AON

I have a walk around table with a backless and armless computer swivel chair in the work room and it can sometimes be quite uncomfortable for reaching and sometimes I just have to stand up for comfort and then I'm stooping over. I also use a higher stool to try to find some comfortable position at the low table and high workbench I have in there. I created a sketch during my lunch so you can get a better idea of what I'm thinking of dimensions are Imperial and metric (in inches and [mm] ) 4' x 8' sheet forms the table top table mounted up against the wall table top can raise any distance up to 15" higher so I can stand at it if I wish lift counterweighted and height adjustments lock with simple pin model mounts on offset centre to bring it closer to the front for a shorter reach model will rotate 360° on horizontal axis mounting table can rotate (tilt) towards or away from me up to possibly 45° (although I show 30°) to get easy comfortable access to under the hull or the deck haven't sketched supporting structure, etc as yet. still forming the idea (CORRECTED THE SPELLING ERROR ON THE SKETCH) MODELING DESK SKETCH.pdf

Popcorn? Power outlets! Hadn't thought of that. Thanks Working up a preliminary sketch... might post something in a few days for comments.

I have a large work room with most of the necessary wood working tools that generate tons of wood chips and sawdust. I also have a nice long space outside the work room where I'd like to build a modelling (or model building) table. An area where the wood chips and sawdust rarely get near. I just have to figure out what it should be. Then I had the grand idea to solicit ideas from the forum... who better to ask than those who have been building models. So my question is, what would you wish for in a modelling table? Remember, all wood storage, cutting and shaping is done elsewhere. The sky is the limit... think outside the box! My short list 1. comfortable height (possibly adjustable) to allow standing or sitting at. 2. model holding portion of table top can rotate and lock in any position 3. table top is large enough to accommodate any size model 4. good lighting 5. trays to put tools / parts down into to keep the table top clear 6. place to pin up reference drawings / sketches / photos ... possibly magnets (not pins) 7. possible to "close it all up" when I'm done for the day to keep the dust out/ off the model 8. possibly the table top could tilt towards me 15° to 30° Your turn... and if it is something you've already got that is the best idea since sliced bread i'd love to read or better yet see it (post a picture).. ... and THANK YOU! I rarely get an opportunity to do something right the first time. This might just be one of them. Alan

It has been a few weeks since my last post. I had suffered back problems and couldn't get anything done. A lot has happened since. Not sure if I mentioned my Bellerophon and Elephant Build Contracts and Elephant framing drawing came in from NMM. I also received the copy of the Ship Modeller's Shop Notes Book 2 from NRG... and I was assigned a mentor from the NRG program!. Now that my back is back to (ab)normal and I can sit for prolonged periods I've finally got the fairing completed. It was a long, nit picky process. The hull at the bow kept buckling on me because of the sharp change in form at the timberline. I had to insert a third intermediate 3D guide curve below the upper most one at the topside. This took care of the problem. Below are the results. Next I want to get 3 or 4 of the frames done up in 3D at midships just to see how to do it. Then I will draw and model the keel stem and stern post assemblies. I will have another project to distract me though, designing and building a modeling work station just outside my work (play) room down in the basement. I may be posting elsewhere on the form to solicit ideas and comments on my plans for this. Alan

Thanks to Tony I was able to complete a surface loft of the hull yesterday. I am continuing my fairing clean up of the model.... tedious work. I am getting anxious to receive the build contracts because my station locations are admittedly wrong and the locations provides in the scantling "tables" do not add up for me as it refers to 176 ft long 74 gun man of war and the Bellerophon was 168 feet long. The tables also lists stations I do not have. Originally I just measured the image and then picked what I thought was logical spacings based on what I measured. Rookie error. All stations should be 5'-6" spacing per the "tables" with about 6 feet at the bow and 4' at the stern. Both the framing and line drawings clearly attest to the 6' and 4' spacings. The 5'-6" seem to be different. This has been baffling me for quite some time and I am hoping the contract clears it up. (The PDF sheet ALLENYED provided earlier suggests different dimensions which tends to make sense of all this)

Loved watching (and studying) the end of your build I can appreciate the need for a break and moving onto something different .... and can also imagine you coming back to it down the road (only because you've left the door cracked open!) I will be revisiting your build and would love any more pics you think worthy of posting Have a few more of the figure head? Enjoy your next build ... possibly an inflatable raft? (bet that would be easier ) Time for grog

DOH! something new to play with

Tony, Thank you for the suggestions. I seem to have only the one "loft" button ... which means I do not understand the "how to" of lofting a surface. Giving up is not in my DNA so with a bit of time and the internet I will figure this out. I wish I had someone at the office that did this so I could just have them show me ... but alas this is not something we do. Hexnut, sorry I didn't "get it" earlier.

Completed two of four sections ... I think After I get the last two sections cleaned up I'll join them all and see if it's true! PS - In the middle is a reference grid I created to help me eyeball how far to move things PPS - Hexnut.... this was faster and cleaner My computer thanks you

Thank you Druxey. I did a couple other diagonal sections to get a different perspective ... and of course you are correct! I've learnt so much already and haven't built anything yet! Joined the NRG and just rec'd my Model Ship Builder's Book 1 .... wasn't able to put it down last night. Still waiting to receive my copies of the two Build Contracts (HMS Bellerophon and Elephant) from NMM. Tried nudging station lines in my model and the existing Loft Feature is making things difficult. I will have to work from a copy of the file, delete the loft feature, make mods suggested earlier by hexnut, adjust one station line and loft that small section alone to see results, then repeat as necessary. Once that station is faired I will move on to the next station of concern. Just realize that not only may the station identified be the problem for the section, but the adjacent stations may be part of the problem also. It is difficult to make progress but if I don't get this part right anything after will compound it.

To help identify areas that likely need adjustments I created sections from the top of the keel upwards at 1 foot intervals and then marked the stations. The PDF below is a select few of them. I've made screen shots of my station sketches with dimensions visible so I do not loose the original dimensions as I nudge things back and forth and then view the results. I am also presently thinking ahead to how to build the station frames. I am leaning towards making each frame as one piece and etching the chocks and scarf joints into them rather than building each piece individually. This will make them stronger and piece alignment will not be compromised. I am also considering hollowing (shelling) the 3D model to the moulded depth (thickness) of the frames and then putting the 1" gaps (slices) between teach frame and cutting out the futtock steps to create the templates. This would have the bevel in the 3D model/templates and reveal the maximum/minimum outside/inside sizes to which I can mark off and pre-shape to before the assembly. My thoughts at the moment, possibly the description isn't clear but as I develop the plan I will reveal it ... if it continues to make sense to follow this thought. Fairing the Hull - ship sections.pdf

Good evening Druxey! I inserted a geometrical reference plane at 45° from Breadth Line (Plane) 3 and sectioned through the hull along this plane to simulate a test diagonal. I also turned on the station planes to identify locations of any deformations. There is one at station 28 near the stern that was seen in the other views from this mornings post. I can change the angle or elevation to whatever I want to create other diagonal sections. I believe this is what you were suggesting. Does give a slightly different perspective. Alan

Good evening Bob (hexnut) Just visited your build and have to say that before I did I realized you had much greater 3D CAD talent than I, seeing your work just added proof. I understand your point 1, don't know what Hahn method means in 2 but do understand the rest, do not understand what lofting surfs are (will have to exercise my Google fingers on this). Thank you for the tips. I will try these out through the week JFTHOI. Alan PS: Google revealed your lofting surfs was an abbreviation for "lofting surfaces", and also what the Hahn method is....DOH !

Test diagonals. .... I'll give it a go tonight if I find a moment. The software is fine, it is the memory that is the problem (I know the feeling intimately) Like me the computer is getting on in years ... possibly 84 years old in dog years (the computer, not me ...yet)

CREATING BREADTH LINES TO FAIR THE MODEL I didn’t actually create lines. I created planes through the lofted model by offsetting the Breadth Plane (lowest plane) and then while looking from above, sectioned through each plane to see the hull outline. Although I only created four at 5 foot intervals I can easily create as many as I feel I need. Having done all the above I could see where things did not flow smoothly. These areas shouldn’t exist and will need to be cleaned up. I will now take my time to make adjustments and then see how she fairs! To recap, I think it is important when making a 3D model of the hull to inspect Breadth and Buttock lines to help identify areas of concern. I should create a few breadth sections in the upper half of the hull to see what is happening in that area. As always, I hope those in the know will point out my errors and keep me from straying too far.

USING THE SOLIDWORKS LOFT FEATURE TO CREATE THE SOLID HULL This is my second (or really fourth) go at this. I admit that even after having received good advice from forum members I still had to watch three videos to “get it”. · Created four guide lines using 3D sketch · Locked the lines to points on each section using “coincident” or “intersect” type mates · Opened the Loft Feature and picked four station outlines and all four guide lines · When these resolved I rebuilt and saved the file, luckily as my computer crashed twice near the end. Without the saving ritual I would have lost everything. · Note that the starboard side does not have guide lines and so has some extra waviness to the hull. I had manually made some adjustments for show afterwards but mainly I am just looking at the port side (with the guide lines). Although I can see the divit in the hull at the stern the bow seems good ... not so in the earlier Buttock line review.

CREATING BUTTOCK LINES TO FAIR THE DRAWING I created BUTTOCK LINES on vertical planes through the hull from stem to stern because I wanted to see how she faired as the original draughtsman might have done. BUTTOCK PLANES • I created a second plane by offsetting the shear plane 0.56 feet which happens to coincide with most station line termination points in the rabbet • I then created additional planes by offsetting them at 10 feet each • I then sketched polylines on each individual plane (buttock lines of my own making) and locked them (pierce mate) at each point they intersect with a station o Peirce mate by picking the station line, hold down the “Ctl” key and pick the polyline point (*) I want to mate to it, then pick “pierce” mate. The point then locks to the line where they intersect on the plane. o While doing this I found two errors in my sketches and as importantly can easily see irregularities in my lines!

The following three groups of images explains the process I am using to fair my lines. You might ask why am I creating a new lofted hull? Although my first attempt was very clean (see image below with all connectors showing (those are the light blue points the computer tacks to the model to connect everything) I could not get my first or last station in the model. I needed to add guide lines and didn’t know how. Three plus years ago I couldn’t model a simple pencil in 3D so I’ve come a long way. The guide lines help the computer connect the various sketches (frames) made on all the different levels. In the end the stern sketch would not connect because the lowest guide line did not extend to it. While learning how to do this I discovered my first lofted hull was easier than when I added the guide lines. Without additional mirrored guidelines on the other half the computer seemed to be confused and inserted connectors in the oddest places creating artificial wedges and twists in my model. When I right click the mouse and pick show all connectors I can see connectors out of alignment and need to manually move them. My final attempt (yes I had to do it more than once) had only one connector out of alignment…. As you will see. Even though I have the lofted hull I think it is important to visually inspect Breadth and Buttock lines as they are more revealing than the lofted hull. I could turn on what is called a Zebra line view to reveal pattern issues on the 3D image but it seems too much information confuses this old man

We use Draftsight at the office strictly for 2D drawing or opening customers AutoCad files (using Solidworks for 3D models and 2D prints) and so I loaded it at home to do some office work here. It is cheap (free) and you get what you pay for. Many times I have to close and re-open the darned program because it forgets what it is... or simply refuses to work for free?

Thank you Druxey Of course you are correct, the "plans" drawing is as built. Anxiously awaiting the copies of the contracts Alan

Received my framing drawing image from NMM Funny how a framing drawing said to be specifically for HMS Elephant disagrees with the plans made specifically for HMS Elephant. As I mentioned earlier HMS Goliath shows it completely removed. I prefer the look of the rail rising over the gun port for a consistent port open area. One nice thing, as opposed to some of the 74 gun framing plan thumbnails on NMM this one I rec'd that had no thumbnail on the website is very simply and clean.... few bent frames. Alan

Thanks Hexnut (and I am left wondering ... why hexnut?) I can see myself sitting through a few Solidworks online tutorials before I will be able to get this to work. Alan

Hexnut Just reread your suggestions and compared to what Don did (see posting in Scantlings forum) I will have to give this a try and see if it resolves my SW conflicts for those two stations Alan

Hexnut, The purpose of lofting at this early time was to see if the hull faired well with the dimensions I took off an electronic image ... paper stretch and all. A friend had shown me exactly how much stretch could be experienced in 200+ old drawings! My intention is to create my templates for my build in CAD from the 3D model. This way everything should fit like a glove (if my wood working skills are up to the task). I do not intend to 100% create a completed 3D ship model... just as much as I need ... and I suspect I will continue draughting through the physical build as I discover I need more. After having been recently schooled in scantlings I have considerable work ahead of me to check my measurements to that of Steels and then possibly to the build contract(s). I just received my quote (50 pounds sterling) and thumb nail image for a framing drawing of HMS Elephant from NMM and having validated it as what I want I will be ordering it tomorrow after they send me the form. From this I will be better able to complete framing modelling, knowing which frames extend to where and how. I also found out today that electronic images of the ship build contracts (HMS Bellerophon and Elephant) are outrageously expensive and so will be ordering the photocopies at 21.28 pounds sterling each. Hope you and others stick around as I am sure I will need some direction as I proceed. Alan

Minor progress... I moved all my stations and Keel down so relevant dimensions are off the base line of the Sheer Plan not the underside of the keel. This makes all scantlings (dimensions) off Steels tables relate directly to my dimensions. I then attempted to loft the features and had three problems 1) my computer kept crashing 2) the lines off the stern plan (plane) caused major defects due to its extreme references not relating directly to the next fuller section. 3) similar issue with the bow end Station Y except it caused a major inwards fold to appear between Stations 10 and 12 This was fixed by doing small groups of 4 stations at a time, rebuilding and saving the file before going to the next group. I also did not include the Stern Plan nor Station Y I also did my loft feature as a solid as opposed to a thin skin as was done by a member in an earlier posting under Scantlings. There are a few ripples revealing themselves on my hull that will need some attention (particularly at station 28). I will also be comparing the tables from Steels to my dimensions and making some adjustments. A lot of work ahead ... and still waiting on some word from NMM for a frame drawing of HMS Elephant and build contracts for it and the Bellerophon. Until next time. Alan