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Bob Cleek

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  1. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from usedtosail in 28 foot American cutter by druxey - FINISHED - 1:48 scale   
    It's a lot like sex: Everyone shares your initial reaction the first time they see it, but most quickly figure out on their own that "Just viewing" can't hold a candle to actually doing it.    
     
    The biggest differences between a kit and a scratch built model are that 1) Scratch built models are unique and 2) people react to them the way you just have. (And, of course, if it matters to one, they're generally worth a lot more money than assembled kits.) Beyond that, the challenges and skills required are really no different than building a high-quality kit.
     
    Experience starts when you begin. Start small and work up to the more complex stuff. Start with a less challenging, but high-quality kit or three. The only difference between assembling a kit and building a model from scratch is starting with plans instead of starting with plans and an expensive box of unsuitable wood, useless string, and poorly cast parts. (Except, of course, for the exceptional modern laser-cut kits offered by some of the advertisers on this forum like Syren Ship Models and Vanguard Models. See: MSW's Ship Model Kit Database for what's available: http://mswshipkits.ampitcher.com/)
     
    Don't let the pros intimidate you.  A lot of the builders posting great stuff on MSW have forty or fifty years of doing it under their belts and it shows. You don't need to play like Arnold Palmer to enjoy golf. Most MSW members posting incredibly good work started back in the pre-internet days when it was really hard to even learn the basics of ship modeling. Now, with a resource like MSW, the learning curve has accelerated immensely and the beginning modeler can learn in a few years what it took the older generation decades to acquire. You can do it, too. 
  2. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from FriedClams in 28 foot American cutter by druxey - FINISHED - 1:48 scale   
    It's a lot like sex: Everyone shares your initial reaction the first time they see it, but most quickly figure out on their own that "Just viewing" can't hold a candle to actually doing it.    
     
    The biggest differences between a kit and a scratch built model are that 1) Scratch built models are unique and 2) people react to them the way you just have. (And, of course, if it matters to one, they're generally worth a lot more money than assembled kits.) Beyond that, the challenges and skills required are really no different than building a high-quality kit.
     
    Experience starts when you begin. Start small and work up to the more complex stuff. Start with a less challenging, but high-quality kit or three. The only difference between assembling a kit and building a model from scratch is starting with plans instead of starting with plans and an expensive box of unsuitable wood, useless string, and poorly cast parts. (Except, of course, for the exceptional modern laser-cut kits offered by some of the advertisers on this forum like Syren Ship Models and Vanguard Models. See: MSW's Ship Model Kit Database for what's available: http://mswshipkits.ampitcher.com/)
     
    Don't let the pros intimidate you.  A lot of the builders posting great stuff on MSW have forty or fifty years of doing it under their belts and it shows. You don't need to play like Arnold Palmer to enjoy golf. Most MSW members posting incredibly good work started back in the pre-internet days when it was really hard to even learn the basics of ship modeling. Now, with a resource like MSW, the learning curve has accelerated immensely and the beginning modeler can learn in a few years what it took the older generation decades to acquire. You can do it, too. 
  3. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from Ryland Craze in 28 foot American cutter by druxey - FINISHED - 1:48 scale   
    It's a lot like sex: Everyone shares your initial reaction the first time they see it, but most quickly figure out on their own that "Just viewing" can't hold a candle to actually doing it.    
     
    The biggest differences between a kit and a scratch built model are that 1) Scratch built models are unique and 2) people react to them the way you just have. (And, of course, if it matters to one, they're generally worth a lot more money than assembled kits.) Beyond that, the challenges and skills required are really no different than building a high-quality kit.
     
    Experience starts when you begin. Start small and work up to the more complex stuff. Start with a less challenging, but high-quality kit or three. The only difference between assembling a kit and building a model from scratch is starting with plans instead of starting with plans and an expensive box of unsuitable wood, useless string, and poorly cast parts. (Except, of course, for the exceptional modern laser-cut kits offered by some of the advertisers on this forum like Syren Ship Models and Vanguard Models. See: MSW's Ship Model Kit Database for what's available: http://mswshipkits.ampitcher.com/)
     
    Don't let the pros intimidate you.  A lot of the builders posting great stuff on MSW have forty or fifty years of doing it under their belts and it shows. You don't need to play like Arnold Palmer to enjoy golf. Most MSW members posting incredibly good work started back in the pre-internet days when it was really hard to even learn the basics of ship modeling. Now, with a resource like MSW, the learning curve has accelerated immensely and the beginning modeler can learn in a few years what it took the older generation decades to acquire. You can do it, too. 
  4. Like
    Bob Cleek reacted to druxey in 28 foot American cutter by druxey - FINISHED - 1:48 scale   
    Good question, Greg. The oars will be deployed in the same way as the Greenwich Hospital barge model.
     

  5. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from EricWilliamMarshall in HMS Victory by dafi - Heller - PLASTIC - To Victory and beyond ...   
    ... which was the most practical posture, given that they often put their chest into it to push the bar. Oddly, though, the  contemporary pictorial record frequently depicts seamen carelessly pushing the bars with their hands. Perhaps this was a casual approach used to take up a slack cable before the real work began. 
     
    The guy on the right in the black cap is definitely a slacker, but then again, there's nothing on the drum!

     
    The men to the left are doing it right. The men to the right aren't. Likely "artistic license" in this engraving.

     
    It seems the Finnish Navy did things differently, but there doesn't appear to be anything on the drum in this apparently posed photo. I mean, really, who mans a capstan in their dress blues?

     
    Doing it right, but again, everybody's in their Class A's and this steam screw vessel appears underway at sea with white-painted anchor chain secured, clean and Bristol fashion, so what are they hauling, anyway?

     
     
    Germans, correctly putting their backs into it like they actually might be doing some real work.

     
     
     
     
     
     
     
  6. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from reklein in Looking for advice on how to cut up a large piece of Alaskan Yellow Cedar   
    Sheesh! 8"X10"X10' is a nice bit of timber, if it's straight grained and clear of knots and pitch pockets, which AYC frequently is. Note that there are various grades of AYC. For modeling, you want "clear, vertical grained, appearance grade." (Which, of course, is the most expensive.) AYC can be knotty, so you should decide whether your timber is suitable for modeling stock before worrying about how you are going to cut it up. Unless you live close to where AYC is harvested (Yes, some of us are that lucky. It's not hard to find in the Northern Pacific Coast,) just shipping it someplace is going to add a lot to the value of it anywhere else. Two four foot pieces are going to cost less than one eight foot piece.
     
    Given your question, I expect you aren't aware that timber that size is probably a lot more valuable than a bunch of two foot long billets. Guys that mill thin sheets of wood from timbers that size to use for laser cutting many parts on a sheet, like kit manufacturers do, suffer the cost of the wasted wood in milling and scrap and have to pass that on to their customers. If you aren't in that league, I think milling large sized quality wood into sheets is wasteful. Keep in mind the scale  you are working in and what the scale-size of the trees would be if they were to the same scale as the model. The end result is that for model building you really don't need wood in larger pieces at all. (Save perhaps masts, as Chuck noted.)
     
    Fact is, somebody would likely pay a lot more for that timber in one piece than you'd ever save cutting it up into scrap wood sizes. If it's clear grade, it's perfect for a keel timber for a small boat, for example. I'd check around and see if you can swap it with a local specialty lumberyard for some "small stuff" at a lower price. You'd probably make more money on the deal than you'd save cutting it up yourself and you wouldn't have to do the heavy duty milling yourself, either. Ripping a timber that size will take a good size bandsaw and some experienced help and a saw up to the task. It's not a one-man job. 
     
    Modelers should keep their eyes out for large construction jobs using AYC. Often, off-cuts from the job site dumpster can be had for free. 
     
    These guys are selling clear AYC 1.5" X 1.5" X  1' S4S "deck pickets" for twenty-five cents a piece. It may cause you to find a higher and better use for that big long beam of yours. https://www.lowpricedcedar.com/product/alaskan-yellow-cedar-clear-smooth-2x2-1/
     
     
     
    Just my opinion. Your mileage may vary, of course.
  7. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from mtaylor in Looking for advice on how to cut up a large piece of Alaskan Yellow Cedar   
    Sheesh! 8"X10"X10' is a nice bit of timber, if it's straight grained and clear of knots and pitch pockets, which AYC frequently is. Note that there are various grades of AYC. For modeling, you want "clear, vertical grained, appearance grade." (Which, of course, is the most expensive.) AYC can be knotty, so you should decide whether your timber is suitable for modeling stock before worrying about how you are going to cut it up. Unless you live close to where AYC is harvested (Yes, some of us are that lucky. It's not hard to find in the Northern Pacific Coast,) just shipping it someplace is going to add a lot to the value of it anywhere else. Two four foot pieces are going to cost less than one eight foot piece.
     
    Given your question, I expect you aren't aware that timber that size is probably a lot more valuable than a bunch of two foot long billets. Guys that mill thin sheets of wood from timbers that size to use for laser cutting many parts on a sheet, like kit manufacturers do, suffer the cost of the wasted wood in milling and scrap and have to pass that on to their customers. If you aren't in that league, I think milling large sized quality wood into sheets is wasteful. Keep in mind the scale  you are working in and what the scale-size of the trees would be if they were to the same scale as the model. The end result is that for model building you really don't need wood in larger pieces at all. (Save perhaps masts, as Chuck noted.)
     
    Fact is, somebody would likely pay a lot more for that timber in one piece than you'd ever save cutting it up into scrap wood sizes. If it's clear grade, it's perfect for a keel timber for a small boat, for example. I'd check around and see if you can swap it with a local specialty lumberyard for some "small stuff" at a lower price. You'd probably make more money on the deal than you'd save cutting it up yourself and you wouldn't have to do the heavy duty milling yourself, either. Ripping a timber that size will take a good size bandsaw and some experienced help and a saw up to the task. It's not a one-man job. 
     
    Modelers should keep their eyes out for large construction jobs using AYC. Often, off-cuts from the job site dumpster can be had for free. 
     
    These guys are selling clear AYC 1.5" X 1.5" X  1' S4S "deck pickets" for twenty-five cents a piece. It may cause you to find a higher and better use for that big long beam of yours. https://www.lowpricedcedar.com/product/alaskan-yellow-cedar-clear-smooth-2x2-1/
     
     
     
    Just my opinion. Your mileage may vary, of course.
  8. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from thibaultron in 28 foot American cutter by druxey - FINISHED - 1:48 scale   
    I envy your having Standard Designs for Boats of the United States Navy. I have a large format copy of Bill Durham's 1963 "Shellback's Library" selected excerpts from it.  Hitchborn's edition is a 2008 reprint of the original 1900 GPO edition. I can't seem to find a copy of Hitchborn for less than around $250, which seems odd for a book published so recently. (Martino Publishing. Out of business? Limited edition?) The original GPO edition, when one comes on the market, runs about $1,000.
     
    Would you consider leaving yours to me when you die?  
  9. Like
    Bob Cleek reacted to druxey in Acrylic Case for small model for sale   
    I hope that your lovely model will be protected in some way, Steve.
  10. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from Archi in How to seal grain? Sand sealer/varnish   
    Seal with shellac, then fill in grain with surfacing putty, sand fair, prime with a base coat and apply finish coats. Surfacing putty thins with acetone. Add a tablespoon of acetone to the can after each use, close the lid and store upside down. The putty will stay creamy for ages that way.
     
    https://www.amazon.com/Interlux-Y257-PT-Surfacing-Putty/dp/B0000AY85D
  11. Laugh
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from mtaylor in 28 foot American cutter by druxey - FINISHED - 1:48 scale   
    I envy your having Standard Designs for Boats of the United States Navy. I have a large format copy of Bill Durham's 1963 "Shellback's Library" selected excerpts from it.  Hitchborn's edition is a 2008 reprint of the original 1900 GPO edition. I can't seem to find a copy of Hitchborn for less than around $250, which seems odd for a book published so recently. (Martino Publishing. Out of business? Limited edition?) The original GPO edition, when one comes on the market, runs about $1,000.
     
    Would you consider leaving yours to me when you die?  
  12. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from Roger Pellett in 28 foot American cutter by druxey - FINISHED - 1:48 scale   
    I envy your having Standard Designs for Boats of the United States Navy. I have a large format copy of Bill Durham's 1963 "Shellback's Library" selected excerpts from it.  Hitchborn's edition is a 2008 reprint of the original 1900 GPO edition. I can't seem to find a copy of Hitchborn for less than around $250, which seems odd for a book published so recently. (Martino Publishing. Out of business? Limited edition?) The original GPO edition, when one comes on the market, runs about $1,000.
     
    Would you consider leaving yours to me when you die?  
  13. Laugh
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from dvm27 in 28 foot American cutter by druxey - FINISHED - 1:48 scale   
    I envy your having Standard Designs for Boats of the United States Navy. I have a large format copy of Bill Durham's 1963 "Shellback's Library" selected excerpts from it.  Hitchborn's edition is a 2008 reprint of the original 1900 GPO edition. I can't seem to find a copy of Hitchborn for less than around $250, which seems odd for a book published so recently. (Martino Publishing. Out of business? Limited edition?) The original GPO edition, when one comes on the market, runs about $1,000.
     
    Would you consider leaving yours to me when you die?  
  14. Thanks!
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from Riotvan88 in How to seal grain? Sand sealer/varnish   
    Seal with shellac, then fill in grain with surfacing putty, sand fair, prime with a base coat and apply finish coats. Surfacing putty thins with acetone. Add a tablespoon of acetone to the can after each use, close the lid and store upside down. The putty will stay creamy for ages that way.
     
    https://www.amazon.com/Interlux-Y257-PT-Surfacing-Putty/dp/B0000AY85D
  15. Like
    Bob Cleek reacted to michael mott in Skipjack by michael mott - 1/8th scale - SMALL - 19 foot open launch   
    So the keel gods spoke to me in a dream (that's my story an' I'm sticking to it) Turns out that they were not happy about using the foreign exotic wood called Castello.... I know it is a beautiful wood to use and work with. However they suggested I use some of the Maple that I cut from the 24 inch log way back in 1976 and that has been thoroughly air dried for the stem and stern

    and the nice piece of rock maple that was in the storage for the long part. So I agreed
     

     
    Michael
     
     
  16. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from mtaylor in How to seal grain? Sand sealer/varnish   
    Seal with shellac, then fill in grain with surfacing putty, sand fair, prime with a base coat and apply finish coats. Surfacing putty thins with acetone. Add a tablespoon of acetone to the can after each use, close the lid and store upside down. The putty will stay creamy for ages that way.
     
    https://www.amazon.com/Interlux-Y257-PT-Surfacing-Putty/dp/B0000AY85D
  17. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from Jaager in How to seal grain? Sand sealer/varnish   
    Seal with shellac, then fill in grain with surfacing putty, sand fair, prime with a base coat and apply finish coats. Surfacing putty thins with acetone. Add a tablespoon of acetone to the can after each use, close the lid and store upside down. The putty will stay creamy for ages that way.
     
    https://www.amazon.com/Interlux-Y257-PT-Surfacing-Putty/dp/B0000AY85D
  18. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from Roger Pellett in How to seal grain? Sand sealer/varnish   
    Seal with shellac, then fill in grain with surfacing putty, sand fair, prime with a base coat and apply finish coats. Surfacing putty thins with acetone. Add a tablespoon of acetone to the can after each use, close the lid and store upside down. The putty will stay creamy for ages that way.
     
    https://www.amazon.com/Interlux-Y257-PT-Surfacing-Putty/dp/B0000AY85D
  19. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from thibaultron in How to seal grain? Sand sealer/varnish   
    Seal with shellac, then fill in grain with surfacing putty, sand fair, prime with a base coat and apply finish coats. Surfacing putty thins with acetone. Add a tablespoon of acetone to the can after each use, close the lid and store upside down. The putty will stay creamy for ages that way.
     
    https://www.amazon.com/Interlux-Y257-PT-Surfacing-Putty/dp/B0000AY85D
  20. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from Nardo26 in HMS Winchelsea - FINISHED - 1764 - by Chuck (1/4" scale)   
    That is a truly masterful carving and hard to believe it's machine-reproducible. Just one thing, though. Sailors are a superstitious lot.  An evolution of the oculi even now still painted on the bows of fishing boats the world over, the figurehead represents the "eyes" of the ship and is always posed as intrepidly looking forward, ever scanning the horizon directly ahead, ensuring the ship follows a true and safe course, as with the original example. That new guy there isn't watching where he's going and he's endangering the safety of that ship!
     
    (I know. I know. People just hate me because of stuff like this.  )
  21. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from FrankWouts in HMS Winchelsea - FINISHED - 1764 - by Chuck (1/4" scale)   
    I strongly suspect that the British Admiralty dockyard models were shellacked, not varnished. Shellac will outlast varnish by orders of magnitude. "Orange" shellac (natural colored,) will darken, and its gloss increase, with each successive coat. It's easily thinned with denatured alcohol. It's also easily removed with denatured alcohol. The darkening and gloss rate of increase will depend on how thick it is. This is referred to as the "cut," expressed in pounds, e.g. "two pound cut," which would be two pounds of shellac flakes to a gallon of alcohol. Most prepared canned shellac ("Bullseye" is a good brand found nearly everywhere) is sold in "two pound cut." Thinning it 50-50 yields "one pound cut," and so on. Multiple thinned coats are the best approach. Applied to thickly will fill in detail, as might paint.  It dries quickly, about as fast as the alcohol evaporates. Shellac on ship models has lasted for somewhere around 5,500 years, so far, if models found in the Egyptian tombs are any indication.
     
    Some top end woodworking catalogs sell shellac in "flake" form, which is the crushed excretions of the female lac bug. You have to add your own alcohol. Mixed shellac supposedly has a "shelf life," and hence the sale of the crushed flakes alone. I've never had any problem with the premixed canned shellac going bad on the shelf over a period of years, though. Other's mileage may vary, but I've never found the higher price, shipping cost, and hassle of ordering flakes by mail and mixing my own worth the trouble and I've used a lot of it over the years. It's a stock item in my paint locker.
     
    Varnish is more difficult to work with, primarily because of extended drying time and the need to resort to chemical strippers, heat guns, or scrapers and sandpaper to remove "goofs." Thinned shellac has the consistency of water and will penetrate bare wood easily. Not so much so varnish. If too much shellac is applied, it won't have brush strokes, runs, and sags ("curtains" in the trade). it tends to soak into the wood and dries quickly. Too much varnish and you end up with brush strokes, runs and sags, much like enamel paint. This is less of a problem with thinned varnish for "model scales," but varnish is finicky. Sometimes the gloss is dulled when it's thinned too much, especially if mineral spirits are mistakenly used instead of pure spirits of gum turpentine, and other times, it can refuse to dry and remains sticky. A capful of Flood's "Penetrol" in a quart of varnish will improve its ability to "lay down" and a teaspoon of Japan drier will improve drying ability. Like oil paint, varnish does require something of a "learning curve" to master the art of conditioning it as required to get a perfect "Steinway piano" finish. (Steinways are actually French polished, I believe... with shellac!) Most quality marine varnishes are adequate, Z-Spar brand "Captain's" varnish is a good one, as is the European and pricier Epiphanes brand (which requires the use of their proprietary thinner.)
  22. Like
    Bob Cleek reacted to wefalck in Minimum plank length   
    I think this is a rather unfair comment !  If there is a straight anwer, you will probably get it. But it is a matter of asking also the 'right' question - a waffly question will result by necessity in a waffly answer. One has to specify the country and the period at least, as most answer will strongly depend on these two variables.
     
    What people today also tend to forget, that the shipbuilders of the day couldn't just walk into a DIY shop and get the material they wanted (and even today you may not find the right stuff for a job), but had to do with what was available. In general, naval yards had (more) control over their supply chain and could impose stricter rules, while in commercial shipping it was more a question of what the customer was willing to pay and what they were able to lay their hands on.
     
    So please be fair to those, who volunteer to make comments with the best of their knowledge on a subject, where a lot of detail knowledge has been forgotten over the centuries.
  23. Like
    Bob Cleek reacted to druxey in Minimum plank length   
    If only a  hull were as easy to plank a s a roof!!!
  24. Like
    Bob Cleek got a reaction from mtaylor in Minimum plank length   
    And two fifteens are better than a twenty and a ten.
  25. Like
    Bob Cleek reacted to mtaylor in Minimum plank length   
    The key, Don, is the word "minimum".   They could use bigger and more than likely did.
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