Canute Posted December 14, 2021 Share #61 Posted December 14, 2021 It will be a deep and convoluted rabbit hole. Been at it a long while and still feel like a noob in many areas. And it is fun. 👍 thibaultron, lmagna, mtaylor and 3 others 6 Quote Ken Started: MS Bounty Longboat, On Hold: Heinkel USS Choctaw paper Down the road: Shipyard HMC Alert 1/96 paper, Mamoli Constitution Cross, MS USN Picket Boat #1 Scratchbuild: Echo Cross Section Member Nautical Research Guild Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egilman Posted December 14, 2021 Share #62 Posted December 14, 2021 5 hours ago, Canute said: Be aware of the radius of the rails. Get the biggest you can handle in you space. These bigger, articulated engines can balk at 18" radius curves. 18" is the usual size included with a basic track setup. Agree, that engine would take a bit of work to horse around an 18" curve, 21" would be better or layout a 24" in flex track... it should cruise around a 24".... popeye the sailor, thibaultron, Old Collingwood and 5 others 8 Quote Current Build: F-86F-30 Sabre by Egilman - Kinetic - 1/32nd scale In the Garage: East Bound & Down, Building a Smokey & the Bandit Kenworth Rig in 1/25th scale Completed: M8A1 HST 1930 Packard Boattail Speedster M1A1 75mm Pack Howitzer F-4J Phantom II Bell H-13's P-51B/C Temporary Suspension: USS Gwin DD-433 F-104C Starfighter "Blue Jay Four" 1/32nd Scale Terminated Build: F-104C Starfighter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote: "Relish Today, Ketchup Tomorrow" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
popeye the sailor Posted December 31, 2021 Author Share #63 Posted December 31, 2021 that's a nice piece you have there Roger I believe the name Rivarossi was tossed around when I did research on the origin of the Army piece I got from my older son. what I did was buy some EZ track form the local hobby store {Hobby Town}, when I decided to try to do the diorama for the snow plow. if you want to see if the loco runs, why not purchase a train set........it will come with everything you'll need to start off. you can always expand from there Egilman, mtaylor, Old Collingwood and 3 others 6 Quote I yam wot I yam! finished builds: Billings Nordkap 476 / Billings Cux 87 / Billings Mary Ann / Billings AmericA - reissue Billings Regina - bashed into the Susan A / Andrea Gail 1:20 - semi scratch w/ Billing instructions M&M Fun Ship - semi scratch build / Gundalow - scratch build / Jeanne D'Arc - Heller Phylly C & Denny-Zen - the Lobsie twins - bashed & semi scratch dual build Billing T78 Norden in dry dock: Billing's Gothenborg 1:100 / Billing's Boulogne Etaples 1:20 Billing's Half Moon 1:40 - some scratch required Revell U.S.S. United States 1:96 - plastic/ wood modified / Academy Titanic 1:400 Trawler Syborn - semi scratch / Holiday Harbor dual build - semi scratch Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Pellett Posted January 2, 2022 Share #64 Posted January 2, 2022 This project is also related to my ship modeling interest- Great Lakes Shipping. The Duluth, Mesabe, & Iron Range Railroad used these massive engines to pull trains of 100-200 24 ft iron ore cars locally called Jennys from the mines to the ore docks in Duluth and Two Harbors, MN. Each car carried 50-70 tons of ore. So it took 2 to 3 trains to load a 600ft ore carrier. The huge gravity ore docks in the harbor are still active, although the large 1000ft ore carriers can carry up to 6 trainloads of refined taconite pellets. The Railroad and the former US Steel Steamship Fleet is now a part of the Canadian National Railroad. I have 10 iron ore cars painted in DM &IR colors and logos. I have a caboose that needs to be repainted and logos added. I have found decals for the caboose, but not for the engine tender. The engine, ore cars and caboose will be about 5 feet long. I intend to run a shelf with track about 9 ft long along a wall of my man cave. The “layout” for the time being will only allow movement of about one train length. Roger king derelict, mtaylor, popeye the sailor and 5 others 8 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egilman Posted January 3, 2022 Share #65 Posted January 3, 2022 (edited) A note of history about the UP "Big Boys", a German spy in 1941 managed to get a dozen photos back to Germany.. They were shown to Adolf as an example of what the industrial capacity of the USA was, he reportedly said that NO ONE could build a locomotive that large, that it was a lie, and the spy should be recalled as soon as possible to be punished for creating such a fabrication... {chuckle} They are a sight to behold.... The reason they were built was that the 4-8-4 moguls needed three engines coupled to haul one train, using five times the fuel. they made great economic sense for the time... they could move twice the tonnage using half the fuel... An amazing example of steam engineering... Edited January 3, 2022 by Egilman Canute, thibaultron, lmagna and 4 others 7 Quote Current Build: F-86F-30 Sabre by Egilman - Kinetic - 1/32nd scale In the Garage: East Bound & Down, Building a Smokey & the Bandit Kenworth Rig in 1/25th scale Completed: M8A1 HST 1930 Packard Boattail Speedster M1A1 75mm Pack Howitzer F-4J Phantom II Bell H-13's P-51B/C Temporary Suspension: USS Gwin DD-433 F-104C Starfighter "Blue Jay Four" 1/32nd Scale Terminated Build: F-104C Starfighter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote: "Relish Today, Ketchup Tomorrow" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack12477 Posted January 3, 2022 Share #66 Posted January 3, 2022 (edited) The other two big ones were the SP 2-8-8-2 Chesapeake and the UP 4-6-6-4 Challenger. I think Steamtown USA in Scranton PA still has a "Big Boy" on display at their museum. Edited January 3, 2022 by Jack12477 popeye the sailor, mtaylor, Egilman and 4 others 7 Quote Jack "No one is as smart as all of us" - Is ón cheann a thagann an cheird The craft comes from the head --------------------------------------------- Current build: US Constellation Non-ship builds: USCG UH-65A Dolphin M16 Multi-gun motor carriage diorama M4A3 Sherman Tanks dioramas 1936-1939 Mercedes Benz 540K 1934 Rolls-Royce Phantom II JSDF Light Armor Vehicle Figures: The Last Bridge: Raider Reaper Edge of Universe: Ianis The Last Bridge: Vadim with cart Completed build log(s): 18th Century Longboat , Marie Jeanne, Willie L Bennett 1888 50 ft Gaff-rigged Ice Yacht Scratch Build The Sullivans (DD 537) Liberty Ship SS John W Brown USS England (DE 635), Artesania Latina Titanic Lifeboat Gallery: Swift , Armed Virginia Sloop, Santisima Trinidad Captain's Launch , 18th Century Longboat , Marie Jeanne Other: Rhinebeck Aerodrome Tour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
mtaylor Posted January 3, 2022 Share #67 Posted January 3, 2022 I remember seeing one the "big boys" in the museum of transport in St. Louis. Not sure if it's still there or if the museum is even still there. Been probably 30 years since I was there. lmagna, popeye the sailor, Canute and 2 others 5 Quote Mark "The shipwright is slow, but the wood is patient." - me Current Build: Past Builds: La Belle Poule 1765 - French Frigate from ANCRE plans - ON HOLD Triton Cross-Section NRG Hallf Hull Planking Kit HMS Sphinx 1775 - Vanguard Models - 1:64 Non-Ship Model: On hold, maybe forever: CH-53 Sikorsky - 1:48 - Revell - Completed Licorne - 1755 from Hahn Plans (Scratch) Version 2.0 (Abandoned) Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jack12477 Posted January 3, 2022 Share #68 Posted January 3, 2022 That's about how long since I last visited Steamtown in PA. First time I saw the Big Boy Steamtown was in Bellows Falls VT, they ran out of space their and almost moved here until the idiot NIMBYs drove them off and they went to Scraton instead, Had to tow the Big Boy to Scranton. It's now part of the National Park Service. popeye the sailor, Canute, Old Collingwood and 3 others 6 Quote Jack "No one is as smart as all of us" - Is ón cheann a thagann an cheird The craft comes from the head --------------------------------------------- Current build: US Constellation Non-ship builds: USCG UH-65A Dolphin M16 Multi-gun motor carriage diorama M4A3 Sherman Tanks dioramas 1936-1939 Mercedes Benz 540K 1934 Rolls-Royce Phantom II JSDF Light Armor Vehicle Figures: The Last Bridge: Raider Reaper Edge of Universe: Ianis The Last Bridge: Vadim with cart Completed build log(s): 18th Century Longboat , Marie Jeanne, Willie L Bennett 1888 50 ft Gaff-rigged Ice Yacht Scratch Build The Sullivans (DD 537) Liberty Ship SS John W Brown USS England (DE 635), Artesania Latina Titanic Lifeboat Gallery: Swift , Armed Virginia Sloop, Santisima Trinidad Captain's Launch , 18th Century Longboat , Marie Jeanne Other: Rhinebeck Aerodrome Tour Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
realworkingsailor Posted January 3, 2022 Share #69 Posted January 3, 2022 (edited) 7 hours ago, Roger Pellett said: This project is also related to my ship modeling interest- Great Lakes Shipping. The Duluth, Mesabe, & Iron Range Railroad used these massive engines to pull trains of 100-200 24 ft iron ore cars locally called Jennys from the mines to the ore docks in Duluth and Two Harbors, MN. Each car carried 50-70 tons of ore. So it took 2 to 3 trains to load a 600ft ore carrier. The huge gravity ore docks in the harbor are still active, although the large 1000ft ore carriers can carry up to 6 trainloads of refined taconite pellets. The Railroad and the former US Steel Steamship Fleet is now a part of the Canadian National Railroad. I have 10 iron ore cars painted in DM &IR colors and logos. I have a caboose that needs to be repainted and logos added. I have found decals for the caboose, but not for the engine tender. The engine, ore cars and caboose will be about 5 feet long. I intend to run a shelf with track about 9 ft long along a wall of my man cave. The “layout” for the time being will only allow movement of about one train length. Roger Something to ponder: https://www.walthers.com/ore-dock-kit-48-1-2-x-5-quot-121-2-x-12-5cm Andy Edited January 3, 2022 by realworkingsailor Jack12477, Egilman, mtaylor and 7 others 10 Quote Quando Omni Flunkus, Moritati Current Build: USF Confederacy Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egilman Posted January 3, 2022 Share #70 Posted January 3, 2022 They were impressive... The consist for the test run comprises 4014 and it's tender, a fuel tank of #5 diesel, (4014 was converted to run on oil) two tool cars and a modern Diesel engine (UP 8937) with it's dynamic brakes set to simulate a load... Here's another longer video of her leaving on her first run in 60+ years.... Jack12477, thibaultron, lmagna and 4 others 7 Quote Current Build: F-86F-30 Sabre by Egilman - Kinetic - 1/32nd scale In the Garage: East Bound & Down, Building a Smokey & the Bandit Kenworth Rig in 1/25th scale Completed: M8A1 HST 1930 Packard Boattail Speedster M1A1 75mm Pack Howitzer F-4J Phantom II Bell H-13's P-51B/C Temporary Suspension: USS Gwin DD-433 F-104C Starfighter "Blue Jay Four" 1/32nd Scale Terminated Build: F-104C Starfighter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote: "Relish Today, Ketchup Tomorrow" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Pellett Posted January 3, 2022 Share #71 Posted January 3, 2022 The Big Boy visited us here in Duluth. It must have been preCovid; 2019. Unfortunately I missed her. The DM&IR operated two types of Mallet locomotives. About 1910 they began to operate 2-8-8-2 engines. In the 1930’s they increased the power of these engines by conversation from compound to simple expansion. In 1941 they began to take delivery of more powerful 2-8-8-4 “Yellowstone” Mallets that they ran into the 1960’s. Duluth is located along an ancient volcanic ridge sloping down to Lake Superior. Trains negotiate a 3% grade down to the ore docks. Difference in elevation is about 600ft. Locomotive power was supposedly based on the number of empty ore cars that could be pulled back up the grade. The big Yellowstone engines could pull 55 empty cars. Once they gained experience with the engines they decided to use them for main line pulling power as well. There is apparently some debate regarding the “largest” steam locomotive; Big Boy vs Yellowstone. Three Yellowstone engines still exist, all in the Duluth Area. Two are outdoors at Two Harbors and Proctor, MN. The third is in the Lake Superior Railroad Museum in the old Duluth Depot. This engine is displayed 6 inches or so above the floor with the wheels revolving slowly and all linkages moving; an impressive sight. The museum is well worth anyone’s visit with a great collection of equipment well conserved by a great team of ex DM&IR volunteers. Avoid an August visit when Thomas the Tank Engine is in Town! Andy’s suggestion offers a more interesting but still compact layout. My idea is still evolving, but back to my Benjamin Noble Model. Roger mtaylor, thibaultron, Old Collingwood and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Egilman Posted January 3, 2022 Share #72 Posted January 3, 2022 1 hour ago, Roger Pellett said: The Big Boy visited us here in Duluth. It must have been preCovid; 2019. Unfortunately I missed her. The DM&IR operated two types of Mallet locomotives. About 1910 they began to operate 2-8-8-2 engines. In the 1930’s they increased the power of these engines by conversation from compound to simple expansion. In 1941 they began to take delivery of more powerful 2-8-8-4 “Yellowstone” Mallets that they ran into the 1960’s. Duluth is located along an ancient volcanic ridge sloping down to Lake Superior. Trains negotiate a 3% grade down to the ore docks. Difference in elevation is about 600ft. Locomotive power was supposedly based on the number of empty ore cars that could be pulled back up the grade. The big Yellowstone engines could pull 55 empty cars. Once they gained experience with the engines they decided to use them for main line pulling power as well. There is apparently some debate regarding the “largest” steam locomotive; Big Boy vs Yellowstone. Three Yellowstone engines still exist, all in the Duluth Area. Two are outdoors at Two Harbors and Proctor, MN. The third is in the Lake Superior Railroad Museum in the old Duluth Depot. This engine is displayed 6 inches or so above the floor with the wheels revolving slowly and all linkages moving; an impressive sight. The museum is well worth anyone’s visit with a great collection of equipment well conserved by a great team of ex DM&IR volunteers. Avoid an August visit when Thomas the Tank Engine is in Town! Andy’s suggestion offers a more interesting but still compact layout. My idea is still evolving, but back to my Benjamin Noble Model. Roger They are both in the same class of engines and biggest is a matter of opinion I guess... Also what type is a matter of some discussion as well, Mallet (french pronounced Malley) or Not? Mallet engines were both articulated and compound steam... articulated means the two traction engines were jointed in the middle to allow them to negotiate the tighter mountain turns easier.. Compound mean that they were two stage steam engines, the rear engine cylinders operated on high pressure steam and the forward engine cylinders operated on the lower pressure steam discharge from the rear cylinders (in a ship this type of engine would be known as a double expansion engine) The Big Boys and Yellowstones (the first yellowstone was built as a Mallet, double expansion engine, the rest were built as simple single expansion engines cause they produced more tractive power) There is some discussion out there in the RR world if they should be categorized as Mallets since they use simple single expansion engines.... Technically they are not Mallets cause of the engines used, to those that believe they are not, they are called "Articulated Engines" The argument runs to being a true Mallet they have to have both characteristics of the Mallet Design... But what it is an example of, ANY innovation in traction steam engines was rapidly taken and applied and tested by most of the railroads, reverse engineering was common, and the examples of engineering design are too numerous to count with many many designs considered failures... The Yellowstones (70 built for four different railroads) and Big Boys (30 built primarily for the UP) were specialized engines considered successful for the purpose they were built, and very adaptable to a number of other uses during their life.... Classic pieces of the American engineering record.... I doubt we will ever see a Yellowstone running again, but the restored UP Big Boy definitely serves to remind us of what once was.... mtaylor, thibaultron, Old Collingwood and 3 others 6 Quote Current Build: F-86F-30 Sabre by Egilman - Kinetic - 1/32nd scale In the Garage: East Bound & Down, Building a Smokey & the Bandit Kenworth Rig in 1/25th scale Completed: M8A1 HST 1930 Packard Boattail Speedster M1A1 75mm Pack Howitzer F-4J Phantom II Bell H-13's P-51B/C Temporary Suspension: USS Gwin DD-433 F-104C Starfighter "Blue Jay Four" 1/32nd Scale Terminated Build: F-104C Starfighter ---------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------- Quote: "Relish Today, Ketchup Tomorrow" Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
Roger Pellett Posted January 4, 2022 Share #73 Posted January 4, 2022 According to Wikipedia, the three Yellowstone’s that I mentioned are the last three in existence anywhere. The Lake Superior Railroad Museum has restored at least two steam locomotives in their collection to operating status. This included re tubing boilers. They have a shop on site and at Cloquet, MN 15 miles away. mtaylor, Old Collingwood, thibaultron and 3 others 6 Quote Link to comment Share on other sites More sharing options...
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