side and move the ports to see how it looks. 

 

Mark Frazier 

[mfrazier]

15 minutes ago, Y.T. said:

Cut through bulkheads?

That is my thought, but it will be difficult, but not impossible. I think I can shift the stern problem ports enough and it will still look okay, but I  don't know about the  front ports, I seriouslydoubt it. They would have to move a lot. I have an idea to get a better look at this problem. 

 

Mark Frazier 

[mfrazier]

I cut some squares of painters tape and put them in the gun port locations. This is with 12 of the front gun ports shifted to safe locations.  At the stern, I  moved four ports. 

I think this may work. I don't think the odd spacing is too noticeable.  What do you all think?

 

Mark Frazier 

[ccoyle]

The stern looks okay, but to my eye the bunching up of the bow ports looks odd. Don't ask me how to fix it though -- that's above my pay grade.

[Old Collingwood]

That looks ok to my eyes Mark,   I think if you can go with the easyest  option (if it looks good to you)   or  failing that  you could go the more fiddly option to cut through the bulkheads causing the problem  (I assume you are doing  dummy guns in the lower decks, by making a box  with a barrel  sticking out)   that would work then just fiddly.

 

OC.

[mfrazier]

I was trying to think how to mark them after the planking is done and the hull is filled and sanded, because the bulkhead locations will be lost. And then it hit me.... make a new template ..... duh. This darn virus really messes my life up. The stores that sell the cardboard to make a new template are not open due to the state shutdown of "non" essential  businesses. I am constantly trying to work with what I  can scrounge up because we can't go buy anything except food and medical right now. I be glad when this is lifted. I am glad I  did some planning ahead with this model. I bought paints and supplies I  knew I  needed before I  got the kit.

 

Mark Frazier 

[mfrazier]

Coyle,

Does this look better? I think maybe the angle of the other photo was effecting the view.

OC.,

 

I am trying to avoid trying to cut the bulkheads through the little port opening if it can be avoided satisfactorily. It would be possible but very difficult. Yes, I am using dummy cannons. There is a rail behind the planking set in about a half inch that the dummy cannons mount in after drilling a hole in it through the opening. That was another concern. The few bulkheads that were almost halfway into the port, would ruin the mounting area for the cannon, this trying to satisfactorily move them. But if moving them doesn't look good, I  will have to cut the bulkhead,  as I  want things right.

 

Mark Frazier 

 

 

 

[Old Collingwood]

I think they look fine Mark  - the only one that you could move if you want is the very first middle deck opening  as its not for a canon  but a double door hatch for ventilation,   you could try just moving it a touch more forward towards the beak (not a lot  just a bit)  I think that will help a lot.

 

I do feel your pain as I had to do the exact same thing on my Corel HMS Greyhound Kit as they were interfering with the frames  on several gun ports, I just did as you are doing and moved them.

 

OC.

[Bossman]

Mark, 

I don’t think one in a 100 people would notice the new spacing. This is just a thought as it might look odd but I will throw it out there. Have the ports closed, or, partially open with the space behind painted black. 

[mfrazier]

Thanks OC.,

I was thinking the same thing about the front opening. It is presently where the pattern showed it, but I  thought it should be a little more forward also. It will be closed as there is a bow filler block behind it. I think I  will probably go with this setup.

 

I somewhat regret getting this kit as I  never heard anything good about Mantua,  but I  had no choice without waiting for who knows how long.  I had already planned for the Billings kit and all the changes. It was a much better choice, but due to the present circumstances,  it was not to be. I will make the best of this kit even with its shortcomings and poor quality. I will still have to buy or make all the same upgrades and maybe even more with this kit and I  had to pay more for this kit. It just ups the challenge. 

 

Mark Frazier 

[mfrazier]

4 minutes ago, Bossman said:

Mark, 

I don’t think one in a 100 people would notice the new spacing. This is just a thought as it might look odd but I will throw it out there. Have the ports closed, or, partially open with the space behind painted black. 

I think you are right about no one noticing, at least in my world. Closed ports crossed my mind for about 10 seconds. I just can't imagine building with closed ports, although there is nothing wrong with it if you like it that way. I just like the cannons showing. I would feel like I  was cheating or taking a shortcut  or something  by closing the ports.

 

Mark Frazier 

[Gregory]

Just out of curiosity, what do you see as the problem with cutting the bulkheads?

[mfrazier]

1 hour ago, Gregory said:

Just out of curiosity, what do you see as the problem with cutting the bulkheads?

While not impossible,  it would be difficult doing it through the little opening and getting a good cannon mounting surface on a few of them. They would have to be cut back about a half inch. Moving them a little is a better option as long it it looks right.

Edited April 23, 2020 by mfrazier
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[clearway]

you could always leave a couple of gunport lids closed at the bow as when the anchors are rigged it wont be as noticable? cereal boxes make an ideal source for card - i use it all the time🧐

 

Keith