Venetian Carrack or Cocha by woodrat - FINISHED - 1/64

[CaptainSteve]

Not sure if this is an idea you'd consider entertaining, Dick, but what about partly-furled ?? This was an option I chose when doing my Launch build. My reasoning being that it showed off the sails, but also displayed a sense of action onboard, whilst also highlighting the rigging. It would be entirely up to you as to how much of the sail is raised/furled.

Edited March 16, 2016 by CaptainSteve

[Louie da fly]

Lovely work, Dick. You continue to amaze with the quality and beauty of this build.

 

Steven

[JesseLee]

I am really enjoying this build Dick!

 

Jesse

[woodrat]

Not sure if this is an idea you'd consider entertaining, Dick, but what about partly-furled ?? This was an option I chose when doing my Launch build. My reasoning being that it showed off the sails, but also displayed a sense of action onboard, whilst also highlighting the rigging. It would be entirely up to you as to how much of the sail is raised/furled.

That's an option worth considering. But the carracks at that time lowered the mainyard  in order to furl the sail, which would obscure the deck detail somewhat. 

 

 

Thanks Jesse and Steven for your kind comments

Dick

[Siegfried]

Hello Dick,

 

This is an excellent project and I am follow it from the beginning on with great interest. It's not just ship modelling. It is a kind of historical research of pre Columbus ship building you are doing here. Do you mind it might worth to make a monographe out of it? I am sure some of us would be interested on it.

 

Cheers, Daniel

[woodrat]

Thanks, Daniel. It was suggested by Dgbot earlier in this blog that it could be written up for the NRG magazine which could detail a little of the research and a lot of the build for ship modellers and I am considering this. Publishing it as a stand-alone publication would be rather presumptuous as I have no qualifications as a historian, nautical architect or archaeologist. Nonetheless, I may do it for myself and put it on the web somewhere. I wouldn't mind some feedback from someone in the nautical archaeology field. Is there anyone like that out there?

Cheers

[Louie da fly]

Dick, I'd suggest you go for it - write your article and send it to Mariner's Mirror. I've found that even academics are more interested in the addition to the fund of knowledge than in the letters after a person's name. I've been thinking of writing one on my dromon when it's finished. 

 

You might have to get a bit of coaching in how to present the paper, and how to add references, bibliography etc., but you can pick a lot of that up by reading academic papers, like some of the TAMU ones you've already looked at. You've made some very worthwhile and valuable discoveries during your build and lack of academic qualifications is no reason not to share the results of your research. I believe it would stir up a lot of interest.

 

You might like to contact Glenn, who's currently building a paddle wheeler on this forum. He's at TAMU and might be able to help out.

 

Steven

Edited March 18, 2016 by Louie da fly

[woodrat]

The author's instructions for the Mariner's Mirror are downloadable as a .pdf from the web. I suspect I would be leaving myself open to a bunfight from the european and especially italian mavens of nautical architecture. But that might be fun! I have published in academic journals in the past and know there would be a lot of toing and froing with reviewers and editors, even if it was accepted. Glenn's opinion would certainly be valued.

Dick

Edited March 18, 2016 by woodrat

[woodrat]

This is my concept of the capstan as it might have appeared. It is based somewhat on the capstan of the Wasa. The rocker pawl is a not unreasonable device for the period. The capstan will be used to assist raising the yard.

 

 

 

 

 

 

 

this painting by Botticelli shows the capstan eccentrically placed in the waist

 

 

 

Dick

Edited April 2, 2016 by woodrat

[Louie da fly]

Very nice, Dick. It looks very business like. I have a feeling one of the wrecks - perhaps the Lomellina? - still had its capstan, but I could be wrong about that.

 

Anyway, a lovely piece of work as usual.

 

Steven

Edited April 3, 2016 by Louie da fly

[Louie da fly]

I checked the Lomellina wreck. It does have a capstan, but very similar to what you've done. Cross section a bit different and tapers upwards. But this was a Genoese vessel, not Venetian, and as I understand it they didn't share shipbuildung secrets - they were often enemies and always rivals. I'm using my phone so can't post pics but I can probably search up the website later today if you're interested.

 

Steven

[woodrat]

thanks, Steven. That would be very useful.

Cheers

Dick

[Louie da fly]

The link is in "important links to ship modelling resources" under "archaeological studies on carrack wrecks". Follow the links and you should be able to find drawings of the capstan as it was found and another reconstructing it as it would have been in the day. I just wish I'd been able to refer you to it before you made your own capstan. Lots of other good stuff there as well, including a port lid and (I think)cannons, pump, rudder . . .

Edited April 4, 2016 by Louie da fly

[woodrat]

Thanks for the links. The Lomellina capstan is not sufficiently different to my capstan which greatly resembles the capstan found and reconstructed on the Red Bay Basque whaling ship of 1565.

 

 

So I think I will leave the capstan as is. Maybe redo the bars.

Dick

[Louie da fly]

Well that's good, then. I didn,t want to be the person who tells you stuff that makes you throw away something you've just spent lots of time and effort making because it turns out to be wrong. As far as I can see, the differences were only in detail, not in kind. I wasn't aware they had the Red Bay capstan, but I'm not really surprised seeing how complete the wreck is.

 

Steven

[woodrat]

Well that's good, then. I didn,t want to be the person who tells you stuff that makes you throw away something you've just spent lots of time and effort making because it turns out to be wrong. A

 

Steven

With this type of reconstruction, it is inevitable that future discoveries will make mine obsolete. Maybe it already is. But it's all about the journey, not the destination.

Dick

[Louie da fly]

That's true. But I find it much more interesting researching and scratch building older ships, where the information is almost always incomplete and where imagination and educated guesswork have to take the place of hard data, than to work from a set of complete plans where everything is known and set down. As far as I'm concerned the research and speculation is a major part of the enjoyment, even if it means not ever really knowing if you got it right, even if what you build may be outdated by later discoveries. It's true - it's all about the journey. I know many others prefer to have the certainty and the plans all laid down properly, but for me the fun is just as much about the detective work as it us about the build itself. To me the two are complementary and both contribute ewually to the enjoyment of the build.

[woodrat]

...... for me the fun is just as much about the detective work as it us about the build itself. To me the two are complementary and both contribute ewually to the enjoyment of the build.

Hear him, hear him!

[woodrat]

the three iron rings were I believe used for shipping the rudder and afterwards to attach rudder preventers 

A preventer is rigged

 

A second preventer is led into the stern

[JesseLee]

Looks very good. I am really liking all the research you are puting into each step of this build.

 

Jesse

Edited April 19, 2016 by JesseLee

[Louie da fly]

A nice piece of work, Dick. I never cease to be impressed by your insight into what, to me, are mysterious or even meaningless details in old pictures, and your ability to turn them into parts of the ship which in hindsight are obviously what the picture represented. It's the old "I should have thought of that!" moment.

 

I wonder if a ship up on the slipway like that might not have had the preventers removed, so they wouldn't appear in Trombetta's picture.

 

Steven

[woodrat]

Thanks Steven and Jesse. Yes , I believe Zorzi sketched the vessel while in a slipway or dock. This would explain the incomplete planking on the main wales exposing the frames (see earlier discussion), the lack of masts and the lack of anchors.

Also I would be loath to deride the ancient illustrators especially those drawing "from life". They are usually correct (vide Carpaccio)

Cheers

Dick

Edited April 19, 2016 by woodrat

[woodrat]

Inside the Great Cabin with ladder to poop deck

note the blinds in the up position

[Louie da fly]

Very impressive.

[JesseLee]

Those are great below deck shots! What are you using?

 

Jesse

[woodrat]

For all my photos I have used an old Nikon Coolpix 5000 digital camera. For these pics I shone a small LED torch through the windows and waited till the autofocus focused the desired bit. It didn't always work. Sometimes I post process with an image processing software but not for these images. I just reduced the image size and cropped.

Dick

Edited April 25, 2016 by woodrat

[woodrat]

The pumps are shown. I can find no evidence for a more complicated mechanism than this for the period.

 

 

 

I think the pump handles are too thick.

Dick

[druxey]

A hand-grip should be about 1½" to 2" in diameter. Is that what those are, DIck?  I'm really enjoying seeing this build as it is a different subject.

[woodrat]

Thanks, Druxey. I will thin them down. Those pumps must have been hell on the back and thighs!!

Dick

Edited April 25, 2016 by woodrat

[woodrat]

This the pumps with more realistic hand-grips

 

 

note the asymmetry of the forecastle canopy to allow for the foremast and the bowsprit.

 

Now to attack the mainmast.

Dick

Edited April 29, 2016 by woodrat