Gunboat Philadelphia 1776 by tmj

[tmj]

21 hours ago, Chuck Seiler said:

Well, partially correct.  Spitfire DID exist.  She was damaged during the battle but managed to escape with the survivors, only to sink at Schyler's Island the next day.  SPITFIRE was discovered in 1997, but never raised.

Chuck,

Do you know why the Spitfire was never raised? Was it too badly decomposed, or what?

[Chuck Seiler]

Just the opposite.  It seems to be in pretty good shape (considering) but ;they' don't want to make the same mistakes Lorenzo Hagglund made in 1935.  He did a fair job with what he had available, but modern archeologist shudder.  The Lake Champlain Maritime Museum announced in June 2017 a five-phase plan to raise and preserve the Spitfire, anticipating a cost of about $44 million and a timeframe of 22 years.

[tmj]

The counterweights did a good job in flattening out the bottom. There are two small dips at about 4.125" and 8.125" as the rule reads, but that's okay. The oil needs another day to fully cure. I'll target those two areas with new counter-weighting measures tonight. I also checked the thickness of the wood. I'm currently about .003" too thick for proper scale. That would equate to about .072" at full scale. After final sanding, once the Tung Oil cures, I should be right about where I should be in proper scale thickness. Now it's back to the ol' curing fan for this nice-looking bottom...    

[tmj]

22 hours ago, Chuck Seiler said:

The Lake Champlain Maritime Museum announced in June 2017 a five-phase plan to raise and preserve the Spitfire, anticipating a cost of about $44 million and a timeframe of 22 years.

Chuck,

Please post a link for this five-phase plan. I'm curious and have been poking around on their site, but coming up with nothing but warnings for those who might attempt to dive that site. I can't find anything outlining their plans to raise this thing. 

Edited July 9 by tmj

[Chuck Seiler]

I don't know the details, I just saw it on Wikipedia.

[tmj]

I've applied my last beads of Tung Oil 'pitch' to the caulking seams of the bottom of this bottom, and it's curing. This view is not the bottom. I flipped it after a few hours of curing to prevent the oil from soaking too deep into the caulking grooves. I'll flip it again just before bedtime. This view is the 'top' of the bottom, the inside. I should be able to start laying out the locations of my flooring timbers on this side of the bottom this coming weekend. The two lines that you see on the outboard starboard plank are not two butt joints. One line is a centerline mark, used as a reference point for laying out the 34 flooring Timbers. The line to the right of that centerline is a butt-joint location as seen on the bottom side. These are all pencil marks, no actual seams. These marks are important as they show where the actual caulked butt-joints, from the bottom of this bottom are located. They will be covered/hidden with 'splice blocks' later on. The lines simply let me know where to place the splice blocks when it comes time to add them.        

I'm also working on a 'gizmo' to better replicate hewn frame members made from branching trees that will show the grain flowing in more appropriate directions for a build like this. I'm not going to show my 'concept' of this gadget right now. I might want to sell a few of these before the Chinese steal the idea and start selling cheap knockoffs. The end result would look similar to the picture below. This is not a scale image. It's only a concept meant to help me in the development of this thing. Not perfect, but better than what I've so far seen in grain orientation for most Philadelphia models and kits. I'm not knocking anyone, nor their models; I just want to add a bit more realism than what is typically seen. My frames are going to be 90% exposed. I want them to look as realistic as possible.   

 

  

Edited July 10 by tmj

[tmj]

Yes... 'another' redundant photo of that same ol' bottom. Things should start to move along a bit faster now that Tung-Oil has cured and I can actually start doing some productive work on this thing again.

I needed to lay out the bottom timber locations, prior to cutting out the shape of the bottom, while I still had true and straight edges to square off of. You might notice that that the gaps between timbers vary. My dimensions for the locations of these timbers are taken off of the Smithsonian's drawings. This is how she was actually built. All of my layed out dimensions are 'ordinate' and taken from the centerline 'zero' point to prevent any accumulation of errors to occur while laying out those 34 lines. The small 'hash-marks' located along the center strake, beside my layout lines, denote where the timbers are to actually sit with respect to the line. If done properly, there will be no visible signs of any pencil lines/marks seen anywhere atop this bottom once all of the flooring timbers are successfully installed. Next up... cutting out the shape of the bottom, 'FINALLY'!   

     

 

[tmj]

After cutting out the bottom shape, the bottom wanted to warp a bit. Not surprising. I now have it blocked up, again, and weighted down just to keep things under control until I start to install the flooring timbers that will eventually shore things up and keep the bottom flat from port to starboard. Each one of those 34 flooring timbers will have two 'limber-holes', 1" X 2" (scale = .042" X .084"), cut into them, close to the centerline, to allow for drainage of water back towards the bailing well located in the aft section of the boat. I'll be referring to the Smithsonian drawings, as well as other sources to properly locate those limber holes prior to cutting any of the flooring timbers. 

 

The current warpage of the bottom, after cutting, is very slight. I'm fairly sure that inserting stainless steel stiffeners into a few of the bottom timbers will not be necessary, albeit. We'll just have to wait and see for sure. I'm going to leave five bottom timbers out of the build, initially, for a few days. If the bottom holds its flat plane, I'll install the remaining timbers as is. If any tendency to warp shows up, I'll stuff the stainless-steel stiffeners into the middle of those five bottom timbers. 

 

Next up... bottom flooring timbers!

   

Edited July 13 by tmj

[tmj]

Flooring timbers and limber hole details have been worked out. The flooring timbers will remain long, as shown, until the frames have been installed. I'll then fair the ends of those flooring timbers to match the geometry created by the frames. The frames themselves will 'NOT' be faired. They will remain square and be placed perpendicular to the inner face of the outer planking. Not fairing the frames saved an enormous amount of time when this boat was being built. There was no time available for such a laborious task as fairing frames! Note that the limber channels are offset from the centerline of the boat. In a flat-bottomed boat, even slight inclines, as well as the natural movement of the boat can cause water to collect in various places. Offset limber holes help to ensure that water drains more efficiently towards the bilge area, or the 'bailing-well' as is the case with the Philadelphia. The five 'magenta' colored flooring timbers are the timbers that I'm going to temporarily leave out while testing the bottom for warpage. They will be installed once it is determined whether or not stiffeners will be needed. 

 

Time to get busy with the flooring timbers...

 

  

 

 

[tmj]

These will be the first six flooring timbers installed. The timbers dimensioned in blue will be milled from 3/16" X 1/4" square stock. The timbers dimensioned in red will be milled from 3/16" X 3/16" square stock. I'll start with the 1/4" stock and mill the entire length down to dimension #1 and then cut timber #34 to length. I'll then mill what's left of the first milled piece down to the #2 dimension of timber #13 and cut 'that' timber to length, etc., etc. I'll get all four blue timbers out of one 24" length with about 3" of drop left over. I'll find use for that drop elsewhere in this build. No waste. I'll then map out another 24" worth of stock for the 3/16" X 3/16" stock before milling and cutting any of the red dimensioned timbers, to ensure maximum yield of my material. This is how the program will go until I'm down to those last 5 timbers mentioned previously. I might even 'treenail' the timbers to the bottom planking as I go, just to break up the monotony of having to make and install lots of trunnels all at the same time. I'll also need to dig out the plans again and search for another detail. It's noted that these bottom timbers were initially 'toe-nailed' to the bottom strakes of planking to simply hold things together while holes were being bored and wedge-free trunnels installed (another time saving shortcut). After the trunnels were installed, the toenails were removed. The evidence of these toenails currently exists in the real Philadelphia as it is displayed at the Smithsonian. If it is noted, on the drawings, the location of those removed toenails... I'll be adding that/those features as well. I should have looked for that when I was looking at the limber holes, but I didn't. I was too focused on one particular thing and wasn't thinking ahead.              

 

 

[tmj]

    Meet Lt. Seamus Ribbit, USN (ret). After an illustrious career 'ship-hopping' across the western Pacific, he came to me, in retirement, seeking employment. I put him to work keeping an eye on my back porch Bonsai trees and keeping the usual bugs and pests under control. When I started growing Nepenthes and Sarracenia pitcher plants, he soon found himself getting bored and also getting very hungry. My pitcher plants were taking away both his job as well as his breakfast, lunch and supper! To make things right, I have now appointed him 'Division Officer' in charge of overseeing the construction process of this vessel. He gets free room and board and I also open the front door numerous times a day to let his breakfast, lunch and dinner come inside, however. I 'am' worried about his coffee habit. A Navy 'old-timer' for sure. He reminds me of the maintenance senior chief when I was in Beeville, Tx. That maintenance chief almost always had a steaming cup of coffee in his hand, even when it was 100 degrees... and when he didn't, he usually boasted a crooked looking index finger where that coffee cup typically hung! A common Navy version of 'Carpal Tunnel Syndrome'!

 

 I'm wanting to cobble together a micro thickness sander, for small timbers, before continuing with this build... and I also needed to order some more wood. Waiting for the wood and tinkering with this thickness sander will keep me busy for the rest of the week. 'Ribbit' will be keeping an eye on things until construction resumes, hopefully this weekend.  

[tmj]

Ribbit is not very patient. He's a "Go-Getter" who likes to take the bull by its horns and get things done! While waiting for 'me' to get my act together, he's decided to start doing a bit of QC and examine just where things currently stand. He's now checking the flatness of the bottom that he must first start with. He sees no issues and has advised me that I probably will not need to add any stainless-steel supports to my flooring timbers, albeit. He also advised me that after gluing those flooring timbers down, and also securely 'tree-nailing' those timbers to the bottom planking... things might change and there will 'still' be a chance for potential warpage. I'm heeding his advice and will incorporate the use of certain 'counter-warp' measures to ensure that such an undesirable thing does not have the opportunity to take place. 

               

[tmj]

A new load of wood just arrived. Not a big haul, just enough material to continue with my build at its current stage. The 3/16" and 1/4" square pieces are what will become my flooring timbers after being milled down to proper dimensions. The plastic bagged 1/32" X 3/16" strips are for a different part of this build, to be addressed later. I've fallen behind on my 'ad hock' milling setup for the flooring timbers (day job keeps getting in the way of things) but hope to make up for that lost time tomorrow. I'm hoping to have some flooring timbers milled and ready for installation no later than Sunday evening. "Fingers are crossed!" I won't be able to 'treenail' any of the flooring timbers to the bottom decking, even if I get the timbers milled this weekend, because my #58 drill bits have now been delayed, in delivery, and not expected to arrive until Monday. No biggie. I think I have my hands full right now with what I have before me.     

     

[tmj]

The 'Redneck' thickness mill works pretty darn good, for what it is. I used my Dremel workstation, two 'C' clamps and a drawplate for the front gauge. The tool is a 1/2" Dremel Carbide sanding drum @ 60 grit. I'm currently about .001" proud of my desired thickness in height, but after smoothing over the milled side with 120 grit paper I should be spot on. Cuts were made shallow, about .020" max per pass. If I tried to hog any more meat off than .020", I'd have to slow down and the wood would start to burn, as well as my finger! The Dremel shaft flexes a little when hogging off those heavier cuts, so I just kept running the timbers through until the shaft was finally relaxed and not cutting anymore, about three passes p/piece. The final finish passes were only a couple thousandths deep so there was no flexing of the shaft.

    

Now that I have the height set for all of my flooring timber material... it's time to start milling the widths of those timbers, cutting them to their proper lengths, as described in a previous post, and cut out the limber channels prior to gluing those flooring timbers in place atop the bottom planking.   

[tmj]

First 9 of 34 flooring timbers have been fabricated and glued in place. Odd locations, I know. I wanted to brace the bottom planking, from port to starboard, to prevent warpage while also getting the best yield from my material. Bottom planking is now well braced, so I'll be able to fill in the gaps with a more 'balanced' sequence of flooring timbers (provided that yield doesn't dictate otherwise). 

 

Milling the widths of these flooring timbers wasn't nearly as difficult, nor time consuming as I thought it was going to be. The job went rather quickly, and accuracy was easily held to within .002" of my desired widths, prior to sanding them smooth with 220 grit paper. After sanding, they are now pretty close to being dimensionally 'perfect'! "Who says that cheap tools from Amazon can't produce accurate results!" "They 'CAN'!"

I laid out the centerline of each timber and taped all of the timbers together using blue painter's tape... then marked out the locations and dimensions for the limber holes. I cut the limber holes using yet 'another' cheap table saw from Amazon with a small diameter, fine tooth blade. I cut the limber holes while all of the flooring timbers were taped together. Worked 'great'!

Here's a photo showing the installed flooring timbers with their limber holes.

 

9 flooring timbers down, 25 to go!

     

[tmj]

In case anyone is curious, 'this' is the cheap Amazon saw that I used to cut the limber holes. It comes with a small fine-tooth blade that works really well on small part details. Nothing to write home about, but it works well if properly used. Just don't expect too much from this. It's 'not' an all-purpose workhorse! 

I'm not trying to promote any products. I'm just letting folks know that while expensive, high-quality equipment is very nice... it's also not absolutely necessary. Learn the limits and the idiosyncrasies of cheap stuff like this and you too will quickly figure out how to overcome all of the short comings and be able to produce some rather accurate work. Everything has its "Ticks and Tricks"... even the expensive stuff!     

Edited July 22 by tmj

[Snug Harbor Johnny]

1 hour ago, tmj said:

In case anyone is curious, 'this' is the cheap Amazon saw that I used to cut the limber holes. It comes with a small fine-tooth blade that works really well on small part details. Nothing to write home about, but it works well if properly used. Just don't expect too much from this. It's 'not' an all-purpose workhorse! 

  The saw you picture is still FAR superior to the "Chicago Tool" mini-saw sold at Harbor Freight - which has no fence, no fine tooth blade, and an odd sized arbor that I had to search the web to find a fine enough blade to fit it and cut modeling wood.  Its a bit of a pain to use, so I'd like to try and at least find the one shown to 'step up' from what I have now.   And I dare say that it will be somewhat less expensive than a $2,000 Byrnes saw - if you can find one at that price on eBay.

[tmj]

4 minutes ago, Snug Harbor Johnny said:

And I dare say that it will be somewhat less expensive than a $2,000 Byrnes saw - if you can find one at that price on eBay.

A Byrne's saw just sold on eBay, last week I think, for over $4K. Another one showed up right after that first auction ended with 'Its' starting price being $1,200, much like the first auction. I'm really, really suspicious about that curious activity and also the timing. I'm not so sure that those auctions were truly 'legitimate'. I have a gut feeling that those two auctions were being put on by illegitimate individuals running shill games, scams, etc. trying to run the 'expected value' of these saws up to ridiculous levels, of which those saws are not truly being sold for, right now. It just looks that way! This sets a very bad potential precedence for future auctions of Byrne's equipment be it by both legitimate folks, as well as illegitimate and manipulative price gougers. I wouldn't buy a Byrne's saw for that much money unless it came with digital read-outs and a CNC upgrade! Call me crazy, call me 'wacky'... I just smell something 💩funny about those two auctions...             

[Kevin Kenny]

Based on the description on how the boat was build the off center planks will be fine.

[bdgiantman2]

On 7/21/2024 at 7:12 PM, tmj said:

In case anyone is curious, 'this' is the cheap Amazon saw that I used to cut the limber holes. It comes with a small fine-tooth blade that works really well on small part details. Nothing to write home about, but it works well if properly used. Just don't expect too much from this. It's 'not' an all-purpose workhorse! 

On 7/21/2024 at 8:17 PM, Snug Harbor Johnny said:

  The saw you picture is still FAR superior to the "Chicago Tool" mini-saw sold at Harbor Freight - which has no fence, no fine tooth blade..........

 

I bought that Chicago Tool for Christmas two years ago, then my dad got me a similar Amazon saw for birthday last year. Mine doesn't have the blade height adjusting feature as a cheaper model, but that would come super beneficial for this hobby.  

 

Brian D

Edited August 3 by bdgiantman2

[Snug Harbor Johnny]

  Still, these mini-saws are REAL tools capable of seriously injuring a wayward finger.  As with all power tools, care in use and attention to safety is essential.

 

[FriedClams]

I enjoy unusual build subjects, so your Philadelphia gunboat caught my eye.   Best of luck on this interesting model.

 

Gary

[tmj]

1 hour ago, FriedClams said:

I enjoy unusual build subjects, so your Philadelphia gunboat caught my eye.   Best of luck on this interesting model.

Thanks Gary!

 

This will likely be somewhat unusual, all the way through the build... not only in a traditional model building sense, but also in techniques used to accomplish certain curious tasks. My goal is absolute precision, personal satisfaction, and also helping any newbies out by showing them that one does not need expensive equipment to create a fine model ship. If I'm able to pull this build off, in the manner that I desire, the Smithsonian will be able to show up with their drawings, notes and a set of calipers... and hopefully find no discrepancies between their dimensions and details vs my scale model. IE. Two tricky parts are coming up soon. #1 will be my tree-nailing the bottom planks to the flooring timbers using 'octagonal' shaped trunnels, as were actually used on the real boat. Making the trunnels will be one thing, but I also need to ensure that the octagonal shapes of those trunnels will be visible to anyone who wants to actually look that close! #2 involves the framing members located between those flooring timbers. They were hewn out of trees where the limbs were branching. This produced a grain that was able to run both horizontally along the bottom, as well as vertically up the sides, with no joints. One hewed 'branching timber' produced one frame member. I've figured out a way to do this but won't be able to know if the results will be satisfactorily acceptable until I give it a try. That's coming up soon. Let's also not forget the elongated, rectangular shape of the iron nail heads used to secure the side planking to this boat. That will be another curious adventure to embark upon. Luckily, there will not be much side planking on this model. It will be open enough to let the seabirds fly through it, so I won't need to make many of those nails.  Things such as this are how I currently expect the entire build of my Philadelphia to go. One adventure after another. 

 

Thanks for taking an interest in this build log. I'll be doing my best to keep things interesting and worth everyone's attention.

  Tom...                    

Edited July 26 by tmj

[tmj]

It's been 5 days since I laid the first 9 flooring timbers atop the bottom planking. I was worried about warpage, over time, but so far so good. The bottom is perfectly flat from both stem to stern, as well as port to starboard. The stem to stern flatness actually surprises me, but I also wasn't too worried about that. The false keel would flatten that out once laid if any warpage 'did' occur in that direction. I'll get started with filling the bottom out with the rest of the flooring timbers starting tomorrow. I doubt that I'll get them 'all' cut and installed this weekend, but I'll advance as best I can.  

  

Edited July 26 by tmj

[tmj]

The remaining flooring timbers have now been milled to their varied dimensions and cut to their proper lengths, 'all' of them. This took all day to do. I spent more time setting my mill up for all of the different widths, one dimension at a time, than I spent actually milling and cutting those timbers. A few timbers are of the same dimension, which was a relief, but the majority of them were varied. The shop is cleaned up and now it's 'Break-Time!" 

  

[tmj]

As previously mentioned, the bottom of this build will incorporate 'octagonally' shaped trunnels to secure the flooring timbers to the bottom planking. My octagonal draw plate just arrived via UPS. You can see how much this thing cost. If anyone knows of any 'other' ships, or boats that used octagonal trunnels, please let me know. Maybe I can eventually recoup the cost of this drawplate, in the long run...

 Not the best photo, but the octagonal shape is indeed still noticeable in the smaller holes, if you look close and hard, in person. You won't see the shape in this photo though. You'll just have to take my word for it.  

 

[tmj]

Progress has been slow. Lots of custom 'one-offs' on those flooring timbers. I still have 11 flooring timbers needing to be installed... then it'll be time to start playing with splice plates and trunnels. That should be fun! 

     

[tmj]

All 34 flooring timbers are 'finally' in place. I'm now scratching my head trying to figure out how to approach those 'octagonal' shaped trunnels. "Hmm?"...

        

[tmj]

The octagonal shaped trunnels are a "No-Go." It's too difficult to pass the small pieces of wood through the draw plate, numerous times, with perfect orientation each time through the hole(s). I was unintentionally rounding off the sharp corners of the intended octagonal shape and thus making the trunnel material somewhat round as a result. "Oh well, I tried!" Trunnels will be round.

I'm now debating on the 'color' for the trunnel materials. The bottom of the boat is Cherry, and the flooring timbers are Basswood. With the interior of this model being exposed, I want contrasting colors between the different components of the structure. My idea is to use 'split-trunnels'. Darker wood for the Cherry bottom planking exterior and a lighter color for the Basswood flooring timbers inside the model. I want the trunnels noticeable, but not too loud nor strikingly obvious.

 
My 'split-trunnel' plans...

The Basswood trunnel material is my favorite for the bottom planking. It's not too loud and the 'halo' around the perimeter of the trunnels, produced by the Tung Oil, adds a certain depth of complexity and visual interest that I like. The Cherry trunnels just look like dark dots. No real character. Let me know what 'you' folks think. Do you prefer the look of Basswood trunnels, or Cherry trunnels?

As for the interior, atop the flooring timbers... I don't like the Basswood, nor the Cherry. The Basswood end-grain gets too dark when the Tung-Oil is applied. The Cherry is just too dark to begin with. This is way too loud and 'striking'. I need some wood, or suitable material that will 'closely' match the color of the Basswood after a couple coats of Tung-Oil finish are applied. 
Does the end grain of Bamboo absorb color and darken, when finished, like the Basswood? 
I'm open for suggestions here. If you know of a good material, please chime in. 

Please pardon the ugly holes. I was playing with different drill bit sizes and RPM's looking for the proper setup. "Found it!"

It's 'Sci-Fi' Saturday. I think I'll take a break from the Philadelphia and do a bit more design work on my wooden 'Steampunk' "Seaview Submarine" design while watching 'Svengoolie' and "Voyage to the Bottom of the Sea" on MeTv tonight.

 

 

Edited August 10 by tmj

[Keith Black]

 Tom, were I you, since the planks are cherry, I'd go with cheery trunnels and let the devil take the hindquarter.