Winchelsea Nef by AnchorClanker - Scale 1:96 - first wood scratch build

[ChiefClanker]

I want to scratch-build a model of the Steam Frigate Minnesota, 1854 - 1901.  Before tackling this project, I am interested in a smaller project to gain the necessary scratch-building skills.  The Winchelsea Nef is just the right size. 

[Louie da fly]

All the best with it, Mark. She's a beautiful vessel.

 

Steven

[Chuck Seiler]

Mark,

 

    What are you using for plans?

[ChiefClanker]

Hi Chuck,

My wife bought me digital copies of a number of the plates from the National Archives.  They are scanned copies of the original plans.  Do you have suggestions?   

Ahoy,

Mark

 

[Chuck Seiler]

    I am not aware of plans of Winchelsea Nef in the National Archives...but then again there is alot I don't know.  I know of the plans in the book NORMANNENSCHIFFE by Jochen von Furchs and the generic nef in the book by Zimmerman.  Steven (Louie da Fly) is taking a different approach.

 

    I look forward to your build log.  Welcome to the middle ages. 

[Chuck Seiler]

Doing a little math, LdF's nef is 14" at 1:75.  At 1:96, that appears to pencil out at about 11".  Does that sound about right?

[Jim Lad]

Chuck, manipulating my trusty scale calculator - if you have 14" at 1/75 then it would be 10 15/16 at 1/96.  Or 355.6mm and 277.8mm.

 

John

[Louie da fly]

11 hours ago, Chuck Seiler said:

I am not aware of plans of Winchelsea Nef in the National Archives...but then again there is alot I don't know.

 

Perhaps they are theoretical reconstructions.  The only contemporary images of nefs I'm aware of are on city seals, plus three manuscript illustrations.

 

Which is the problem faced by those of us who are interested in ships of this period. These images are about all we've got, as we lack any archaeological information on ships of this type.

 

Steven

[Tony Hunt]

I believe Chief Mark is referring to the plans for the steam frigate USS Minnesota when he refers to the plates from the US National Archives.   

Edited September 5, 2021 by Tony Hunt

[Chuck Seiler]

Oh.

[ChiefClanker]

That is correct.  I am referring to the Steam Frigate Minnesota.  The US National Archives holds the original drawings. 

[ChiefClanker]

They were available for a fee.  

[mtaylor]

Maybe the title of this needs to be changed to the Steam Frigate Minnesota.   Easy to see the confusion since the title is for the Nef.

[liteflight]

Chief Mark

I look forward to your build.

 

Can anyone suggest a collective noun for Nefs ?  There seems to be an outbreak of nef-building ( statistically, the number of builds has doubled in the last week)

 

And that doesn’t include builds of Hulcs,  frumious or otherwise.

[Chuck Seiler]

    I was hoping Louis da Fly, Druxey or AnobiumPunctatum would weigh in on this.  They are more knowledgeable than I on this subject.

 

    "Collective noun" would be 'medieval ship'.  As I understand it, NEF is an archaic French word for "ship" and encompasses the various northern European  permutations of ships between the viking longship and knarr, and the cog, including roundships and hulcs. 

 

    The nef that LdF is working on (and that I have on the back burner) is roughly based on the knarr (viking cargo ship) and was used in southern England (Cinque Ports) and northern France in the 12th thru early 14th centuries.  This is not unusual, since the English nobility of that period were from Normandy and the Normans were transplanted Vikings.  While no nefs have been found, there is much speculation based on artwork and wrecks of knarrs from a century or so before.

[ChiefClanker]

Yes, my posts maybe confusing, I admit, after re-reading the conversations again.  I have two build logs, one for the Nef and one for the Minnesota.  My motivation for building the nef is to gain the skills in scratch building necessary to tackle a larger project like the Minnesota.  

 

Louie da fly is helping me with ships plans for the nef since he built one. The internet is kind of sparse with plans for nefs. However, there are a few. 

 

Warm regards,

Chief Mark

 

[mtaylor]

Ok... lets just leave this one as is since you already have one for the Minnesota and this conversation at this point is the Nef.  It's sometimes (many maybe?) easy to go off topic and confusion results.  Best bet is not to cross over postings like the Minnesota here and the Nef over on the other one.

[Louie da fly]

Hmm - there's a difference between a plural and a collective noun. The plural of nef should, I suppose, be nefs (using the French system of making plurals out of singular words). This of course doesn't take into account the fact that nef really isn't a specific term for this kind of ship - there wasn't one. In fact, I thought I'd made it up, in default of any correct name existing for them, then found others on the Internet had beaten me to it.

 

But a collective noun for them - like  a Pride of lions or a murder of crows, or a parliament of fowls, or a mob of kangaroos (yes, really - that's the name for a group of roos!), a sanctimony of bishops, a flourish of strumpets, or a flange of baboons, a smugness of young IT professionals - hmmm, perhaps a jabberwock of nefs? Oh, no, that would be for hulcs, wouldn't it?

 

Maybe a bandersnatch of nefs?

 

Steven

 

 

 

 

 

 

[Chuck Seiler]

Bandersnatch of nefs it is.  I'll alert Webster's and Oxford.

[ChiefClanker]

 

With Christmas and New Years over, I am commencing upon building my model ship.  Louie da Fly provided the hull plans including the shape of the frames.  After penciling in the remainder of the shape of the frames and the stem post, keel, and stern post, I cut out the shapes.  See the attached photos.  

I will be using basswood.  It is a popular wood for making models in these parts.  There is plenty available in various sizes and shapes in hobby shops and hardware stores at a reasonable price.

Next, I will cut out the stem post, keel, and stern post.  After that, is cutting out the frames, two each.  Before gluing the frames to the keel and posts, I will make a jig to keep the keel and posts upright while gluing.

I named my nef, The Tyburn Treader.  

 

[Louie da fly]

All RIGHT!

 

Good to see this build starting.

 

Steven

[ChiefClanker]

Yes, at last!

 

Before cutting out the posts, keel, and frames, I made sure I numbered and label the parts appropriately.  It is 6 below with a new blanket of snow and bright sunshine.  With a warm garage, cutting out the posts, keel, and frames will be a comfortable endeavor. 

 

[ChiefClanker]

A relative who has his bachelors degree in model making suggested getting the largest self-healing mat my workspace could handle.  The craft store which has the largest variety of sizes and types had a two-pack on clearance. Each mat is 23 X 35 inches.  The price was 70% off the regular retail price. I am very pleased to have had only that option on clearance.  One mat is for the house and one is for the garage.  At least for now that is the way it is.  

 

[Cathead]

This will be fun to compare with Steven's build.

[Louie da fly]

I'd agree about the self-healing mat - got mine cheap from a junk shop (selling cheap stuff, not Chinese ships - just to clarify). I've found it invaluable.

 

Steven

[ChiefClanker]

The stem, keel, stern, and the frames are laid out on the basswood.  I need another piece of basswood to get the remainder of the frames laid out.  It may be hard to see the outlines, but they are there.  The basswood is 1/8" thick.  I will use 3/32" thick basswood for the planking.  As one may guess, this will be a plank on frame model.  

[ChiefClanker]

Yesterday I cut out the remaining frames.  Today I will sand them and the stem post, keel, and stern post.  Next, maybe tomorrow, will be laying out where the frames are fastened to the keel and begin attaching them.  

 

[ChiefClanker]

I may make a second model of the Winchelsea Nef to see if I can 'duplicate' my own efforts.  It will also be to try a different method of making and attaching the frames to stem post, keel, and stern post.  Also, I may try lapstrake planking instead of carvel planking.  

[Louie da fly]

PHOTOS! We need PHOTOS!!! 

 

Steven

[ChiefClanker]

I get the picture, Steve!     

They are forth coming.