thibaultron

I have plans, but they are buried at the back of my shop, I'm doing renovations. Pyro made a model called the Bomb Ketch, and here are some pictures. The pyro model is what got me interested in the Marine Models kit.

Does anyone know if the old Marine Models kit for the bomb ketch is based on an actual ship? I think it was labeled as HMS Lion.

I have several kits, all from respected US companies, the dowels in all of them are mostly useless.

t the following site they have a converson chart for Floquil to other manfg. paints. This site says Vallejo Ivory matches the Floquil Antique White. https://www.microscale.com/Floquil%20Color%20Chart.pdf

I looked up on the Web, and got the following information for the color values for Floquils Antique White: Name # Antique White Product # F110085 HTML # F1E8D6 CMYK # 5, 7, 15, 0 RGB # 241, 232, 214 This may be useful to someone. A paint store may be able to get you a swatch to use as a comparison for mixing your own.

What did you have to trim?

The post #14 in the thread "Furling a boom-footed forestaysail" on this forum has interesting information on how a main sail would be attached to the mast hoops, on a boat with a steeply raked mast, which the skipjacks have. The above thread has much more information on this. They have a large rake on their masts, and the foot is basically immovably attached to the boom. The sail would jam, if directly the leading edge was laced to the hoops. So they have a rope running between the lower hoops and the sail hanks. This rope was loosened when the sail is lowered, allowing the leading edge to slide back. This is a drawing of the sails of the skipjack Kathryn. Notice details A and B. And here is a picture from the top of the box of Pyro's skipjack model showing the sail being lowered. When I started on my model, I thought that they had not cast the sail correctly. I'm used to modern sailboats.

Part 22 I guess I owe Pyro an apology. At the beginning of this build, I commented that the casting they made for the furled, or as it turns out being furled, main sail was incorrect. I think I used a stronger comment. Because I'm used to modern sailboats, I said that they had cast the angle of the leading edge, in the wrong direction, as it angled away from the mast. They had it right! After reading the thread "Furling a boom-footed forestaysail" on this forum, post #14 described how the sail is attached to the hoops. The foot of the mainsail is laced to the boom in such a fashion that it cannot side forward as the sail is lowered. With the steep rake of the mast, the leading edge would jam as the sail was lowered. I have not worked up the geometry for this, I'll take their word for it. To solve this problem, the lower part of the sail is not directly laced to the mast hoops. Instead there is a rope that runs between the sail hanks and the hoops. I'm not explaining this well but the drawing that will follow should clear it up. As the sail is lowered this rope is loosened and the leading edge can pull away from the hoops, letting it slide back. Detail A shows how the lower part of the sail is attached to the hoops by a rope running between them and the hoops. Detail B shows the upper hoops laced directly to the sail. So Pyro’s casting with the lower part of the sail pulled away from the mast, as it is being lowered, is correct. The jib has only a partial boom, so this is not a problem. It is hanked directly to the stay. Learn something new every day.

I can't help you with AutoCAD, but I did do a step by step for CADing a simple boat for the builder in the below build: America Schooner POF by Walter BilesThe procces used may help you.

I used a type similar to the one in your link, almost constantly. It is one of the older round florescent bulb types. The only problems I have with it are that it tends to sway back and forth when first positioned, or when I hit it with my hand or a tool. This is a frequent occurance, and a pain. On the other hand my over the eyes types have a much closer focal distance, so that I have to either be holding the parts close to my eyes, or be bent over it. The desk mounted lighted one allows me to do most of the modeling in a comfortable position. My eyes require magnification for any small work, and the shakiness of my hands makes holding parts some times challenging.

Frank; The width and depth of the base would be helpful too. As you know, I'm going to building ones for my Carrie Price, and I need to build two other sets in 1/32, and 1/28.

Thank you for the additional info on the placement of the winders in the sunk well boats. I'll place mine there when I get to that kit.

I saw that, but figured that the men were probably 2" to 4" shorter back then.

I think the winders on these sunk wells were a little shorter, see the Fisheries drawing I posted earlier. The crank handle would be much closer to the deck than the one I drew and you provided the pictures for. If you look the dredge itself is narrower. I have the Midwest skipjack kit. In reading Chappelle's Small Boat book, I found drawings of the skipjack "Messenger" that almost exactly match the Midwest kit. So close that it is a matter of less than inches. I think Midwest based their kit on these plans. This skipjack was one of the type used for "Oyster Pirating", dredging the oyster tonging beds at night, illegally. This boat has the sunken well, and a narrow roller for the dredge, like in the drawing. Below is the drawing with the two plans overlaid. The black is the Messenger, the red the Midwest skipjack.

Kevin from Hampton Roads just posted some pictures of the hand dredge at the Chesapeake Bay Maritime Museum for me on his built "Skipjack Albatross". Has some nice pictures of the skipjack that is there too. His last model was amasingly well done. Wish I could build that well.

Thank you for the pictures!! Now I can correct my drawings! I have been trying for a long time to find more information on them. Wonderful pictures of the skipjack. I'd probably would have spent the whole time listening to the captain too. Do you remember the approximate height of the winch?

Here is a drawing of the hand winder I came up with: My drawing Photo from the Chesapeake Maritime Museum site Drawing from an 1880s government book on fisheries I have more references in the post on my build, also some history that might interest you.

If you are going to build the As Built version. Look at my build. I have a section on the hand dredges at this time. The Chesapeake Maritime Museum, may also have one on display. They at least have a photo of one that I used as a basis for mine. If you go there, please take a few pictures of it for me.

Will be following your build.

Part 21 Using a chisel blade and a regular blade I spent some time hollowing out this area. For the engine block I removed the center and the two next slats. For the shaft I just removed the center one. For the flywheel, I cut out an additional slat on each side. The chisel blade was just the right size to remove the center three slats for the engine. I cut vertical cut stops where the holes would end, and worked back and forth from the ends and center, to remove the slats. Unfortunately while doing this, I damaged one of the slats beside the engine area. I will see how it looks with a little paint, later. Hopefully it will not be too noticeable. This would be Really hard to replace. For the shaft, the chisel was far too wide, so I had to attack it from the sides. Not fun. I was going to recess the flywheel hole more so I could retain more of it. Luckily while I was doing this I flipped the hull over. That is when I saw that I was just about to cut all the way thru. I had not noticed the plastic getting translucent as I was cutting from the top! I managed to get the flywheel hole only about .010 deeper than the engine area. You can see the flywheel area from the bottom. It is the slightly darker area by the bow. Those slats were cast deep. I went back and cleaned up the area, by scrapping with both blades. I colored in the cutout, roughly, with a pencil to make it more visible. After taking the picture, I thought, “Dummy ,I wonder how well the paint will stick to the pencil graphite!!!” I cleaned it out as best I could with the eraser and window cleaner and a cotton swab. I’ll go back later with paint thinner to see if I can get out more. I discovered while doing the hollowing out that my hands seem to shake concirably more than they did 40 years ago! J To see how things were going to look I set the engine in the hull, and the deck on top. Yes, I didn’t get the deck back all the way, but I had enough trouble just getting everything to stay in place. It was sort of like those toys where you have to get all the BBs into the holes. The flywheel is not installed in these shots. To simulate the center hub, I’m going to use a regular pin. The head will be positioned so it is a little away from the center web, and I will add a little glue to fill in the area. But, right now I don’t have a regular pin. I’ll finish this in the future. I also decided not to drill the lightning holes in the flywheel. I do not feel like making another one, if I mess it up, the first was hard enough. I’ll work on the flywheel this week, and post it. It may be a couple weeks after that before I post any more. I will be helping a disabled friend to pack up to move.

Part 20 The next part is the mounting flange at the back of the crank case, for the transmission. I punched out some 3/32” (6” scale) disks from .020 and .014” sheet. The .010” disk again came out ragged, and the disk warped. Even the .014” disk had rough edges, but I could not figure a way to sand them, the back of the engine will be almost invisible, anyway. Then I drilled the disk, using the center dimple, for the crank shaft/pin. I inserted the pin into the disk, and pushed the pin into the crank case. I then glued the disk, and also glued the cylinder head to the case. It’s starting to look like an engine. The photo also shows I still have a bit of sanding to do on the sides of the crank case. I then cut the cylinder head away from its’ handle. Then the engine block from its’ handle. If you look close you can see that I cut the crankcase just below the crank shaft hole. The top of the engine from the mounting flange up is what protrudes above the hull’s cast in flooring. I also sanded the bottom of the engine block so that it leans toward the back of the boat. The engine was cut just below the crank shaft hole, leaving the hole in the engine block. Here the engine block is set in the boat, to see how it looked. I had not yet sanded the angle in the base. For the transmission, I found a half round sprue the right diameter. The bottom of this part would have mostly been cut off anyway, and I did not have any round pieces even close. I glued the engine and transmission to a piece of .010” plastic sheet. This serves three purposes. The bottom of the engine that I did not model, was the section directly below the engine mounts, so the .010” will be cut to model these flanges. The transmission contact area to the engine is almost nonexistent, the sheet will serve to tie them together. I will leave a piece of the sheet projecting forward, temporarily. This will contact the back of the flywheel, and serve to mark where I should cut it. When I’ve cut the flywheel I’ll remove this section. The black mark at the rear of the transmission is permanent marker, used to mark the top of the ½ round sprue. This helped when I was attaching it. With this small a part telling the round side from the flat with just my fingers was hard. I held it in place while gluing with the tip of a modeling knife. The sprue was a little warped, so I glued it in sections from one end to the other. I used thin liquid cement applied with a micro brush. When the glue had dried, I cut the engine off the rest of the sheet. I used a piece of 1/32nd plywood as a spacer when cutting the engine mount tabs. It used the engine to make a cardstock template for chiseling the hole in the push boat floor. I allowed what looked like a reasonable space for a scale hand and arm the reach into the hole and work on the engine. I cleaned up the inside of the coaming, removing the last remnants of the seats, and smoothing the inside surface. The tiller and rudder are molded in the neutral, straight ahead, position. This is a standard modeling setup. There is a problem with this on this model. If you look closely, the hole for one of the lift blocks, is in the center of the tiller. I’m going to model the push boat with the tiller lashed to one side. I choose that the tiller would be lashed to the base of the aft lift block, on side toward the skipjack. I removed the tiller from the casting, with a knife, file, and sand paper. Then I angled the rudder to match. Now what does the rudder have to do with the building of the engine, you ask. Nothing just felt like fixing this now. J On the floor of the boat I darkened the center slat with a pencil, so that I could more easily place the pattern, I also marked where the front of the engine block would be. Then I glued in the pattern. You can see the marked center slat behind the pattern. Once again I attached it with white glue, so I can remove any leftover glue, easily. Originally I planned for the flywheel to be 4 scale inches from the engine block, and put something between them to represent a pump. When I trial fit the flywheel, this area was hidden by the flywheel. I decided to move the flywheel in to 2”, and forget the pump. The pattern was cut to include this change. The cutout for the tail of the transmission will not extend back as far as the pattern, I needed a handle while installing it. I will cut the slot for the flywheel a little wider than the pattern, but I’ll do that during final fitting of the engine. I’m going to try to cut the flywheel slot a little deeper, to keep more of it, on the model. I decided that the engine cutout for the block would end at the middle support, and that the transmission/prop shaft would end at the right hand one, and that all the cutouts would stop on the inside edge of a slat.

Mine is an Atlas 12 X 36 one. Finances dictate the sale, unfortunately. Maybe some day I will be able to get a small one.

Thanks for the information on the furling on sharply raked masts, my present build has such a mast.

Part 19 Back to the engine. I started with the flywheel. It is 14” in Dia., at full size. The rim inner dia. Is 10”, and ideally is to be 2 to 3” thick. I used a Harbor Freight hand punch to make the parts. First I punched out 7/32” disks from .020” styrene modeling sheet. Then I punched out some from .014” plastic from a hardware store “For Sale” sign. I tried using .010” styrene, but the pieces came out too ragged. Normally I avoid using the sign plastic for modeling, as it is too soft. But in this case it punched well. I normally use it for airbrush painting practice. For a $1 or so a sheet it gives a lot of surface area to play with. I can also try out colors and effects, before I use them on a model. I’m just starting out with the airbrush, so cheap practice material is helpful. The punch leaves a small dimple in the center of the disk. I used this to help center the piece when I punched out the center to make the rims. I glued the disks to a piece of sign plastic with white glue, and let it dry overnight. The white on white is a little hard to see in the photos. Then I used the center dimples to locate for the 5/32” hole. The .014” plastic had released somewhat making the center harder to find on some of the disks. I had to used both hands and magnification for this, so no pictures. The punch “stud” has a small point. I partially pressed the handle until there was barely clearance to slide the plastic in, then I squeezed until there was a little drag, and tried to get the dimple to catch on the point. Out of 10 or so pieces I managed to get two or three acceptable rims. As you can see at the left, some were close, but still too much off center. I punched out some 7/32” plain disks for the center web of the flywheel. I glued a rim on either side of a web, and placed weights on them so that they would be flat. I made flywheels out of both three layers of .020” (about 4” total thickness scale), and .014” (about 3”) and will pick out the one that looks best with the engine body. Unfortunately the punch did not have the dies for the 4” axle boss I want, and I don’t have any really small metal rod or tubing. I’ll see what I can do for this, as I go on. Next I shaped the cylinder head. I chucked a sprue piece in my battery drill, and using a regular small flat file, and a flat needle file, I reduced the diameter to 3/32” (6” scale) for the cylinder head where the water jacket will be. For doing this I placed the drill on my lap and held it with one hand, and filed with the other. Not the best way, but it worked. I had left the blob on the end to shape the crankcase with, but messed it up. So I cut it off and reduced the end to 1/16” (4” scale) for the non jacketed bottom of the cylinder head. The picture is a little blurry, my camera has problems with these small parts.. The black section is the water-jacket area. I colored it with permanent marker before starting the filing for the smaller section. The white upper part is the section I reduced to 1/16” (4” scale) for the exposed area of the cylinder head. For the crankcase I printed the pattern and glued it to a piece of .040” plastic sheet. The final thickness will be greater, but it is easier to cut a series of thinner sheets than an .080, or .100 thick small part. After the white glue was set, I rough cut the piece along the sides, leaving a long tab at what will be the bottom of the engine. This will be used as a handle until most of the other operations are complete. This is the second attempt. The first time I cut it too close to the lines, and the top was not wide enough to match the cylinder head. I read an article several years ago about a highly detailed and highly complex armor model that had been built from scratch. The builder said that during the construction, he had probably thrown away another model’s worth of unsatisfactory parts. I try to keep this in mind. I stop when mine are only slightly unsatisfactory. :-) Then I glued this onto another .040” piece. When the glue had dried I cut off the extra at the sides, and sanded them square. Using the cylinder head part as a guide I cut the top flat, leaving some on either side to represent the mounting flange. Looking at the final width of the top verses the thickness of the crank piece, I decided to add another layer of .020” plastic. A little final shaping and the top of the crank case was done. I did not have any small 1/32nd rod (2” Scale) for the crankshaft, but found a “T” pin with the right diameter. I reattached the paper pattern, which had come off during the shaping, and used it as a guide for drilling the shaft hole in the crank case. I used a #70 drill, but the size would depend on what you had to use. This left a tight fit to the pin. To smooth the outside of the flywheel rim, I cut down the end of a dowel to fit inside the rim, and glued it to the flywheel. I will admit to cheating a little here. I used a metal lathe to accurately reduce the dowel diameter, as I did not have a dowel the right size. I’ve avoided using it before in this build, as many do not have one, and I am selling mine, so will not have one in the future. In this case the dowel’s large diameter was the same as the outside of the rim. If I had the right size dowel, I would have used a piece of scrap under the dowel while sanding, to bring the edge to the proper level. An advantage to gluing the flywheel using the inside of the rim as a reference, is that the outside will be concentric with the inside, giving an even rim width. After smoothing I used the dimple in the center to drill the flywheel shaft. To check the parts out I temporarily assembled the crank case and flywheel. In the end I chose the flywheel made from the .014” sheet, the other looked oversized. Glad I had those signs laying around. I did not worry about shaping the bottom of the crank, as this area will be cut out when I fit the engine to the boat. The bottom of the flywheel will also be removed (see Part 17). Next time I’ll work on completing the engine, and perhaps the chiseling out of the boat flooring for the engine compartment. I may even get extremely brave and drill three holes in the flywheel web, like those shown in some of the pictures I found. These were used to lighten it somewhat.