Does anybody have experience with Vanda-Lay Industries tools for the Dremel?

[BillB]

I'm in the market to upgrade my workshop. I have several kit boats under my belt, and being retired I am spending more time in the workshop. I'm currently finishing up on the Pen Duick and eyeing a Shrimp boat next.  I have been using a Dremel drill press to drill small holes in 1/8 or 1/16 brass strips. I have not been happy with the results.  The drill bit can bounce around on the brass, and there is too much play with the unit when I switch it on which causes me to try to realign the work piece after the power is on. I solved some of these issues by using a on/off foot pedal, and using tape on top of the brass to help steady the drill bit on contact. But I'm still itching for an upgrade. I do not have an XY table, and I have never used a Mill or a Lathe (yet). I do see myself wanting to try Mill/Lathe capabilities sometime in the future as I grow my skills in modeling.

 

I have been looking in to Vanda-Lay industries tools for the Dremel as an option. I could get their Acra Mill Plus with all the attachments for around $450 + tax and shipping. This would give me a Mill, Drill Press, and Lathe. As well as XY and Z control. Or I could start with the Drill Press Plus with Vice, and Drill Press table for around $215. But I wouldn't have XY precision (I'm not sure I need that), and no Mill or Lathe.  Their products look good, but they are based on a Dremel which may be an issue with precision, but it could be good enough for an average modeler. I'm OK spending up to $500, but not interested in getting up in the $1000+ high end micro tools. The boss would not approve.  I could start with the drill setup now and ask Santa for a Mill or Lathe down the road. Does anybody have a recommendation?

 

I have also considered the Micro Mark 3 speed Drill Press for $300 when I add the XY table, Proxxon TBM 115 for around $315 with a XY table, or the Proxxon MF70 Mill at $400 which include XY I think. I also could go cheap with a Euro Tool DRL300 from Amazon for $115. I suspect some will say get the Proxxon Mill for $400, but to date I only use a drill and the mill looks awkward for mostly drilling.

 

Thanks for your thoughts,

Bill

[Jaager]

1 hour ago, BillB said:

a Euro Tool DRL300

The basic tool is what I have been using and it has done the job.  I got mine from Otto Frei.  I would suggest looking at brand name jeweler's supply sites because although all of the units may come from the same shop in China, the QA on the machines going to brand sites is probably better, with economy sites getting the just so units.

I added an XY table.  For a while, I kicked myself for paying MM for a table that cost about as much as the drill.  There are low cost ones at AliExpress, but there is the same QA issue and a low cost unit probably has loose tolerances.  I had to drill a hole in the base to mount the table.

I mostly use the XY table to hold a piece of 3/4" AA Birch ply as the work surface.

You also will want a momentary foot switch.

HSS bits.

I am fairly confident that my unit will serve as a wood mill - as long as the passes are light and the tools are SHARP.

For metal - especially steel, you will want an actual mill -  this becomes a factor if you make your own tools.

It has been as good a drill press as I have needed.

 

For wood or brass, you will want to use a sharp awl tip to make a starter hole so that the drill bit does not dance.  You want to pull the drill tip to the surface at the pilot hole before you engage the foot switch.  Sock foot for feel - switch fixed to a piece of scrap flooring.

[Bob Cleek]

Vanda-Lay makes quality products for what they are. Their customer service is great because they are a small family-owned company. I have their drill press and it works fine for what it is, a small "micro" drill press. (I also have the same capability with my full-size 1950's Craftsman/King Seeley bench top drill press which has a quill adapter to mount quarter-inch  router and milling bits and an X-Y table and vise for drilling and milling, and my Unimat SL which has mico- drilling and milling capability.) The Vanda-Lay drill/mill set up looks quite nice. Their CNC machined tools are well made and I expect you'll find have tight tolerances right out of the box. (Most all Asian-made machine tools will require significant amounts of fettling (tuning) to get working to acceptable tolerances. This is what you are paying for in the price difference between, say, Little Machine Shop or Micro Mark and the lowest prices online for the same unit.)

 

I picked up my Vanda-Lay drill press and a top of the line Dremel slightly used for peanuts from a modeler who became disabled and quit the hobby. For the same money for a new Chinese small drill press, I would look for some "old 'arn" like the 1950's cast iron Craftsman bench top drill presses that are quite inexpensive used and well worth restoring if the price is right on a beat up one. Remember with machine tools that weight equals accuracy. I would not waste money on the cheap small Chinese-made drill presses. Particularly for drilling with very small bits, you want a press without runout in the quill. A wobbly tiny bit will quickly break. Also, it's always better to pay a bit more for a larger machine tool if you have the space for it because you will always have the workpiece capacity limitations of the machine to run up against. Buy a 7x12 Sieg Chinese lathe and it won't be long before you experience the frustration of it's not being able to handle a 14" workpiece!

 

The best maxim is to only buy a tool when you need it and then buy the best quality tool you can possibly afford. Cheap tools are a waste of money. They may be cheap the first time you buy one, but the cost adds up when you have to keep replacing them over and over again. A top of the line tool will last a lifetime and still have some meat on the bone when your widow sells your tools off or gives them to your buddies.  

 

Vanda-Lay is good quality stuff in terms of materials, fit and finish. The primary limitation with the Vanda-Lay tools is their Dremel power plant. Dremel mototools are handy gizmos but they were never intended to do hand-held work to fine tolerances or operate at slower speeds. (They rely on speed, not torque, to get the job done.) Dremels are big and clunky if you are trying to do fine work with them and, at high speeds, a slight slip of the hand can ruin a workpiece. I've spoken with Vanda-Lay and they've assured me that they'd be happy to provide a holder for a standard one-inch diameter Foredom Flex-shaft handpiece to replace their stock holder for the Dremel Mototool. While I haven't the need for one, I've not yet ordered one, but I think this would be a great improvement over the Dremel. The Foredom handpieces are much lighter and not so "top heavy," their foot pedal variable speed controls are more sensitive, and their large motors have far greater torque than the Dremels, particularly at low speeds. A decent used Foredom setup will probably run you a couple of hundred bucks, but once you use one, you'll never go back to the Dremel for modeling. You could easily spend five hundred bucks on a Foredom-equipped Vanda-Lay mill/drill set up, so you may be tempted to take the step up to a Sherline lathe and/or mill, or the equivalent, but remember that once you get into dedicated lathes and mills, you will easily have to spend as much again on the essential tooling and accessories for those machines before you can start doing any work with them.

 

As always with modeling tools, one can spend a lot of money on fancy machine tools, but a skilled craftsman can do the same with sharp hand tools with far less of an investment in money. The trade off, of course, is that with hand tools, you're trading your working time for those savings. There are many variables to consider and everybody has their own comfort level. It's easy to invest a lot of money in tools. "Choose wisely, Grasshopper!"  

Edited August 24, 2022 by Bob Cleek

[Roger Pellett]

If you want to upgrade your drilling equipment and at the same time not upset your wife by spending too much $$$ I would not spend $200-$500 on any drilling equipment powered by a rotary tool; Dremel or otherwise.

 

My first choice would be buying a used drill press as Bob suggests- Estate sales, Craig’s List, etc.  I bought a new drill press in 1972.  It is a Toolcraft made in Chicopee, Mass;  all cast and machined cast iron.  The only plastic is the knob on the quill handle.  It is the tool used most often in my workshop and after 50 years it still runs great.  The 3/8in capacity chuck will hold virtually any drill bit that I need to use.  Bits smaller than 3/32in are best chucked in a pin vice that is then mounted in the main chuck.

 

I realize that you might not want to bargain hunt for a used tool or be faced with the need to restore it.  In that case I would not dismiss the “no name” drill presses sold by big box home improvement stores or Harbor Freight.  These sell for a fraction of what you plan to spend to upgrade your Dremel and you will be getting a much more capable tool, even though it will probably be made in China and might not last 50 years.  I would avoid tools with electronic speed control in favor of the much more reliable belt and stepped pulley drive.

 

If you have problems with drill bits skating across the surface when drilling brass are you first center punching the hole?  A center punch is easily ground from any cylindrical piece of steel.  Even a nail can be used with the point properly ground.

 

Lathe and milling machine?  Start saving for a Sherline!

 

Roger

 

 

[Nirvana]

I have some of Vanda-Lay items, and they are good.
However, when it comes to newer Dremel units they won't fit good this as the holes are meant for round shaped drills.

I overtighten one and damaged the Dremel, luckily I had an old Sears/Craftsman drill that fitted perfect.

[catopower]

I have a Vanda-Lay Acra-Mill Plus and the Drill Press. I did quite a bit using the setup when I was scratch building my Mary Taylor and Lively models. I set it up to scratch build my rigging blocks, to thickness sand a small number of small strips, and even used it cut planking strips.

 

Everything that's been said about it here sounds correct to me. I had older Dremels and they worked just fine – don't know about newer ones.

 

I think the best aspect of the Acra-Mill, etc., is that you can use them in a small space. So, if you're in an apartment, or just don't have workshop space, it's quite handy. Also, if you really don't need to do a lot of cutting, milling, etc., then it can be quite handy to have. However, after a while, it becomes a pain to have to take it apart to reconfigure it and put it back together every time you need a different set up. I still have mine, but haven't used it in years now. 

Myself, I never liked using a Dremel except for use as part of the Acra-Mill set up.

 

Personally, I think the most useful item would probably be a decent micro drill press and X-Y table. Or, even just any micro drill press. As Roger suggests, I got a cheap one that was made in China, and it works great and gets more use than 3/4 of my other power tools. However, I got one with electronic speed control. Has worked great for 4 or 5 years now.

 

[catopower]

On 8/23/2022 at 9:09 AM, BillB said:

Euro Tool DRL300

LOL. I didn't know what this was, so I looked it up... Oh, that's what I have! I do wish I had an x-y table for it though.

[glbarlow]

Any tool that relies on a Dremel isn’t a good use of money. The best machines are by Byrnes modeling, though he doesn’t make a drill press. In my opinion a mini saw, sander, mill, and lathe all have greater value to modeling than a drill press. When I need one my Proxxon Mill serves to do the job.  I’d look at the Proxxon line, reasonably affordable and good quality. 
 

The first, and by far most used tool in my modeling is the Byrnes saw. 

[Kevin Kenny]

I have a Cameron  drill press which is the best in class. I got it years ago from Charley files who developed and sold the Preac table saw. Its the second most used tool in my shop after the Byrnes table saw. I also have a beautiful XY vice.  It is expensive.

 

[BillB]

Thanks everybody for responding!  Turns out I have a 10 inch Delta press in the shop that I never considered for this fine work. Given the recommendations (which I agree with) I'll avoid the Dremel solutions.  I ordered a Pin Vise attachment from Amazon, and bought a cross slide vise (X Y capability) from Northern Tool. I've already tested the cross slide vise and it works pretty well out of the box. I plan to clean it up and tighten it up as well. I was able to center drill a 10mm brass rod using a center punch and the cross slide vise to make a search light for my next project.  It worked out well.  When the pin vise arrives I try the ultimate test of micro drilling 3mm brass. I'm confident I can make it work.  This saves me the big bucks so I can save for the Byrnes table saw, and a mini lathe.

 

Bill