Nisha by Glomar - Vanguard Models - 1:64 - Brixham 'Mumble-Bee'

[Glomar]

Hi All! 

I am a beginner builder having just completed Model Shipways Grand Banks Dory and Norwegian Sailing pram. I picked this model because it seemed like a good transition into rigging and I heard nothing but great things in regards to quality and accessibility. Definitely not saying anything novel when noting the quality seems to incredible as well as the instructions 

 

 

I live in smallish apartment so I got this portable table on which I do alot of the smaller projects (with the added benefit of using the TV!) 

 

Not sure if this is the right format but looking forward to working on this! 

[Glomar]

First update just involves the joys of sanding! There edge for the bevel is laser etched but I not sure when to stop. I dried fit some of the pieces and they slotted in beautifully though 

[Glomar]

Everything seems to be coming along nicely!  

Like others before me, it took me a bit to find the courage to flex the deck in place but it really just fits right in. Part of the deck did splinter a bit but it was nothing tragic or consequently. It really is incredible how perfectly everything has fit so far and it really has been plug and play. Even now the boat feels SOLID when picking it up. 

Next step is fairing. This is the first model in which I had to to do planking like this so a bit nervous. Any pointers or tips would be super appreciated! 

[Glomar]

I finally mustered up the courage to start fairing! Going off well established wisdom of you all I have been sanding 3 bulkheads at a time. I feel like I am just echoing the what Andyrew, Ajohnson and Grey have said in their build logs but flexible sanding sticks seem to be a must (or at least is the easiest way I have found)

I seem to making progress but I am still having a hard time telling whether or not I am done and I am also not entirely sure how I should be checking contact with the bulkheads- do I use a plank to check contact of all bulkheads at once or in sections. Not entire sure how to check contact either on the aft bulkheads where it starts to curve up (picture 1)  

[Oldsalt1950]

Glomar. nice start. When fairing use the longest plank you can. You should be checking as many bulkheads as possible, gentle curves included. Stop your hull fairing at the end of part 24. The rest is the transom area and is handled differently. Leave your hull planks at the stern long. the transom area planking will butt up with it. When I fair my bulkheads, I taper/bevel them from the scribe line to the back of the bulkhead when moving aft. When going from the stern forward the bevel goes the other way, so it is from the scribe line to the forward edge.Take your time , don't rush. When you start planking small issues can be sanded out or shimmed to make corrections.

 

Jim

[Glomar]

15 hours ago, Oldsalt1950 said:

Glomar. nice start. When fairing use the longest plank you can. You should be checking as many bulkheads as possible, gentle curves included. Stop your hull fairing at the end of part 24. The rest is the transom area and is handled differently. Leave your hull planks at the stern long. the transom area planking will butt up with it. When I fair my bulkheads, I taper/bevel them from the scribe line to the back of the bulkhead when moving aft. When going from the stern forward the bevel goes the other way, so it is from the scribe line to the forward edge.Take your time , don't rush. When you start planking small issues can be sanded out or shimmed to make corrections.

 

Jim

@Oldsalt1950 Thanks for further breaking this down for me! I am still learning the lingo, so could explain a little more about what a scribe line is? 

[Craigie65]

This is a lovely and straight forward model - I have just finished mine and started Erycina.

Your fairing looks spot on.  You will also need to fair the stern parts. Look at step 49 and you will see that they need to be faired before adding part 60. Otherwise the counter will only sit on the edges.

Edited April 11, 2022 by Craigie65

[Oldsalt1950]

Glomar the scribe line is the line imprinted on the bulkhead.

 

Jim

[Craigie65]

When adding the bulwarks (parts 45 and 46) you may need to fair part 24 just a touch to get a smooth run. 

Edited April 11, 2022 by Craigie65

[Andyrew]

On 4/11/2022 at 7:52 PM, Craigie65 said:

You will also need to fair the stern parts. Look at step 49 and you will see that they need to be faired before adding part 60. Otherwise the counter will only sit on the edges.

I didn't do this and when I went to fit the Stern Counter I discovered it needed doing, I had to remove the rear part of the Bulwarks and sand down the outer Counter Frames, a real pain.

[Craigie65]

Hey we all have our moments.  The main thing is you went the extra mile and fixed the problem.  

[Glomar]

I finished fairing and started planking. Not sure what I am doing wrong as there still seems to be pretty big spaces between planks. I am not sure how to best taper the planks as well. Is this salvageable or should I try and redo it?

 

 

[Craigie65]

Hi,

A couple of things come to mind, which may help you.  First is edge bending - have a look for Chuck’s video of this in the planking techniques.  Second is bevel the top edge of your planks. As planks are covering a curve they create a gap if the back edge is not bevelled.

Hope that helps

Edited April 19, 2022 by Craigie65

[Craigie65]

Looking at the front edge of your bulwark and planks.  They look to be too far forward.  Part 58 needs to fit on the stem to act as a  

rebate for your second planking.  From the last photo it does not look as if they will fit. Step 72 has a good photo of how the front edge of your first planking should sit.

Edited April 20, 2022 by Craigie65

[Glomar]

Thanks! Do you think I should take them off and start over? 

[Craigie65]

If part 58 does not fit, then as painful as it maybe, then yes I would. Otherwise I think your second planking will be a bit of a struggle.   You will not be the first to strip off bulwarks.  I have often removed offending planks. 

 

For my build of Erycina, I drew in the position of the equivalent of part 58. I used this as a guide to make sure my first planking did not encroach. You can see the pencil line.

Edited April 20, 2022 by Craigie65

[Glomar]

@Craigie65 Thanks Craig, I glued the bulwarks on pretty solid with woodglue, do you think it would be better to trim them at the front in order to fit part 58 or just remove it. 

Any advice on how to disassemble? There also seems to be a height difference between the 3 and 4th plank and I am wonder if I just did a poor job with the fairing as well. 

I can't seem to grasp some of the fundamentals with this project and am feeling super lost at this point on what to do. I am wondering if I bit off more than I can chew with this project 

 

[Craigie65]

Hi Glomar,

Don’t be disheartened, we all sometimes feel out of our depth. Well maybe not Chuck Look at @Dave_E build of Lady Nelson.  He had similar planking issues and made the brave decision to remove his first attempt.  He is now going great guns.

 

I believe Isopropyl alcohol is the preferred method on MSW.  Personally I have never had to use it - I have removed the offending planks with warm water as the glue had not fully cured.

The difference in height on the planks could be just the thickness of each.  As good as the quality of the materials Vanguard use there is always some variation. I have just had a similar problem on my current build but managed to sand it out. If not then it could be a high or low spot on the frame - a bit more sanding if a high spot or a shim if low will sort that out.

Edited April 20, 2022 by Craigie65

[Peanut6]

I can attest that isopropyl alcohol is better than water on water soluble PVA.  Water causes the wood to swell and can raise the grain (which can cause additional work to get the wood right again) where isopropyl alcohol does not.  I was halfway thru planking my Jolly Boat and was dissatisified with the result.  I used isopropyl alcohol and removed all the planking so I could start over and it didn't affect my frames in the slightest.  I would follow Craigie65's input closely since he has built this kit.  Looks like everything is salvageable, so I would have to agree with the others and suggest you remove what you have and start again.  I believe it will cure a couple of issues.  You can do some additional fairing to take care of the high spots you noticed, be sure to use a long plank over many hulkheads from stem to the appropriate point stern and the full length of the bulkheads.  You will be able to properly position the bulwarks, trying to fix what you have by trimming probably will cause more problems elsewhere.  The gaps between planks can be addressed with tapering and edge bending, as mentioned earlier, and don't forget the bevel.  There are many tutorials on these subjects in the planking section.  They take a few tries to get the results you're after but the time and effort spent on the first planking more than pays for itself on the second planking.  Don't dispair, we've all been there and sympathize with what you're feeling.  Take your time and enjoy the voyage.       

[Craigie65]

Happy to input if helpful.  Unfortunately I did not keep a build log.  @AJohnson has a very good log of his build of Nisha, in particular the bulwarks and first planking.  I am sure we will all help as much as we can.

[Chuck Seiler]

    Isopropyl alcohol is the way to go.  Some use 90ish% whereas I prefer the 70ish %.  I soak the joint by applying the alcohol with a Q tip or cottonball, depending on how much area that needs to be removed.  Once well soaked and allowed to soften, I use an exacto blade (attached to the handle, of course) to gently separate the plank from the frames.  Resoak and let soften as needed.  Slow, gentle deconstruction takes time and patience, but is well worth the effort.

[Glomar]

Thanks all for the advice and encouragement! I am having the hardest time conceptualizing how to bend and taper the planks. I watched Chucks amazing video on planking and went over Allan Tylers guide among others but is there an even more basic set of instructions (or is that even possible?) 

[AJohnson]

Hey another little “Nisha” build log, I will follow along to this latest addition to the growing fleet of “Mumble Bees”.

The advice you have had so far is sound, if you can take a deep breath and pause to absorb the planking techniques of edge bending and tapering planks available on MSW, then things will go better we promise!  We are all here to help on MSW, just give yourself time to absorb how it’s gone and if you can’t face taking the planks off just yet you can always do some of the more straight forward assemblies like the hatches and winches and keep in a “creative” mode before going back. I often jump to something easy to do whilst pondering a more difficult stage in a build. Just need time for ideas to sink in, there’s no rush.

Excellent progress so far, keep at it! 👏😁

[Glomar]

On 4/11/2022 at 2:52 PM, Craigie65 said:

This is a lovely and straight forward model - I have just finished mine and started Erycina.

Your fairing looks spot on.  You will also need to fair the stern parts. Look at step 49 and you will see that they need to be faired before adding part 60. Otherwise the counter will only sit on the edges.

@Craigie65So I am just realizing that I did not fair the after parts (21,22,23,24) before putting on the counter. Should I go back and redo it? I am not sure what you mean when you say "the counter will only sit on the edges. I also got one Bulwark on before realizing that I should have sanded the counter beforehand which I was at least able to catch on the other side 
 
 

Side without sand stern parts

 

Side with sanded stern part 

[Glomar]

So I decided to go round 2 with planking and start over. The blanks were glued on using white glue so they were removed fairly easily with 90% alcohol and some Q tips. I was maybe a little to overconfident with the Bulwarks and really went all out with the wood glue so those were a little more tricky. Still was able to get them off with rubbing alcohol, q tips  and an xacto knife without too much trauma. 

Afterwards I created little tick strips to better mark out were to place the Bulwarks and put a little shim in the hole in the front to act as a stop. I also pinned it this time but used white glue just incase 3rd time is the charm. Next steps is going to be plotting my attempt at planking/procrastinating out of fear! 

[Andyrew]

You did well getting the Bulwarks removed in one piece and refitted. I found with both layers of the planking that you need to do plenty of dry fitting, mark the position of each Bulkhead on the plank and keep making small adjustments to the edge of the plank until it fits tight against the other planks. It sometimes took me a few hours to fit one plank but it's worth the effort. Good luck.

[Craigie65]

Glomar,

That is looking much better. Well done for taking the plunge to restart your planking, it will pay off in the long run.

 

Good idea adding that shim for the front of the bulwarks. 

 

What I was trying to convey is the counter pieces 21 to 24 are frames that need to be faired as the counter is curved across the the beam of the boat. If you took a plank and laid it across the counter frames you would see it only touches this highest edges of these frames.  You can see from this photo of Erycina’s counter how much of a curve is in this piece.

It looks as if the counter is conforming to the curve of the stern.  If it is secure I would be tempted to leave it.

 

Good advice from @Andyrew each plank is a mini project.  

Edited April 25, 2022 by Craigie65

[Glomar]

@Craigie65 Thanks for clarifying! I agree about not tempting fate! 

I added the first planks again and they fit alot better- especially after beveling the top edge (thanks @Craigie65@starlight!) but they are not exactly flush with the bulwarks. Is this a fairing issue and/or something that can be fixed by sanding? Still having difficulty getting the planks flush in the stern. 

[starlight]

That's looking much better, Glomar! 

 

A few comments:

• Not to worry about not being flush with the bulwarks. If the error is less than 1 mm it will easily sand out.
• It looks like you did not cut a rabbet into the stem and keel. I highly recommend doing this, otherwise you will find it hard to get a good plank termination at the bow and for the garboard strake.
• The area at the stern where the bulkwark strip, stern counter, and first planking strip all meet is very tricky. I think you've done as good of a job as can be expected. Just spend some time with filler + sandpaper there to prepare it for the second planking.
• I don't mean to harp on this, but will you be removing those brass pins once the glue has dried? They will stand proud of the wood surface and interfere with the second planking if you don't.

-starlight

[Craigie65]

Glomar,

This plank is looking much better.

Is there any give in the bulwarks at frames 2 and 3?  If so they may not be flat against the frame causing the plank to look a touch low.  If they are I think Starlight is right and you will have to blend a little once the planking is finished.  I too would remove these pins now - it is a pain to get them off once you have added the next plank. 

I found the rear a bit tricky too given the sheer of the stern. You will have to use a bit of filler to blend the plank once you have finished planking the hull. Time for plank number 2!

@starlight I would normally agree, but the design of this kit does not need a rabbet (rebate) for the first planking. I found both Nisha and Erycina can have the first plank added without it.  The lines allow the garboard plank to sit well. There are additional parts which form the rabbet for the second planking.  

Edited April 26, 2022 by Craigie65