GUNBOAT PHILADELPHIA by Steve.Y - FINISHED - Model Shipways

[bebopsteve]

Well, After some prodding I am starting a build log on my recently acquired Model Shipways Gunboat Philadelphia. I am rather new to ship building, and anticipate a lot of fun trying to construct this boat. Fellow member Chuck Seiler (builder of a scratch Philly) has been very kind in offering up advice and tips. I welcome any advice. In fact, Please! Chuck is building the same kit, and I will shadow his progress gathering info and ideas. I have already inundated him with questions. So that being said, off I go to glue, cut, sand and try and figure how to build a boat!

[Chuck Seiler]

...and here we all are!!!  Welcome to the build Steve.  Hopefully a bunch of my followers will cross over.

[bebopsteve]

_{Thanks Chuck! I am looking forward to the fun and learning!}

[bebopsteve]

Taking a cue from Chuck, I am going to plank the bottom underside. It is not included in the kit, but heck, why not?

[jwvolz]

I'll be following along Steve, since this one is in my future build plans. Good luck with the build!

[bebopsteve]

Thanks Joe, If you have any advice or see anything that might help, I would sure appreciate it!

[bebopsteve]

Sternpost and stem glued to keel. However, keel is not glued to bottom as I am going to plank the underside. So far all looks pretty good. Tight solid fit. Using Titebond, so at least I can get mistakes apart for a re-do if needed. Did a parts inventory and all are accounted for. Also numbered parts for easy, quick access.

I really enjoy taking my time and relaxing as I work on this. I am not in a hurry. I find it fun going slow and thinking each step out. Of course I have had a lot of help from Chuck! Can't wait to see his Philly get started!

[dgbot]

If you get Seaways Ship in Scale Kurt Van Dahm did several articles on building the Philadelphia.

David B

[Chuck Seiler]

Steve,

    Looking good!

 

    Rumor has it ME has PHILLY on sale for $119.  Maybe we will get more builders.  Sounds like a 'community build' project, eh?

[bebopsteve]

Ship n Scale is not available retail. I can not find it anywhere. I guess I will order from the source. Chuck was the thin strip on bottom to simulate keel 3/8"? That is how wide it is.. 

[Chuck Seiler]

Steve,

 

   My strip on the underside is as wide as the centerpiece/false keel, whatever that is.  It is 3/64 thick, as are all the other planks.  In reality, it would stick out a little prouder than the bottom planking, but not much-only  scale inch or two.  However, that makes it unstable when it sits on a flat surface, so I make it all the same.

[bebopsteve]

Sorry Chuck, I meant 3/16" wide. Ok no prob.

I was just at hobby shop, they were out. I will check the download angle! Thanks!

[Chuck Seiler]

3/16 sounds about right. 

 

In reality, I doubt if ANYONE will see the center strip and almost nobody will actually see the underside planking.  The ME instructions did not call for planking the underside (that I saw) nor is it addressed in Kurt's article.  Some people may wonder "Then why plank it?".  As I expressed to you seperately in an IM, I think planking the bottom is important because (1) Just because, ( b )To demonstrate that it really is the bottom of the boat and not a waterline model.

 

Hi Kurt!.

Edited August 14, 2014 by Chuck Seiler

[bebopsteve]

So, planked the bottom and started to trim and sand. What about nails? Should I?

[foxy]

Excuse my ignorance Steve.

 

Lovely build so far and very interesting subject.

 

What scale are we talking about for this build. if its bigger than 1/96, then yes go for the nails, will look much better.

 

Watching with Interest

 

Cheers foxy

[bebopsteve]

Scale is 1:24. The planks on underside was the idea from Chuck S, who also has a Philly build going on. This is my first real build, so he has been very helpful. Any ideas, tips is greatly appreciated!!

[foxy]

In that scale Steve I would go for nails shipmate.

 

Some do it with pins, but a black pen would also make it look good, Not sure if that type of ship had Caulk between the planks, that to using a  pen on one side will show the effect very easy when planking.

 

Foxy

[bebopsteve]

Thanks for the tip!..

[bebopsteve]

Any Ideas on nail placement ?

[foxy]

Afraid not on this type of ship.

But the nails were in two's at the joins between planks end to end and single nails between for most ships.

 

But could be wrong for this one.

Foxy

Edited August 18, 2014 by foxy

[bebopsteve]

No worries... I will check it out.. Thanks

[Chuck Seiler]

Steve,

    I would not go with nails for the underside at this point.  Nails in th ehull and deck are going to be a pain in the @$$ enough. 

 

   For my scratch Philly I used pencil point (very sharp #6 hard) with some success.  Based on some research, I am thinking of using a grayish monofiliment.  I will be doing experimentation to figure out which I like best.  The problem with the pencil is that sometimes the stain caused it to run (such as on the rudder). 

 

   Bottom line; subtle is where you want to go....nails that are TOO obvious tend to detract. ....and there are alot of nails.

 

  

 

    For the hull, there are four nails per main plank (the ones below the wale) per frame.  I forget how wide these were, but I think that equates to 1 nail for every 6 inches of width.  Since the real Philly had twice as many frames as the model, you would have nails at the existing frames PLUS halfway between them.  The above picture gives you an idea where and how many nals there were onthe hull. 

 

    For the deck, the number of nails were similar, particularly on the forward and middle platforms, due to the guns.  The replica uses treenails because it has to worry about corrosion, but the original did not have that problem.

 

Edited August 18, 2014 by Chuck Seiler

[Chuck Seiler]

Foxy,

 

   The rules for 'nailing' planks varied from country to country, depending on date and size of ship, as well.  Sometimes 1 nail (normally a wood treenail) between butt ends, sometimes 2 staggered.  All that gets thrown out the window with Philadelphia (along with alot of other things.  Check out my scratch Philly to see other areas where their building practice went counter to what we normally think as being correct.)

 

   They used alot of iron nails to hold these gunboats together.  The structural stresses from the 12 pound gun forward and 9 pounders amidships had to be significant.

[bebopsteve]

_{As Usual, Chuck "Nailed It".. Great info.. !}

Edited August 18, 2014 by Steve.Y

[Chuck Seiler]

Yeah, it's not like I haven't had time to think about this, eh?  I still think it will be an issue of experimenting with things to see how it looks before actually 'going live'.  I am going to try a couple things...probably Septemberish.  I will let you know what I come up with, but in the meanwhile, I am still working on mounting and planking.

 

Have you decided how to mount it yet?

[bebopsteve]

I am thinking of going in your direction on mounting. I am also thinking of not mounting. Let me ask, is it possible to have it just sit on some sort of cool looking blocks? I am planning on putting the the finished boat in a case. Thanks again for steering me on the planking basics. This week will be sanding the planks and stain.

[bebopsteve]

Also Chuck, do you use a wood conditioner prior to staining?

[Chuck Seiler]

Absolutely, non permanent mounting is definitely an option if you don't plan on moving the case around.  If that is the situation, there is no need to screw/nail/bolt/duct tape/super glue the model to the base.  I strongly endorse your plan for a case. 

[Chuck Seiler]

I do NOT use wood conditioner, since I am working with hardwoods such as box, maple, holly, etc.  I'm not sure if a wood sealer is needed with basswood in order to get a good finish.  Check out Chuck Passaro's CONFEDERACY or WINCHELSEA.  I believe they were both in basswood.

 

If somebody doesn't provide an answer in a day or so, post the question on my build log, I know you will get an answer there.

[bebopsteve]

Thanks Chuck.. You forgot Velcro!

So, sanding the planks. What's your take on wood conditioner. Necessary?