Jaxboat

Some of you have been subjected to my frequent harping that ship modelers refer to "acrylics" as if it  was an all inclusive term, So I found the perfect example today to show it isn't. Many of us use floor polish polymers to provide a removable coating or smooth coating for placing decals. The solution is fairly clear because the acrylic polymers employed are actually water soluble under basic (high pH) conditions because they are low molecular weight and have hydroxyl and acid functional acrylic monomers in them which promote water solubility. Once upon a time, these type of floor polishes also contained a soluble zinc salt which would complex with the functional groups as the polish dried and provide a more durable finish that could only be stripped off using a very basic ammonia solution to resolublize  the Zn. The EPA put a stop to that when they realized how much soluble (toxic) Zn was being discharged into rivers and streams. I am only making the point that acrylics vary widely in composition and molecular weight which give them very differing capabilities. It is a very versatile chemistry.

Red Ochre refers to a pigment used in paint. Basically it is iron that is oxidized. In this case, red is rust. If you reduce the amount of oxygen when burning in the presence of iron you can also produce various shades of brown, tan and even black. Red ochre is some what subdued compared to organic reds but it is authentic for ship use. The pigment would be dispersed in some kind of vehicle (not sure what it would be in 17th and 18th century).  There were organic red pigments available but they were expensive and not very UV stable
Jaxboat

Red Ochre refers to a pigment used in paint. Basically it is iron that is oxidized. In this case, red is rust. If you reduce the amount of oxygen when burning in the presence of iron you can also produce various shades of brown, tan and even black. Red ochre is some what subdued compared to organic reds but it is authentic for ship use. The pigment would be dispersed in some kind of vehicle (not sure what it would be in 17th and 18th century).  There were organic red pigments available but they were expensive and not very UV stable
Jaxboat

Or maybe Amati told him: "loose lips sink (planned wooden model)ships!"
Jaxboat

Never buy a cheapie. It's a snare and delusion. You'll never regret getting a quality tool, be it machine or hand tool.

Ochres are ferric (i.e. trivalent) iron oxyhydroxides of varying composition (generic formula FeOOH). The less water you have, the more reddish they tend to be. They are the residues from a particular weathering environment. In some parts of the world there are quite pure occurences, for instance in southern France (see e.g. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Roussillon,_Vaucluse), so that it can be mined for pigment. Otherwise, red soils are quite common in the tropics, but contain a lot of sand and other impurities.

From Wikimedia

Red Ochre refers to a pigment used in paint. Basically it is iron that is oxidized. In this case, red is rust. If you reduce the amount of oxygen when burning in the presence of iron you can also produce various shades of brown, tan and even black. Red ochre is some what subdued compared to organic reds but it is authentic for ship use. The pigment would be dispersed in some kind of vehicle (not sure what it would be in 17th and 18th century).  There were organic red pigments available but they were expensive and not very UV stable
Jaxboat

Or maybe Amati told him: "loose lips sink (planned wooden model)ships!"
Jaxboat

Red Ochre refers to a pigment used in paint. Basically it is iron that is oxidized. In this case, red is rust. If you reduce the amount of oxygen when burning in the presence of iron you can also produce various shades of brown, tan and even black. Red ochre is some what subdued compared to organic reds but it is authentic for ship use. The pigment would be dispersed in some kind of vehicle (not sure what it would be in 17th and 18th century).  There were organic red pigments available but they were expensive and not very UV stable
Jaxboat

Or maybe Amati told him: "loose lips sink (planned wooden model)ships!"
Jaxboat

Gentlemen,
 
I just did some pruning of this topic. This thread was started specifically to discuss projects in the works at Amati. I don't know why Chris hasn't posted in a while, but I'm sure he has his reasons. In the meantime, the thread was drifting off-topic and threatening to become a full-blown topic hijack. Discussions of particular kits already in production should go in the wooden kits forum. Build pics should go in a build log. Chit-chat should go in the Shore Leave forum.
 
Thank you!

My sentiments exactly....the sooner the better for Victory,... while I still have all my faculties ---
 
JP

Red ochre is one possible pigment in a paint and would have been a lot cheaper than most other red(dish) pigments,

The red came from Red lead pigment. Until recently Lead was replaced by organo tin compounds. Anti-fouling paints now make use of organic compounds which are more biodegradable after leaching (mechanism for fouling control for all). The Italian Navy did use a green anti-fouling paint but I do not know the Chemistry.
Jaxboat

This area is intended for your build logs of any scratch-built models you are working.  Whether they are wood, plastic, card, or RC kits.  This is the place where you can document your step-by-step progress.  Post images of your work and share your techniques and ideas with your fellow Model Ship World members.
 
How to set up your log?
 
Create a new topic for each individual model you are working on.  As you make more progress on it,  reply within that topic to post updates on it.  Please keep all such posts on topic with regard to the log you are working on and all replies within your one log.  Do not create another topic each time you want to make an update.  If you are only posting images of your completed model...please do so in the gallery.  This forum is for works in progress so we can follow along with your step-by-step explanations.
 
How to Name your build log?
 
We have a "Build Log Naming Convention" to enable the Search Engine to sort them Alphabetically by "Ship's Name" and/or "Builder's Name".
 
We urge you to follow the guidelines below to make this work properly. If you don't, a Moderator will do it for you anyway - so you may as well get it right first time and save us the trouble.
 
This is how your Build Log Title must be set up for Static Wooden Ships :
 
HMS Victory by Fred Bloggs - Scale 1: 75 - 1805 as she appeared after Trafalger - First wooden ship build
 
The first section in RED is MANDATORY and must be done EXACTLY as shown to enable correct Sorting by the Search facility. Note there are SPACES either side of the dash following your Username.
 
Check other Build Logs for an existing one to see whether the "HMS" (or other prefix) is used before the Ship's Name.
 
DO NOT Re-Title the RED section if it has been done by a Moderator.
 
The second section in GREEN is OPTIONAL - you may add any further information you like. There is a much larger Character Limit than previously - 150 characters compared to the old one of about 40.
 
(Note that the colors above are only for this demonstration - you can't Format a Title like you can with other Text)
 
For Plastic, Card, Ships in Bottles and Radio Controlled the following (in PURPLE) will need to be added :
 
USS New Jersey by giblets - PLASTIC - Superdetailed with PE
 
HMAS Sydney by ship ahoy - CARD - 1: 100
 
HMS Victory by Simmo - BOTTLE - 1/700 scale
 
Vosper PT Boat by whereami - RADIO - A nice model to build
 
Instructions on how to use the Search to find a Build Log list of the Ship you are looking for are in a pinned Topic in "Questions/instructions on how to use and post to this forum/Site Problems or suggestions".

Nice brickwork for the stove.
 
Ben

First add in quite a while more pics to come. Deck hatches and base for ship stove, Challenging but great fun

Cellulose nitrate is known as "nitro cellulose" in English. It was the first synthetic paint vehicle. Model T Fords were all painted with Nitro Cellulose lacquers. It also had a long run in furniture finishing. In the skilled hands of SE High Point NC US furniture experts, it could be used in many, many coats to give a beautiful warm finish. It has virtually disappeared from that application because of air pollution issues from the solvent. It is also related to gun cotton. Nitro cellulose is not UV stable and readily degrades in sunlight

Cellulose nitrate is known as "nitro cellulose" in English. It was the first synthetic paint vehicle. Model T Fords were all painted with Nitro Cellulose lacquers. It also had a long run in furniture finishing. In the skilled hands of SE High Point NC US furniture experts, it could be used in many, many coats to give a beautiful warm finish. It has virtually disappeared from that application because of air pollution issues from the solvent. It is also related to gun cotton. Nitro cellulose is not UV stable and readily degrades in sunlight

The red came from Red lead pigment. Until recently Lead was replaced by organo tin compounds. Anti-fouling paints now make use of organic compounds which are more biodegradable after leaching (mechanism for fouling control for all). The Italian Navy did use a green anti-fouling paint but I do not know the Chemistry.
Jaxboat

Is it possible that what you are seeing in the photograph is thin wood sheathing painted over?

Hmm, the glue contains solids and a vehicle, and the vehicle carries the solids and evaporates, leaving the solids to congeal or react. 
 
If you want to put glue exactly where you want it and nowhere else, then 1) test fit the parts first, and 2) then figure out a way to hold them position until the glue solidifies.  3)Then place a small dot of glue on a card, and use a needle or toothpick to pick up a droplet and apply it to the parts. Don't use the applicator of the tube.  if you use a lot of CA glue, you can draw it up in polypropylene transfer pipettes with fine tips and invert them. They keep for a long time uncapped, or you can crimp the ends.  
 
Incidentally, many yellow or white PVA glues can be released with alcohol and/or heat.  CA eventually degrades in water (but that's not practical here), but acetone will loosen it.  Most epoxies melt at about 250F, but some much at higher temps (e.g. grey J-B Weld).  Silicone RTV glues (e.g. aquarium cement) can withstand heat up to about 500F.  Polyurethane glues are essentially permanent and must be mechanically removed.

Busy day in the shipyard!  I installed all the deadeyes and chainplates and covered the from edge of the channels with some cherry to finish them off.  I also glued the gun supports to the hull and assembled the swivel guns.  They were mounted (temporarily) on the starboard gun mounts.  There are just a few tasks left:  The horizontal portion of the catheads, finishing and rigging the anchors, and making the great cabin lights.  Almost done!
 
The ship will be mounted on the backs of some cherry seahorses fixed to a cherry base.  I still need to rout a profile on the base and glue the seahorses in place.  # or 4 coats of wiping varnish and it'll be done.

All good ideas. I would start with  a medium paint brush and very carefully remove any surface dust I could. The saliva idea is worthwhile. New moms have been using saliva as a primary cleaning agent for their progeny for millennia! . I would also try a dilute solution of Isopropanol. You can buy it at any pharmacy. I would experiment at a discrete can be seen spot on the hull. IPA can affect acrylics but I suspect this model was not painted with acrylics. A weak solution of IPA can remove greasy sol including nicotine. Good luck with he project. It looks like a beautiful model.
Jaxboat

Fascinating! And the amazing thing is there was no "research" as such. Everything was learned through the accumulation of experience over the generations.
Best
Jaxboat